Sojourn Review

I have been debating if I should bother writing a review of the Sojourn for some time. First, I don't like cruises. Our best friends, keep dragging us along on various cruises (We have cruised with Oceania, Celebrity, Princess, Cunard, Silver Sea, Regent, Crystal, Azamara and now Seabourn). We really enjoy our time with them, but don't like the cruises at all. We held out hope that we would eventually find a line we like, but after our spring Med. cruise on the Sojourn, I am never setting foot on a cruise ship again. Compared with a nice hotel, the rooms on ships are much smaller and less luxurious, the food is astronomically better at a restaurant and worse yet, I think cruises are more expensive than a better hotel vacation. The real deal breaker is that everything feels rushed on a cruise. You show up one place in the morning, then leave by dinner. You spend most of your vacation in a bus or private car and there is no time to see anything in-depth. I don't find this style of vacation at all relaxing.

Secondly, I don't know if there is any point posting a negative review here. If you are considering a cruise and have come here for objective advice, you are entirely in the wrong place. If a poster here has more than 10 posts, ignore everything they have to say. These posters are so in love with cruising, and Seabourn in particular, that their perspective is completely skewed. They have been referred to as "cheerleaders", but this term does not go far enough. I realize that I might seem like a troll, but I don't care. I call things how I see them, and if you don't like what I have to say, so be it.

After that long preamble, how does Seabourn compare with the other cruise lines I have traveled with? There was nothing about Seabourn that made me say "wow". The main difference between the cruise lines seems to be the size of the ships. Seabourn was on the smaller side, with relatively less to do.

The rooms on the Sojourn were not more luxurious than other lines. I don't have exact numbers, but I feel they were slightly larger than other lines. That said, the penthouse suite we stayed in had this bizarre glass partition wall that served no purpose and just wasted space.

The food was good, but really only average compared to the other cruise lines, and was substantially worse than a good landed restaurant. The included wines were terrible. At least they let you bring your own on board, which was a cinch in Europe.

The service was spotty at best. I think there were many regulars on board that monopolized all the attention. A lot of the regulars seemed to be very demanding of special requests. Their behavior coupled with a running dialogue of how things were better in the past was off-putting. Certain staff members were good, but there were an equal number that had a palpable "i don't care" attitude. I have experienced slow, or unenthusiastic service on other lines, but I have never seen such indifference and obvious disdain by staff. Fortunately, none of it was directed at my party.

I don't know what else to say. If you insist on cruising, I would advise picking by price and itinerary. Their is nothing special about Seabourn.

Ah well, what a shame you did not enjoy it....... but at least you are a good friend and go on lots of vacations that you know you will have to endure to please others.

I agree that there are many "cheerleaders" who love to cruise and are willing to overlook the restrictions cruising entails. However ,dstamps. you are the complete opposite, someone who does not like to cruise and is unwilling to overlook anything. Cruising is obviously not for you and I only wonder why you have taken so many cruises just to please others since you are obviously not easily pleased yourself.

wripro- as chief cheerleader I figured you would reply as such. You have a history of attacking the poster, not the content of their complaint.

I believe I answered your question in the original post. We were hopeful that we would find a suitable cruise line if we kept trying and we really enjoy vacationing with our friends. Planning a vacation is very time consuming, and we are very grateful that our friends have taken that burden upon themselves for our benefit. We have been on many land based vacations that were absolutely perfect. I am 100% convinced that Seabourn will never deliver an experience that comes anywhere close to as good as we have had at numerous resorts. So, we have very politely let it be known that we thoroughly enjoy their company, but please no more cruises.

feeling sorry you did not like the sojourn - i did not like the odyssey but did like the quest ... simply because it was a better team.

i immediately agree there is a difference between seabourn in the early years ( pre carnival and pre HAL ) and the actual seabourn

as on so many others lines : cruising did change

concerning "cheerleaders" : i find it simply sad that existing "facts" are sometimes immediately embellished - or even - denied by some people to defend a favourite cruise company

just one item : it cannot be denied that seabourn does serve prosecco on the welcome party what used to be French champagne

however by request you do receive a glass...

but why trying to embellish the facts ?

And the point of your post was????

If you don't like cruising then why review, it is always going to be a negative one.

How can you review from a balanced perspective?

I take at least five holidays a year, with only one of them being a cruise,and think that Seabourn offers service and quality comparable to any land based vacation. This is comparing to minimum 5 and some 6 star resort, as i wont holiday below this level.

Having stayed many times Raffles, Burj al Arab, Shangri La etc, i wonder where you go to in order to receive such fantastic service?? Obviously the food is not of Michelin quality, but then it isn't trying to be!

Tillylovesseabourn- given your username, I think you have adequately proven my point about cheerleaders on this forum. Why review the Sojourn if I don't like cruises? If you read the full post, you can see that I compare the Sojourn to other cruise lines I was on with the final assessment that Seabourn is nothing special, and is in many ways a lesser product to the other lines.

Vistaman - you bring up a good point that I neglected in the original post. One of my dislikes about cruising is the all-inclusive product. By going all-inclusive I feel that cruises have diluted the quality of the experience to the point that they are not in the same class as true luxury properties. Substituting proseco for real champagne in a cost savings measure? Wow, what luxury. Seabourn management should be ashamed of their wine list.

Dstamps, you clearly don't read all of my avatar.

My point is that if you state you don't like cruising, and complain about having to go on a cruise, then before we even read it we know you aren't going to like ANY cruise, so what is the point of reviewing?

I love many cruise lines, Seabourn amongst them, and have sailed with many different lines, thus having an objective point of view. I am certainly not naive enough to think that there will never be anything else out there either.

Seabourn has always been all inclusive and always had available Champagne, and there are some lovely wines available to purchase from a selection, but if you didn't want to pay the extra........

Obviously the food is not of Michelin quality, but then it isn't trying to be!

I could not think of a more damning assessment of the food quality on Seabourn. Thank you for making my point that if fine dining is important to you, you can do much better on land. I can understand the difficulty a ship would have sourcing fresh high quality ingredients, especially on a penny pinching all-inclusive budget, but your own admission that they don't even try? Wow! Are you sure you really love Seabourn? And if so, why?

Loved the original post. I really do not disagree with much that was written.

The thing that might be missed is that this is a forum for people that cruise.

Most like, or love it. Coming here to demonstrate your disdain for the hobby makes as much sense as writing on a forum for race car drivers, if it has no interest to you.

Wripro as lead cheerleader.....not even close. And his comments to you, made sense to me.

I could not think of a more damning assessment of the food quality on Seabourn. Thank you for making my point that if fine dining is important to you, you can do much better on land. I can understand the difficulty a ship would have sourcing fresh high quality ingredients, especially on a penny pinching all-inclusive budget, but your own admission that they don't even try? Wow! Are you sure you really love Seabourn? And if so, why?

Oh dear, Mr Troll, methinks you had better go back to your cave!

You really don't read things properly in context do you, otherwise you wouldn't have such snarky replies to my food related comments. Anyway, hotshot,you still haven't told us all of the fantastic places, on land, we are supposedly missing'!!!

Better take Oregon50's advice

Thanks for the report. As you sound like you have realized, cruising is not for everyone. Perhaps you can have some land based trips with your friends?

Tilly, what context am I missing? You brought up the Michelin guide. Not everyone realizes that Seabourn will never achieve a single star. Please explain yourself, and how they are not even trying to achieve excellence in their cuisine.

Oregon50- I don't disagree with anything you said, that is why I prefaced the whole thing with I don't even know why I am bothering. I was open, honest and upfront when I stated that after 10 cruises, I prefer land based vacations.

I just don't see how this invalidates my opinions about cruising in general and about Seabourn in particular.

Believe me, I am not here to flame you guys. I just think there might be some people out there that believe this sight is about objective cruise reviews, instead of a cruise enthusiast board. That is why I posted my thoughts.

 

I just don't see how this invalidates my opinions about cruising in general and about Seabourn in particular.

It doesn't. We're all allowed to have one.

The fact is that a land based holiday IS in many ways superior: a suite in a top hotel will offer much more space and comfort, often with a huge bathroom complete with stunning views. The hotel may well have a Michelin starred restaurant, if not there are likely to be many other restaurants, cafes, even street food vendors to choose from in the neighborhood. Pools will be larger, less crowded. Many of the staff will be local so it is easier to connect with the regional culture even if you never leave the hotel grounds and a good resort hotel can be used as a base from which to explore the area in depth. It is most unlikely that anyone will suffer sea sickness. And therein lies the rub.

What a land based holiday does not offer is the opportunity to be at sea. Granted a beach resort may be by the sea, but many people who go on cruises (I guess) like to be AT sea and the Seabourn ships, by virtue of their size, do give one a sense of seafaring. Which you can't get on a land based holiday. Personally I like ports, by and large. I like sailing into them and sailing away from them. I like the gentle motion of the ship at night, the cooling breeze in the tropical heat, watching the lights from fishing boats reflect in the water, seeing the stars turn as the ship turns (seeing the stars period). I like getting to know some of the relatively small number of fellow passengers, I like the sense of something shared rather than the feeling of people just passing through for a few days that one often has in a hotel.

You are right - in many ways Seabourn is nothing special, but in many other ways it is.

But if you don't like cruising, then perhaps you don't like being at sea, in which case no cruise line is going to ring your bell.

Its a shame about your experience with the staff on Sojourn. I'm afraid it can be hit or miss sometimes, although it shouldn't be, but it can happen at good hotels too.

I find it sad that you take vacations that you do not like. Life is to short. I happened to like SB very much. That is not to say it is perfect all the time. It is not. We have had to have some issues addressed, but it still works for us.. I do not like SS and I am not using this word lightly. I hate Paul Gauguin. When I tried to write about it on their board I got trampled on my their Cheerleaders. They were not kind especially one particular man.I just gave up and know I will never travel on that line again.

You are right you need to give up cruises, it is just not for you. I think you deserve the right to say what you want. The reason for this blog. I only hope you went on this cruise with an open mind. You said you did. The Staff can be quite wonderful if given the chance. I believe they can make or break a cruise.We have been lucky.

Happy Traveling.

...that this thread is running.

I was told about it when it started and I read...

" First, I don't like cruises. Our best friends, keep dragging us along on various cruises (We have cruised with Oceania, Celebrity, Princess, Cunard, Silver Sea, Regent, Crystal, Azamara and now Seabourn). We really enjoy our time with them, but don't like the cruises at all."

The man does not like cruises.

Nothing that Seabourn could do will change that.

The man does not like cruises.

Even his 'best friends' have failed to get him to change his mind. I would certainly not try nine cruise companies if I did not like cruising.

I am surprised with all these friends that the OP is seeking advice here. Or maybe he isn't actually seeking advice.....

Tony

The fact is that a land based holiday IS in many ways superior: a suite in a top hotel will offer much more space and comfort, often with a huge bathroom complete with stunning views. The hotel may well have a Michelin starred restaurant, if not there are likely to be many other restaurants, cafes, even street food vendors to choose from in the neighborhood. Pools will be larger, less crowded. Many of the staff will be local so it is easier to connect with the regional culture even if you never leave the hotel grounds and a good resort hotel can be used as a base from which to explore the area in depth. It is most unlikely that anyone will suffer sea sickness. And therein lies the rub.

 

What a land based holiday does not offer is the opportunity to be at sea. Granted a beach resort may be by the sea, but many people who go on cruises (I guess) like to be AT sea and the Seabourn ships, by virtue of their size, do give one a sense of seafaring. Which you can't get on a land based holiday. Personally I like ports, by and large. I like sailing into them and sailing away from them. I like the gentle motion of the ship at night, the cooling breeze in the tropical heat, watching the lights from fishing boats reflect in the water, seeing the stars turn as the ship turns (seeing the stars period). I like getting to know some of the relatively small number of fellow passengers, I like the sense of something shared rather than the feeling of people just passing through for a few days that one often has in a hotel.

 

You are right - in many ways Seabourn is nothing special, but in many other ways it is.

 

But if you don't like cruising, then perhaps you don't like being at sea, in which case no cruise line is going to ring your bell.

 

Its a shame about your experience with the staff on Sojourn. I'm afraid it can be hit or miss sometimes, although it shouldn't be, but it can happen at good hotels too.

+1

Thank you Flaming June for putting into words how I feel about cruising. It is being on the sea that I love and the crew.

dstamps thank you for taking the time to express your opinion. You are just as entitled to yours as I am to mine. I don't find the crew indifferent but maybe I am one of the people monopolising their time by talking to them and finding out how they are. :o

Julie

About Seabourn and cruising in general...

In addition to Flamin-June's points about the luxury and excitement of cruising on a perfectly balanced Seabourn ship- service, food, space, accommodation- it's the variety of experiences from those sea days, port visits, chances to meet new people and the parties. In effect, I view every meal, conversation, coffee session and event as a party.

Yes, I love these aspects of Seabourn and I don't know how you could even come close at some 5 star hotel- or combination of hotels- when you have something of a budget and a couple of weeks or a couple of months to spare.

Further, I know Frantic26 and Wripro and probably some others on this thread whom I will happily see again on a Seabourn ship. Same applies to dozens of their dedicated staff and officers. And I look forward to doing so.

We don't necessarily know when or where and that does not matter. It's a club and we know we are members. Yep, that's makes the expectation of another Seabourn cruise something special!

Happy sailing!

PS- Cruisecritic has rolls calls for Seabourn and Seabourn has Club parties for their repeat guests with awards for their top sailors.

Ever heard of that for a group such as Ritz Carlton or maybe at a hotel chain with just 5 properties, the number of Seabourn ships?

Happy sailing!

Dstamps - how did you find the other cruise lines you sailed on? Did any of them come closer to what you expected?

"Did any of them come closer to what you expected?"

My guess is that they all did. The man said he does not like cruising.

A bit like not liking fish and grumbling there is nothing you like in a fish restaurant.

Tony

PS- Cruisecritic has rolls calls for Seabourn and Seabourn has Club parties for their repeat guests with awards for their top sailors.

 

Ever heard of that for a group such as Ritz Carlton or maybe at a hotel chain with just 5 properties, the number of Seabourn ships?

 

Happy sailing!

True reinforcement of dstamps thought process. Two events I have never considered attending. It is fun giving the bowl to a worthy crew person.

I had two goals in my original post.

The first was to provide a review specific to my Med cruise on the Sojourn. In an effort to be honest and upfront, things have degenerated into a conversation about the relative merits of a cruise vacation. Let me be clear, I am not paying for the privilege of spending 14 days to be tortured inside some middle east prison. We went on vacation and we had fun. Yet at the end of a cruise, I always know that we would have had more fun and experienced much greater luxury on a land vacation. I think Flamin June nicely presented some of the reasons why I prefer resorts, and being on the water holds no special meaning to me. The one clear thing cruises do better, and Seabourn seems to excel at this, is cause the passengers to mingle and create a sense of comradery. Since we bring our own friends along, this benefit is lost on us, and it certainly does not offset the significant drop in luxury.

To get back on point, there are five areas I judge a vacation on facilities, accommodations, food, entertainment and service.

Facilities: The Sojourn is fairly new, but is already starting to look a little threadbare. Noticeable stains on carpeting and occasionally the smell of raw sewage in the hallway. If you like to gamble you will be extremely disapointed in the casino. As a smaller ship, it compares to SS. All the other ships had significantly more to do. I particularly like the cooking school and art classes on Oceania, as well as the golf on Crystal.

Accommodations: If you compare similar room categories, the Sojourn's rooms are quite large. In the same class as Regent which might be slightly larger. If you compare by dollars spent, you can get a much bigger, nicer room on Princess, Oceania and Celebrity for the same money. I think Crystal had the smallest most uncomfortable rooms.

Food: I think the top two lines would be Oceania and Crystal. The Sojourn is comparable to SS, Azamara and Regent and they are not far behind the top group. Things get complicated if you include the for charge restaurants. Take for example Celebrity, the food quality is better in their for fee restaurants than on the Sojourn, but the main dining room and buffet is substantially worse than the Sojourn's.

Entertainment: The entertainment is much better and more diverse on the larger ships. On the Sojourn, it is dancing or drinking in the smoky observation lounge. Team trivia seemed to be popular, but we skipped it.

Service: This was the biggest surprise for me. The service on the Sojourn was similar to that on Princess or Celebrity. Sporadically slow, inattentive definitely not 5 star. Want breakfast in the MDR during a port day? Sorry, not going to happen. Want to order off the menu in the Colonnade? With the overcrowding and under-staffing, good luck getting a drink refill let alone an order in. Expect on 1.5 to 2 hours to be finished for a breakfast ordered off the menu. I think Regent and Crystal had the best service, though it could border on obsequious.

I hope that provides more detail than the previous posts.

In what is already a too long post, my second goal was to educate the novice looking for cruise reviews about the nature of this site. If you google cruise reviews this is the first hit. If you google car reviews the selection is much more diverse. To use the car analogy, this site is not car and driver, auto trader and it definitely is not consumer reports. This site is akin to the BMW club of North America. Do you think you would get an unbiased review of a Lexus there? How about a Mazda? I think it takes some time for people to realize the nature of this board, and I don't want anyone misled by unchecked bias.

I had two goals in my original post.

 

The first was to provide a review specific to my Med cruise on the Sojourn. In an effort to be honest and upfront, things have degenerated into a conversation about the relative merits of a cruise vacation. Let me be clear, I am not paying for the privilege of spending 14 days to be tortured inside some middle east prison. We went on vacation and we had fun. Yet at the end of a cruise, I always know that we would have had more fun and experienced much greater luxury on a land vacation. I think Flamin June nicely presented some of the reasons why I prefer resorts, and being on the water holds no special meaning to me. The one clear thing cruises do better, and Seabourn seems to excel at this, is cause the passengers to mingle and create a sense of comradery. Since we bring our own friends along, this benefit is lost on us, and it certainly does not offset the significant drop in luxury.

 

To get back on point, there are five areas I judge a vacation on facilities, accommodations, food, entertainment and service.

 

Facilities: The Sojourn is fairly new, but is already starting to look a little threadbare. Noticeable stains on carpeting and occasionally the smell of raw sewage in the hallway. If you like to gamble you will be extremely disapointed in the casino. As a smaller ship, it compares to SS. All the other ships had significantly more to do. I particularly like the cooking school and art classes on Oceania, as well as the golf on Crystal.

 

Accommodations: If you compare similar room categories, the Sojourn's rooms are quite large. In the same class as Regent which might be slightly larger. If you compare by dollars spent, you can get a much bigger, nicer room on Princess, Oceania and Celebrity for the same money. I think Crystal had the smallest most uncomfortable rooms.

 

Food: I think the top two lines would be Oceania and Crystal. The Sojourn is comparable to SS, Azamara and Regent and they are not far behind the top group. Things get complicated if you include the for charge restaurants. Take for example Celebrity, the food quality is better in their for fee restaurants than on the Sojourn, but the main dining room and buffet is substantially worse than the Sojourn's.

 

Entertainment: The entertainment is much better and more diverse on the larger ships. On the Sojourn, it is dancing or drinking in the smoky observation lounge. Team trivia seemed to be popular, but we skipped it.

 

Service: This was the biggest surprise for me. The service on the Sojourn was similar to that on Princess or Celebrity. Sporadically slow, inattentive definitely not 5 star. Want breakfast in the MDR during a port day? Sorry, not going to happen. Want to order off the menu in the Colonnade? With the overcrowding and under-staffing, good luck getting a drink refill let alone an order in. Expect on 1.5 to 2 hours to be finished for a breakfast ordered off the menu. I think Regent and Crystal had the best service, though it could border on obsequious.

 

I hope that provides more detail than the previous posts.

 

In what is already a too long post, my second goal was to educate the novice looking for cruise reviews about the nature of this site. If you google cruise reviews this is the first hit. If you google car reviews the selection is much more diverse. To use the car analogy, this site is not car and driver, auto trader and it definitely is not consumer reports. This site is akin to the BMW club of North America. Do you think you would get an unbiased review of a Lexus there? How about a Mazda? I think it takes some time for people to realize the nature of this board, and I don't want anyone misled by unchecked bias.

I think you make many valid points and I would have to agree with your automotive analogy (as a member of the BMWCCA). I even get the fact that travel with your friends is important enough to make you take a holiday not of your first choice. They must be great friends and fun to be with. Sorry about the flaming but that goes with being on a public forum. I have had much the same results on another all inclusive line's board by suggesting they were less than perfect. Finally, others had the same experience and now are worse than I.:eek: I fully agree that the cruise experience is degrading. They seem to be h*ll bent to follow the airlines model. Cut corners and fill the ships. I love cruising and particularly on smaller ships. This is out of step with most of the cruising world as they keep building bigger ships with more "options" like zip lines, rock walls, etc. As the trend progresses, watch out or you might find me on the lounger next to you at the Four Seasons.:eek::D