On Grandeur now..

[kikki21]

The tabloid journalism isn't just restricted to the USA....the UK papers have got hold of this story and embellished it... especially the Daily Mail!

 

What really got my goat was the general publics comments about the story which ranged from "cruising is just for old people" and that cruise ships are just "floating council house estates" to "you would have to pay me to sail on a floating death trap"

 

How many of these people have actually been on a cruise I wonder! :mad:

 

I am glad that everyone is safe on this cruise and I hope that repairs don't take too long and that the Grandeur is sailing again soon!

[Ebvette]

I have not found a link or post giving a link to a description of the damage yet.I did see a post saying the ropes were burnt up and then ropes appeared at port:rolleyes:

 

so, is there a link describing structural damage

 

One can see from the picture that there was heat and smoke, peeling paint

 

The "Aft-Hauser" compartment, or as they describe it as the "Mooring Room", is where lines (not ropes) are stored, winches or capsans are located, and other tack equipment and surplus material is stored, that is used for upkeep of the ship. In some cases, paint, cleaning chemicals, and other such material are put in lockers and all is stored in the ares for the ship. Most obvious the far aft or stern mooring room is used primarily during the docking of the ship. The immediate area is kept very clear of any storage materials, lockers or extra line, as it is an operational ares, however futher back in this room you could have the storage of material that I talked about. Fire hoses, extiguishers and an interal sprinkler system are installed in this compartment, and just outside the compartment, specifically for this type of incident. The lines are nylon composites and will burn rather easily as they are made from some petrolum products. Remember the capsuns and winch equipment using hydrolic fluids that are flammible and run through a maze of pipes to suppy the systems with the fluids needed for these machines to work. Under ANY condition a fire on board a ship is serious, regardless of the size, as damage can spread rapidly. Miles of eletric and communication lines run through this area and are a concern as a fire could crawl along the lines and go into other compartments these lines run through, this is called fire running, and I am sure the crew recongnize this condition and keep water on all these conduit runs keeping the fire contained.

 

The good part of this is these ships are build with fireproof doors that are used to contain the fire to a section of the ship. Most ships have a very refined sprinker system that once set off can keep the fire compartmented. Plastics burn fast, and produce black sute that easily covers steel painted surfaces. Fire burning hot WILL warp steel, and even melt aluminum. One other thing to consider, damage due to water and heat, although not indicated by the outside photograph was down to the decks below. Most causes the Stern lower decks contain the emergency steering room which is very critical, if that was damaged, it might have to be dry docked to verify how much was damaged.

 

Only from limited views I have of this ship, it did not suffer severe damage, but serious damage this will have to go into major repairs before it will be able to pass inspection to be put into service. Captain and crew did an excellent job, from what I understand keeping passengers informed, and on the ready if more extreme measures were needed. From what I could tell, once fire was contained, it did not pose a threat to passengers or the ship, as the damage photographs show a demarcation of the damage and it was contained to the aft section of the ship. The investigation of what started this fire will be complete and lesson's learned will be valuable both for ships design and refining crew and passenger evacuation procedures. NEVER jump to conclusions. It could be as simple as a short circuit in electrical panel, so DO NOT JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS of the cause. They will find it.

 

The crew obviously did a very good job containing, and putting the fire out. Deck plates and bulkhead plates get extremely hot fast, and the crew just did not shoot water onto the fire, but had to keep the adjacent deck and bulkhead plates cool by watering the areas just outside the fire to cool them down, as this conductive head could have cause more outbreaks of fire if they did not do this. Good Job...

 

Hope this provides you and inside look, from a person who has been there and done it, of what the Mooring Room is and its use, and most of all the fact many precautions are take to assure if something like this happens, fire equipment is readily available, the design of the ship isolates this from spreading, but most of all, this is when a crew shows its training being put to use. It is obvious to me RCL has a good training program for its crewmembers, and the Captain made logical and good decisions along the way.

[Big_G]

Thanks to Dharma for keeping us posted. Grandeur was our first so it's little extra sad for us.

[vols_159]

This is not an attempt to continue the passport vs no passport debate, but I am curious about what the process is for those traveling on DL/BC. We always travel on passports, but never thought about whether or not we would be grabbing them in case of a middle of the night muster... in that case, say our cabin was no longer accessible... we could potentially be trying to get home without ANY id?

 

They will wave it just like the carnival accidents.

[vols_159]

They can always replacement temporarily with what they can get. I'm betting temporary carpet and drapes are cheaper than losing millions per cruise.

 

My bet is that all will depend on how extensive any damage to the MDR is. It would be tough to have a cruise with that part closed. Lounges or crew areas can be managed to other areas temporarily and let a cruise go on.

 

They are fully insured insurance will cover loss revenues also

[betsyl]

Finally -- just finished reading pages 1 - 42! Glad I delayed getting on CC to a work day so as not to waste my Memorial Day-off!:D

[lawblond7]

Apparently the flights back to Baltimore are not going as swiftly as possible, hopefully the flights get back on track.

 

http://www.wbal.com/article/100130/2/template-story/Passengers-On-Fire-Damaged-Cruise-Ship-Wait-On-Flights-Home

 

 

Working in the commercial aviation industry - dealing with flgiht tracking, etc. the delay can be due to the fact these are unscheduled planes - they were added to the flight path. Flying into the DC metro area (3 airports Dulles, National and BWI) and there is ALOT of traffic on a weekday, especially after a 3 day weekend, so the delay most likely is do to too much traffic. There also has to be availabilty for a gate and staff once the plane arrives at BWI and most likely this will need to be squeezed in. I know the frustration

 

Sharon

[Krazy Kruizers]

Hi All! Our flight departs Freeport at 4pm. We just went thru a shipwide immigration process in the Palladium theater that went very smoothly. We are taking a chartered flight into Baltimore and they are driving us to the port.

 

We have been eating in the WJ for all of our meals and even though given the circumstances it hasn't been that bad at all. I will NEVER EVER complain about an embarkation lunch again....lol.

 

We have decided to continue our vacation in OCMD and keep our toes in the sand and drinks in our hand.

 

Just some things that might be of interest: premium coffee has been free, and drink packages have been refunded in full.

 

It seems that other passengers that were closer to the fire had a much more harrowing experience such as our tablemates who were on deck 3 after very near where the fire started. They had no power in their cabin...barely heard the captain awaking us at 2:50am and had their stateroom attendent banging at the door and screaming to leave. They had no lights to gather any belongings and in fact some passengers were pulled out of their rooms physically in boxers shorts. Add no lights and smoke. We luckily had no real idea what was going on just a few staterooms down.

 

Anyway..My DH is starting behind me telling me to get off the computer. Best of luck all...time to think about our next cruise that we will get a nice chuck of change off of!

 

Thank you for the update.

That must have been very scary for those people in the cabins back there.

Have a safe flight back to the states and try to enjoy what is left of your vacation.

[Dizney]

Hi I'm new to the board and I'm new to cruising. My family and I are booked on Grandeur of the Seas out of Baltimore on July 5th. I came here to see if I could find out any information or advice or just some wisdom from folks who are familiar with cruising and when things go wrong (the fire). But every time someone posts something that could turn into a meaningful conversation - someone else goes and writes something completely ignorant and ridiculous. If anyone can guide me to a site where there is a productive discussion going on - I'd sure appreciate it. Thanks.

 

Welcome!

Do a lot of skimming! There is a wealth of information, but you will need to assimilate it. As a PP stated, what's ignorant to you may be gold to someone else.

Happy Skimming...Reading! :-)

[cruisingram1]

Lifeboats are stowed in their davits above the promenade deck. When Dharma said they were lowered, that means they were lowered to the promenade deck, which is also the embarkation deck, and on many ships the muster location. This is a preliminary move, and sometimes is done before the General Alarm is sounded so that the moving of the boats and davits is done before the passengers muster under them. When the Captain decides to actually abandon ship, the passengers will board the ship at the promenade deck, and where the muster stations are inside, the groups of guests will be escorted from the muster station to the boat. Once everyone is onboard, the boat will be lowered to the water. The tender ports are not usable during an emergency, as they are too close to the water, and could flood if opened at sea.

Thank you for that clarification. I guess I was right in the first place.. that you would get on a lifeboat and ride it down to the water. On all our cruises, I don't recall any staff member ever giving specific details about what happens in the event of having to abandon ship other than to go to your muster station. This incident reminds us to pay attention during muster. It does not hurt to be informed and prepared. Also going to pack flashlights - one for each person and keep it in the nightstand for easy finding.

[ryano]

This incident alone is why I cringed everytime I read "thats why I stick with Royal Caribbean" back when Carnival had all its run of bad luck.

 

Things can happen to any ship on any line. The difference is how the corporation handles things afterward. From all accounts I can gather, RCI seems to be doing a bang up job.

[Boatdrill]

Hope this provides you and inside look, from a person who has been there and done it....

 

Thank you for a very informative post...much appreciated.

[Tika]

My last 5 cruises I have had a balcony.

 

NEVER, EVER, NOT ONCE have I found a cigarette butt on my balcony.

 

Ditto Johneeo !!!!!!!! On our "many" cruises in staterooms with balconys either forward, aft or mid ship we have never ever found a cig. butt on our balcony!!!!!!! I have also never seen anyone deliberately throw something over a rail!

Amen.

[MADflyer]

I see that a Delta flight 8876 on a 767 wide-body has lifted from Freeport for BWI. This is not the normally scheduled route for this flight number. That would carry only around 320 passengers, I would guess.

 

This shows up on www flight radar 24 dot com .

 

No other flights show up on this route at the moment.

[cruzincurt]

My guess is the guy posing in the picture at the dock hiding his face will soon be an ex-employee if he was one.

[MADflyer]

Two more 767s are heading in to Freeport right now. An Omni Air flight is inbound from Dallas and a North American Airlines flight from Norfolk, VA. They might normally be charter planes that carry troops....

 

So there are another 700 passengers that will be on their way out soon.

[Piepkorn]

I see that a Delta flight 8876 on a 767 wide-body has lifted from Freeport for BWI. This is not the normally scheduled route for this flight number. That would carry only around 320 passengers, I would guess.

 

This shows up on www flight radar 24 dot com .

 

No other flights show up on this route at the moment.

 

Miami Air has run a couple of flights as well using a 738. There are at least 2 - 763's and a 752 operated by Delta on this as of the moment. Pulled that up from Flightaware.

 

With that said, much better service than what was provided by Carnival related to their 2 incidents of late.

[chengkp75]

That's what I was thinking.

 

Unless they can snitch matching soft goods from another ship entering refit, a big challenge may simply be getting carpeting, upholstery, drapes, etc. to match what was just installed.

 

Would the manufacturer have enough just lying around to replace what was damaged in aft guest spaces?

 

If not, I bet the factory is working Megga-overtime right now.

 

When we refurbished the Norwegian Sky to the Pride of Aloha, every square yard of carpet was renewed (had to get the Hawaiian theme!). The factory in India had screwed up the order, and NCL was chartering a plane every time there was 10 rolls ready for shipment, so the carpet layers were actually waiting on the carpet during drydock, and we finished the carpet renewal on the repo cruise to the islands.

[skittl1321]

They are fully insured insurance will cover loss revenues also

 

 

Are you actually privy to this information, or is this just a guess?

 

Many large corporations self-insure.

[royalbluepea]

I volunteer at BWI and they have asked for extra volunteers today to help with the Royal Caribbean returning passengers. There are 10 scheduled for today and one tomorrow.

[m*u*g*]

Are you actually privy to this information, or is this just a guess?

 

Many large corporations self-insure.

 

 

Like BP?

[Winnigirl]

The tabloid journalism isn't just restricted to the USA....the UK papers have got hold of this story and embellished it... especially the Daily Mail!

 

What really got my goat was the general publics comments about the story which ranged from "cruising is just for old people" and that cruise ships are just "floating council house estates" to "you would have to pay me to sail on a floating death trap"

 

How many of these people have actually been on a cruise I wonder! :mad:

 

I am glad that everyone is safe on this cruise and I hope that repairs don't take too long and that the Grandeur is sailing again soon!

 

The Daily Mail LOVES cruise ship horror stories. The comments from the "non" cruisers (all, evidently, who are experts on cruising) would be laughable if they weren't so totally ridiculous. I wonder, if all those "you couldn't pay me to take a cruise" people were offered a free cruise, how many would turn it down? Not too many, I suspect. (You forgot "only snobs cruise"). ;)

[chengkp75]

It's my understanding that Freeport has pretty extensive ship repair departments. It wouldn't be unusual for them to already have on hand most of what would be needed to do all but the most custom repairs. They wouldn't have the right carpet for instance, but most everything else should be able to be sourced pretty quick. I can't imagine that Royal doesn't have backup somewhere or stuff stored for new ships not yet layed.

 

While carpets, upholstery, and drapery is easily replaced (given time or the decision to use what is available), what is really needed is the joinery panels that make up the visible walls and ceilings of the spaces. While Freeport is an extensive shipyard, shipyards are predominately concerned with ship mechanical and structural repairs. While some shipyards are experienced in cruise ship renovation and refurbishment, they do not have the materials for the joiner work laying around. They may have the steel to replace the window frames for the lounge, but not the joiner panels. These are sheet metal sandwiches with insulation stuffed in between. The panels have tongue and groove edges to join them together. The outer sheet of metal will normally have either some form of vinyl wall covering, wood grain vinyl, or tile as the exterior surface. Tile panels are no problem, it is getting the panels with the right surface coating, and with the electrical cable runs in the proper places that will cause delays. RCI probably does have some of this on hand in a corporate warehouse, the question is, how much.

 

The amount of spare carpeting kept onboard is limited by the fire load that its storage causes on the ship's sprinkler system. When the Aloha was renewing carpet on the way to Hawaii, as I've mentioned in earlier post, USCG would only let us carry as much as the installers could install during the transit.

 

RCI's best hope is that a sister ship is near refurbishment period, and the materials staged for that ship can be used for the Grandeur.

[KeywestK]

Hi I'm new to the board and I'm new to cruising. My family and I are booked on Grandeur of the Seas out of Baltimore on July 5th. I came here to see if I could find out any information or advice or just some wisdom from folks who are familiar with cruising and when things go wrong (the fire). But every time someone posts something that could turn into a meaningful conversation - someone else goes and writes something completely ignorant and ridiculous. If anyone can guide me to a site where there is a productive discussion going on - I'd sure appreciate it. Thanks.

 

Actually Cruise Critic USUALLY is an excellent source of information regarding all things cruising. The vast majority of folks who post on these boards are really good people who, like most of us, share a passion for cruising and travel in general. Many of us are very well traveled, and we are happy to share what information we know, what works well, what doesn't, recommendations/advice, etc. Unfortunately, as you would find in any large (and oftentimes anonymous) group, there will be a small faction of folks who use the boards in a very unproductive manner. Those are the ones you will quickly learn to ignore. Don't allow that small faction turn you away from an otherwise exceptional website and group of people who have only one agenda--to help ALL of us have a better and more fulfilling cruising experience. And maybe to share a few laughs along the way;)

 

Time to get off my soapbox now;):cool:

[chengkp75]

Thank you for that clarification. I guess I was right in the first place.. that you would get on a lifeboat and ride it down to the water. On all our cruises, I don't recall any staff member ever giving specific details about what happens in the event of having to abandon ship other than to go to your muster station. This incident reminds us to pay attention during muster. It does not hurt to be informed and prepared. Also going to pack flashlights - one for each person and keep it in the nightstand for easy finding.

 

When I was with NCL, we would have one boat lowered to the rail during the passenger drill, and myself and a deck officer would stand by after the drill to answer questions about the boats, drills, etc. A simple thing, but something that the passengers seemed to truly appreciate.

 

Every professional mariner I know lives with a flashlight clipped to the bulkhead at his/her bunk. When the alarms go off at night, and the lights are out, you don't need to be fumbling around trying to find your shoes! I have one next to my bunk, one in my office, and one in my pocket at all times.