Fuel Rebate?

[nealstuber]

As one of the few folks who actually paid a fuel surcharge a few years ago (albeit on a pretty great rate) when oil hit 90 bucks a barrel, I'm wondering when Carnival and the other lines will start offering rebates now that Oil has dipped below 40.

 

Recalling some of the arguments of the defenders back then:

 

Fuel is their biggest variable cost.

 

They could not predict this unexpected change in price when selling cabins over a year in advance.

 

Its not that much money.

 

Seems all of the above are true in the reciprocal situation. Putting the rebates aside, why are fares and on board costs rising when the lines have enjoyed this unexpected windfall?

Edited August 25, 2015 by nealstuber

[BenjiRodney]

Because they are being forced to add expensive scrubbers to the exhaust to control the emissions from the smoke stacks. Carnival is still the most economical to take a cruise with. I don't expect a rebate since they are not charging a fuel surcharge.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[nealstuber]

I don't expect a rebate since they are not charging a fuel surcharge.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

You may have missed the surcharges of the late 2000s since your signature indicates you were on a cruising sabbatical back then.

Edited August 25, 2015 by nealstuber

[JohnSpo]

Seems all of the above are true in the reciprocal situation. Putting the rebates aside, why are fares and on board costs rising when the lines have enjoyed this unexpected windfall?

 

The cruise lines are charging the higher cruise fares because the customers are willing to pay the higher fares.

 

Airfares and airline fees are also rising even with lower fuel prices so the same thing is also going on with the airlines.

 

Perhaps since oil and gas prices are so low at home, people may be willing to pay more for such things as cruises and airfares.

[sanmarcosman]

Bless your heart ;) It would be nice but it aint gonna happen.

Also, Carnival and other cruise lines buy future contracts for oil. The oil they are burning today cost more than what a contract purchased today would cost. This is because they purchased the current contract 2 years ago (approximately) and oil was more expensive at that time.

Edited August 25, 2015 by sanmarcosman

[nealstuber]

The cruise lines are charging the higher cruise fares because the customers are willing to pay the higher fares.

 

Airfares and airline fees are also rising even with lower fuel prices so the same thing is also going on with the airlines.

 

Perhaps since oil and gas prices are so low at home, people may be willing to pay more for such things as cruises and airfares.

 

You are correct sir! Shame, back when fuel prices were so high, the lines couldn't figure out we had less discretionary income and went ahead with the surcharges anyway.

[riclop]

As one of the few folks who actually paid a fuel surcharge a few years ago (albeit on a pretty great rate) when oil hit 90 bucks a barrel, I'm wondering when Carnival and the other lines will start offering rebates now that Oil has dipped below 40.

 

Recalling some of the arguments of the defenders back then:

 

Fuel is their biggest variable cost.

 

They could not predict this unexpected change in price when selling cabins over a year in advance.

 

Its not that much money.

 

Seems all of the above are true in the reciprocal situation. Putting the rebates aside, why are fares and on board costs rising when the lines have enjoyed this unexpected windfall?

Ha Ha Ha now that's funny, but don't hold your breathe.

[klfrodo]

As one of the few folks who actually paid a fuel surcharge a few years ago (albeit on a pretty great rate) when oil hit 90 bucks a barrel, I'm wondering when Carnival and the other lines will start offering rebates now that Oil has dipped below 40.

 

Recalling some of the arguments of the defenders back then:

 

Fuel is their biggest variable cost.

 

They could not predict this unexpected change in price when selling cabins over a year in advance.

 

Its not that much money.

 

Seems all of the above are true in the reciprocal situation. Putting the rebates aside, why are fares and on board costs rising when the lines have enjoyed this unexpected windfall?

 

1st world problems

 

When you lose your job, lose the house, and can't feed your kids,,,, come back and whine about the cost of your cruise vacation.

[S.S.Oceanlover]

1st world problems

 

When you lose your job, lose the house, and can't feed your kids,,,, come back and whine about the cost of your cruise vacation.

 

I get warm fuzzies every time i read one of your post.!

 

Keep them coming:)

 

Bill

[sparks1093]

As one of the few folks who actually paid a fuel surcharge a few years ago (albeit on a pretty great rate) when oil hit 90 bucks a barrel, I'm wondering when Carnival and the other lines will start offering rebates now that Oil has dipped below 40.

 

Recalling some of the arguments of the defenders back then:

 

Fuel is their biggest variable cost.

 

They could not predict this unexpected change in price when selling cabins over a year in advance.

 

Its not that much money.

 

Seems all of the above are true in the reciprocal situation. Putting the rebates aside, why are fares and on board costs rising when the lines have enjoyed this unexpected windfall?

 

Scrubbers and having to use more expensive fuel when in US waters on the ships that don't have scrubbers. I doubt that the cost of cruising will go down any time soon and is more likely to rise instead. As much as I am hooked on cruising if and when it becomes cost prohibitive there are other ways to vacation.

[RuthlessBoss]

You are correct sir! Shame, back when fuel prices were so high, the lines couldn't figure out we had less discretionary income and went ahead with the surcharges anyway.

 

No way to politely answer this. Cruising is a luxury item. Every one's income was lower then, including cruise workers.

[Sweet Dutch Girl]

I really never understand posts that are accusatory against a cruiseline on a money issue. Don't like the fare, don't go. Don't think it is fair for a cruiseline to make a profit, don't go. Don't like the cost for "special items" on a cruise then don't buy. Think drinks are too expensive, then don't drink. I just don't get it!

[NCTribeFan]

I really never understand posts that are accusatory against a cruiseline on a money issue. Don't like the fare, don't go. Don't think it is fair for a cruiseline to make a profit, don't go. Don't like the cost for "special items" on a cruise then don't buy. Think drinks are too expensive, then don't drink. I just don't get it!

 

Thanks. Saved me the time to write that, which is pretty much exactly what I was going to say.

 

So, fuel prices have dropped. Why aren't my groceries immediately way cheaper? Why haven't my utility bills dropped over night? Why didn't my airfare for my November cruise drop by half?

 

You want to talk economics, how about this? Fares are rising because of supply and demand. If the cruiselines can charge more and fill ships, they will charge what the market will bear.

 

In inflation-adjusted dollars, I'm paying considerably less per night now than when I started sailing in 2001. I'm not going to complain that they aren't dropping prices further. And I'm not going to come here and cry CUTBACKS CUTBACKS CUTBACKS when I'm still receiving a tremendous vacation value for my dollars.

[nealstuber]

I really never understand posts that are accusatory against a cruiseline on a money issue. Don't like the fare, don't go. Don't think it is fair for a cruiseline to make a profit, don't go. Don't like the cost for "special items" on a cruise then don't buy. Think drinks are too expensive, then don't drink. I just don't get it!

 

Thanks. Saved me the time to write that, which is pretty much exactly what I was going to say.

 

So, fuel prices have dropped. Why aren't my groceries immediately way cheaper? Why haven't my utility bills dropped over night? Why didn't my airfare for my November cruise drop by half?

 

You want to talk economics, how about this? Fares are rising because of supply and demand. If the cruiselines can charge more and fill ships, they will charge what the market will bear.

 

In inflation-adjusted dollars, I'm paying considerably less per night now than when I started sailing in 2001. I'm not going to complain that they aren't dropping prices further. And I'm not going to come here and cry CUTBACKS CUTBACKS CUTBACKS when I'm still receiving a tremendous vacation value for my dollars.

 

Wow, such vitriol and unfounded assumptions.

Where to start...

Yes I do know what its like to loose a job, but found another before it affected my house and its really not a big issue for me.

 

The rest of you are either too shallow or too self or self confident to get to sarcasm in my original post.

 

OF COURSE its about economics and supply and demand. My point was cruise lines should not be whining about their costs when it comes to fuel surcharges or scrubbers when they try to raise our costs. Either they can do it for what the market will bear or someone else will.

 

And while we're on the topic of supply and demand, that goes for cruise workers too. Cruise lines can hire from countries where my tips for a week would be more than what they'd make in a month (plus tax free room and board). We should not be guilted by the cruiselines (or their cheerleaders on this board) to pay higher tips and service charges when there are so many willing to work for less.

 

I too am paying for cruises what I paid 20 yrs ago too, as I'm paying about the same for just about everything except Healthcare, Education, Taxes and everything else the government touches. But, since I would be earning the same if not for hard won promotions and merit increases, I don't feel obligated to bequeath my normal 1.5 to 2.5% increase to the cruiselines.

 

And yes, it ticks me off that my grocery and gas bills don't go down as quickly as they rise when a corresponding change happens with the price of oil - and I'm sure it ticks others off as well.

 

So I say clearly to all who are too obtuse to read between my lines:

CCC, RCCL, and the rest of you guys - We get that you're making more money with low fuel prices and that's OK - just don't come to us hat in hand for an increase in fares, surcharges or OB fees every time your costs increase. Your costs are your problem, my costs are my problem, set your price where you think I will pay, but don't use the BS excuse of fuel costs in the next 5 to 10 years!

Edited August 26, 2015 by nealstuber

[sparks1093]

My point was cruise lines should not be whining about their costs when it comes to fuel surcharges or scrubbers when they try to raise our costs. Either they can do it for what the market will bear or someone else will.

 

And while we're on the topic of supply and demand, that goes for cruise workers too. Cruise lines can hire from countries where my tips for a week would be more than what they'd make in a month (plus tax free room and board). We should not be guilted by the cruiselines (or their cheerleaders on this board) to pay higher tips and service charges when there are so many willing to work for less.

 

So I say clearly to all who are too obtuse to read between my lines:

CCC, RCCL, and the rest of you guys - We get that you're making more money with low fuel prices and that's OK - just don't come to us hat in hand for an increase in fares, surcharges or OB fees every time your costs increase. Your costs are your problem, my costs are my problem, set your price where you think I will pay, but don't use the BS excuse of fuel costs in the next 5 to 10 years!

 

I've never heard a cruise line whine about their costs except maybe at a shareholder meeting.

 

While there may seem to be an endless supply of workers from other countries to fill cruise ships the numbers are much smaller than they look- first the number of people that are willing to leave their families for months at a time is not as large as you think and second the number of workers that are both qualified and can pass the rigourous background checks cuts the first number down significantly. Like any other employer when faced with a limited talent pool they must set their rates accordingly to attract the best workers.

 

And their costs are very much your problem since your fare has to cover said costs in order for the company to make a profit.

[Sweet Dutch Girl]

Wow, such vitriol and unfounded assumptions.

 

 

So I say clearly to all who are too obtuse to read between my lines:

CCC, RCCL, and the rest of you guys - We get that you're making more money with low fuel prices and that's OK - just don't come to us hat in hand for an increase in fares, surcharges or OB fees every time your costs increase. Your costs are your problem, my costs are my problem, set your price where you think I will pay, but don't use the BS excuse of fuel costs in the next 5 to 10 years!

 

They can use whatever "excuse" they deem fit to use. It's their (and their stockholders) cruiseline....they could say that they are charging a "sur-charge" for the open air surrounding the cruise ship and I can believe them or not but I will still need to pay it to board "THEIR" ship. Again, you can choose to sail or not...no one is twisting your arm. You can tip or not, again no one is twisting your arm, you can rant and rave about how "unfair" their practices are but none of your tirades will get you on the ship without paying what "THE PRICE" they set is.

 

You, after all, have the upper hand as the end consumer. If everyone thought as you did they could choose to boycott the product....and then the cruiseline would feel the pinch. So what will you do if Carnival comes up with another "lame" excuse to charge you more money?

[NCTribeFan]

Oh! The whole original post was supposed to be tongue-in-cheek? Well, so sorry for not being able to see that in the typing!

 

Since there are so many "out there" threads started, how is anyone supposed to guess that you're being sarcastic?

 

I spewed no vitriol. Not one little ounce. Well, at least not in this thread! ;) <note use of smiley to denote tone>

 

Anyway, I cruised and paid a fuel surcharge. And while I didn't particularly enjoy it, I didn't complain about it because, well, fuel costs were very high! I didn't want it buried in the cruise fare.

[love my grandkids]

Bless your heart ;) It would be nice but it aint gonna happen.

Also, Carnival and other cruise lines buy future contracts for oil. The oil they are burning today cost more than what a contract purchased today would cost. This is because they purchased the current contract 2 years ago (approximately) and oil was more expensive at that time.

 

very true

[Cruise, J.D.]

Bless your heart ;) It would be nice but it aint gonna happen.

Also, Carnival and other cruise lines buy future contracts for oil. The oil they are burning today cost more than what a contract purchased today would cost. This is because they purchased the current contract 2 years ago (approximately) and oil was more expensive at that time.

 

Not really. They hedge and get some of the benefits of lower prices right now. In fact, they are substantially benefiting.

 

http://www.tradewindsnews.com/tw_catchall/352054/Cruise-lines-set-to-benefit-from-crude-oil-price-slump

 

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/carnival-corporation--plc-reports-significantly-higher-first-quarter-earnings-300056899.html

 

Fuel prices declined 38 percent to $406 per metric ton for 1Q 2015 from $654 per metric ton in 1Q 2014.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Cruise, J.D.

[jma624]

1st world problems

 

When you lose your job, lose the house, and can't feed your kids,,,, come back and whine about the cost of your cruise vacation.

 

 

This is a message board about cruise vacations. Pretty much exclusively "first world problems" by definition. What's your point?

[TNCruzer56]

Bless your heart ;) It would be nice but it aint gonna happen.

Also, Carnival and other cruise lines buy future contracts for oil. The oil they are burning today cost more than what a contract purchased today would cost. This is because they purchased the current contract 2 years ago (approximately) and oil was more expensive at that time.

 

Not completely true!

CCL only hedges effectively 50% of it`s fuel cost and those futures contracts are coming in much lower.

-

If the fuel price of late last year persists, market leader Carnival Corp alone could see its fuel bill decrease from $2bn in 2014 to less than $1.5bn in 2015, estimates Jaime Katz, a Chicago-based analyst at investment research firm Morningstar.

-

I don`t think the OP`s suggestion is that outlandish!

[Cruise life]

While food prices soar...

[nealstuber]

I've never heard a cruise line whine about their costs except maybe at a shareholder meeting..

.

 

 

When the fuel surcharges were rolled out we heard about fuel cost and now we're hearing about the cost of scrubbers.

 

While there may seem to be an endless supply of workers from other countries to fill cruise ships the numbers are much smaller than they look- first the number of people that are willing to leave their families for months at a time is not as large as you think and second the number of workers that are both qualified and can pass the rigourous background checks cuts the first number down significantly. Like any other employer when faced with a limited talent pool they must set their rates accordingly to attract the best workers. .

.

Last I checked, there were over 6 BILLION people in the world including almost 2 in China. What are there, 400 cruise ships with an average crew of a 1000? If you consider that a limited labor pool, please don't consider a career in H.R.

 

And their costs are very much your problem since your fare has to cover said costs in order for the company to make a profit.

.

 

As others have noted its only my problem if I choose to sail with them. Honestly, I didn't start this thread because I'm still miffed on $60 in fuel surcharges I spent 8 years ago. And in the extremely unlikely event lines were to start offering rebates since fuel is so low - it would not affect my vacation purchase decisions.

 

The purpose of my post was to call attention to the fact that lines are cleaning up as a result of the price of oil and - hopefully - make it a little more difficult for lines to say "our fuel costs have doubled so here is your price increase" a couple years down the line.

 

PS - to the guy talking about airfare going up a couple days ago: I book 7 to 9 one way flights a month for travel (on no notice). I booked my flight from ORD to Greensboro tomorrow, this afternoon: $198 bucks, for (lame) first class -but- the fare includes what otherwise would have been $160 in bag fees if I was in coach. As I do fly so frequently, I think I might be more in tune to what's going on with airfares than most. Airfares, at least last minute airfares, are dropping. At the same time, I was scoping out a Magic cruise a couple of months ago for October, had to wait due to uncertain schedules. Stars aligned with schedules a couple days ago, but the cruise I was looking at went up over 20%. So I did not book - yet.

Edited August 27, 2015 by nealstuber

[Sweet Dutch Girl]

.

Last I checked, there were over 6 BILLION people in the world including almost 2 in China. What are there, 400 cruise ships with an average crew of a 1000? If you consider that a limited labor pool, please don't consider a career in H.R.

 

A great deal of the reasonably skilled labor crew that speak english now are lost to the technical age....I probably speak to someone half a world away at least once a week when I call for an online service. Also, I don't think that mainland China grants many exit visas even for work, many of the asian countries with a somewhat good labor force, and many of the baltic countries (ditto) don't need to search for jobs elsewhere as there labor market has improved over the last 20 odd years. Its also hard to convince those with families to leave for 6 months at a time with only 6 weeks off at the end of the tours to leave their homeland. At one time many brits were seeking cruise jobs but that doesn't seem to be the case anymore...and virtually no north americans want to work as hard as they would have to on a cruise ship. Also more and more countries have started their own at home tourist industries with luxury resorts and all inclusive vacations. The southeast coast of Mexico is a prime example. And, as more and more ports have opened to cruising people can stay home and cater to the tourists in their own backyards and that includes the coastal baltics.

 

I am sure the cruiselines search continuously and diligently for their staff but it is now much more of an uphill climb. One of the reasons entertainment on a cruise ship is down, way down, is because entertainers with reasonable skills can hone their skills at indian casinos, riverboat casinos, and Las Vegas. It would be interesting to really research where the cruiselines now get their work force....last few trips I haven't encountered a single Filipino, who at one time were the mainstay of cruise staffs. YMMV.

Edited August 27, 2015 by Sweet Dutch Girl

[nealstuber]

....One of the reasons entertainment on a cruise ship is down, way down, is because entertainers with reasonable skills can hone their skills at indian casinos, riverboat casinos, and Las Vegas. It would be interesting to really research where the cruiselines now get their work force.....

 

I don't know where they're getting them from now either, but the caliber on our last Carnival Cruise was below your average high school musical. Sets and Tech made it better than that, but still, they call them "starving actors" for a reason. As to your unquoted contention that its tough to find good workers who are willing to be away from their families: Have you seen what has happened to the American family the past 20 years? Family is not what it was even 10 years ago. The workers are there.