Cancelling P&O auto tips - does this hit P&O in the pocket or the staff?

I've always paid the auto tips, relatively happily because P&O staff (I exclude the officers, of course) are appallingly paid and they need that bit extra to manage much more than basic survival:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/apr/29/cruise-firm-performance-bonuses-tips ("P&O cruise ship staff paid basic salary of 75p an hour")

This was 2012, of course, but I doubt the figure's gone up much since then.

However, I've always assumed, naively probably, that the additional payments I've made to P&O have gone to the staff, and that if I opted out it would impact on what they receive.

Now I learn that opting out makes absolutely no difference to what the staff get - P&O simply pocket the lot and the staff receive exactly the same, whether I pay the charge or not. Their pay depends entirely, it seems, on customer feedback ratings, and not at all on how much P&O extract from customers by way of auto tips.

Is this actually the case? And if it is, is there any point whatever simply boosting P&O's profits by paying auto tips, as against giving the money to the staff?

 

Is this actually the case? And if it is, is there any point whatever simply boosting P&O's profits by paying auto tips, as against giving the money to the staff?

imho - NO

I've always paid the auto tips, relatively happily because P&O staff (I exclude the officers, of course) are appallingly paid and they need that bit extra to manage much more than basic survival:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/apr/29/cruise-firm-performance-bonuses-tips ("P&O cruise ship staff paid basic salary of 75p an hour")

 

This was 2012, of course, but I doubt the figure's gone up much since then.

 

However, I've always assumed, naively probably, that the additional payments I've made to P&O have gone to the staff, and that if I opted out it would impact on what they receive.

 

Now I learn that opting out makes absolutely no difference to what the staff get - P&O simply pocket the lot and the staff receive exactly the same, whether I pay the charge or not. Their pay depends entirely, it seems, on customer feedback ratings, and not at all on how much P&O extract from customers by way of auto tips.

 

Is this actually the case? And if it is, is there any point whatever simply boosting P&O's profits by paying auto tips, as against giving the money to the staff?

Have you really learnt that or have you read someones archaic argument against tipping and P&O.

Whaetver, I am sure it is not black and white and the answer lies somewhere in between..

Have you really learnt that or have you read someones archaic argument against tipping and P&O...

Actually, yes, I have really learned that - and today, too, on another thread.

And there obviously has to be a black and white answer - either it makes a difference to the payments received by the staff if you opt out, or it doesn't.

I can find nothing on the P&O website, or anywhere else, confirming that any or all of the auto tips go to the staff. It seems increasingly clear that it all goes to boosting P&O's profits, and that the staff will get exactly the same, whether you auto tip or not.

That's an eye-opener to me!

Actually, yes, I have really learned that - and today, too, on another thread.

 

 

 

And there obviously has to be a black and white answer - either it makes a difference to the payments received by the staff if you opt out, or it doesn't.

 

 

 

I can find nothing on the P&O website, or anywhere else, confirming that any or all of the auto tips go to the staff. It seems increasingly clear that it all goes to boosting P&O's profits, and that the staff will get exactly the same, whether you auto tip or not.

 

 

 

That's an eye-opener to me!

That’s what you get for believing post which have been made up at a very convenient time..

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That’s what you get for believing post which have been made up at a very convenient time..

 

 

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Sorry - not with you on that one.

Sorry - not with you on that one.

Because there is a great deal of miss information is being posted and people are falling for it.

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Because there is a great deal of miss information is being posted and people are falling for it.

 

 

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Fake news only prospers when there is no denial from its target, that just leads people to believe there must be an element of truth there.

Fake news only prospers when there is no denial from its target, that just leads people to believe there must be an element of truth there.

But in this case there is no opportunity for denial. This is a chat forum, these things happen and get propogated.

But in this case there is no opportunity for denial. This is a chat forum, these things happen and get propogated.

There have been lots of posts from passengers who have queried this with P&O, but no specific denials, just weasel words.

There have been lots of posts from passengers who have queried this with P&O, but no specific denials, just weasel words.

I wonder why...

Anyway if you want to reward the staff give them old fashioned cash in their hand.

If you want to reward shareholders with increased dividends keep paying the auto tips.

I wonder why...

 

Anyway if you want to reward the staff give them old fashioned cash in their hand.

 

If you want to reward shareholders with increased dividends keep paying the auto tips.

Precisely.

I shall pay no more auto tips, and the money will go to the underpaid staff rather than the Carnival shareholders in the USA.

...Is this actually the case? And if it is, is there any point whatever simply boosting P&O's profits by paying auto tips, as against giving the money to the staff?

As P&O are directly involved in collecting the "tips", I think they should be obliged to explain to us the concept, system, call it what you will, but clarify it so the end result can represent our intentions.

Precisely.

 

 

 

I shall pay no more auto tips, and the money will go to the underpaid staff rather than the Carnival shareholders in the USA.

Many shareholders are in this country as it is a multi country company.

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There have been lots of posts from passengers who have queried this with P&O, but no specific denials, just weasel words.

The very comprehensive information about the pay structure which is 'out there' seems to me to be far more convincing than anything else we have been told. Until that is refuted and the 'real' details (for those who claim it's 'fake') are made clear, I for one am buying into it. AGs provided a significant cash flow to P&O (although likely to be decreasing with the number saying they are opting out) and this is distributed at their discretion. Giving crew cash tips at least means you know for sure that they benefit.

Would any of those defending the current AG system go along with it in a restaurant, or anywhere else, for that matter?

When I pay the final bill after eating, I ask if a tip added to the card payment goes to the staff. If they say it does, I'm happy to pay it that way. If they say it doesn't, or the answer is in any way evasive, I pay it in cash.

What is the difference between this scenario, which I imagine many on here follow, and adopting the same approach with P&O?

I cannot believe that anyone who has read all the recent dialogue on this subject would continue to pay the AG/Autotip.

From what the crew member who posted recently said about their bonus payments, there is vast discrepancy between the amount of money collected by P&O from us and the bonus payment paid to staff. As P&O are unwillingly to state how the money is dispersed and the amounts involved - how can we be expected to a) trust the system and b) continue to pay it.

P&O are unwilling to offer any more information than saying that money is shared between the staff. I have asked what happens to the £196 I would pay for a 2 week cruise and was told that it is shared between the CS and the waiters - but we know that it is simply not true based on the information given by the crew member. When I asked how much went to each person I was told that it varies according to performance. When I asked what happens if my CS and waiters underperform they said it is shared between the others. I don't believe any of it, I think it pays the whole wage bill.

End of the line for autotips from here on in. Can't understand why it's taken us so long to smell the coffee.

I was told by a cabin steward that if the tips are removed they are still paid the same as long as the feedback is excellent. So seems to confirm the original post.

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Gratuities free cruising here we come [emoji3][emoji106]

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I was told by a cabin steward that if the tips are removed they are still paid the same as long as the feedback is excellent. So seems to confirm the original post.

 

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I was told the opposite almost. He said if he didn't get excellent he wouldn't get his BONUS - that's a bit different!

I was told the opposite almost. He said if he didn't get excellent he wouldn't get his BONUS - that's a bit different!

Pretty much the same thing, I think. Basically they get the same pay (with or without the bonus) regardless of whether you remove the auto-tip.

What REALLY matters, above all else, is the feedback you give.

How long, I wonder, before P&O make these tips compulsory instead of voluntary, or just incorporate them into the headline price? The more of us that withhold them (and there's no logical reason whatever to pay them and boost shareholder dividends) the more likely that is to happen.

Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing depends on your viewpoint; the present system is keeping prices down, but only if you opt out, and if you pass on the 'saving' to the staff you gain nothing.

Pretty much the same thing, I think. Basically they get the same pay (with or without the bonus) regardless of whether you remove the auto-tip.

 

What REALLY matters, above all else, is the feedback you give.

 

How long, I wonder, before P&O make these tips compulsory instead of voluntary, or just incorporate them into the headline price? The more of us that withhold them (and there's no logical reason whatever to pay them and boost shareholder dividends) the more likely that is to happen.

 

Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing depends on your viewpoint; the present system is keeping prices down, but only if you opt out, and if you pass on the 'saving' to the staff you gain nothing.

They won't get rid of auto tips any time soon as there are still plenty of suckers who pay them.

I was told by a cabin steward that if the tips are removed they are still paid the same as long as the feedback is excellent. So seems to confirm the original post.

 

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I agree on our last couple of cruises, the cabin steward was so determined to get us to give an "excellent" rating on the end of cruise questionnaire, in the 7 days he must have mentioned it at least 3 times.

Yes agree. I have learnt the same. The autotips dont matter but the Excellent does! I shall carry on removing the autotips until they stop it and put it in the cruise price.