Maybe Celebrity is right to run us off.

[Tingle]

Cruises are promoting themselves mostly on price these days - there's talk of over capacity - the more pressure there is on cabin prices the more the operators will try to extract money from you when you're on board.

 

But they can't afford to turn down their low margin customers, they need to fill their ships and that's their priority, so a low margin customer that keep returning and occupying unpopular cabins is actually very valuable. The only problem would be if too high a percentage of their customers wanted to do it on the cheap all the time.

 

They're getting themselves into this by discounting so heavily - good on yer :)

[turning46]

No, of course I don't care if the OP or anyone else spends modestly or lavishly. My point is that he is saying that X is "running off" people like him, and he speculates it's because of his frugal spending.

 

But what changes, specifically, is the OP claiming are running him off? And how are those changes, specifically, related to frugal spending habits? I just don't get the connection.

[4774Papa]

A little background. We are Elite Plus, and Celebrity has always been our line of choice. We sailed for 28 nights on Celebrity in the last 6 months. The only other ships we have sailed are RCL and that is mainly due to the proximity of Baltimore. We are in our mid 60s and very active.

 

Well, you would think that Celebrity would love us-but maybe not and maybe they are justified. We consider ourselves savvy and usually take advantage of special pricing or promotions. We always transfer our booking to a TA. Usually prefer ocean view, but are happy with an inside depending on pricing. Occasionally balcony if the price is great. We always research excursions and almost always go independent. Due to our status, we enjoy happy hour each evening and our bar bill otherwise is rarely over $20. Most of that is pop. I might risk $20 in casino-wife none. Never buy more than a few bucks worth at on board shops. Haven't bought photos since our first cruise many years ago. Usually go to specialty once per cruise if there is a "deal." We like my time dining and don't usually do much after dinner. Maybe listen to karaoke or a good entertainer such as Perry. Don't go to clubs and buy drinks often at all. Never use up all our obc.

 

So, although we are loyalists, we may not be making Celebrity happy. I suspect our profile is fairly common. People who love Celebrity but who don't spend a lot. Ironically, it seems that the more that people cruise, the more they learn how to minimize their costs through independent excursions, TAs, etc.

 

It has become obvious that Celebrity is trying to shift to a different demographic. As much as I like traditional Celebrity, I really can't blame them. I don't know if that is an economic necessity or if they are just trying to increase their profits. Many of us have commented that we hope they can attract new customers without radically changing what has drawn us to Celebrity to begin with. I think that is going to be very difficult. One area that has generated a lot of controversy is noise level. Most of us would at least grudgingly go along with loudness at the Martini bar and disco. But, it seems that they have discovered that the Martini bar is their biggest source of revenue and have concluded that they need to spread the party boat all over the ship. That, of course, irritates those who prefer a quiet atmosphere, and we have seen hundreds of posts on that topic alone.

 

It seems to me that they are probably justified in trying to attract new and younger customers and that they hope to do so without alienating the people who have built their business.

 

But, I also think they are really just trying to reinvent themselves and are not quite ready yet to risk losing their loyalists. We're sort of necessary evils.

 

I will still sail Celebrity-at least for now. But I no longer feel as wanted and valued as I once was. Maybe the fact that I have learned how to cruise economically has something to do with that. ;) Maybe we have gotten too smart for our own good.

 

Happy Sails to You

 

OOOEEE :D:D Bob and Phyl

We have been cruising X for four years and have not noticed any significant changes to the product.

Perhaps X is trying to broaden its fan base. They would be fools not to do so.

We do cruises that are 12-17 days long and find the average age to be in the 60s. Most people that we dine with are retired or semi-retired. I suspect the cruising age is lower for 5-7 day cruises.

 

We have on a few occasions noted music that seemed louder than normal, but we just left and went to another place on the ship.

 

It is no time to panic.

[ghstudio]

We have been cruising X for four years and have not noticed any significant changes to the product.

Perhaps X is trying to broaden its fan base. They would be fools not to do so.

We do cruises that are 12-17 days long and find the average age to be in the 60s. Most people that we dine with are retired or semi-retired. I suspect the cruising age is lower for 5-7 day cruises.

 

We have on a few occasions noted music that seemed louder than normal, but we just left and went to another place on the ship.

 

It is no time to panic.

 

While I generally agree, there has been a significant reduction in service staff...sommeliers, waiters, bar servers,.... The demographics haven't changed much....I guess that their marketing program isn't working too well :)

[CathyCruises]

Well your vacation sounds a bit joyless, but maybe thats just me.

 

 

This is an extremely :eek: arrogant comment!!! How can you say that my cruise experience is joyless because I am careful with my hard-earned dollars? Quite the opposite!! Ask anyone who has cruised with me if I appear to be enjoying myself!! ;)

 

Between DH and I, we have 7 children and 21 grandchildren--who by the way bring us lots of joy, too. I work two jobs, neither of which will offer me any possibility of retirement income, and I love my cruise vacations.

 

What I don't like is spending my money unnecessarily. I detest cruise ship excursions and find them phony, overpriced, and way too slow for me--I like to hit the ports running and have a ball. I choose NOT to have a drink package because I don't want to have an open bar for 15 days running--but I still have plenty of drinks, and tons of fun. I don't like the low-quality overpriced spa services with sales pitches thrown in, and there is nothing worth buying on board--I don't need tee shirts, watches, or gold-by-the yard. I prefer to spend my money on great quality experiences, not overpriced junk.

 

So you go ahead and spend your money the way you choose, but please do not imply that I am a miserable miser because I don't follow your lead. And just so you know, I usually follow a cruise vacation with a 10 to 30 day land vacation beginning in the port of disembarkation, so I do know how to spend money--I just elect to spend it my way, and I have a fantastic time doing it.

Edited March 19, 2014 by CathyCruises

[Oceanview77]

A little background. We are Elite Plus, and Celebrity has always been our line of choice. We sailed for 28 nights on Celebrity in the last 6 months. The only other ships we have sailed are RCL and that is mainly due to the proximity of Baltimore. We are in our mid 60s and very active.

 

Well, you would think that Celebrity would love us-but maybe not and maybe they are justified. We consider ourselves savvy and usually take advantage of special pricing or promotions. We always transfer our booking to a TA. Usually prefer ocean view, but are happy with an inside depending on pricing. Occasionally balcony if the price is great. We always research excursions and almost always go independent. Due to our status, we enjoy happy hour each evening and our bar bill otherwise is rarely over $20. Most of that is pop. I might risk $20 in casino-wife none. Never buy more than a few bucks worth at on board shops. Haven't bought photos since our first cruise many years ago. Usually go to specialty once per cruise if there is a "deal." We like my time dining and don't usually do much after dinner. Maybe listen to karaoke or a good entertainer such as Perry. Don't go to clubs and buy drinks often at all. Never use up all our obc.

 

So, although we are loyalists, we may not be making Celebrity happy. I suspect our profile is fairly common. People who love Celebrity but who don't spend a lot. Ironically, it seems that the more that people cruise, the more they learn how to minimize their costs through independent excursions, TAs, etc.

 

It has become obvious that Celebrity is trying to shift to a different demographic. As much as I like traditional Celebrity, I really can't blame them. I don't know if that is an economic necessity or if they are just trying to increase their profits. Many of us have commented that we hope they can attract new customers without radically changing what has drawn us to Celebrity to begin with. I think that is going to be very difficult. One area that has generated a lot of controversy is noise level. Most of us would at least grudgingly go along with loudness at the Martini bar and disco. But, it seems that they have discovered that the Martini bar is their biggest source of revenue and have concluded that they need to spread the party boat all over the ship. That, of course, irritates those who prefer a quiet atmosphere, and we have seen hundreds of posts on that topic alone.

 

It seems to me that they are probably justified in trying to attract new and younger customers and that they hope to do so without alienating the people who have built their business.

 

But, I also think they are really just trying to reinvent themselves and are not quite ready yet to risk losing their loyalists. We're sort of necessary evils.

 

I will still sail Celebrity-at least for now. But I no longer feel as wanted and valued as I once was. Maybe the fact that I have learned how to cruise economically has something to do with that. ;) Maybe we have gotten too smart for our own good.

 

Happy Sails to You

 

OOOEEE :D:D Bob and Phyl

What a great post...even though I don't think Celebrity is looking to run you off at all. I think they are trying to cast a wider net. It sounds like you enjoy yourself on your cruise and you enjoy all the benefits of the loyalty you have earned. I'm sure Celebrity is grateful to have you. I do think Celebrity is not interested in catering to the very loud minority that can never be satisfied and are never happy. See threads when new Captains Club was rolled out for some examples. Happy Cruising....no matter what you spend!

[OCruisers]

Do you think maybe it's more that Celebrity is trying to attract a wider passenger base than it is they don't still appreciate their loyal long time cruisers? :confused:

LuLu

~~~

[DebbieMacG]

A few arrogant comments on here that made me smile, people think you aren't having a good time or are lacking somewhat because you aren't spending money on things you don't want or need? How does that work? :eek:

 

We don't buy a alcoholic drinks package because we don't drink, that doesn't mean we can't have fun and a great laugh, we just don't have the hangover the next morning to go with it! It's nothing to do with money

 

We don't do ships excursions, why? Because we prefer private tours usually booked through the roll call or organised ourselves. It's nothing to do with money, it's personal preference.

 

We don't buy ships photographs, why? Because my husband is a professional photographer and we aren't photogenic! :)

 

We don't buy stuff from the shops, why? Because we have enough stuff as it is!

 

We book inside cabins or balconies (when they are cheaper and without drinks packages!), why? Because we like to cruise twice a year and add land days each end of the cruise often in very nice hotels. We like to afford to take private transfers and not the bus or train.

 

Apart from the cruise fare Celebrity don't make a lot of extra money from us, do I think that Celebrity treat me differently because of this? No. I think Celebrity is wise enough to know they attract all sorts of spenders, from people who will cruise cheaper and more often to people who will spend a lot and cruise less to those who will spend a lot and cruise a lot. :D

 

So please don't think people are less worthy because they spend less, it may be because they choose to! :)

[4774Papa]

While I generally agree, there has been a significant reduction in service staff...sommeliers, waiters, bar servers,.... The demographics haven't changed much....I guess that their marketing program isn't working too well :)

We have done seven X cruises in four years and have not noticed any decline in the level of service. Are you judging from a longer period?

[Germancruiser]

Also a tip of the hat for the OP- I agree- and I find you should foreward this post or transfer it into a mail to Captains Club- regardless what you spend on board, as Elite plus you have spend a whole lot of money with them and so you earned all the benefits that comes with Elite plus and should be more than threated like loyal customer. We run a few coffee shops here in germany and when we have a customer who spends money every day on coffee and maybe someting else - but not much more- we are more than happy to have him - EVERY DAY! That is what counts!

[ghstudio]

We have done seven X cruises in four years and have not noticed any decline in the level of service. Are you judging from a longer period?

 

Three years....the most obvious to us is the reduction in sommeliers...it's now pour your own wine.

[CHUCKIE50]

I always wonder what people are talking about when I read these type of threads. Celebrity is part of a large corporation that knows to the minute exactly how much money they are making. Basically that is all their shareholders (ie owners), Wall St and the directors care about. According to an analyst report I recently read for the month of Feb 2014 bookings for cruises 13-18 months out Celebrity has sold the cabins for an increase of 9.5% over this year and for 7-12 months out the increase has been 3.8%. So as far as I am concerned we should not worry about how much money we are or are not spending as cruisers.

Anecdotally we all can say how we are splurging or not on any particular cruise but they will figure it out and will try to increase earnings. Whether this means alcoholic packages, loud music, better food, more exclusive cabins I personally don't care. I know their ships and where the quiet places are, who the best bartenders are, my favorite cabins, whom to tip for the best pour etc. I learned that here on CC and on board. I do know that any day that someone makes my bed for me and cooks my meals is a great day and I am happy to spend my money that way.

[DavidYYC]

I am absolutely not being arrogant, and I find it completely obnoxious of posters to say that, BTW.

 

What I am saying is that I do not see it as a point of honour NOT to spend just to somehow make "corporate Celebrity" sit up and notice or whatever.

 

I spend where I want to, save where I want to. But its all about ME - not being spiteful towards a cruise line that for a certain reason, a certain demographic loves to hate.

 

I find it sad.

[The_Big_M]

Cruises are promoting themselves mostly on price these days - there's talk of over capacity - the more pressure there is on cabin prices the more the operators will try to extract money from you when you're on board.

 

But they can't afford to turn down their low margin customers, they need to fill their ships and that's their priority, so a low margin customer that keep returning and occupying unpopular cabins is actually very valuable. The only problem would be if too high a percentage of their customers wanted to do it on the cheap all the time.

 

They're getting themselves into this by discounting so heavily - good on yer :)

 

Spot on.

 

You may not make large profits from these customers, but they also support your costs by keeping demand up -and meaning they don't need to discount so much which helps revenue.

 

It doesn't make for a profitable business of its own, but if balanced it's still a worthwhile way to run a business. It may be the dream for every business to make massive profits from every customer, but it's not realistic, especially with the growth in supply.

Edited March 19, 2014 by The_Big_M

[tn1728]

We had the pleasure of sailing on a cruise a few years ago with OP. Didn't know him before the cruise, don't keep in touch with him now....but thru his efforts pre-cruise on the roll calls, helping get people together for events, made for one of our more enjoyable cruises on Celebrity. Even if OP didn't spend a lot of money, the rest of us did, so Celebrity needs to realize that amount spent per cruise per couple does not always give the whole impact one couple can have on the bottom line.

 

Theresa

[Christine Frances]

Three years....the most obvious to us is the reduction in sommeliers...it's now pour your own wine.

 

 

Did you not have sommeliers on the Infinity? We just duplicated the Asia Millie b2b that you took last year (got home a month ago) and we had the best sommeliers ever, especially Alexandria!

 

 

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Edited March 19, 2014 by Christine Frances

[jgreenwo17]

Nice post stateroom sailor! I commend you on choosing X for the vibe on your upcoming Ak cruise. I was on the Carnival Spirit in AK a few years back and even they toned it down to match the itinerary.

 

I like your style. I hope to sail with you on that cool hybrid line someday!

 

Peace out,

 

John

[jgreenwo17]

I like OPs honesty. My family have done cheap cruises and spendy cruises. It is all good.

Some of us need to sretch our dollars more than others. The cruiselines may like their frugal pax and may love their spendthrift pax more. I'm happy to see a mix of people.

(I'm sure X is happy too).

[ghstudio]

Did you not have sommeliers on the Infinity? We just duplicated the Asia Millie b2b that you took last year (got home a month ago) and we had the best sommeliers ever, especially Alexandria!

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums mobile app

 

One sommelier in blu.....they used to have enough time to fill wine glasses. Not any more...it's pour your own on refills. Same in the mdr when we tried it one night.

[Christine Frances]

There were quite a few circulating the MDR during the early seating on the Millie. The sommelier we had on the Baltic cruise said he preferred working Traditional rather than Select as the diners were all pretty much on the same courses and it was easier to keep track of us.lol

 

 

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[TheMediaman]

Our expectations of cruising is a mixture between the romantic lore of yesteryear, the Las Vegas bigger is better showmanship of today and the Chicken Little economic corporate cries. Remember a few years ago when food and entertainment revenue surpassed gambling revenue in Vegas? Cruise lines are delivering much more onboard amenity value than when my parents cruise on in the early 80s however aggressive pricing to put bodies in the cabins has meant revenue streams shifting to other areas; what we love to debate about excursion, drink prices and salary ranges.

 

Because cruising is more affordable and/or accessible many of us cruise, well, more. I see 7, 10, 20 cruise vacations for many members, however, with repetition comes desensitization. My own experiences after 3 on RCCL had some tarnish. I noticed the MDR menu and food was not as impressive and was much the same as previous years. Did quality decline or did my expectations mixed with first cruise fond memories set the tone for my perceived disappointment? For the record I would cruise RCCL again.

 

We change and so do cruise lines. They are in business to make profit. Unfortunately capitalism is rather aggressive these days and we long for "simpler times". How many years between that first and most recent cruise? Chances are you have changed in your life attitude, experience and knowledge now as a savvy cruiser and your personal definition of what value for the money is.

 

It's not that any line wants you off. Perhaps, like old friends and lovers from long ago, you've just grown apart.

Edited March 19, 2014 by TheMediaman

[ThursdaysChild]

One sommelier in BLU.....they used to have enough time to fill wine glasses. Not any more...it's pour your own on refills. Same in the mdr when we tried it one night.

 

The cutback in dining room staff was something I noticed as well in my last two cruises. Blu was particularly a mess on my November Infinity cruise, and I and other customers made sufficient noise about the one overworked sommelier in Blu that an assistant was called in to help out about 5 days into the cruise.

 

Since late 3rd Q 2012 I have noticed a cutback in staff and service. :(

Edited March 19, 2014 by ThursdaysChild

[Smiles3usa]

A tip of the hat to the OP – what a refreshing post!

 

My two bits say that Celebrity is not trying to “run off” the more frugal cruiser. Rather, I think, Celebrity is trying to raise the total outlay all cruisers spend. I think, the 1-2-3 promo and its ilk, are just the beginning as Celebrity raises the overall cost per day from all cruisers. In the very near future I see Celebrity becoming more inclusive (including perhaps the classic drink package and/or gratuities ) and raising the base fare to reflect such inclusion. Many will complain that they don’t want Celebrity to be more inclusive – Celebrity knows this. They also know that those who will abandon the line because of the increase in costs are the very ones not likely to spend significant monies on the ship in the first place. One way or another, Celebrity will exact more than the bare minimum from all who cruise.

 

In sum, the more frugal Celebrity cruisers won’t be run off. But, I think, they will be required – very soon – to pay more monies to continue to sail Celebrity.

[CoopColbie]

I think people need to realise that it is not just Celebrity that is trying to change and attract a different demographic ... It is all cruise lines. And that is because 'holiday-makers' all over have woken up to the benefits and ease of cruising. Every cruise line ... Even those high-end river cruises ... Have young family/child-friendly options. Yes, there are still some cruise lines that are 'no kids' and more exclusive ... That is their option ... But even the Queen Mary has a kids club and is priced at a point where a fun-loving family of four could be tempted to book a trip.

 

We all need to accept that the rest of the world has finally realised how great cruising is and the cruise companies are just positioning themselves to take advantage of this.

 

 

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[awhfy]

WVUfan, we had the pleasure of sailing with you on Connie on a 14 night Southern Caribbean (you'd know me then as pikespeakmarathon) your knowledge & persistence saved us many $$ on several amazing tours. We don't think you're miserly at all, frugal yes (nothing wrong with that). It was our first time with cruise critic & you & Phyl set the bar pretty high. Hope to see you again on the open water, until then fair winds & following seas. Awhfy (Melody & Les)

 

 

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