Question about pre-&-post city stays ... Do it ourselves?

[JCinPA]

My wife and I are doing our first cruise next year on the Istanbul-Venice run, September 25 - October 4. We were on this summer, but got pushed back because the ship was not ready. We are very much looking forward to this trip!

 

My question is about the extra stays on each end. I know in Istanbul they use the Conrad Istanbul Bosphorus Hotel and the two days costs $1,798 through Viking, including breakfast. I don't know what tour activities are planned.

 

Checking the website, I can get a King room with a park view for two nights, cancellable and changeable, for about $565 (depending on exchange rates, of course). That's a pretty darn big difference!

 

Likewise, in Venice they use the Hilton Molino Stuckey Venice and that two days is $1,998. I can get a King Deluxe room with a view, cancellable and changeable, today for about $910!

 

That's a $2,300 savings! I think the wife and I can occupy ourselves, tour-wise, pretty well on our own for that. Airfare is $1,490 for both of us (includes the $50 premium thing whatever that is).

 

I'm wondering if I'm missing something? Those differences seem to be ridiculous, but we have zero cruising experience. I'm wondering if we should just take the cruise and do our own air and hotels, or see if Viking will do the air on our extended dates and just leave the hotel stays to us?

 

Advice?

[cmaasfamily]

We've never booked before/after stays so I have no first hand experience but I think the value is that the line will include tours, transfers and will take (at least some degree of) responsibility if you are delayed, etc.

 

Having said that, I think it probably comes down to your individual comfort level, experience and risk tolerance. We are arriving a couple of days before our cruise and staying after too, and we're managing it all ourselves. BUT... I know the cities in question well and I'm comfortable navigating and negotiating accordingly.

[JCinPA]

Thank you for that reply. I'd appreciate others. We don't know those cities well, but we've lived all over the world back in my service days and we are very comfortable researching cities and touring ourselves around them. Your response is kind of what I was looking for.

 

My inclination is to set this up ourselves. I would like a couple other opinions, but boy, we can tour ourselves around pretty well on $580 a day!

[TERRIER1]

Viking is not unique in charging extremely high rates for pre/post excursions and hotel stays. If you are comfortable then book your own rooms and use private tours for your excursions and transportation to and from the airport. It will save you a ton of money and you don't have to wait around for others to land at the airport to fill the bus to get you to the hotel. You can use the CC forums for advice on private excursion and airport transfers. Tripadvisor is an excellent source of information as well.

Edited November 4, 2015 by TERRIER1

[Mrs Miggins]

Hi, We are on this cruise too. However as we have been to Istanbul before we are not doing a pre-cruise stay but we are staying on in Venice for two days. We just asked our UK travel agent to delay our Viking flight home to London by two days and we are definitely going to book our hotel ourselves. We have been to Venice several times and last time used the Aqua Palace which was wonderful. I have not yet booked but looked online and we can book two nights for £550. I can remember when they were 'building' the Hilton inside a huge ex flour mill. To be honest I think you could possibly do better at the same or indeed lower cost in a hotel with more Italian flavour and in a better more central location. Some of the famous hotels like The Danieli and the Gritti Palace look fantastic although we have always stayed in smaller places.

 

Venice is a wonderful and magical place to wander and explore by yourself. It is especially wonderful at night when it is not quite so busy. I am sure you will love it.

[roothy123]

We did Viking's Venice to Istanbul cruise (Empires) Sept. 27, but booked only the cruise. We booked our own flights, but not because of cost. (Viking's were lower and probably no worse, but we wanted premium economy and didn't know if it would be available from Viking.) We booked our own hotels, and planned how we'd get to and from airport, dock, and hotels. It was our first visit to Venice and Istanbul.

 

We've been on a number of Oceania cruises, often going in early or staying late. We never purchase the cruise line's pre- or post-hotel packages, preferring to save money by doing extra days on our own. Those packages are offered for convenience. They appeal to people who don't like or don’t have time to research, are a little afraid of doing things on their own, like to be in groups rather than on their own, have more money than me, or other reasons like that. They probably don’t appeal to people who want to save a little money. Obviously, everyone's priorities are different, so choose what works best for yours.

 

With the Viking packages you don't have to worry about anything. If the airline changes your flights, you don't need to worry or re-plan. If the ship's docking location changes, you don't need to know or re-plan. (That happened in Venice; no huge deal, but caused a bit more researching on my part.) If you have no clue how to get to the ship or airport in each city (and in Venice it's hard), you don't have to think about it. If you have trouble toting your luggage around, cruise line transfers make things easier. If you're worried about security while on your own (some people were while in Istanbul), you'll have Viking staff around you. (Of course, a bus full of cruisers might not be the safest place to be in some areas of the world, but even in Istanbul I think it's unlikely you'll be a target.) Convenience, no need for planning, no worrying about whether the hotel will be decent, preferring to be around people or to have Viking people watching over you are reasons to book the pre and post hotel packages. You'll also probably get a great hot buffet breakfast at the hotels. You'll get taken from airports to hotels to ship and ship to hotels and airport on the way back with no additional cost. In Venice I think you go in a water taxi rather than the crowded public vaporettos we used in our independent travel, although of course you could pay for a private water taxi ($100 and up per trip). Tips are included for meals and transportation. Luggage handling is minimal; I think it ends up at hotels, ship and airport. (I know that was the case in in Venice; assume it would be the same in Istanbul.) You also don't need to worry about whether you'll need local money for transportation or tips.

 

It sounds like you're the kind of person who isn't fazed by the above, so could probably do fine on your own. If you DIY it though, I would figure out how you'd get from the airport to hotel and then ship in Venice. It isn't as easy as just calling a cab. To a hotel from the airport can cost $100 and up for a shared water taxi or if public transportation is taken, it might only be maybe $75 for two people. In Istanbul, our cab from the Sultanahmet hotel to the airport area was at least the Turkish lira equivalent of $40 for 2 people. (Gas is $9 a gallon there.) I would consider staying at an Istanbul hotel in Sultanahmet area of Istanbul rather than wherever the Conrad is located, which I assume is Beyoglu/Taksim. We loved staying right in the thick of the historical area of Istanbul, with major sightseeing places really close by. Of course, we did go up to Taksim Square, and it was fairly easy by tram and funicular, so either location would probably do. My impression is that Beyoglu is better for shopping but that Sultanahmet is better for sightseeing. Both have lots of places to eat. I suspect the Conrad is a lot nicer than many hotels in Sultanahmet, especially if you like big, American hotels. We just figure staying in small European hotels is part of the adventure of traveling. So far I haven't picked a bad one, but I DO spend a lot of time planning, which some people don't have.

 

The Hilton in Venice seemed fairly convenient for sightseeing and for getting to the port, and people seemed to like it. Of course, if you want to stay right on the island of Venice itself, there are many other hotels to choose, although the nicer and more accessible ones close to water with few footbridges are pretty expensive, and the modest ones fairly modest! I don't see any huge advantage to staying in the hotels Viking uses other than the things I've mentioned above - plus perhaps that they’ve been thoroughly vetted by Viking! I imagine they might also have a Viking staff member on site to answer questions, but of course, you can always call Viking with questions (or call the Star, although you might incur charges if the call is routed through the ship's system.

 

Not sure if Viking allows you to book the air without the hotels, as we didn't really consider that - but here's how it's done on Oceania: We use their air, which is usually included in cruise price, but we pay a deviation fee (more than $50) to be able to fly early or come back late. We tell them what days we want to fly and they book the flights (few nonstops, no choice of flights unless you pay extra). Then we book hotels and plan transfers (additional on Oceania; we just take cabs instead of buying the transfers).

 

Don't wait to book Venice hotels - there are many, but they do book up, and late September didn't seem to be off-season at all when we were there! Hilton is big, though, so perhaps that’s not an issue. Someone on our Roll Call (Sept. 27 cruise) has a few pictures of the inside and outside of the hotel - and comments as well.

Edited November 4, 2015 by roothy123

[Dauntless]

I just cancelled my air with Viking because I found that I could get it cheaper than their 'discount' on the air and that was before I was going to have to pay extra to go early and stay later and then still could not choose time of travel or seat locations. If you change anything to accommodate you, they seem to cancel transfers but don't deduct anything from the price so therefore, you're paying twice for transfers. The amount of savings is hundreds per person.

 

Now I have not been to either port cities, embarkation or disembarkation, but what they offered at the embarkation port was just the hotel, no extras, just advice on what to do. When researching the hotel, I found out that what Viking was charging was twice the amount per night. When we wanted to do 3 nights it became evident that the extra money we saved on hotel could be better used to enhance the experience of the city. Just researched comparable hotels on the internet and found one we thought we would enjoy and be a value for our money spent. The hotel has been helpful with information concerning transfers and accommodations amenities of business and the city.

 

I'm usually an independent traveler but have never cruised or been to Europe so I thought I might need 'training wheels' to feel secure. In the end, I found I feel more secure with more money in my bank, than Viking's bank. I'm sure there may be some sort of 'learning curve' with this experience but when I discussed this with a travel agent(not mine) they said I pretty well had the thing under control and I should feel confident proceeding on my own.

 

I took their advice.

[id4elizabeth]

We were on the Istanbul to Venice leg of the maiden cruise. We stayed two extra nights in Istanbul at the Hilton Bosphorus (not the Conrad). It's about a block and a half from Taksim Square. Breakfast was huge buffet style with everything conceivable. Got our stay with Hilton points. In your research, if you want breakfast included, make sure you pick the rate that includes breakfast. We took a cab from the Istanbul airport to the hotel - no hassles, no waiting - important to us after an 18 hour flights - about $40. We did use a private guide for touring Istanbul and I highly recommend him. His name was Volkan and we got him through EpesusShuttle.com (who we used for our Ephesus stop as well). The whole day for just the 2 of us was around $90 but we were OK with taking public transportation with our guide. A more expensive (and probably slower) option would be a private car with guide.

 

We didn't stay in Venice as we continued on the Star until Stockholm. But we did spend a whole day in Venice on our own with no problems. I would not bother with a private guide there. Just get some good guide books. We had no problems finding people who spoke English.

 

In my humble opinion, do it on your own. You can get the same hotels for far less, see much more, no waiting for others with either private guides or on your own with a copy of Rick Steves.

 

Our upcoming trip to Eastern Europe for a Viking cruise has us staying in Prague on our own for a week ahead of time and going to Transylvania afterwards on our own instead of Viking's post-extension.

[pukekolive]

We are booked on Venice to Istanbul on the Star 18/03/2016 and are travelling to Venice on 15/03/2016 independently for 3 nights at Hotel Violino D 'Oro in San Marco close to Harry's Bar. We booked this about 3 months ago as our TA was taking a long time quoting hotels. We are lucky we did as most of the good rooms are already booked out. We went to Venice with Trafalgar Tours in May 2014 and are looking forward to doing our own thing next March and walking everywhere!

 

As far as Istanbul is concerned, we are booked for 2 nights at Hotel Seraglio in Sultanahmet and there were many great hotels in the Sultanahmet and Eminonu areas (The Sirkeci Mansion would have been our second choice).

 

We only have the disembarkation day, the following day then the next morning to soak up the atmosphere. I absolutely love the planning stage of holidays and had considered the pre and post stays but decided we would prefer our freedom, What we disliked the most about our previous organised month in Europe with Trafalgar was the regimented timetable.

 

Go for it and organise your own stays!

 

 

My wife and I are doing our first cruise next year on the Istanbul-Venice run, September 25 - October 4. We were on this summer, but got pushed back because the ship was not ready. We are very much looking forward to this trip!

 

My question is about the extra stays on each end. I know in Istanbul they use the Conrad Istanbul Bosphorus Hotel and the two days costs $1,798 through Viking, including breakfast. I don't know what tour activities are planned.

 

Checking the website, I can get a King room with a park view for two nights, cancellable and changeable, for about $565 (depending on exchange rates, of course). That's a pretty darn big difference!

 

Likewise, in Venice they use the Hilton Molino Stuckey Venice and that two days is $1,998. I can get a King Deluxe room with a view, cancellable and changeable, today for about $910!

 

That's a $2,300 savings! I think the wife and I can occupy ourselves, tour-wise, pretty well on our own for that. Airfare is $1,490 for both of us (includes the $50 premium thing whatever that is).

 

I'm wondering if I'm missing something? Those differences seem to be ridiculous, but we have zero cruising experience. I'm wondering if we should just take the cruise and do our own air and hotels, or see if Viking will do the air on our extended dates and just leave the hotel stays to us?

 

Advice?

[rjscott]

JCinPA,

1. If you take Viking Air, and plan to do a pre- and /or post- cruise stay, but not Viking's, you will pay a deviation fee on the air for your extension outside your cruise air. So, you'll want to factor that into your calclulations. When we wanted to stay over in Prague at the end of our Passage to Eastern Europe cruise on our own, the deviation fee was $100 pp. If you are going in early as well, it will be $100 pp on that end as well. If you decide to do the air on your own, factor in the transfers. We did a private transfer in Istanbul for our party of 4 for $39. In Vence, we did do a water taxi to our hotel, as it had a private jetty. The water taxis are pricey, but if you share, not so bad vs. Dragging your luggage over bridges, which did not appeal to my husband. ;)

2. As already mentioned, there are many very lovely hotels to choose from in both Istanbul and Venice, but there are some advantages to staying at those used by Viking. We did this in Prague and the Viking hosts in the hotel lobby were still very generous in providing us with information and recommendations. if you are a very independent traveler, that may have no bearing on your decision.

 

Becki

Edited November 5, 2015 by rjscott

[JCinPA]

Wow! Excellent responses! Special thanks to Roothy, that was a lot of time and effort.

 

I can see the convenience factor, and my wife is, um, patience-challenged, shall we say? She tends to not deal with frustration very well at all, while I'm kind of a take things as they come sort of guy.

 

Still, since I was still on active duty in the Air Force for the first five years we were married, and we like to travel, we're pretty confident explorers. Never cruised, but lots of travel. And we'd often do it on the fly, take a train from my base in Germany to Paris without any reservations and just figure out where we'd stay and what we'd do when we got there.

 

Now I realize that we won't save much money, once we get the transfers, breakfasts and such, and get a tour guide and such, we certainly won't be saving $2,300 ... but I think I'd rather be independent to do what we like when we like, and have what should still be a meaningful amount left for my wife to spend on whatever.

 

id4elizabeth, can't thank you enough for the guide recommendation, I will definitely look him up! :)

[Essiesmom]

WE have visited Venice pre-cruise twice. The first time, our TA booked us into the Bonvecchiati, convenient to Piazza San Marco. It had the smallest elevators and rooms we have ever stayed in. Made our standard cruise ship cabin seem spacious. It was pricey (to us) and the hotel HAL uses, but we paid less. The second time, I booked myself, using Best Western Olimpia just off Piazzale Roma. Convenient to airport shuttle and vaporetti. We only took one tour, included by hotel, to Murano. the rest we DIY. We used Rick Steves' Mediterranean Cruise Ports and he Venice book. He has free audio tours for ipod/mp3 on his website for download. We pretty much knew what we wanted to see, having read many of Donna Leon's Commissario Guido Brunetti mysteries. Venice is very walkable, especially when you clear the main tourist areas and just enjoy the architecture and ambiance. EM

[JCinPA]

JCinPA,

1. If you take Viking Air, and plan to do a pre- and /or post- cruise stay, but not Viking's, you will pay a deviation fee on the air for your extension outside your cruise air. So, you'll want to factor that into your calclulations. When we wanted to stay over in Prague at the end of our Passage to Eastern Europe cruise on our own, the deviation fee was $100 pp. If you are going in early as well, it will be $100 pp on that end as well. If you decide to do the air on your own, factor in the transfers. We did a private transfer in Istanbul for our party of 4 for $39. In Vence, we did do a water taxi to our hotel, as it had a private jetty. The water taxis are pricey, but if you share, not so bad vs. Dragging your luggage over bridges, which did not appeal to my husband. ;)

2. As already mentioned, there are many very lovely hotels to choose from in both Istanbul and Venice, but there are some advantages to staying at those used by Viking. We did this in Prague and the Viking hosts in the hotel lobby were still very generous in providing us with information and recommendations. if you are a very independent traveler, that may have no bearing on your decision.

 

Becki

 

 

Well that blows any economy in letting Viking get group rates on airfare--adds a cool $400 to it. I'm calling them today and blowing off everything but the cruise, getting a refund on the rest, doing our own thing. I will stay at their Istanbul hotel, at the minimum, however, if for no other reason than it's one less decision to wrestle with and I will feel more confident because Viking people will be there who can make sure we get to the ship OK.

[roothy123]

You're getting great info here.

 

One more thing, just for people booking their own flights after a cruise: I've seen so many people post on Cruise Critic saying they booked their return flight at X AM and asking if they'll make their flight. I would not book a flight until at least 4 hours after the scheduled arrival time at the disembarkation city. The ship needs to be tied up, cleared by the authorities, and you'll probably need time to walk to a terminal, find your bags, possibly get in a passport or Customs line in the terminal, and then compete with others for taxis. Often it will be rush hour in a big city, which means traffic could be slow. It's just not worth the hassle and risk - book your flight accordingly, and then allow plenty of time to make your flight!

[JCinPA]

No worries, Roothy ... it will be two days later. :D

[sunrocket]

We have cruises 2 times with Viking River. Next fall we are cruising with Viking Ocean to the Mediterranean. We used Viking pre-cruise in Amsterdam which was not worth the cost, hotel not convenient to anything, tour guide was horrible and so was the Viking representative at hotel. But the post-cruise package in Prague was worth the cost because it included transportation from Budapest to Prague, Hilton there was a great hotel, with breakfast and included Prague tour which was excellent. The second river cruise in France we did hotels on our own.

Transportation from/to the airport to the hotel on pre and post extended stays is not included unless you use Viking air. Transportation from Hotel to ship is included.

I also looked up cost for Venice Hilton and agree with you. If we decide to stay there, we will book ourselves.

We never use Viking air.

Sunrocket

 

 

 

My wife and I are doing our first cruise next year on the Istanbul-Venice run, September 25 - October 4. We were on this summer, but got pushed back because the ship was not ready. We are very much looking forward to this trip!

 

My question is about the extra stays on each end. I know in Istanbul they use the Conrad Istanbul Bosphorus Hotel and the two days costs $1,798 through Viking, including breakfast. I don't know what tour activities are planned.

 

Checking the website, I can get a King room with a park view for two nights, cancellable and changeable, for about $565 (depending on exchange rates, of course). That's a pretty darn big difference!

 

Likewise, in Venice they use the Hilton Molino Stuckey Venice and that two days is $1,998. I can get a King Deluxe room with a view, cancellable and changeable, today for about $910!

 

That's a $2,300 savings! I think the wife and I can occupy ourselves, tour-wise, pretty well on our own for that. Airfare is $1,490 for both of us (includes the $50 premium thing whatever that is).

 

I'm wondering if I'm missing something? Those differences seem to be ridiculous, but we have zero cruising experience. I'm wondering if we should just take the cruise and do our own air and hotels, or see if Viking will do the air on our extended dates and just leave the hotel stays to us?

 

Advice?

[rjscott]

I would not reject Viking Air out of hand w/o doing some shopping. On our first Viking river cruise, we priced the flights we wanted then talked to Viking Air. Even after paying extra for Viking Custom Air and a bit more for a n/s flight home, we still came out ahead and had the transfers included.

We've also had free air and discounted airfare on Viking cruises and I was very pleased with the flights we were booked on.

That said, we've also booked our own air and hotel on two Viking cruises where we found better pricing than we could get thru Viking.

 

Becki

[roothy123]

No worries, Roothy ... it will be two days later. :D

 

Well, if you make it 3 days later, you could even make it to Cappadoccia (spelling?). That's on my bucket list, and I did consider trying to squish it in on this trip. We could have done it, but then would not have seen much of Istanbul and if something had happened to delay us in Cappadoccia, our airfare would have been really messed up. I'll just have to find another cruise to or from Istanbul!

[Port Hope]

Well that blows any economy in letting Viking get group rates on airfare--adds a cool $400 to it. I'm calling them today and blowing off everything but the cruise, getting a refund on the rest, doing our own thing. I will stay at their Istanbul hotel, at the minimum, however, if for no other reason than it's one less decision to wrestle with and I will feel more confident because Viking people will be there who can make sure we get to the ship OK.

 

We were on the Viking Star this fall doing the reverse of your itinerary. We used Viking Air and the Viking post package in Istanbul. We were a little concerned that the political situation in Turkey might disrupt the itinerary. However, since we had cruised out of Venice previously we booked our own hotel and made our own arrangements. I wasn't going to post since others had thoroughly covered all the pros and cons until I saw your comment that you were going to book the Viking hotel in Istanbul.

The Conrad is a beautiful hotel in a lousy location for tourists. There were several conferences there, including a meeting of the G20 Finance Ministers which reinforced my opinion that it is more of a business hotel. Viking literature states that the hotel will be in the Taksim Square district. Not even close! I had researched the location ahead of time and knew that it was a 30 minute walk to Kabatas which is the start of the tram line and also the location of the funicular up to Taksim Square. No problem, I thought. If we are too tired to walk we'll get a cab from the tram stop. Well, cab drivers consider this too short a trip and won't take you. The concierge at the hotel told us that and we found out he was right. The second day we did get a cab from the Conrad to the Sultanahmet district to save our weary legs. (We'd walked about 10 miles on day one!) We were with friends and the cost was quite reasonable, except that the cab driver didn't drop us off where we asked.

Perhaps for your cruise Viking will have changed their hotel. There are two Hiltons in the Taksim Square district that would be much more convenient.

[JCinPA]

Thanks for that tip! Will investigate other hotels. Plenty of time.

[diane.in.ny]

Take a close look at the location of the Hilton in Venice. It is across the Guidecca Canal and if you want to go out for dinner and stroll around, you have to keep in mind shuttle times.

 

I recommend staying 'in' Venice.

[id4elizabeth]

We stayed at the Hilton Bosphorus which was about a block and a half from Taksim square. From there you catch the one stop funicular which takes you down to the tram line. I would not say it's ideally located for seeing the sights - Sultanahmet would definitely be better. But if you, like us, are going to use points for your stay, the Hilton Bosphorus is definitely better located than the Conrad. The other Hilton is way out in the financial district and not near any public transportation, but it's a new hotel. The Executive Lounge at the Hilton Bosphorus is quite good and we had hearty breakfasts there.

[JCinPA]

Thanks for all the suggestions! My wife and I finally decided what to do with this.

 

I got a refund for the Venice stay, $1,998, but less the aforementioned $400 flight deviation fee, so a net refund of $1,598. We had an airfare discount when we signed up and paid for the "Air Plus" which I believe lets us choose flight times from a set of options they provide to us. All in the airfare including the deviation fee came to $945 pp, and for the convenience factor alone, I'm happy with that. We may not have bested that price in any event, but even if we did, it would not have been by much.

 

After talking to a stewardess friend of ours instead of two days on each end we are taking 3 days in Istanbul at the front and only one extra day in Venice at the back end. We think 10 AM one day through lunch the next in Venice is probably plenty, and we'll likely be anxious to get back home, and we feel we can definitely fill 3 days in Istanbul, without a doubt.

 

Just because I started this thread, I will finish it with the hotels we finally choose.

 

Cheers,

 

John

[id4elizabeth]

Sounds like a good plan. Something to think about -- you might want to get a guide in Istanbul for at least 2 of those 3 days. It certainly made our extra day in Istanbul less stressful and I think we saw more than we might have. Certainly had things explained to us and we enjoyed his discussion of Turkish politics. Venice -- there IMO you don't need a guide - just a good guide book and a map (one with the vaporetti stops indicated).

[diane.in.ny]

Venice -- there IMO you don't need a guide - just a good guide book and a map (one with the vaporetti stops indicated).

 

I agree

 

And you might want to take a look at this web site. Lots of helpful information.

 

http://europeforvisitors.com/venice/