The other side of the Freedom/tobacco story

[BecciBoo]

Ok,Im no expert on hookah,but if he had hookah tobacco,wouldnt he be smoking it like hookah(using a pipe like below)?? Not sure why you say no hookah was involved:confused:

..

 

This is a hookah:

 

 

 

 

There was no hookah.

[jennmaybe]

Can someone tell me the name of the other thread....somehow, I missed that one! I just read the news here on CC and then noticed this thread!

 

I haven't read the other thread yet, but something tells me that there is still so much more to this story!!

[wolfganghowell]

I have some sympathy for Hager BUT the crucial detail that we have all jumped on is hiding the tobacco and pipe in a hairspray can. Becci, I usually agree with you but comparing it to hiding jewelry is a reach. Hiding jewelry is to keep it from being stolen, hiding tobacco leaves and a pipe is to imply there is something wrong with them. I would think anyone who smokes loose leaves and travels knows that being open with them is a lot easier than trying to be deceptive.

 

Perception is what sealed the case on this. Unfortunately, his actions were the catalyst for the entire debacle and his actions had consequences. I do think Royal should refund them their cruise fare but I don't feel they are owed any damages. I understand why Royal acted the way they did - concealing it made it seem it was illegal. Sadly, Hager's hubby needs to take responsibility for screwing this up and if she knew he was hiding it in a fake bottom of a fake hairspray can, she too bears some of the blame. Like I said, I have some sympathy but ultimately they set themselves up and are not innocent victims.

[Scotty G]

Oh, OK. I defended the OP on the other thread, but things much clearer now. Typical 'dummy run', Captain worried they are going shopping for something in the islands, which they will smuggle back onboard the same way, therefore high risk.

My thoughts exactly. Good call by whoever made it!

[mation101]

Security finds something that looks like an illegal substance hidden in a false bottom hairspray. To me that would make the passenger high risk. At that point I dont think it mattered what was in the baggie, his cruise was over.

 

He was conducting himself in a suspicious manner.

 

It was the Captains call.

[LittleMissMagic]

My thoughts exactly. Good call by whoever made it!

 

Actually, they do have a legal use which has been mentioned on this thread - hiding valuable such as jewelry.

[EV2008]

There's not a policy in the world that is going to compensate someone for being denied boarding for violating policies.

 

 

OK the article said that it was determined that it was not illegal substance, so how can they be in violation of policies?:confused: just because they packed it in another container does not make it illegal. It may look odd, but that is not illegal.

[sredish]

Can someone tell me the name of the other thread....somehow, I missed that one! I just read the news here on CC and then noticed this thread!

 

I haven't read the other thread yet, but something tells me that there is still so much more to this story!!

 

It was pretty easy to miss...only about eleventy billion posts long. Trust me though, it's very entertaining.

[BecciBoo]

I have some sympathy for Hager BUT the crucial detail that we have all jumped on is hiding the tobacco and pipe in a hairspray can. Becci, I usually agree with you but comparing it to hiding jewelry is a reach. Hiding jewelry is to keep it from being stolen, hiding tobacco leaves and a pipe is to imply there is something wrong with them. I would think anyone who smokes loose leaves and travels knows that being open with them is a lot easier than trying to be deceptive.

 

Perception is what sealed the case on this. Unfortunately, his actions were the catalyst for the entire debacle and his actions had consequences. I do think Royal should refund them their cruise fare but I don't feel they are owed any damages. I understand why Royal acted the way they did - concealing it made it seem it was illegal. Sadly, Hager's hubby needs to take responsibility for screwing this up and if she knew he was hiding it in a fake bottom of a fake hairspray can, she too bears some of the blame. Like I said, I have some sympathy but ultimately they set themselves up and are not innocent victims.

 

I would agree except that perception is not the law. Fact is the law. In a court of law, even eye witness testimony many times is not factual. You make decisions like this on the facts, not perception. I still say they did nothing mentioned within the confines of the cruise contract that would keep them from sailing. Stupid and lame yes, but guilty, no.

[sredish]

Maybe she was thinking of THIS pipe that Popeye smoked....

 

[karatemom2]

"Oh what a tangled web we weave..."

 

I feel bad that she lost her vacation, but people who act like they have something to hide generally do.

[BecciBoo]

Maybe she was thinking of THIS pipe that Popeye smoked....

 

 

There ya go! THey did not have this one:D I wonder should be ask for a picture of hers????

[Cruising89143]

All I want to know is why didn't Hagerz tell us the part about the can with the false bottom?? Why did she say a baggie??:confused:

 

Remember this post on the original thread??

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=33559086&postcount=1056

Think we have our answer. Stupid is as stupid does.

 

Now that we have finally heard both sides of the story, it makes more sense why they did not get on board but again all it took was "common sense" to figure it out. ;) Interesting that the OP left out abou the can with hidden compartment. I guess she did not want to give us ALL the facts.

[BecciBoo]

"Oh what a tangled web we weave..."

 

I feel bad that she lost her vacation, but people who act like they have something to hide generally do.

 

In other words, "Guilty until proven innocent" in your country... How about after proven innocent....still guilty???? Hope nothing like this ever happens to you.

[reallyitsmema]

Why has the story been edited in the news section? Anyone else notice that Hager and her husband's names have now changed?:cool:

[BecciBoo]

Remember this post on the original thread??

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=33559086&postcount=1056

Think we have our answer. Stupid is as stupid does.

 

Now that we have finally heard both sides of the story, it makes more sense why they did not get on board but again all it took was "common sense" to figure it out. ;) Interesting that the OP left out abou the can with hidden compartment. I guess she did not want to give us ALL the facts.

 

O.K. I concede that the Captain could see him as a risk based on the common knowledge of narcotics agents, but I still think they are owed a refund. Again, assumption is not truth.

[wolfganghowell]

I would agree except that perception is not the law. Fact is the law.

 

Agreed! :) But perception is what got them in hot water and I think he knowingly knew the perception would be negative so he chose to hide it. Which in this case backfired badly.

 

As for the law, I would bet that Royal will find a way to legally justify denying boarding even though the leaves were not illegal. Like I said, I think they should be reimbursed but I can't see this becoming a legitimate court case.

[knittinggirl]

We used to take a faux colgate can on trips, thinking we could hide jewelry inside it. But after the first few trips, we stopped. Why are we taking two full size cans of Colgate shave cream? We figured if the maids were going to steal, then they would know all the different types of Faux containers. Now, the colgate can stays home, and so does our jewelry.

[Rockfordcruiser]

I would agree except that perception is not the law. Fact is the law. In a court of law, even eye witness testimony many times is not factual. You make decisions like this on the facts, not perception. I still say they did nothing mentioned within the confines of the cruise contract that would keep them from sailing. Stupid and lame yes, but guilty, no.

 

Ok this has nothing to do with what the law is...(YET) It has to do with policy's RCCL has in place for Possible illegal behavior while on their cruise ship. This person did something that was suspicious in behavior. It drew a red flag and according to their policy it only has to be "possible" illegal behavior. The captain made a decision is my guess based on the policy RCCL has in place.

[DaveG99]

When I was in Jamaica in 2002 on a cruise with my dad, sister, and grandma I got offered to buy a sack of weed in the market. The guy actually offered this to me in front of my dad! I was 25 at the time so I wasnt a kid but still it was strange. I told the guy jokingly that I can get it cheaper in the states. I am not a big pot smoker and didnt want any anyway. I did bring a bottle of appleton rum back on board the ship though.

[BecciBoo]

If you go to the link within CC article called Halo Hookah you can see the actual cans of "Tobacco". It is flavored tobacco, that's all.

I see the original names still Kathy, what are you referring to??

[wolfganghowell]

News article says names are Mary and Robert.

[johneeo]

This person did something that was suspicious in behavior ....

 

I have beedy eyes and sweat a lot.

 

..... This person did something that was suspicious in behavior. It drew a red flag and according to their policy ....

 

I could be denied boarding.

 

Makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

But, that is RCI standard operating procedure, common sense is not part of the equation.

[Cruising89143]

O.K. I concede that the Captain could see him as a risk based on the common knowledge of narcotics agents, but I still think they are owed a refund. Again, assumption is not truth.

 

I don't agree. Unless you're trying to hide something then there is no reason for them to place tabacco in the container that they used. It's obvious that the cruise lines are used to this ploy and this person was considered a high risk. They gambled and they lost.

[reallyitsmema]

When I was in Jamaica in 2002 on a cruise with my dad, sister, and grandma I got offered to buy a sack of weed in the market. The guy actually offered this to me in front of my dad! I was 25 at the time so I wasnt a kid but still it was strange. I told the guy jokingly that I can get it cheaper in the states. I am not a big pot smoker and didnt want any anyway. I did bring a bottle of appleton rum back on board the ship though.

That is not unusual at all. That doesn't mean you can bring it on the ship easily though. Not saying stuff doesn't get on, it does, but ending up in a Jamaican jail is not something on my bucket list.