VIKING continues ambitious payment policy

[Bake apple]

I have been in conversations with Viking regarding booking the Waterways of the Tsars for June 2020, it would be our fourth cruise with Viking. Full payment is expected by the end of August. I asked for and was turned down when I asked for a much better final payment date. I understand Avalon, Uniworld, AMA and Emerald have more reasonable policies from 90 to 120 before start of cruise.

 

It is disappointing for sure and I am wondering why the North American market is not pushing back at this stance. Perhaps it has and makes no difference to Viking. I'm looking at the other cruise lines naturally.  Am I really off base here or is Viking's policy out of line with the rest of the industry. I can't think of anything I would pay full price for and not receive the goods or services for a year.  Your thoughts or has this topic been done and dusted?  Safe travels everyone.

[BarkLessWagMore]

I believe this topic has been discussed extensively in other threads. I will simply add that like you, we found Viking's Draconian payment policy to be not to our liking. This led me to explore their competition which led us to book a cruise on the Danube with Avalon. Small deposit at booking and payment in full 90 days before embarkation. Perfectly reasonable. We had an absolutely wonderful cruise and Avalon suits us very well. We will sail with them again I am sure. I might encourage you to look at other lines if they have a similar cruise.

[Peregrina651]

Viking has always marched to a different drummer; they do not care how the rest of the industry does things.

 

When we first booked with Viking, when it was just a river cruise company, payment was due at the end of the month in which we booked. Even if one booked a year in advance, payment in full was due more or less at the time of booking-- but they didn't announce schedules much more than a year in advance. When they opened the Ocean division, the policy continued even though they were now booking (and selling out) cruises some two years in advance. When we booked our first Ocean cruise in 2014, we  expected to pay in full at the time of booking (or certainly by the end of the following month)  and were delightfully surprised at it being delayed by 6 months (which was 18 months before we sailed). Their payment policy is not a new policy.

 

The NA market is not pushing back because, regardless of the policy, they want to sail with Viking. Viking's client base, for the most part, is not scrimping and saving for an annual vacation, and may even be taking multiple Viking cruises a year. They are not worried about having cash tied up for so long.

 

The good thing is that there are enough other cruise lines which don't expect payment so far in advance and those who don't like Viking's policy have plenty of other choices--which is so much better than choosing Viking and then harping about it for the entire cruise.  Vacations are to be enjoyed, so choose what makes you happy.

 

[Bake apple]

P-651: Good points and well stated. As I said this would have been/may be our fourth cruise with Viking in four years yet I still balk at handing over my hard earned vacation money so darn far in advance. I guess the ball is my court. 'Nuff said.  Safe travels all.

[Babr]

One of the things that bothers me about this policy is that it creates a dilemma about travel insurance.  It must be purchased well in advance also if one wants protection for pre-existing conditions.  That money is gone whether you go on the trip or not.  The premium is non-refundable if you cancel early - before the penalty period. So even when your cruise fare is not at risk, the insurance premium is.  It would cover your cancellation fees, but that is a poor return on the investment.

 

Seems as if there are plenty of people who are willing to accept those terms so Viking will never miss my business.

[Texas Tillie]

I'm sure with all the advertising Viking does they are attracting many who have never done a cruise of any kind. Those people have no idea how it's usually done in the industry. What amazes me is how successful Viking has become when their product, especially the river product, can be matched or exceeded by others. I guess it's a case of there's a fool born every minute. The Viking guy is the new P T Barnum.

[Peregrina651]

1 hour ago, Babr said:

One of the things that bothers me about this policy is that it creates a dilemma about travel insurance.  It must be purchased well in advance also if one wants protection for pre-existing conditions.  That money is gone whether you go on the trip or not.  The premium is non-refundable if you cancel early - before the penalty period. So even when your cruise fare is not at risk, the insurance premium is.  It would cover your cancellation fees, but that is a poor return on the investment.

 

Seems as if there are plenty of people who are willing to accept those terms so Viking will never miss my business.

 

While not a solution to the dilemma, here are a few things to know about insurance, particularly if you are booking more than a year in advance.

 

Many companies permit you to buy enough to cover the deposit and then raise the coverage at the time you make the payment in full.

 

If you decide to change your plans, some/many companies allow you to move the insurance to another tip as long as you have not made a claim against the policy.

 

However, don't assume that any of this applies to the company you are dealing with. Talk to the insurance company about this before you buy and understand any restrictions before you buy.

 

In any case, if pre exisiting conditions are an issue, better to be out the cost of the insurance versus than the entire cruise fare. There have been some awful stories of people who did not buy insurance and then had to cancel or interrupt their trips.

 

Edited July 12, 2019 by Peregrina651

[Peregrina651]

5 minutes ago, Texas Tillie said:

I'm sure with all the advertising Viking does they are attracting many who have never done a cruise of any kind. Those people have no idea how it's usually done in the industry. What amazes me is how successful Viking has become when their product, especially the river product, can be matched or exceeded by others. I guess it's a case of there's a fool born every minute. The Viking guy is the new P T Barnum.

 

Choice of cruise line is a personal choice. What works for one person might not work for others. In the end, it is good that we can all choose what works for us and cruise with people who are happy with their choice.

[Babr]

Thanks Peregrina651,

 

The problem is that final payment so closely follows the deposit that you have to insure the whole cost of the trip long before the penalty period.  A lot can happen in the months between. Circumstances other than medical can cause a change in plans. Regardless, if you cancel before the penalty period, the premium is gone unless you can move it to another trip.

[Peregrina651]

1 hour ago, Babr said:

Thanks Peregrina651,

 

The problem is that final payment so closely follows the deposit that you have to insure the whole cost of the trip long before the penalty period.  A lot can happen in the months between. Circumstances other than medical can cause a change in plans. Regardless, if you cancel before the penalty period, the premium is gone unless you can move it to another trip.

 

It is not a solution to the dilemma, especially when pre-existing conditions are involved. If you aren't worried about your own health (or your parents' or your children's) causing you to cancel your trip (or having to interrupt it), then don't buy the insurance until the cancellation penalties kick in. Just be clear as to what reasons for cancellation will be covered and which will not --and which reasons for claiming under the coverages will be covered. 

 

Another possibility is not to book until 120 days out--and that has its downsides as well.

 

Also, does the insurance automatically disappear (and I am talking about 3rd party insurance, not buying it from the cruise line) if you cancel a trip and don't immediately rebook? I don't know the answer to this  but perhaps worth finding out.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2019 by Peregrina651

[Babr]

All of the points you make are things I’ve been wrestling with because I wouldn’t consider booking an expensive international trip without adequate coverage for cancellation as well as medical and evacuation. I haven’t found an answer I’m comfortable with yet so I have avoided Viking.

 

I do appreciate your input.

[$hip$hape]

1 hour ago, Peregrina651 said:

>>>

Also, does the insurance automatically disappear (and I am talking about 3rd party insurance, not buying it from the cruise line) if you cancel a trip and don't immediately rebook?

I don't know the answer to this  but perhaps worth finding out.

 

 

For our upcoming Viking Ocean,

WE canceled (had to cancel our booking and lose $200) our booking with Viking to get their latest,

reduced fare with a new booking number.

Our third party insurance was automatically transferred to the new booking number.

However, friends our ours, who bought insurance through Viking,

were told if they wanted the reduced fare they would lose their insurance.

The Viking insurance could only be transferred to a future Viking cruise,

NOT the same cruise; Viking Insurance disappears.

For them, the reduced fare was not worth it.

Edited July 12, 2019 by $hip$hape

[Texas Tillie]

3 hours ago, Peregrina651 said:

 

Choice of cruise line is a personal choice. What works for one person might not work for others. In the end, it is good that we can all choose what works for us and cruise with people who are happy with their choice.

 

My point was I believe there are many people who don't know that Viking's policy isn't the industry standard. However, it's not my job to save people from themselves. If they are happy with whatever choice they make, I'm happy for them. I am informed and wouldn't make the same choice.

[$hip$hape]

7 hours ago, Bake apple said:

 I understand Avalon, Uniworld, AMA and Emerald have more reasonable policies

from 90 to 120 before start of cruise.

 

It is disappointing for sure and I am wondering

why the North American market is not pushing back at this stance. 

 

Maybe, since Viking (customers) pay for the bulk of attractive, European River Cruise advertising,

these other lines can get a free ride, and offer better policies & discount prices? 

Edited July 12, 2019 by $hip$hape

[Babr]

26 minutes ago, $hip$hape said:

For our upcoming Viking Ocean,

WE canceled (had to cancel our booking and lose $200) our booking with Viking to get their latest,

reduced fare with a new booking number.

Our third party insurance was automatically transferred to the new booking number.

However, friends our ours, who bought insurance through Viking,

were told if they wanted the reduced fare they would lose their insurance.

The Viking insurance could only be transferred to a future Viking cruise,

NOT the same cruise; Viking Insurance disappears.

For them, the reduced fare was not worth it.

Wow! Viking has lots of ways to confound the unsuspecting.  Another reason to tread carefully.

 

[$hip$hape]

31 minutes ago, Babr said:

Wow! Viking has lots of ways to confound the unsuspecting.  

Another reason to tread carefully.

 

It's not simple.

 

WE actually paid Viking ahead, in full, to secure our flights/seats through Viking Air. 

In the past, we have waited for Viking to pay for flights and, by that time,

were lucky to get overseas flights with seats together, as it was nearly sold out.  

If one does not know how to handle Viking,

I suggest you get a Travel Agent you can/may trust.

 

So, why are we back.?

Once on the Viking Cruise, we have always had a wonderful time !

The ships and staffs have always been very good.

Edited July 12, 2019 by $hip$hape

[lackcreativity]

2 hours ago, Texas Tillie said:

 

My point was I believe there are many people who don't know that Viking's policy isn't the industry standard. However, it's not my job to save people from themselves. If they are happy with whatever choice they make, I'm happy for them. I am informed and wouldn't make the same choice.

As a first time ocean cruiser who selected a Viking cruise, you are right that I don't need you to save me from myself. I chose Viking because it is different from the industry standard in a host of ways that to me are mostly positives. I am happy to book early and if required to pay early, as we select  the lowest cost Veranda cabins. The room is quite satisfactory, and once we walk out our cabin door we have access to all the amenities and pleasant service that everyone else on the ship can enjoy. Many others value that same concept, so those rooms are the first to sell out. What I save on the cost of the room more than covers the cost of the insurance I could possibly lose if I have to cancel in unfavorable circumstances.

 

We have now booked our fourth Viking Ocean cruise. I am on this website to make sure that I am an informed consumer, and I remain a happy Viking customer.

[Peregrina651]

1 hour ago, $hip$hape said:

For our upcoming Viking Ocean,

WE canceled (had to cancel our booking and lose $200) our booking with Viking to get their latest,

reduced fare with a new booking number.

Our third party insurance was automatically transferred to the new booking number.

However, friends our ours, who bought insurance through Viking,

were told if they wanted the reduced fare they would lose their insurance.

The Viking insurance could only be transferred to a future Viking cruise,

NOT the same cruise; Viking Insurance disappears.

For them, the reduced fare was not worth it.

 

Thank you! Interesting to know, $$.

 

I have always felt that the policies sold by the cruise lines have the best interests of the cruise line in mind and not my best interests. Moreover, they don't cover the entire trip, only what is purchased through Viking.

[mort&fran]

One other point – Travel insurance generally reimburses only what you cannot get refunded.

 

We have booked an October 2020 Viking cruise; total cost ca. $7,000 per person, with $250 per person deposit. However, the cancellation penalty is only $100 per person until 120 days before departure. Since I have had a heart attack I need the pre-existing condition waiver, so we purchased travel insurance with a $100 per person limit (because that is all we will lose if we have to cancel before the 120-day mark).

 

The cancellation penalty increases to 20% at 119 days, 35% at 89 days, etc. When those dates are reached, I will have the insurance company increase the limit accordingly.

 

I’ve never had a problem doing this.

[Peregrina651]

12 minutes ago, mort&fran said:

The cancellation penalty increases to 20% at 119 days, 35% at 89 days, etc. When those dates are reached, I will have the insurance company increase the limit accordingly.

 

 

Please, just to be safe, double check that with your insurance carrier. My TA told me when we booked in May that recently there have been some changes to this pay in increments policy, at least for the carrier we use, and that now coverage for the full amount has to be made with in x many days of making the final payment. It might not apply for your chosen carrier but better safe than sorry and all that stuff about assuming.

 

This warning also applies to people who are insurance shopping and thinking of using mort&fran's plan of attack. Make sure that you ask if this can be done and not just assume that every insurance company has the same policies.

 

 

[Babr]

That sounds like a perfectly reasonable plan to protect yourself without having to put all the money up front. At my age, that can be a considerable amount. 

 

Have you ever had to file a claim? Does this pay-as-you-go schedule expose you to any problems with satisfying the terms of the policy?

 

Oops. Didn’t quote mort&fran. My reply is out of sequence. If the policy reverts to final payment as peregrina165 suggests, then this schedule won’t help matters. Nevertheless, it is another idea to investigate.

Edited July 12, 2019 by Babr
Out of sequence

[Peregrina651]

1 hour ago, Babr said:

Have you ever had to file a claim? Does this pay-as-you-go schedule expose you to any problems with satisfying the terms of the policy?

 

Good questions!!!

 

I would definitely ask the last question directly to the insurance company you are looking to deal with, especially since "but they told me Cruise Critic" will not get you very far in a dispute with them.

[Turtles06]

3 hours ago, mort&fran said:

One other point – Travel insurance generally reimburses only what you cannot get refunded.

 

We have booked an October 2020 Viking cruise; total cost ca. $7,000 per person, with $250 per person deposit. However, the cancellation penalty is only $100 per person until 120 days before departure. Since I have had a heart attack I need the pre-existing condition waiver, so we purchased travel insurance with a $100 per person limit (because that is all we will lose if we have to cancel before the 120-day mark).

 

The cancellation penalty increases to 20% at 119 days, 35% at 89 days, etc. When those dates are reached, I will have the insurance company increase the limit accordingly.

 

I’ve never had a problem doing this.

 

As you've been advised above, it is critical to read the terms of your policy carefully and check with your carrier about such a plan.  When you say, "I've never had a problem doing this," do you mean you were able successfully to file a claim when you've used your schedule of payments?   In what circumstances?  If not, then "I've never had a problem doing this" means only that you had no problem getting the insurance company to take your money. 

 

I can't speak for anyone else's policies, but I have been specifically advised by Travel Guard that when you make a payment toward a trip, you must insure the amount of that payment that you would lose if you had to cancel the trip on the day you were scheduled to depart, not based on a sliding scale according to the cruise line's increasing penalty schedule.  Again, I'm only speaking of the policies I've purchased from Travel Guard. 

Edited July 13, 2019 by Turtles06

[Host Jazzbeau]

My TA has always stated the Allianz rule as based on 'final payment' date – but she doesn't recommend Viking so she wouldn't be aware of this wrinkle where full payment is due before the penalty date.  It is important to make this distinction clear to whomever you are asking about insurance rules, as it is unique in the industry.

[mort&fran]

On 7/12/2019 at 9:33 PM, Turtles06 said:

As you've been advised above, it is critical to read the terms of your policy carefully and check with your carrier about such a plan.  When you say, "I've never had a problem doing this," do you mean you were able successfully to file a claim when you've used your schedule of payments?   In what circumstances?  If not, then "I've never had a problem doing this" means only that you had no problem getting the insurance company to take your money. 

 

We have filed 3 claims with Travel Guard (including a heart attack while on a cruise and a cancer diagnosis that required cancelling a booking). All three were fully covered, however I cannot say for sure whether we paid in full initially, or increased the limits as the cancellation penalties increased. We’re currently booked on 3 cruises, for which I have been adjusting the limits as the cancellation penalties increased, so I sent a question to Travel Guard, asking if my understand is correct. I’ll let you know when I hear from them.