Queen Mary 2 world voyage 2024….Red Sea?

[mcoprof]

On 1/16/2024 at 5:06 AM, exlondoner said:

Just to be clear about this: what makes Carnival/Cunard ships US owned?The company is quoted on both the NY and London stock exchanges, while Cunard’s registered office is in Southampton.

 

From Wikipedia:  offered with a grain of salt....

 

Cunard Line (/ˈkjuːnɑːrd/) is a British shipping and cruise line based at Carnival House at Southampton, England, operated by Carnival UK and owned by Carnival Corporation & plc. Since 2011, Cunard and its three ships have been registered in Hamilton, Bermuda.

In 1998, Carnival Corporation purchased a controlling stake in Cunard, completing the acquisition in 1999 to become sole shareholder.[45]

 

Between 1989 and 1999, the company [carnival corporation] acquired Holland America Line, Windstar Cruises, Westours, Seabourn Cruise Line, Costa Cruises and Cunard Line. The name Carnival Corporation was adopted in 1993, to distinguish the parent company from its flagship cruise line subsidiary.[3]

Carnival Corporation and Carnival plc jointly own all the operating companies in the Carnival group

 

...the only U.S. flagged cruise ship, Pride of America [NCL] sails year round from Honolulu

 

 

[mcoprof]

On 1/16/2024 at 11:54 AM, Patria21 said:

My friends and I are all having a great time - but that’s helped by the fact that none of us is getting on or off in Dubai so we’re more comfortable living with an uncertain itinerary. Plus we’ve all been through something similar before: It’s the cost of traveling in an uncertain world. So we float. 

We are in the same boat (er.. ship), literally.  Dubai, Petra and Athens are on my bucket list.  But what will be will be. 

Lucky and grateful to be here and now. 

Edited January 17 by mcoprof

[Austcruiser84]

It occurred to me that any changes must factor passengers’ ability to obtain visas. That will certainly determine the route and stops in any diversion. 

[tjunmin]

2 minutes ago, Austcruiser84 said:

It occurred to me that any changes must factor passengers’ ability to obtain visas. That will certainly determine the route and stops in any diversion. 

The sooner Cunard announces the changes, the longer people will have to adjust and get ready.

 

Historically speaking, how has Cunard behaved when it comes to itinerary changes? Have they been proactive and given passengers plenty of time to react, or have they waited for as long as they could and left passengers scrambling? What have been your experiences?

[SaltyCroc]

Here is an article describing how Marsh insurance brokers, one of the world’s largest brokers, has moved to exclude US and UK owner ships for Red Sea insurance coverage.  (I work in the finance industry and Marsh is an industry giant.). Carnival Corp has a real problem with at least 8 ships from their subsidiary lines (Princess, Aida, HAL, Cunard, Costa, Regent) slated to traverse the Red Sea in March to May.

 

i am sure the accountants in Miami are working overtime to figure out how they want to play this as what they do for one line, they will do for all lines. We can only wait to see what they decided.

 
https://gcaptain.com/ship-insurers-seeking-exclusions-for-us-and-uk-vessels-from-red-sea-coverage/

Edited January 18 by SaltyCroc

[Winifred 22]

5 hours ago, SaltyCroc said:

Here is an article describing how Marsh insurance brokers, one of the world’s largest brokers, has moved to exclude US and UK owner ships for Red Sea insurance coverage.  (I work in the finance industry and Marsh is an industry giant.). Carnival Corp has a real problem with at least 8 ships from their subsidiary lines (Princess, Aida, HAL, Cunard, Costa, Regent) slated to traverse the Red Sea in March to May.

 

i am sure the accountants in Miami are working overtime to figure out how they want to play this as what they do for one line, they will do for all lines. We can only wait to see what they decided.

 
https://gcaptain.com/ship-insurers-seeking-exclusions-for-us-and-uk-vessels-from-red-sea-coverage/

Regent is not a Carnival brand. Regent is owned by NCL who are nothing to do with Carnival Corp/ Carnival UK. ( Seabourn is also in the Carnival Corp family along with P&O Australia and P& O Cruises)

Edited January 18 by Winifred 22

[Victoria2]

and do Carnival Corps. use Marsh as their insurers SaltyCroc because although they might be a big noise in the insurance world, I don't thin k they are part of the International P&I Clubs.

 

However, I am sure any company involved in insuring marine traffic due to be in the area of any conflict, will be in touch with the companies involved 'to have a discussion'.

[rog747]

Further to my post re my Nephew who is V-P at a Lloyd's of London firm in Marine and Rigs Underwriting Insurance - >>

He's talked to his colleagues yesterday in Hull's Underwriting, and it's of course a fluid situation that may be resolved in time for the ship to stay on the intended route.  

However for now though, 

it must be said, that Cunard at present would not get Insurance to sail into the areas and transit home via Suez as the risks currently stand.
Cunard's Broker would have to request Coverage from the Underwriters who would most likely decline Cover, or charge an eye watering additional Premium, but with untenable Exclusions. 

The Joint Hull Committee at Lloyds would still class this region as a 'Breach Area' and therefore voiding the ships Insurance if they sail in that area, and they could still assess the area as too High Risk for the foreseeable, even if current Hostilities decline soon. plus they have to be mindful of any increase, or sudden uptake in more Hostilities.

Cunard know what they are doing, and they, and their Insurance Brokers will be on it as we speak.

More news will come ASAP for any affected Cruise segments and Passengers once Cunard make their decisions on the ship's route.

 

[Easybimble]

32 minutes ago, rog747 said:

Further to my post re my Nephew who is V-P at a Lloyd's of London firm in Marine and Rigs Underwriting Insurance - >>

He's talked to his colleagues yesterday in Hull's Underwriting, and it's of course a fluid situation that may be resolved in time for the ship to stay on the intended route.  

However for now though, 

it must be said, that Cunard at present would not get Insurance to sail into the areas and transit home via Suez as the risks currently stand.
Cunard's Broker would have to request Coverage from the Underwriters who would most likely decline Cover, or charge an eye watering additional Premium, but with untenable Exclusions. 

The Joint Hull Committee at Lloyds would still class this region as a 'Breach Area' and therefore voiding the ships Insurance if they sail in that area, and they could still assess the area as too High Risk for the foreseeable, even if current Hostilities decline soon. plus they have to be mindful of any increase, or sudden uptake in more Hostilities.

Cunard know what they are doing, and they, and their Insurance Brokers will be on it as we speak.

More news will come ASAP for any affected Cruise segments and Passengers once Cunard make their decisions on the ship's route.

 

Thanks for this, kind of as one would imagine but interesting to see👍

[rog747]

Just for fun mind!

Voyage distances for alternative route avoiding call at Dubai and transit Suez. 

(rerouting is not possible via Panama Canal) 
Port stops are not included.
Options shown are to go back from Colombo (on Day 90) to Southampton,
and from there she then has to cross to New York (on Day 117) to undertake a R/T B2B TA.

Distance    10286 nautical miles via Cape of Good Hope
Vessel speed    25 knots
Time    17 days 03 hours 

This gives her more than enough days even at a slower speed, with some Port stops enroute, to be back in SOU on time for the NYC crossing departing 28th April (Day 117).

I have used Colombo as the last scheduled Port of Call on the current WC  itinerary, because the ship is not going to be sailing from any Australian Ports.
The ports prior to Colombo are all in SE Asia.

Therefore due to the distances involved, suggestions for her to maybe return via Cape Horn are not tenable. 

Folk due to disembark Dubai could get off at Colombo.

She would definitely stop again at Cape Town (most likely stay overnight as usual) - a St Helena sail-by would be doable as time permits 
 

 

Edited January 18 by rog747
my typo

[Patria21]

47 minutes ago, rog747 said:

Just for fun mind!

Voyage distances for alternative route avoiding call at Dubai and transit Suez. 

(rerouting is not possible via Panama Canal) 
Port stops are not included.
Options shown are to go back from Colombo (on Day 90) to Southampton,
and from there she then has to cross to New York (on Day 117) to undertake a R/T B2B TA.

Distance    10286 nautical miles via Cape of Good Hope
Vessel speed    25 knots
Time    17 days 03 hours 

This gives her more than enough days even at a slower speed, with some Port stops enroute, to be back in SOU on time for the NYC crossing departing 28th April (Day 117).

I have used Colombo as the last scheduled Port of Call on the current WC  itinerary, because the ship is not going to be sailing from any Australian Ports.
The ports prior to Colombo are all in SE Asia.

Therefore due to the distances involved, suggestions for her to maybe return via Cape Horn are not tenable. 

Folk due to disembark Dubai could get off at Colombo.

She would definitely stop again at Cape Town (most likely stay overnight as usual) - a St Helena sail-by would be doable as time permits 
 

 

Queen Victoria departs Colombo for Africa and Southampton on March 30, right before we get there on March 31. So I agree: It seems clear that there is time for the QM2 to follow a similar route as Victoria back to Southampton from Colombo if that’s what Cunard chooses to do. 

[rog747]

16 minutes ago, Patria21 said:

Queen Victoria departs Colombo for Africa and Southampton on March 30, right before we get there on March 31. So I agree: It seems clear that there is time for the QM2 to follow a similar route as Victoria back to Southampton from Colombo if that’s what Cunard chooses to do. 

Yes, I just spotted that the QV is almost dead ahead of QM2 when at CMB ! 

plus the HAL Zuiderdam is 2 days in front of QV, due to go from Colombo via Suez and the Azores to FLL.

 

Colombo would be a good Air 'Hub' for disembarking and embarking DXB passengers, and looking at Port space availability QM2 could overnight at Colombo if needed.

Getting Port space booked now especially for an overnight at Cape Town must be at the forefront of Cunard Operations re any changing of the QM2's route.

The passage time available (if QM2 is rerouted via the Cape) does allow for a visit to St Helena which would be rather a nice treat for many of the Passengers. 
Something I would really like to experience. 

Anyway, all conjecture for now..... 

 

Edited January 18 by rog747

[Joe33472]

5 hours ago, Patria21 said:

Queen Victoria departs Colombo for Africa and Southampton on March 30, right before we get there on March 31. So I agree: It seems clear that there is time for the QM2 to follow a similar route as Victoria back to Southampton from Colombo if that’s what Cunard chooses to do. 

 

Wow!  Just looked at both itineraries and this would be a logical solution to the Red Sea issue for the QM2.   Although the WC passengers probably wouldn't be too happy as they already went around Africa, but better to be safe.   Hopefully Cunard makes a decision sooner, rather than later, so people can adjust their plans accordingly.  

Edited January 18 by Joe33472

[Bmj276l]

We were due to fly to Dubai and travel back to Southampton.

due to obvious concerns we cancelled the day before full payment was due .

cunard have refused to refund or even give a future credit with regard to our deposit which is disappointing.

Had we paid the balance then we may have been redirected at a later date as being discussed .

would have happily used our deposit to go with Cunard as he haven’t tried them yet .As we booked a saver fare no option of a credit .

so it’s cost us a few quid .

I did however try to rebook the Dubai to Southampton cruise in April only to find all cabins sold out , tells me that’s unlikely.

We will fight to get our deposits back and yes I know what is said in writing,however I think we have a case .

For those that go I wish you all well.

 

 

[Winifred 22]

45 minutes ago, Bmj276l said:

We were due to fly to Dubai and travel back to Southampton.

due to obvious concerns we cancelled the day before full payment was due .

cunard have refused to refund or even give a future credit with regard to our deposit which is disappointing.

Had we paid the balance then we may have been redirected at a later date as being discussed .

would have happily used our deposit to go with Cunard as he haven’t tried them yet .As we booked a saver fare no option of a credit .

so it’s cost us a few quid .

I did however try to rebook the Dubai to Southampton cruise in April only to find all cabins sold out , tells me that’s unlikely.

We will fight to get our deposits back and yes I know what is said in writing,however I think we have a case .

For those that go I wish you all well.

 

 

Sadly the risk of loosing a deposit and not being able cancel and rebook is the downside of a saver fare. 

[LittleFish1976]

3 hours ago, Winifred 22 said:

Sadly the risk of loosing a deposit and not being able cancel and rebook is the downside of a saver fare. 

Given the reasons for cancelling the booking (turmoil in that part of the world) surely Cunard could see their way to accomodating their customers by issuing a FCC which is money they still have and will have regardless - not much skin off their corporate nose.

 

I've just spent an hour or so on the phone to Cunard sorting out using a FCC to pay off a cruise already booked which they refused to do yesterday when my travel agent rang them. I'm told it has now been done but why should it entail numerous phone calls and my having to express to them an unwillingness to get off the phone until the problem is resolved. Yesterday my TA was told the rest of the FCC had ceased to exist because I didn't use it all on the one booking which is not what I was told when the booking was made, nor is it their customary practice. Today they managed to find the FCC and apply it as requested. Their customer service landside is really frightful in my experience. I hope to find a cruise line I like as much so I can cease dealing with this nonsense.

[LittleFish1976]

4 hours ago, Bmj276l said:

We were due to fly to Dubai and travel back to Southampton.

due to obvious concerns we cancelled the day before full payment was due .

cunard have refused to refund or even give a future credit with regard to our deposit which is disappointing.

Had we paid the balance then we may have been redirected at a later date as being discussed .

would have happily used our deposit to go with Cunard as he haven’t tried them yet .As we booked a saver fare no option of a credit .

so it’s cost us a few quid .

I did however try to rebook the Dubai to Southampton cruise in April only to find all cabins sold out , tells me that’s unlikely.

We will fight to get our deposits back and yes I know what is said in writing,however I think we have a case .

For those that go I wish you all well.

 

 

 

I wish you the best of luck. They are very difficult to deal with although the call centres in some parts of the world are better than others.

[rog747]

11 hours ago, Bmj276l said:

We were due to fly to Dubai and travel back to Southampton.

due to obvious concerns we cancelled the day before full payment was due .

cunard have refused to refund or even give a future credit with regard to our deposit which is disappointing.

Had we paid the balance then we may have been redirected at a later date as being discussed .

would have happily used our deposit to go with Cunard as he haven’t tried them yet .As we booked a saver fare no option of a credit .

so it’s cost us a few quid .

I did however try to rebook the Dubai to Southampton cruise in April only to find all cabins sold out , tells me that’s unlikely.

We will fight to get our deposits back and yes I know what is said in writing,however I think we have a case .

For those that go I wish you all well.

 

 

Sorry to hear your woes and that you have cancelled your first cruise on Cunard, but I fully understand your predicament with such a fluid and uncertain Security issue in the Gulf Region. 

As I guess you are in the UK, I would escalate with Cunard your request for your Deposit to be reconsidered perhaps given to you as a Credit, as you clearly wish to go on Cunard one day.
They would be daft to lose your business and personally I have always had a positive result from Cunard's Sales and Customer Service at Southampton when I have had to deal with similar refund and voyage change issues in the recent past. 

Your case will no doubt have more clout for your Deposit to be credited back to you if the Voyage is subsequently changed to go around the Cape...?
Perhaps you would like to do that trip ? 

As I mentioned I always found Cunard (UK) to have decent empathy with such issues and I wish the same to you.
Good luck.
 

Edited January 19 by rog747

[rog747]

18 hours ago, Bmj276l said:

We were due to fly to Dubai and travel back to Southampton.

Due to obvious concerns we cancelled the day before full payment was due.

Cunard have refused to refund or give a future credit with regard to our deposit which is disappointing.

 

I did however try to rebook the Dubai to Southampton cruise in April only to find all cabins sold out , tells me that’s unlikely.

 

 

 

Yes,

I think they have taken that WC segment off-sale for obvious reasons, for now...

Dubai To Southampton, 21 Nights (M409)
7 Apr 2024 - 28 Apr 2024
Sold Out

But Singapore to Southampton is wide-open and has availability in most cabin categories.
 

[D&N]

I feel sorry for the poster who elected to cancel and I hope they eventually get a resolution to their satisfaction.

But I just can't understand the logic of cancelling a booking knowing the deposit is not refundable, unless there was some other personal reason that would have forced us to cancel anyway. Cunard would have been responsible for passengers safety whatever happened in any part of the world. I would have paid up and waited to see what Cunard did. If Cunard then cancelled or changed the itinerary in some way that the trip was no longer possible for us, they would have been obliged to refund.

During the pandemic we didn't consider cancelling our Cunard bookings. Final payment was due when it was unlikely that the crossings would take place but hadn't been officially cancelled. We waited for them to cancel and ended up with nearly 40% more FCC than we had originally paid.

[exlondoner]

6 minutes ago, D&N said:

I feel sorry for the poster who elected to cancel and I hope they eventually get a resolution to their satisfaction.

But I just can't understand the logic of cancelling a booking knowing the deposit is not refundable, unless there was some other personal reason that would have forced us to cancel anyway. Cunard would have been responsible for passengers safety whatever happened in any part of the world. I would have paid up and waited to see what Cunard did. If Cunard then cancelled or changed the itinerary in some way that the trip was no longer possible for us, they would have been obliged to refund.

During the pandemic we didn't consider cancelling our Cunard bookings. Final payment was due when it was unlikely that the crossings would take place but hadn't been officially cancelled. We waited for them to cancel and ended up with nearly 40% more FCC than we had originally paid.

And, if they let people with saver fares be flexible, it undermines the argument for booking more expensive fares and annoys those who did do that.

[Tifferoo]

Hello! First time poster here, first time on Cunard, though I've been on P&O several times...including Hong Kong to Seychelles segment of the WC for my honeymoon 25 years ago. To celebrate our silver anniversary.....we're booked on Singapore to Dubai on QM2 😮 

I'm watching this thread with interest to see what might happen. TBH if it re-routes I'm not too bothered as long as we can get on, though we did book flights separately so that's an added complication. The QV route to Cape Town looks a bit dull, but I guess there's plenty of entertainment on the ship.

One thing I am a little worried about though is I'm prone to sea-sickness. It was only a problem on one day of my honeymoon and I was hoping for calm seas on the original route. My husband suspects if we follow the route from Colombo to Cape Town sea sickness could be an issue. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

Apologies for any mistakes with the Cruising lingo 🙂 

[Victoria2]

18 minutes ago, Tifferoo said:

Hello! First time poster here, first time on Cunard, though I've been on P&O several times...including Hong Kong to Seychelles segment of the WC for my honeymoon 25 years ago. To celebrate our silver anniversary.....we're booked on Singapore to Dubai on QM2 😮 

I'm watching this thread with interest to see what might happen. TBH if it re-routes I'm not too bothered as long as we can get on, though we did book flights separately so that's an added complication. The QV route to Cape Town looks a bit dull, but I guess there's plenty of entertainment on the ship.

One thing I am a little worried about though is I'm prone to sea-sickness. It was only a problem on one day of my honeymoon and I was hoping for calm seas on the original route. My husband suspects if we follow the route from Colombo to Cape Town sea sickness could be an issue. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

Apologies for any mistakes with the Cruising lingo 🙂 

One of our most favourite  routes, is Colombo to Cape Town.

 

Lazing onboard with the beautiful Indian Ocean gently aiding our way, is heaven on sea! We've 'done' it a few times with QV and have yet to experience anything other than pure, relaxing, wonderful bliss.

 

[cruiseluvva]

49 minutes ago, Tifferoo said:

Hello! First time poster here, first time on Cunard, though I've been on P&O several times...including Hong Kong to Seychelles segment of the WC for my honeymoon 25 years ago. To celebrate our silver anniversary.....we're booked on Singapore to Dubai on QM2 😮 

I'm watching this thread with interest to see what might happen. TBH if it re-routes I'm not too bothered as long as we can get on, though we did book flights separately so that's an added complication. The QV route to Cape Town looks a bit dull, but I guess there's plenty of entertainment on the ship.

One thing I am a little worried about though is I'm prone to sea-sickness. It was only a problem on one day of my honeymoon and I was hoping for calm seas on the original route. My husband suspects if we follow the route from Colombo to Cape Town sea sickness could be an issue. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

Apologies for any mistakes with the Cruising lingo 🙂 

We’ve “done” the Indian Ocean a few times and it’s been so calm it was glassy. 

[D&N]

1 hour ago, Tifferoo said:

but I guess there's plenty of entertainment on the ship.

One thing I am a little worried about though is I'm prone to sea-sickness. It was only a problem on one day of my honeymoon and I was hoping for calm seas on the original route. My husband suspects if we follow the route from Colombo to Cape Town sea sickness could be an issue. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

If we were on QM2, no matter what the itinerary was, we wouldn't be leaving the ship unless required to by immigration rules or there was something in that particular port we wanted to buy and couldn't order online. There is too much to do onboard, and we don't do shows or enrichment lectures.

 

My wife has felt a little off colour on a few rough North Sea and Channel crossings. In a force 10 gale travelling overnight from Zeebrugge to Felixstowe in October 1989, in the smallest imaginable inside cabin, on a small converted freight ferry, was actually sick. It was probably the most uncomfortable night I've ever spent on a ship and I had to drive for several hours the next morning.

 

I cannot imagine any conditions in which she would feel ill on QM2.