Oceania Refused My Service Dog.

[jdcolorado]

This is my first ever try at posting in public so please forgive any mistakes.

I am a disabled (100%) U.S. veteran and I travel with my certified service dog Ginger. We have been on 11 cruised together and have been treated with respect by all crews and passenger with zero problems until yesterday. We booked a 20 day cruise on Oceania and paid the full amount because it sails Aug.2,2014. I received a call back from my travel agent who told me Oceania refused to allow Ginger to travel. I told her there must be a mistake because I have sailed with Oceania several times before and there was no issues. When I called Oceania, I was told "flat out" that my dog was not allowed and was not welcome on their ship. The lady (Natasha I think) was firm. She stated that because the ship did not touch the U.S. on this cruise Oceania was not required by law to allow Ginger onboard and because they were not required, they won't allow it.... period. When I asked to talk to a manager she told me it would do not good because that was policy and there was no manager available.

 

I had my agent cancel the cruise and have the credit posted to my credit card. As I said above we are not new to cruising(Hal, Princess, Oceania, etc.) and have never had a problem of any kind, not even on a trip to St. Petersburg, Russia.

Sorry this is so long but I needed to vent and let some folks know how Oceania feels about disabled people. If not required by law .... they don't want you,

 

Thanks,

Jim:mad:

[DOJO466]

This is my first ever try at posting in public so please forgive any mistakes.

I am a disabled (100%) U.S. veteran and I travel with my certified service dog Ginger. We have been on 11 cruised together and have been treated with respect by all crews and passenger with zero problems until yesterday. We booked a 20 day cruise on Oceania and paid the full amount because it sails Aug.2,2014. I received a call back from my travel agent who told me Oceania refused to allow Ginger to travel. I told her there must be a mistake because I have sailed with Oceania several times before and there was no issues. When I called Oceania, I was told "flat out" that my dog was not allowed and was not welcome on their ship. The lady (Natasha I think) was firm. She stated that because the ship did not touch the U.S. on this cruise Oceania was not required by law to allow Ginger onboard and because they were not required, they won't allow it.... period. When I asked to talk to a manager she told me it would do not good because that was policy and there was no manager available.

 

I had my agent cancel the cruise and have the credit posted to my credit card. As I said above we are not new to cruising(Hal, Princess, Oceania, etc.) and have never had a problem of any kind, not even on a trip to St. Petersburg, Russia.

Sorry this is so long but I needed to vent and let some folks know how Oceania feels about disabled people. If not required by law .... they don't want you,

 

Thanks,

Jim:mad:

 

Thank you for posting. This is NOT good:(

[nana541]

This is my first ever try at posting in public so please forgive any mistakes.

I am a disabled (100%) U.S. veteran and I travel with my certified service dog Ginger. We have been on 11 cruised together and have been treated with respect by all crews and passenger with zero problems until yesterday. We booked a 20 day cruise on Oceania and paid the full amount because it sails Aug.2,2014. I received a call back from my travel agent who told me Oceania refused to allow Ginger to travel. I told her there must be a mistake because I have sailed with Oceania several times before and there was no issues. When I called Oceania, I was told "flat out" that my dog was not allowed and was not welcome on their ship. The lady (Natasha I think) was firm. She stated that because the ship did not touch the U.S. on this cruise Oceania was not required by law to allow Ginger onboard and because they were not required, they won't allow it.... period. When I asked to talk to a manager she told me it would do not good because that was policy and there was no manager available.

 

I had my agent cancel the cruise and have the credit posted to my credit card. As I said above we are not new to cruising(Hal, Princess, Oceania, etc.) and have never had a problem of any kind, not even on a trip to St. Petersburg, Russia.

Sorry this is so long but I needed to vent and let some folks know how Oceania feels about disabled people. If not required by law .... they don't want you,

 

Thanks,

Jim:mad:

 

 

Really??? Wow! This has got to be some kind of mistake or there is much more to the story!

 

Puzzling even more as you say you have sailed with Oceania before and you say there were no issues on these sailings.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

Edited March 8, 2014 by nana541

[neverbeenhere]

Call back, and vent to the manager, who is 'not' there. Then work you way up the chain. Corporate chiefs need to hear your frustration. Might be surprised by what can be done by the executive secretary to the president. Change the world...

[tropicalkerry2002]

I''m pretty sure I read this in my documents received recently, and I was shocked!. I thought it was the law that service dogs were allowed everywhere.

[Hawaiidan]

This is I think a reaction to the growing and out of control " service dog" and even service animals including monkeys are creating

There was a recent article that showed a huge fraud in the service animals by pet owners who want their pet with them and can easily obtain fraudulent papers and vests or what ever.

Under US law a vendor can not ask to see any proof, giving the frauds more encouragement.

The author of the article was a professional dog trainer for Guide Dogs for the Blind, who observed all sorts of , to him , obvious frauds like a lady in Disneyland with miniature Chihuahua.

 

Too I have seen this as well, on another cruise with a very capable lady riding on her scooter, with her " service" dog riding too, while she fed him ice-cream cones... and cutting into lines and running over people to get places. When she got there she would jump up and sprint over to grab something and sprint back... she needed that scooter like a hole in the head... Just riding around with her pet being obnoxious.

So do not blame so much companies that are getting fed up with all the fakes.. and their inability to control it. It is a natural reaction to over the top abuse.... In this case the frauds are depriving truly genuine folks..

 

Until laws change and penalties and strict documents demanded this will only get worse

 

As an aside since I mentioned "scooters" the makers and advertising has been all but shutdown by the US Attny General , FBI and Medicare as the companies that made them were certifying anybody to have a need...

 

Again the frauds punish people with a real need... But whether fake service dog or fake scooter need... those people could care less...except about themselves.

[Noxequifans]

I agree that there may be more to this matter. Is it possible that one or more of the countries to be visited has restrictions on animals being brought in even briefly. Some jurisdictions require quarantine, chip implantation, etc.

 

Bottom line, it is up to O to make the call as to what is in the best interests of all passengers and crew.

[LHT28]

Did you travel with your Dog on Oceania before ??

 

I thought I had read in the T & C's that service animals were not allowed on Oceania

that said we did have a service dog on our Jan caribbean cruise

 

So maybe as someone suggested it has to do with the ports visited

 

Lyn

[LHT28]

16. PETS

No pets or other animals, except for certain necessary service animals of a disabled Guest, are allowed on board the Ship, and only allowed when Cruise embarks, disembarks or stops at a United States port. Guests wishing to bring a service animal on board the Ship must notify Carrier at the time of booking Cruise, and must receive Carrier’s written approval. Guest agrees to accept responsibility, reimburse and/or indemnify Carrier for any loss, damage or expense whatsoever related to the presence of any service animal brought on the Cruise, and to determine and meet any documentary or other requirements related to the service animal. Guest further agrees to be solely responsible for providing all food and/or other dietary requirements, medications or medical equipment required by the service animal. Passenger food, medications and/or medical treatment will not be provided by the Ship to any service animals.

 

To read more check under the TICKET CONTRACT

http://www.oceaniacruises.com/corporate/legal/termsconditions.aspx

[RetiredFL]

To confirm, Oceania has to allow service dogs if they touch a US port because it is US law. However on cruises that do not enter a US port there is no requirement.

I do agree with Hawaiidan that here in the US the law is being misused which unfortunately affects those who truly need a service animal.

[orchestrapal]

Sorry you will not be able to cruise Oceania with your service dog.

The posted paragraph from the O contract is clear so they probably would not change their minds even if you were to get to top management. Possibly you could choose a cruise which will have a US port. Hope to meet you and Ginger on board some day soon.

Edited March 8, 2014 by orchestrapal

[nana541]

Guess that clears that up!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[cbb]

Thank you for your service to our country.

[journeyfan]

Last year we took a Baltic Sea cruise on Regent and met a blind man who was traveling without his guide dog. He said that although Regent had always allowed him to bring his dog on US and Canadian cruises, they couldn't allow it on international cruises that would be stopping in a number of different countries because it can take up 4-6 months in some of those countries to get the clearance to allow a dog on board. I suspect that is the problem you are facing. It is very unfortunate. If that is what you are dealing with, it is a shame that Oceania didn't bother explaining that to you.

[Pet Nit Noy]

... The author of the article was a professional dog trainer for Guide Dogs for the Blind, who observed all sorts of , to him , obvious frauds like a lady in Disneyland with miniature Chihuahua.

 

A dog trainer for Guide Dogs for the Blind views the world through his filter. That Chihuahua would make an inept service dog for a blind person but might make a wholly acceptable service dog in alerting the owner about the onset of a seizure. Anxiety dogs assigned to meet the needs of PTSD combat veterans is such an example. In those cases, the human has no visible impairment whatsoever. The list of services that service animals have been trained to provide covers disabilities not apparent to a casual observer.

 

The lady with the Chihuahua may well have been a fraud. The lady you personally observed "sprinting" may well have been a fraud. But here's where you and I part company. I would rather the frauds be allowed come on board if it preserves the opportunity for cruisers with legitimate needs to bring service animals on board.

 

When someone starts posting hard statistics about the number of service animals on cruises -- perceived to be legitimate or not -- then we can talk. When someone starts posting the costs of upkeep to ships because of service animals on board and their impact on the cruise prices for everyone, then we can talk.

 

Someone uses the following quote at the end of his/her posts: "The plural of anecdote is not data." You've posted the anecdote about the sprinting-scooter-fraud before, but there has been no groundswell of replies others sharing similar anecdotes. I've been on more than 20 cruises and I think I have once seen a service dog. That doesn't make my anecdotes any more accurate or relevant than your anecdote.

 

... In this case the frauds are depriving truly genuine folks...

 

No, actually in this case the law has never applied to itineraries that do not include one or more US ports. The percentage of people who have sailed fraudulently with a service animal may or not be going up but that isn't going to change this situation one iota.

[rubysue]

A dog trainer for Guide Dogs for the Blind views the world through his filter. That Chihuahua would make an inept service dog for a blind person but might make a wholly acceptable service dog in alerting the owner about the onset of a seizure. Anxiety dogs assigned to meet the needs of PTSD combat veterans is such an example. In those cases, the human has no visible impairment whatsoever. The list of services that service animals have been trained to provide covers disabilities not apparent to a casual observer.

 

The lady with the Chihuahua may well have been a fraud. The lady you personally observed "sprinting" may well have been a fraud. But here's where you and I part company. I would rather the frauds be allowed come on board if it preserves the opportunity for cruisers with legitimate needs to bring service animals on board.

 

When someone starts posting hard statistics about the number of service animals on cruises -- perceived to be legitimate or not -- then we can talk. When someone starts posting the costs of upkeep to ships because of service animals on board and their impact on the cruise prices for everyone, then we can talk.

 

Someone uses the following quote at the end of his/her posts: "The plural of anecdote is not data." You've posted the anecdote about the sprinting-scooter-fraud before, but there has been no groundswell of replies others sharing similar anecdotes. I've been on more than 20 cruises and I think I have once seen a service dog. That doesn't make my anecdotes any more accurate or relevant than your anecdote.

 

 

 

No, actually in this case the law has never applied to itineraries that do not include one or more US ports. The percentage of people who have sailed fraudulently with a service animal may or not be going up but that isn't going to change this situation one iota.

 

Thank you for your excellent post. Keep in mind, there are more than a few on the Oceania board who think that the use of canes, unattractive orthopedic shoes or other signs of impairment are all scams so you can skate the minimal dress code or get on the elevator first.

[Mura]

Wow, Ruby Sue, isn't that a bit harsh?! I for one have never thought that way ... perhaps because when we boarded Regatta back in Nov '05 I'd just blown out my knee and ended up having to use a wheelchair to get to the restaurant and back to our stateroom. I could walk, yes, but not well. (The waiters always asked me if could get to my seat the table by myself, and I could.) I certainly never thought of going to the head of the line because I was temporarily handicapped!

 

As for the OP, my sympathies are with him. I see the problems from the cruiseline's perspective as well. We have never seen a service dog on board any ship, and hadn't thought about it at all. When we were on QE2 we knew that there was a kennel, but while owners could visit their pets, the pets could not leave the kennel area.

 

There are practical reasons for banning dogs on a ship -- where do you walk them? Some people are just terrified of dogs of any size. But for me people who need service animals should be allowed to have them. Yes, in NYC there have been newspaper articles about people who take advantage of the law. "I 'need' my pet for my emotional well being." That's a bit different from a disabled person who truly needs the animal, whether it's a seeing eye dog or an animal that can predict a seizure is coming on.

 

At the same time as I say that, if it is true that in non-U.S. ports the cruise line has a plethora of paper work to go through (and I have no reason to think that is incorrect), it's understandable that the cruiseline really cannot do that.

 

I also thank the OP for his service. He would not be in this position of needing his dog if he had stayed home.

 

Mura

Edited March 9, 2014 by Mura

[RJB]

I guess it's between the rock and the hard place. Our laws and foreign laws do not always match up and that's too bad but for O to continue to dock in some of these places they have to conform to their laws weather we like it or not.

[waterbug123]

I thought it was the law that service dogs were allowed everywhere.

 

It is US law, but not necessarily the law in other countries.

 

 

Someone uses the following quote at the end of his/her posts: "The plural of anecdote is not data." You've posted the anecdote about the sprinting-scooter-fraud before, but there has been no groundswell of replies others sharing similar anecdotes. I've been on more than 20 cruises and I think I have once seen a service dog. That doesn't make my anecdotes any more accurate or relevant than your anecdote.

 

I've seen service dogs several times during my 25+ cruises. And I know people who flat out admitted they bought a "service dog" vest online for $75 so that they can take their pet wherever they wish. They've never taken it on a cruise, though. It's very easy to "say" you have a service dog, and companies really can't ask any questions or require proof, so very easy to abuse this law. None of us have any way of knowing how many "service animals" we see out and about are legitimate or fake, but given how easy it is to skirt the law here, and how often easy-to-skirt laws are generally skirted, I think it's safe to say that probably a number of animals people claim are service animals are not.

[TKS]

JDColorado, thanks for your service. I'm sorry O can't accommodate your needs.

 

Pet Nit Noy, it is interesting to note this is the second thread I've seen on fake service animals in two days here on CC. The other was on another line's thread and the discourse follows pretty much the same lines as this one.

 

I only recently learned about the fake service dog issue watching people in PetSmart picking out official-looking jackets for their "darling," and talking, in public, about how good it would look when the logo they ordered was put on it:eek: Guess I'm getting old. Seen it, but can't believe such people really exist!

[Noxequifans]

Sadly there are some folks who look for a way around the rules we all follow. Fake service dogs are just one example.

[Pet Nit Noy]

Pet Nit Noy, it is interesting to note this is the second thread I've seen on fake service animals in two days here on CC. The other was on another line's thread and the discourse follows pretty much the same lines as this one.

 

I only recently learned about the fake service dog issue watching people in PetSmart picking out official-looking jackets for their "darling," and talking, in public, about how good it would look when the logo they ordered was put on it:eek: Guess I'm getting old. Seen it, but can't believe such people really exist!

 

Yikes! Those people sound pretty morally bankrupt! If you're a believing person, you know those folks will face a day of reckoning.

 

However, a few bad apples are not keeping cruisers with legitimate service dogs off the ships as long as the ship stops in at least one US port. The cruise line management -- and posters to CC -- can wring their hands and mutter darkly all they want about frauds pretending to have service animals. As long as the law stands, the folks with real needs are going to able to cruise with their animals. (And I've got to believe that loopholes -- like phony jackets and credentials -- will be closed long, long, long before people lose their right to travel with service animals.)

 

If England is any example -- and the UK was formerly known as having some of the strictest pet immigration laws in the world -- there is now a way to get a Pet Passport. This involves surgically implanting a micro-chip in the animal that documents its history of vaccinations and other required veterinary treatment. (I looked online and learned that this same new option is being accepted by EU countries and their associated territories.) Even with this new option, there are still some restrictions, but it opens the possibility that US animals will be able to travel world wide.

 

At the least, I hope any US organization that provides service animals will become pro-active and outfit all its animals with a microchip before placing them with a person.

Edited March 9, 2014 by Pet Nit Noy

[tropicalkerry2002]

Are the dogs allowed off the ship?

Some countries may have quarantine rules....

just wondering?

[Pet Nit Noy]

In the non-US ports, are the dogs allowed off the ship?

 

Not necessarily. The rules of the port country always trump US law.

 

Some countries may have quarantine rules.... just wondering?

 

Absolutely. And require proof of vaccinations.

 

Cruisers taking a Caribbean vacation, for example, would need to investigate each port of call.

 

Here's a list of countries that have signed up for the what the web site below calls the Pet Travel Scheme. (I'm confident the word "scheme" is being used in its UK meaning to indicate plan or approach or method. I don't think it is referring to the US meaning which is negative.)

 

"All EU countries (and associated territories), Andorra, Antigua & Barbuda, Aruba, Ascension Island, Australia, Bahrain, Barbados, Bermuda, Canada, Cayman Islands, Chile, Croatia, Falkland Islands, Fiji, French Polynesia, Grenadines, Hawaii, Hong Kong, Iceland, Jamaica, Japan, Liechtenstein, Mauritius, Mayotte, Monaco, Montserrat, Netherlands Antilles, New Caledonia, New Zealand, Norway, Russia, St Helena, St Kitts & Nevis, St Pierre & Miquelon, St Vincent, San Marino, Singapore, Switzerland, Taiwan, United Arab Emirates, USA (mainland), Vanuatu, Vatican, Wallis & Futuna."

 

Source: http://www.justlanded.com/english/UK/UK-Guide/Visas-Permits/Pets

[Noxequifans]

Here is a link with pet entry requirements. Interestingly Hawaii is very strict in this regard. Also, China does not allow pets for vacationers.

 

http://www.dogfriendly.com/server/travel/info/customs/travelcustoms.shtml#uk

 

I believe that it is wise that Oceania does not permit pets on non-US ported trips. As regulations change, it is a challange to keep up in this regard.

 

Also, there is a potential safety issue with animals on board that can't be ignored.