Tor: COVID is really behind us...

[brianw123]

On 4/18/2022 at 11:26 AM, rbslos18 said:

Oh my. Andy, your response is quite charitable. The logical conclusion of the original post is Viking’s bankruptcy. The ships won’t only be empty, they will be gone!

 

Viking is following the lead of its  scientists and physicians. Those who disagree with Viking’s experts have the option of finding a different cruise line whose experts have a different approach. They exist. 
 

With the exception of those of us who are trained in Epidemiology and infectious disease, perhaps we should return to Cruise Critic’s core values—providing information and help to fellow cruisers. 

I completely disagree. I think you underestimate the number of people that trust the effectiveness of the vaccine and want to move on. If Viking stops daily testing I believe the ships will still be at capacity. To the contrary Viking will eventually lose business if they keep doing daily testing. They are alienating the majority to satisfy the minority. It's a bad business decision.

[bbtondo]

3 minutes ago, brianw123 said:

I completely disagree. I think you underestimate the number of people that trust the effectiveness of the vaccine and want to move on. If Viking stops daily testing I believe the ships will still be at capacity. To the contrary Viking will eventually lose business if they keep doing daily testing. They are alienating the majority to satisfy the minority. It's a bad business decision.

I agree with you.  When I posted here before my Viking Nov 2021  Med cruise I got a lot of disagreement regarding not testing and no contact tracers.  Now however, it seems that more and more Viking customers are writing here agreeing with getting rid of the testing and contact tracers.  

 

I think Viking will do away with the testing when and if they are not bringing in enough $$$$ .  I have booked a cruise with O this summer doing my own test before I travel to make sure I'm not positive. Now, we need the US to do away with the testing requirement to fly back home to the US.  How about if at the very least US citizens don't have to test anymore when flying HOME. JMHO 

[Blackduck59]

1 hour ago, brianw123 said:

I completely disagree. I think you underestimate the number of people that trust the effectiveness of the vaccine and want to move on. If Viking stops daily testing I believe the ships will still be at capacity. To the contrary Viking will eventually lose business if they keep doing daily testing. They are alienating the majority to satisfy the minority. It's a bad business decision.

 

Unfortunately you have chosen to take the response you quoted out of context. It was a carry over from an earlier post that "at risk people should just stay home" implying they should in effect be under house arrest so that others won't have to use a modicum of precautions on their behalf. 

I just got off a Viking cruise and the daily testing was no big deal. Viking has bigger problems than that to deal with. It was our first and last Viking voyage and daily testing had nothing to do with our decision to not use Viking again. 

[BQEC]

Blackduck59, So what influenced your decision not to use Viking again?

[Jim Avery]

I read the post about at risk people should stay home a bit differently.  To me the issue is that at risk people should accurately self evaluate and choose what is good for them.  Not expect the rest of the world to adapt to them.

[OnTheJourney]

2 hours ago, brianw123 said:

will eventually lose business if they keep doing daily testing

Not to mention allegedly having to wear something designed for contact tracing purposes. Seriously?  As Jim said awhile ago, sounds more like house arrest than a cruise!  

 

We can hope that someday NONE of this current covid-related talk as to testing and various other protocols, etc. will all be behind us. 

Edited April 20, 2022 by AnyWayIsGood

[OnTheJourney]

On 4/17/2022 at 7:40 PM, Let Me Travel! said:

if the people who are at high risk would stay home,

Truly unbelievable.  I've heard this sort of thing before on CC.

 

Jim...I do see your interpretation, so had it been stated in such a manner, though, it might not have received the same reaction.

 

Scrooge..."let them die and decrease the surplus population". That's one way it kind of comes across. 

Edited April 20, 2022 by AnyWayIsGood

[OnTheJourney]

2 hours ago, bbtondo said:

if they are not bringing in enough $$$$

The way I see it, despite the pandemic setback, it would appear that Viking and other cruise lines are doing ok if they're continuing to invest in and build new ships. I recall  the one cruise we were on where we were told that a million dollars of new business was generated via "next cruise" bookings that took place during the voyage. For me, the status of future bookings with Viking depends on the outcome of this next one. DW and I are starting to look favorably on cruising mostly out of the two ports that are within easy driving distance for us. No need to fly anywhere. 

[Blackduck59]

50 minutes ago, BQEC said:

Blackduck59, So what influenced your decision not to use Viking again?

 

It was a combination of several things. My biggest thing was that the service level was not what I expected for the price paid. I don't really want to critique the cruise on this thread, which is about Viking's chairman declaring covid to be "behind us"

[BQEC]

Thank you Blackduck 59. 

[duquephart]

1 minute ago, Blackduck59 said:

 

It was a combination of several things. My biggest thing was that the service level was not what I expected for the price paid. I don't really want to critique the cruise on this thread, which is about Viking's chairman declaring covid to be "behind us"

 

Start a new thread. We're all waiting ------------

[SJD117]

2 minutes ago, Blackduck59 said:

 

It was a combination of several things. My biggest thing was that the service level was not what I expected for the price paid. I don't really want to critique the cruise on this thread, which is about Viking's chairman declaring covid to be "behind us"

Interesting. We've enjoyed five Viking cruises precisely because of the service we've received. But, different strokes for different folks. 

[OnTheJourney]

On 4/18/2022 at 11:53 AM, Twitchly said:

Land trips — or another cruise line — are looking more appealing to us these days.

Agreed...

Edited April 20, 2022 by AnyWayIsGood

[hutch1994]

Guess Tor hasn't been following all those positive covid cases on his river boats and people being taken off said boats.

[CCWineLover]

2 hours ago, hutch1994 said:

Guess Tor hasn't been following all those positive covid cases on his river boats and people being taken off said boats.

They’ve got to realize what’s going on and hopefully are discussing course of action over the rest of 2022.

[Let Me Travel!]

On 4/20/2022 at 10:30 AM, AnyWayIsGood said:

Truly unbelievable.  I've heard this sort of thing before on CC.

 

Jim...I do see your interpretation, so had it been stated in such a manner, though, it might not have received the same reaction.

 

Scrooge..."let them die and decrease the surplus population". That's one way it kind of comes across. 

I’m so sorry you read my opinion in such a way… I hope each person will evaluate their own ‘risk’ and make their decision whether to go or not…I truly believe each person knows their own risk level and each person can decide whether or not to take the risk of traveling.  I genuinely believe that people who are not considered to be “at risk” (folks who have gotten 4 shots, are in good heath, even though they may be over 60…) should not have to change their lives to the point where the cruise looses enjoyment.

[rbslos18]

On 4/20/2022 at 8:18 AM, brianw123 said:

I completely disagree. I think you underestimate the number of people that trust the effectiveness of the vaccine and want to move on. If Viking stops daily testing I believe the ships will still be at capacity. To the contrary Viking will eventually lose business if they keep doing daily testing. They are alienating the majority to satisfy the minority. It's a bad business decision.

I get your frustration but I think you may not get the point of my post or my explanation is inadequate. I trust the effectiveness of the vaccine and agree it is time to move on. Where we may disagree is who should decide what moving on looks like. I advocate these medical decisions be made by scientists and medical experts and not frustrated (myself included) passengers. Should I, as a customer, disagree with the experts, I can fire the experts and go to a different cruiseline. Personally, I see COVID as endemic and would be thrilled to see Viking’s experts reduce mitigation measures.

Edited April 22, 2022 by rbslos18

[OnTheJourney]

On 4/21/2022 at 9:25 AM, hutch1994 said:

positive covid cases on his river boats

Oh?  Guess I haven't been keeping up enough. Lots of cases?  What about on the Ocean voyages? 

[uktog]

17 hours ago, AnyWayIsGood said:

Oh?  Guess I haven't been keeping up enough. Lots of cases?  What about on the Ocean voyages? 

Viking are not as open as other ocean lines.  There’s no way of knowing accurately

[Let Me Travel!]

Well, We leave tomorrow to go on the GRAND EUROPEAN (A to B) on Lif.  We have been “re-masked” until 4/30…There are some reports (see Grand European thread) that discusses OTHER threads / posts, where several folks have tested positive and been removed from River ships; however, it seems over the past several days, the numbers have gone down…I think because the River ships are smaller, the contagion may be more likely.

 

As I have read, (not that I Have read them all)….even though some folks have tested positive, no on is reporting anything worse than a scratchy throat.  Isn’t that the most important issue? The positive diagnoses have not resulted in any kind of serious illness…yeah! Hasn’t that been the overall goal? 
 

we have “glowing” arms from up to 4 shots, we’ve pre-flight tested, we’re getting tested daily (at least for now) and we’ve been temporarily re-masked….time to “Let it Go”…..

[BigBee51]

Until the US drops the mandatory PCR test within 24 hours of boarding a flight into the the country, I'd rather test positive (yikes) while on board and on Vikings dime than get off the ship and be unable to board a flight home and stuck in some hotel on my dime. Just saying.... 

[SailorPaulH]

34 minutes ago, BigBee51 said:

Until the US drops the mandatory PCR test within 24 hours of boarding a flight into the the country, I'd rather test positive (yikes) while on board and on Vikings dime than get off the ship and be unable to board a flight home and stuck in some hotel on my dime. Just saying.... 

Taking it one step further - it's best to test positive 10-90 days before you leave, based on Viking's travel instructions.

 

One question I have not seen asked is about various reports of people being quarantined or removed from VOC and VRC cruises: are these passengers testing positive for their first time ever or have they tested positive sometime in the past (prior to the 90 day limit)? IF so. it would suggest that anyone who has had COVID in the past should not worry to much about testing positive during the trip as re-infection has been shown to be a rare event (albeit it possible).

Edited April 24, 2022 by SailorPaulH
typo

[shadowlover]

32 minutes ago, SailorPaulH said:

Taking it one step further - it's best to test positive 10-90 days before you leave, based on Viking's travel instructions.

 

One question I have not seen asked is about various reports of people being quarantined or removed from VOC and VRC cruises: are these passengers testing positive for their first time ever or have they tested positive sometime in the past (prior to the 90 day limit)? IF so. it would suggest that anyone who has had COVID in the past should not worry to much about testing positive during the trip as re-infection has been shown to be a rare event (albeit it possible).

I know many people who have tested positive multiple times , some of them despite 3 vaccines.  This is a crazy and unpredictable virus.  No one I know who has received the vaccines and then tested positive has had any symptoms worse than a mild cold.  It is time to truly move past this for those of us vaccinated and boosted and willing to continue with recommended vaccines.

[rbslos18]

5 hours ago, shadowlover said:

 No one I know who has received the vaccines and then tested positive has had any symptoms worse than a mild cold.  It is time to truly move past this for those of us vaccinated and boosted and willing to continue with recommended vaccines.

What you describe is scientifically true. The big elephant in the room is how does Viking  move forward given those who are vaccinated and boosted rarely end up in the hospital or even seeing a doctor.

 

Here are some ideas that would be a win-win for Viking and passengers. Please feel free to tweak and debate. Can we come up with a new policy most of us can endorse and share this with Viking? Doctors' input is especially welcome. Remember the goal is to make this a win-win.

Vaccinations: All passengers and staff must be fully vaccinated and boosted by at least two weeks before the cruise.

Pre-test: Proctored or lab-performed Antigen test or PCR tests 72 hours before boarding the ship

PCR Testing: Only upon embarkation and on day 5 of the cruise. Testing will only be increased if there is evidence of an outbreak or surge.

Masks: Optional unless there is evidence of an outbreak onboard or if required in a port city.

Quarantining: In the cabin

Does this proposal seem reasonable and safe?

Edited April 24, 2022 by rbslos18

[KBs mum]

59 minutes ago, rbslos18 said:

What you describe is scientifically true. The big elephant in the room is how does Viking  move forward given those who are vaccinated and boosted rarely end up in the hospital or even seeing a doctor.

 

Here are some ideas that would be a win-win for Viking and passengers. Please feel free to tweak and debate. Can we come up with a new policy most of us can endorse and share this with Viking? Doctors' input is especially welcome. Remember the goal is to make this a win-win.

Vaccinations: All passengers and staff must be fully vaccinated and boosted by at least two weeks before the cruise.

Pre-test: Proctored or lab-performed Antigen test or PCR tests 72 hours before boarding the ship

PCR Testing: Only upon embarkation and on day 5 of the cruise. Testing will only be increased if there is evidence of an outbreak or surge.

Masks: Optional unless there is evidence of an outbreak onboard or if required in a port city.

Quarantining: In the cabin

Does this proposal seem reasonable and safe?

Or accept it is endemic, vaccines as reccomended prevent serious illness, so as is increasingly the case in Europe, treat covid in the same way as any other infectious disease. If you've got it, try to avoid passing it on, otherwise carry on as normal. 

Those who need to self isolate should be given assistance to do so.