First Seabourn cruise postmortem

[seabourn_noob]

I don't claim to be an dedicated cruiser... this was our fifth cruise in 25 years. And this was our first Seabourn cruise. Everything about the ship itself: service, food, entertainment, design, cleanliness -- was outstanding and beyond my expectations. But the shore excursions (at least the three Seabourn-sponsored ones we bought on a 12 night cruise) were third-rate at best.... and overpriced. With minimal research, I put together a competing whale-watching trip at half-price, a near-private tour of the Scottish Highlands at about 75% of the price of the bus tour offered by Seabourn, and a terrific Oslo fjord tour at about one-third the Seabourn price. The Seabourn tours I took (East Iceland highlights in Seydisfjordur, Scalloway and Ponies, and Gothenburg and the Haga District) were (IMO) poorly thought out and badly overpriced. People I spoke to on the Scottish Highlands tour confirmed that it was similarly subpar. There is no reason this should be so. Seabourn has actual staff who can vet third-party suppliers and ought to have leverage to make the tours cheaper than a guy doing Internet research on his own can do. And for a cruise line which was outstanding in everything else it was very odd. I should note that I didn't try to book "experiences" like hiking or meditation or biking tours -- just pedestrian old "show me the basic sights" stuff. Maybe those shore excursions are better. But a failure to deliver on the pedestrian stuff was striking.

[markham]

What ship is this? Who handled your complaints, if you made any, and what happened?

 

These details would be helpful.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

[SDuckers]

Our experience on our first Seabourn cruise, in the Mediterranean, was similar.  We mostly did our own excursions using Tours by Locals and much preferred the private guide (at a fraction of the cost) to what we heard our fellow cruisers experienced with Seabourn tours.  On that cruise we did use the Seabourn excursion to go to Florence (because of concern that if there was an issue getting back on time, we were better off with a Seabourn-booked tour), but felt it was highly overpriced for what was essentially just transportation to Florence.  Other Seabourn cruises (particularly in Alaska) have been a mixture of good/fair priced or unique experiences.  I think it's wise to consider both Seabourn-booked, and book-on-your-own on every cruise.

 

[seabourn_noob]

1 hour ago, markham said:

What ship is this? Who handled your complaints, if you made any, and what happened?

 

These details would be helpful.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

It was Ovation 5/30-6/11.  I don't think there was really much to complain about at the time.... it was just three poorly executed excursions.  I did mention it to the Assistant Cruise Director at dinner on my last night aboard, and she said I should let Seabourn know.  I gave this same critique on the postcruise comment form I received.

 

I don't want to make this sound worse than it was.... They put us on buses; there was a guide; they took us where they said they would take us; they got us back on time.  It was just substantially worse, in terms of both content and price, than similar excursions I arranged on my own.  It was more the contrast with the first-class level of everything else.

[frantic36]

2 hours ago, seabourn_noob said:

It was just substantially worse, in terms of both content and price, than similar excursions I arranged on my own.  It was more the contrast with the first-class level of everything else.

 

I have had some good experiences with Seabourn but always more hiking or more strenuous ones. For example when we stopped in Melilla last year we chose the walk around town which included exploring the siege tunnels and castle. It was marked most strenuous and it was, lots of steep stairs and walking but it was a great experience. One older lady joined us but there was two guides and one guide helped her go up and down the stairs. We all got a good work out that day. This was a Sunday so the tour with Seabourn was the only way to get into those siege tunnels.

 

There was just a standard walk around town and unfortunately the guide from the feedback I heard was quite weak and there were lots of complaints.

 

I have found only doing the ones that are difficult if not impossible to arrange on my own is usually best. Organising private or with others in a small group of no more than 2 other couples always works best. I think this applies to most cruise lines. 

[Vineyard View]

We just completed our first Seabourn cruise. Loved almost every aspect and I would like to write a review. Currently I am waiting to hear back from SB about, how should I say, miscommunication with the FCC on board regarding a cruise we booked on board before I do. That said, we obviously loved our experience or we would not have booked a future cruise. 
We had OBC to use and decided to try a couple excursions. I will say we never book ship excursions - only DIY or private based on experience. We thought maybe it would be better with SB. Nope. That was not the case with either of the excursions. It only confirms we will stick with our usual MO. Unfortunately the pool of excursion companies and guides are apparently shared by all cruise lines, and even more so post C. We did provide feedback while onboard,  on the one where we were beyond uncomfortable and way to crowded in a small mostly enclosed boat and received a 20% discount. It was not worth arguing about. It was a lesson to stick with our past game plan. It’s just so much more difficult post C to find companies and individuals than it was before. 

[seabourn_noob]

2 hours ago, frantic36 said:

 

I have found only doing the ones that are difficult if not impossible to arrange on my own is usually best. Organising private or with others in a small group of no more than 2 other couples always works best. I think this applies to most cruise lines. 

Maybe you're right and nobody is any good at this any more.  I will say that on our last cruise, barely pre-pandemic (Jan. 2020) on Crystal (Danube riverboat), the shore excursions offered were uniformly good, IMO, and Crystal offered both free tours and somewhat more extensive tours for a fee.  But I must say that Seabourn does itself no favors offering events which are not up to the rest of their overall package.  

[frantic36]

Just now, seabourn_noob said:

Maybe you're right and nobody is any good at this any more.  I will say that on our last cruise, barely pre-pandemic (Jan. 2020) on Crystal (Danube riverboat), the shore excursions offered were uniformly good, IMO, and Crystal offered both free tours and somewhat more extensive tours for a fee.  But I must say that Seabourn does itself no favors offering events which are not up to the rest of their overall package.  

 

 

I think river excursions are uniformly better but having sailed on Crystal ocean ships before I had problems with some of their excursions as well. Same with Silversea excursions which is why I usually do my own. I am sailing on Regent next year Tokyo - Tokyo and I will carefully vet their offerings and select the more strenuous or look to do our own.

 

[2SailingNomads]

Seabourn and most other cruise lines use the same local companies.  We usually avoid ship tours and book private unless something like going to Marrakesh which is a long way and don't want to miss the ship.  That said we did a few Regent included tours and they ranged from decent to very good.  I believe frantic36 will be doing a Regent cruise in the future and can add her take on the included Regent tours.

Edited June 20, 2023 by 2SailingNomads

[seabourn_noob]

15 minutes ago, 2SailingNomads said:

Seabourn and most other cruise lines use the same local companies.  We usually avoid ship tours and book private unless something like going to Marrakesh which is a long way and don't want to miss the ship.  

I fully agree that missing the ship is the biggest thing that line-based excursions have going for them.  As to the fact (if it's a fact) that the cruise lines all use the same tour companies, it raises a different set of questions: (a) then why are they more expensive? Shouldn't the pricing power of the cruise lines reduce prices? (b) who is vetting these tours?  who is curating the sights visited? who is rating the guides? (c) shouldn't there be a value proposition for a cruise line in offering better tours than their competitors?  why would you give up a potential competitive advantage by simply going with the tour companies everyone else uses?  

[2SailingNomads]

4 minutes ago, seabourn_noob said:

I fully agree that missing the ship is the biggest thing that line-based excursions have going for them.  As to the fact (if it's a fact) that the cruise lines all use the same tour companies, it raises a different set of questions: (a) then why are they more expensive? Shouldn't the pricing power of the cruise lines reduce prices? (b) who is vetting these tours?  who is curating the sights visited? who is rating the guides? (c) shouldn't there be a value proposition for a cruise line in offering better tours than their competitors?  why would you give up a potential competitive advantage by simply going with the tour companies everyone else uses?  

Good points.  I can not say every cruise line, rather I should have said cruise lines under the same corporate parent typically use the same vendors - go to the Regent board to see examples- and I have heard of various CCL lines especially HAL having identical tours (and website just different branding) as Seabourn. Price is profit for the cruise line.  A $150 tour on a bus to the same cable car that you can walk to or take a $15 taxi R/T and the cable car is $20 is a convenient proposition to many.  We know people who book based on what ship tours are offered.  It works for many cruisers and then they complain when 60 minutes of free time...  To each their own.

[Vineyard View]

I think that the pool of available cruise excursions companies is much smaller than it used to be pre C. (Just as it is for private and independent tours). 
I also believe that cruise lines have always mostly used the same excursions companies both before and after C because that is what is available. There are, as far as I have discovered (other than river cruises on Viking where there were specific Viking busses for excursions - maybe other river cruise lines too) no real other options, and as a result not a lot of competition for these companies to ‘up their game’. Unfortunately, I believe you get what you get with excursions no matter whom you sail on. They all seem pretty cookie cutter with no real differentiators. What you pay, on the other hand, can vary greatly for similar excursions depending on cruise line. 
Have I  said - I really, really  dislike cruise ship excursions?
Sometimes though, depending on the port, not a lot of options. 

Edited June 20, 2023 by Vineyard View

[Techno123]

18 hours ago, seabourn_noob said:

But I must say that Seabourn does itself no favors offering events which are not up to the rest of their overall package.  

Especially when some of their main competitors are including equally mediocre tours but not charging extra for them 😜

[frantic36]

13 minutes ago, Techno123 said:

Especially when some of their main competitors are including equally mediocre tours but not charging extra for them 😜

Our pricing for next years Regent cruise is more per diem than our Seabourn cruises and we in Australia don't get included air. As I said there are a couple of ports I am looking to do private tours after reading reviews of Regent tours in places like Kyoto so it is awash really.

[Vineyard View]

5 hours ago, Techno123 said:

Especially when some of their main competitors are including equally mediocre tours but not charging extra for them 😜

We found that some of their competitors with included excursions penciled out to be more per person per day than Seabourn. So I think maybe it depends on the value of having excursions included for each passenger. Some passengers, like us, do not find value in that. Some do. 

[2SailingNomads]

For the most part any cruise with included tours will cost more than one with out them.  If just a financial decision than easy, but if you want to compare other aspects of the cruise- service, food, venues, whatever criteria is important to you then one has to take them all into consideration.  After sailing on Regent which is usually more expensive than Seabourn given an identical itinerary unless Regent is ridiculous priced for now until we have a bad experience I will spend the extra for Regent, based on my last few not so good  Seabourn cruises.  (And other long time Seabourn cruisers who were on with us felt the same).

I am not the only person on this forum to express a disappointment with recent cruises.  Several other long-term Seabourn cruisers have weighed in touting SS and other lines.

Edited June 21, 2023 by 2SailingNomads

[tv24]

Usually the excursions that you book on your own will be less expensive.  This is not unique to Seabourn, but is the typical experience, Cunard, HAL, Crystal, etc.  IMHO, the advantage of cruise ship excursions is the convenience of not having to shop on-line and the promise that they will get you back to the ship on time.  

[Techno123]

I know this is not a fair comparison as different parts of the world but this year we have a Norwegian Fjord cruise booked with Seabourn and a far east cruise booked with Regent - both 14 nights and both on one of the newer ships. The Regent cruise includes flights (cattle class but we are from the UK😜), transfers, a superior suite, excursions and an overnight in Tokyo. Seabourn is cruise only in a V1 and the Seabourn cruise is costing 50% more than the Regent one.

There really are huge differences in cost depending on when and where you are making your booking. Up to now I have loved Seabourn and very much enjoyed Regent but I am looking forward to being able to contrast the two experiences this year as both lines should be getting back to some semblance of normality 😁

 

[JPH814]

I am not a "noob" - to cruising or Seabourn (you can see my signature.   We (my wife and I) have used ship sponsored excursions and have booked my own privately. 

 

I agree that the quality of private touring is so much better.  But it is not necessarily less expensive  - unless we share with another couple.  We sometime travel with others and in that case it is a good deal. 

 

With private, we hop in a car and go off, spend as much time or as little at a stop and often custom fit the day to our desires. 

 

With a Seabourn excursion, you wait for 20 people to board the bus.  You spend X minutes at a stop - no more and no less.  The schedule invariably includes time at the gift shop.  You make time for 20 people to use the bathrooms.  The transportation is usually fine (comfortable bus).  The guides have been good, rarely great, occasionally blah.  And you do get what you pay for.

 

Having said that, we continue to book some excursions through Seabourn.  The more exotic or "back woods" the port is, the less inclined I am to book something on my own. Also, if I am just looking for a 2 or 3 hour trip around town to see the sights, Seabourn is fine  But for most major countries and ports, we have been very successful booking through Tours by Locals.  We will tend to book a full day - 8 hours or more - of a local guide who knows the area well.  

Edited June 21, 2023 by JPH814

[Mr Luxury]

I like to stay on the ship and watch all of you get off and get into a bus together.

The ship is bliss without you.😀

[2SailingNomads]

Agree.  Then watch them run to get back on board. 

[whogo]

7 hours ago, JPH814 said:

With a Seabourn excursion, you wait for 20 people to board the bus.  You spend X minutes at a stop - no more and no less.  The schedule invariably includes time at the gift shop.  You make time for 20 people to use the bathrooms.

You wait for the person(s) who just can't seem to make it back to the bus at the appointed time.

[2SailingNomads]

51 minutes ago, whogo said:

You wait for the person(s) who just can't seem to make it back to the bus at the appointed time.

Yes, in Marrakesh we waited about 50 minutes should have left the so self important people could have fended for themselves. Why we almost never book ship tours but Marrakesh was 3+ hours each way.  So didn't want to risk stuck in traffic which happened to the bus after the arrogant people arrived late.

[Mr Luxury]

3 hours ago, 2SailingNomads said:

Agree.  Then watch them run to get back on board. 

Usually at 3.30 scavenging around the pool grill trying to get the value out of lunch.😁

[PaulMCO]

It is all about people and tour guides that have found other lines of work.  Certainly the quality of the guides are lower and in many ports you need 20 guides.

 

Second, the cruise lines have also stopped vetting or monitoring these excursions.  At one time, there would be a cruise line person on the tour to help with any issues (they could be an enrichment speaker, a singer from the show etc.) that has stopped. Maybe to avoid exposure to Covid??

 

We have done 5 cruise in 2022 and 2023. On Regent, Seabourn and Oceania.  All have had issues, the worse being Oceania who had pre-pandemic descriptions in the documents.  In one case, two of the places were closed during COVID and never opened. A third was destroyed by a Hurricane in 2019 and never rebuilt.