And here's another thing cruise lines will have to do to prevent the spread of Covid

[cruisemom42]

2 hours ago, dogs4fun said:

 

Just recently, my internist disclosed that she is habitually displeased by incorrect information dispensed by the infamous Dr. Google. She said that some patients actually believe the slop they read online rather than the medical advice she provides - they argue with her! 

 

I worked at WebMD when it was a start-up. We heard from physicians with great frequency about how patients would come in, print-outs in hand, and proceed to tell the doc what was wrong with them and how they knew it (and often, what prescriptions they needed!).

 

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, clo said:

Probably. Since we only do drive thru I never really thought about it.

I kind of remember at a local McDonalds back in the old days when you could sit at the tables that it said by the soda machines, no refill when taking out. To me that implied you could refill when you were eating there.

[clo]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I worked at WebMD when it was a start-up. We heard from physicians with great frequency about how patients would come in, print-outs in hand, and proceed to tell the doc what was wrong with them and how they knew it (and often, what prescriptions they needed!).

 

Argh. As you likely recall I have a good bit of medical/scientific background and I'm super conservative as to the sites I go to. Mayo, NIH, CDC, etc. I've fact checked countless things that FB friends share and some are so egregious I all but beg them to delete them.

[clo]

9 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

In developing countries they increase the level of fat, sugar and salt in their products compared to what they would serve in developed countries because of the legislation that exists in many developed nations. They directly advertise to children by sending their mascots to schools so children will have a direct association with the brand. Something that is also banned in most developed countries. The food industry in developed countries is legislated, some more harshly than others but it is not the free for all that it is in developing countries. 

I don't know about the rest of the world but Mexico uses real sugar rather than high fructose corn syrup so it tastes like what I grew up drinking. It's only an occasional treat but it tickles my taste buds :

[ilikeanswers]

1 minute ago, clo said:

I don't know about the rest of the world but Mexico uses real sugar rather than high fructose corn syrup so it tastes like what I grew up drinking. It's only an occasional treat but it tickles my taste buds :

 

Fructose Corn Syrup is mostly an American thing because the government heavily subsidises the corn industry making the syrup cheaper than sugar. It was why it was invented because the subsidies created excess corn which they wanted to find a way to use. In Australia sugar is subsidised so it is a much more economical option. I would think sugar is a cheaper sweetner in Mexico because corn is an actual staple food so the industry doesn't need subsidies to be profitable. 

 

[clo]

8 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Fructose Corn Syrup is mostly an American thing because the government heavily subsidises the corn industry making the syrup cheaper than sugar. It was why it was invented because the subsidies created excess corn which they wanted to find a way to use. In Australia sugar is subsidised so it is a much more economical option. I would think sugar is a cheaper sweetner in Mexico because corn is an actual staple food so the industry doesn't need subsidies to be profitable. 

 

Thanks for that explanation.

[ilikeanswers]

7 hours ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I’ve found that, in the USA, a ‘small soda’ is the size of a ‘large soda’ in the U.K. 

American portion sizes have the reputation of being massive compared to other parts of the world

 

I never understood why American tourists complained our portions were too small till I visited America and realised what they think "small" is😂. There is a really interesting experiment where they set out a buffet and give people at first a small plate and then second serving the next day a big plate and every one compulsively fills the whole plate. And the people really believe they are eating the same portions in both servings. They are shocked that they have eaten 30% more all because of plate size 😉

 

5 hours ago, clo said:

I think that's overgeneralizing. I can get a small Coke at McDs that IS small. But larger sizes are the same price. But I dont WANT the larger.

 

Yes that is problem in Australia too. The difference in price between small and big is only a few cents. So per ml I have to pay more for my small drink than a person with a large drink. It so unfair I have to pay more for wanting less😬. 

[Cruz3r4life]

 

 

On 8/23/2020 at 10:24 PM, Elaine5715 said:

Our mainstream media barely mentions that obesity is one of the comorbidities that leads to a poor outcome with COVID especially with children   

 

That's because the phrases personal or parental responsibility might come up and that's a big no-no. 

 

At least in my local area the news doesn't even report the infection numbers accurately, they announce the "total" cases but don't mention that  it is in fact a cumulative count of the active infections, recovered and deceased cases - so if you tested positive in April 2020 and have recovered, you are still being announced in that daily number of cases even though it's August.  

[2wheelin]

On 8/24/2020 at 4:07 PM, Cruzaholic41 said:

Oh, the irony! 😂🙄

 

 

On 8/24/2020 at 4:10 PM, clo said:

LOL! I almost said the same 🙂

 

Best laugh I have had all day.

[2wheelin]

On 8/24/2020 at 8:06 PM, ilikeanswers said:

 

Fructose Corn Syrup is mostly an American thing because the government heavily subsidises the corn industry making the syrup cheaper than sugar. It was why it was invented because the subsidies created excess corn which they wanted to find a way to use. In Australia sugar is subsidised so it is a much more economical option. I would think sugar is a cheaper sweetner in Mexico because corn is an actual staple food so the industry doesn't need subsidies to be profitable. 

 

Unfortunately what so many people do not realize is that artificial sweeteners, HFCS are worse for you than sugar. People think they are safer and thus consume greater quantities, when in fact they condition the body to crave more.

[ilikeanswers]

4 minutes ago, 2wheelin said:

Unfortunately what so many people do not realize is that artificial sweeteners, HFCS are worse for you than sugar. People think they are safer and thus consume greater quantities, when in fact they condition the body to crave more.

 

It's a bit more complicated in Mexico. There are no laws about advertising to children. When kids come out of school in Mexico there are trucks at the gate selling soft drinks, at restaurants despite the improvement in tap water patrons still choose to buy drinks and since soft drinks are the cheaper option why would you buy the water, go to the dentists and it is not uncommon to see Coca Cola logos over the furniture because surprise surprise they donate it. Companies put a lot of research into how to influence choice and in most developed countries despite hard lobbying by these companies there are laws to limit that power. Especially for countries who have public medical systems they see preventative medicine as a way to save a lot of money. Mexico has been slowly coming to this realisation perhaps Covid 19 will be the push they need to catch up with developed nations.

[SelectSys]

14 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

It's a bit more complicated in Mexico. There are no laws about advertising to children. When kids come out of school in Mexico there are trucks at the gate selling soft drinks, at restaurants despite the improvement in tap water patrons still choose to buy drinks and since soft drinks are the cheaper option why would you buy the water, go to the dentists and it is not uncommon to see Coca Cola logos over the furniture because surprise surprise they donate it. Companies put a lot of research into how to influence choice and in most developed countries despite hard lobbying by these companies there are laws to limit that power. Especially for countries who have public medical systems they see preventative medicine as a way to save a lot of money. Mexico has been slowly coming to this realisation perhaps Covid 19 will be the push they need to catch up with developed nations.

 

Note that the state of Oaxaca just passed a law prohibiting the sale of junk food and sugar drinks to kids.  Several other states are considering this including Mexico City (which is now a state rather than a special federal district.) 

 

Coke sponsors more teams in the Mexican Football/Soccer league than any other sponsor.  One of the Mexico's largest corporations - FEMSA - controls Coke distribution.  FEMSA also owns OXXO which is crazy popular in Mexico as it's way more than just a convenience food store.  OXXO also sells enormous amounts of junk food.  

 

I am not sure COVID is changing anything in Mexico with respect to diet.  The Mexican government is using it as an excuse right now, but I just don't see it making its way down to those at the lower levels who are most at risk.   Those people are having a hard time connecting the dots between immediate actions and long term consequences.  Hopefully things will change but I am not sure. 

 

Edited August 31, 2020 by SelectSys

[BlueRiband]

"Soda taxes" are not enacted to promote public health.  They're enacted as an excuse for tax revenue.

[ilikeanswers]

30 minutes ago, BlueRiband said:

"Soda taxes" are not enacted to promote public health.  They're enacted as an excuse for tax revenue.

 

Economic impact of excess weight now exceeds $1.7 trillion

[dsrdsrdsr]

3 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Economic impact of excess weight now exceeds $1.7 trillion

Yes, well when the figures look stupid, it's probably because they are stupid.  $1.24 trillion in lost productivity?  That's about £8,000 per US worker, or about 20% of the average person's wage, lost just because of people being too fat.  Do they really think that fat people, on average, lose 40% of their working life to illness?  That figure is nonsense.

 

And of course they haven't taken pensions into account.  Dementia and other similar conditions are very much disproportionately suffered by the thin.  Mainly because the fatter people have died of something else first.  We all die in the end; the ones that look after themselves and keep healthy will still die, and almost certainly will die of something that needs expensive medical treatment first, and will draw many years' pension before they get there.  

 

There are plenty of reasons to discourage fatness.  Cost isn't one of them.

[navybankerteacher]

6 hours ago, BlueRiband said:

"Soda taxes" are not enacted to promote public health.  They're enacted as an excuse for tax revenue.

 

3 hours ago, dsrdsrdsr said:

Yes, well when the figures look stupid, it's probably because they are stupid.  $1.24 trillion in lost productivity?  That's about £8,000 per US worker, or about 20% of the average person's wage, lost just because of people being too fat.  Do they really think that fat people, on average, lose 40% of their working life to illness?  That figure is nonsense.

 

And of course they haven't taken pensions into account.  Dementia and other similar conditions are very much disproportionately suffered by the thin.  Mainly because the fatter people have died of something else first.  We all die in the end; the ones that look after themselves and keep healthy will still die, and almost certainly will die of something that needs expensive medical treatment first, and will draw many years' pension before they get there.  

 

There are plenty of reasons to discourage fatness.  Cost isn't one of them.

Of course revenue is a primary (if not the only) motivation for enacting taxes, but isn’t it better to at least consider public health?  Say, by taxing cigarettes and liquor more than fresh fruits and vegetables?  

 

But, have you grounds for claiming that dementia, etc. are primarily afflictions of the thin?  And don’t people who “look after themselves” generally require less, and probably less costly, medical care?

[dsrdsrdsr]

2 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

Of course revenue is a primary (if not the only) motivation for enacting taxes, but isn’t it better to at least consider public health?  Say, by taxing cigarettes and liquor more than fresh fruits and vegetables?  

 

But, have you grounds for claiming that dementia, etc. are primarily afflictions of the thin?  And don’t people who “look after themselves” generally require less, and probably less costly, medical care?

Two main grounds for claiming that dementia etc. are primarily afflictions of the thin.  1 - they affect people who live a long time.  Fat people live less long so are less likely to live long enough to get dementia.  2 - take a look round a nursing home.  It's full of thin people.

 

People who look after themselves don't need less care.  They need the same amount of care, but they need it later.  As you have pointed out, we're all going to die; and logically, that means we're all going to die of something; most of us are going to be ill before we die; ill people need treatment.

 

This study appears to be imagining that fat people by and large get ill and need expensive treatment while thin people live long productive lives before suddenly dying with no need for medical care at all.  It isn't like that.  You also have fat people who die suddenly with no medical treatment and thin people who are under permanent medical care for many years before they die.

 

OK, fat people die of diabetes and heart disease wheras thin people, by and large, don't.  All it means is that thin people die of something else, and that something else will need expensive treatment too.  (And an expensive pension.)

 

Plenty of reasons for wanting people to eat and to be healthy.  Cost isn't one of them.  and to answer your first point, I am considering public health - that's the point.  No need to consider finances because finances aren't (on a national basis) an issue.

[navybankerteacher]

2 hours ago, dsrdsrdsr said:

Two main grounds for claiming that dementia etc. are primarily afflictions of the thin.  1 - they affect people who live a long time.  Fat people live less long so are less likely to live long enough to get dementia.  2 - take a look round a nursing home.  It's full of thin people.

 

People who look after themselves don't need less care.  They need the same amount of care, but they need it later.  As you have pointed out, we're all going to die; and logically, that means we're all going to die of something; most of us are going to be ill before we die; ill people need treatment.

 

This study appears to be imagining that fat people by and large get ill and need expensive treatment while thin people live long productive lives before suddenly dying with no need for medical care at all.  It isn't like that.  You also have fat people who die suddenly with no medical treatment and thin people who are under permanent medical care for many years before they die.

 

OK, fat people die of diabetes and heart disease wheras thin people, by and large, don't.  All it means is that thin people die of something else, and that something else will need expensive treatment too.  (And an expensive pension.)

 

Plenty of reasons for wanting people to eat and to be healthy.  Cost isn't one of them.  and to answer your first point, I am considering public health - that's the point.  No need to consider finances because finances aren't (on a national basis) an issue.

What a load of bull!

 

People who look after themselves certainly do require less care - they look after themselves - those who do not look after themselves leave that chore for others.

 

Obesity is recognized by COMPETENT medical authorities generally as one of the principal AVOIDABLE health threats.

 

Dementia sets in when it sets in - and has been shown to be more likely to impact sedentary (read fat) than fit, active people.

 

The cost of any sort of intensive medical care (more likely in the case of an obese person) will far outweigh several years of government pension payments.

 

Finall, finances surely are an issue - for every individual and for governments.

[dogs4fun]

Obesity is a known risk factor for dementia. Excellent info found here:

https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/sites/default/files/pdf/factsheet_risk_factors_for_dementia.pdf