Is Carnival Falling Behind?

[kybluecruiser]

I think carnival is still somewhat innovative. I think ncl has copied some of their innovations, such as a large waterworks, the lani deck, if i am not mistaken i believe Carnvial was the first to add an outdoor big screen on lido,, just to name few. Those seem small but they are being used industry wide now across differnt lines. It seems like royal or ncl arent that innovative. Royal has copied NCL freestyle dining on quantum but expanded it. Ncl has copied carnivals lani deck and water works on breakaway and getaway and expanded it. So dont count carnival out.

Edited May 12, 2014 by kybluecruiser

[PaulMedik]

The Dream class ships have the best spa of any ship we have been on, we have cruised on the Dream 4 times mainly because of the Cloud 9 Spa...

 

 

gklow,

 

Dream specifically has THE best spa IMO. I love the steam rooms, thallosotherapy sp? poo, and heated tables.

[aaron3219]

It's not the size of the ship, it's the motion of the ocean!

 

Seriously though. I'd rather have an affordable fun time, then spend a bunch of cash for a bunch of fluff and a floating city.

 

I felt great on our cruise because we had spent so little. It was nice being on board, everything is paid for minus the extra drinks and other small things.

[OCruisers]

Carnival's new ships stopped being innovative in 1996, when the Destiny was launched. Most new ships in the Carnival fleet have been derived from the same old design since.

 

Carnival's CEO has made it very clear that their niche are the passengers looking at the most affordable way to cruise, which means that they will not invest in new ship designs of the caliber of Royal's or NCL's newbuilds. Its not what they are interested in. It's just not financially feasible to charge budget prices to support what an Oasis type ship offers.

 

There's no right or wrong here, and Carnival hasn't "lost its edge" because they are doing things the way that works for them. Each one of these cruise line is using a different strategy to attract passengers, and each one is being successful at it. The day that Carnival stops filling up their ships and making money, they may be forced to get more innovative then. But until then, Carnival will continue charging budget prices and keeping their ships more basic.

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

Nicely said .... Very much agree!

LuLu

[Topo Gigio]

Thanks to Tapi for some well written and well reasoned contributions. Very constructive and informative.

 

Tapi always hits the nail on it's head.

[Tapi]

Bigger ships = More people = Longer lines:eek:

 

 

While the bigger ships may not be for everybody, this is one of the biggest misconceptions about ships like the Oasis twins. There are no lines, literally. Everything, including the design of the cruise terminal and the layout of the ship, is done in such a way that everybody is scattered over a larger area, giving the feeling as if you're, many times, all by yourself. It's truly an amazing thing to see how they handle the crowds.

 

The Oasis twins are divided into 5 neighborhoods. Think of it as 5 smaller ships tied together. Not once did I stand in line for anything, from the moment we boarded until we got off the ship on the last day.

 

I have felt much more crowded and stood in much longer lines on a Fantasy class ship, which have a worse passenger flow and ship design, as well as a less favorable space to passenger ratio.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[Tutontow]

Did the Breeze last year, a great ship, but just did the Ecstasy and it was awesome, bigger isn't always better :cool:

 

Totally agree we much prefer The Legend to The Dream. It seems to me the public areas aren't any bigger on The Dream. They added 1000 more passengers and left the amount of staff the same as The Legend. Everyone on The Dream seemed overworked and all of the public areas seemed over crowded.

 

I found The Legend very mellow and relaxing. When I got off of The Dream I was grinding my teeth.

[Krissica]

Carnival's new ships stopped being innovative in 1996, when the Destiny was launched. Most new ships in the Carnival fleet have been derived from the same old design since.

 

Carnival's CEO has made it very clear that their niche are the passengers looking at the most affordable way to cruise, which means that they will not invest in new ship designs of the caliber of Royal's or NCL's newbuilds. Its not what they are interested in. It's just not financially feasible to charge budget prices to support what an Oasis type ship offers.

 

There's no right or wrong here, and Carnival hasn't "lost its edge" because they are doing things the way that works for them. Each one of these cruise line is using a different strategy to attract passengers, and each one is being successful at it. The day that Carnival stops filling up their ships and making money, they may be forced to get more innovative then. But until then, Carnival will continue charging budget prices and keeping their ships more basic.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

Very well said.

If every cruise line offered the exact same type of cruise, it would be boring. The car analogy used in this thread was spot on as well. If I want a BMW, I will go get a BMW at the BMW dealership but that is not what I'm looking for. I like Carnival for both what it is and what it isn't. If I ever feel like I want more than that, I know I will have to go somewhere other than Carnival.

[stevenr597]

I am not interested in the mammouth ships. Too many people, much more $$, and not interested in some of what is on the ship. Yes, I like RCCL and did one on a small ship of theirs, but I just cruised on the Carnival Ecstasy and enjoyed the smaller ship, and Carnival has what the others do not have......."no single supplement" on some of their cruises. A cruise is what you make it!:D

 

One could argue that 90,000 or Panamax Cruise Ships are the largest size that makes sense. If you consider this to be true than one can argue that Carnival's larger ships are larger just for the sake of being larger and carrying more passengers.

 

The question I still have raised is that Carnival used to be fairly inovative. In the sake of being the cheapest line sailing have they given up on having new and inovative ships as compared to their competitors such as NCL and RCCL.

[kybluecruiser]

One could argue that 90,000 or Panamax Cruise Ships are the largest size that makes sense. If you consider this to be true than one can argue that Carnival's larger ships are larger just for the sake of being larger and carrying more passengers.

 

The question I still have raised is that Carnival used to be fairly inovative. In the sake of being the cheapest line sailing have they given up on having new and inovative ships as compared to their competitors such as NCL and RCCL.

 

What do you consider being innovated? Bumper cars? Ferris wheel at sea? Flow rider instead of waterworks? What has ncl innovated that they havent copied?

[bobnsons]

It's not the size of the ship, it's the motion of the ocean!

 

 

By golly I think you have it.

 

 

It was not all that long ago Carnival wanted not to meet expectations they wanted to surpass them. Carnival even wanted to hear back from cruisers and gave out feed back forms. When was the last time you saw one of those forms?

 

 

For those who have cruised with Carnival for the past 8 + years it ain't what it use to be. They keep doing their best to squeeze more and more money from the customers.

[Warm Breezes]

I personally don't need CCL to copy cat or lead NCL and RCCL when it comes to innovation. I prefer to have options when I choose a cruise. When we sail, we are not always looking for the same thing. We look at each ship and what they offer and not necessarily the line (unless we have a FCC to use up). Sometimes our wants are to sail a larger ship and we are willing to pay more to do it for that particular vacation. Most of the time not. But it is great to have options on all the different lines and ships when making that decision. If CCL isn't as innovative as you like then choose another ship....I truly believe there are plenty of others not looking for that innovation to take your spot, especially for the price CCL charges.

[CJinFLA00]

Totally agree we much prefer The Legend to The Dream. It seems to me the public areas aren't any bigger on The Dream. They added 1000 more passengers and left the amount of staff the same as The Legend. Everyone on The Dream seemed overworked and all of the public areas seemed over crowded.

 

I found The Legend very mellow and relaxing. When I got off of The Dream I was grinding my teeth.

 

respectfully, totally disagree. Loved the Dream, didn't care for the Legend.

[JustMeandTheSea]

Let me just say that Vista will be Carnival's most innovative ship yet! So I think...

[Maraprince]

Lets not forget that RCCL copied Carnival's idea of outdoor movies and water slides!

 

If you consider bumper cars to be innovative with RCCL, go pay for most venues on their ships that you will not use but are being charged for

anyway!

 

Many of RCCL new and larger ships can only fit in a limited number of ports. I not too keen to spend more money on a smaller cabin with less storage space and then end up getting a hot dog from a truck on board in the dining room.

 

The Quantum does not have a MDR but a number of dining venues some of which are extra charge. The downfall here is that the menus do not change daily. One of them will require formal attire all the time -- lobster is on the menu here. Reservations are "strongly" suggested for both the dining venues and shows. No reservation, show up and take your chances. The buffet area will be open 24/7 and serve breakfast all day. Sort of tells you where RCCL is expecting the most activity.

 

MARAPRINCE

[topguy]

Besides Carnival, I have only sailed NCL, so I can only compare those two lines. NCL does have a lot more to offer and a lot of newer ships. Carnival is more for the budget minded and because so, it would not have as many amenities as the others.

[jimbo5544]

Let me just say that Vista will be Carnival's most innovative ship yet! So I think...

 

I totally agree.....sort of.;)

[EngIceDave]

I can't remember all the ships I have been on, but I know I have sailed only CCL and RCL

 

For example been on CCL Triumph and Valor and been on RCL's Freedom and was on the inaugural sailing of the Allure

 

I don't think CCL is "falling behind," but rather choosing to not go the "mega-route" of ships like Oasis/Allure. Yes, the open center Central Park of those two is innovative or different, that doesn't create superiority or that one is tracking behind another.

 

Seems to me, CCL has pretty much always marketed themselves as the affordable and family oriented cruise line, especially since moving away from their "party ships" advertising campaign of years ago.

 

Yes, I can go on a larger RCL ship, but that doesn't automatically translate to a more superior cruise or a more superior level of service.

 

It's like arguments people have in my industry daily over a Honda being better than a Kawasaki, when the truth is, both are great products, it's just a personal preference of maybe the service you can get at your local shop.

 

It's the same thing here, both RCL and CCL offer great products, it's just that certain products will appeal to one over another for whatever particular reason. Some like the lower prices, some like the larger/different design, some think one has better food than another and some just like the kooky-ness of the staff or waiters and some others like feeling like they're cruising on a giant Bellagio Hotel/Casino

 

There's no "bad" or "behind," there's preference and CCL is offering an alternative to RCL, which is the smart move, because you never want to follow, always be different and always offer the customer a choice. CCL is offering a clear choice over their competitors, be it in price, packages or general "feel," but they're not "falling behind"

[Midwestgal]

Just off the Breeze and I must say it's a beautiful ship ...nicest ship in the fleet.

I'm glad there not going the way of the Oasis class of ships as not everyone wants that large of ship with all the things RC offers. As far as RCL & NCL bring compared to BMW that's pretty funny, Princess or HAL yes but not RCL & NCL.

 

That being said we're going to bypass RC and check out Princess next.

[Georgiagolfer]

By golly I think you have it.

 

 

It was not all that long ago Carnival wanted not to meet expectations they wanted to surpass them. Carnival even wanted to hear back from cruisers and gave out feed back forms. When was the last time you saw one of those forms?

 

 

For those who have cruised with Carnival for the past 8 + years it ain't what it use to be. They keep doing their best to squeeze more and more money from the customers.

 

Having cruised on CCL since 1992, I have always filled out a survey. Initially we did this on ship prior to debark, but the last 4-5 years always received Email survey from CCL, and a follow up survey the last 2 cruises.

[Hendricks Clan]

As someone who jumped to NCL in 2012 from CCL, I personally have no intention of coming back to CCL until they decide to catch up. Its funny every time I see a thread like this I keep seeing, "Well I don't want to pay for this and that, that you do on NCL and RCI." We cruised over Easter on Epic, we had 2 Aft balconies for less money than one balcony interline rate on an older, smaller CCL ship such as Glory, Liberty, and Conquest were the 3 we looked at. The NCL product just simply appeals more to us right now than what CCL offers. It would be hard for me to change back and miss a lot of the activities that NCL offers that CCL can't even come close to offering. That said it doesn't take anything away from CCL, I have throughly enjoyed all but 1 of my cruises with them and thats what made me look elsewhere after a terrible cruise. I hope one day I can come back to CCL, but it just seems like they are falling farther and farther behind.

Edited May 12, 2014 by Hendricks Clan

[Georgiagolfer]

Carnival is falling behind, but only in new ship builds. DW and I have sailed CCL and RCI, and like both lines. Each line is different but similar, just like each class ship for each line. Haven't sailed Oasis/Allure on RCI but have sailed Freedom of the Seas. Did not use flow rider or rock wall. Did not attend ice show, tickets not available as all seats were reserved before we could get. So these 3 innovations had no impact on my cruise. Are they better because they have these? If you use and/or participate, maybe.

 

IMO, CCL is performing just well in a very tough market. Basically, to each his own.

[jimbo5544]

I can't remember all the ships I have been on, but I know I have sailed only CCL and RCL

 

For example been on CCL Triumph and Valor and been on RCL's Freedom and was on the inaugural sailing of the Allure

 

I don't think CCL is "falling behind," but rather choosing to not go the "mega-route" of ships like Oasis/Allure. Yes, the open center Central Park of those two is innovative or different, that doesn't create superiority or that one is tracking behind another.

 

Seems to me, CCL has pretty much always marketed themselves as the affordable and family oriented cruise line, especially since moving away from their "party ships" advertising campaign of years ago.

 

Yes, I can go on a larger RCL ship, but that doesn't automatically translate to a more superior cruise or a more superior level of service.

 

It's like arguments people have in my industry daily over a Honda being better than a Kawasaki, when the truth is, both are great products, it's just a personal preference of maybe the service you can get at your local shop.

 

It's the same thing here, both RCL and CCL offer great products, it's just that certain products will appeal to one over another for whatever particular reason. Some like the lower prices, some like the larger/different design, some think one has better food than another and some just like the kooky-ness of the staff or waiters and some others like feeling like they're cruising on a giant Bellagio Hotel/Casino

 

There's no "bad" or "behind," there's preference and CCL is offering an alternative to RCL, which is the smart move, because you never want to follow, always be different and always offer the customer a choice. CCL is offering a clear choice over their competitors, be it in price, packages or general "feel," but they're not "falling behind"

 

One of the best posts I have seen in a long while. Thanks for the input.

[cruisinfanatic]

Carnival had a couple tough years, there is no question. While cutbacks are there (and they are there for all cruise lines, make no mistake about that), I think a lot of the criticism and band wagon mentality. Having sailed Oasis on March I can honestly tell you that I thought the Carnival MDR food was a bit better. Carnival Steakhouses are much better than Chops. I really felt nickel and dimed on our Oasis cruise. That is not a better cruise experience in my book.

Why? Nothing free on Carnival that isn't free on Oasis

[cruisinfanatic]

Bigger ships = More people = Longer lines:eek:

you are uninformed