Celebrity Dress Code Discussion Thread

[Scott2.0]

As I've said NUMEROUS times, this was on the Eclipse in the 14 day Caribbean trips. On formal night most pax were very well dressed. About 60%+were wearing tuxes. I only wear tuxes on Cunard. I think on the Eclipse, the dress seems more formal on the 14 day trips, probably because the pax were generally much older(actually older than on Cunard)the older crowd sticks to the more formal dresscodes. Since we like dressing up I totally enjoy the older crowd & the touch of class it brings to the trip.

 

The dress code is the same for all ships and itineraries, is it not? You seem to be implying that a 14 day cruise on the Eclipse has a different dress code. If you're not, I don't see the point that you're trying to make.

[cle-guy]

The dress code is the same for all ships and itineraries, is it not? You seem to be implying that a 14 day cruise on the Eclipse has a different dress code. If you're not, I don't see the point that you're trying to make.

 

That poster isn't saying the RULES vary ship to ship, he's saying that PARTICIPATION by the guests varies as does ENFORCEMENT of the rules. And I can see that being the case in my travels. Also, Eclipse summers in the UK so likely has a built in reputation for being a bit more formal than say Constellation and her shorter party cruises in Caribbean.

 

Shame X doesn't enforce the same across all ships.

[keithm]

The dress code is the same for all ships and itineraries, is it not? You seem to be implying that a 14 day cruise on the Eclipse has a different dress code. If you're not, I don't see the point that you're trying to make.

Did you not read my letter? I'm sure the dresscode is the same.Pax on that ship seem to dress far more formally from how I gather they do on the other Celebrity ships. There seems to be a lot of variety on pax on the Celebrity ships. I'd say the average age was WELL over 65 on the Eclipse last Jan. Is it that high on all the ships? I doubt it. I think because of the 14 days you get far more retirees than on Celebrity's other ships. I believe this is why the dress style seems more formal. The pax are from a more traditional time, which is why we enjoyed that trip. To Curt, I kind of think that larger lines with more ships seem to strive to provide a slightly different feel for some of it's ships. With a small line like Cunard having only 3 ships, it would be hard to offer differences when you have only 3 ships, We found the Eclipse to be much similar to Cunard, but would feel that some of the other ships in Celebrity are different in what type of pax choose. Obviously there's real loyalty among Celebrity ships.

[Scott2.0]

Did you not read my letter? I'm sure the dresscode is the same.Pax on that ship seem to dress far more formally from how I gather they do on the other Celebrity ships. There seems to be a lot of variety on pax on the Celebrity ships. I'd say the average age was WELL over 65 on the Eclipse last Jan. Is it that high on all the ships? I doubt it. I think because of the 14 days you get far more retirees than on Celebrity's other ships. I believe this is why the dress style seems more formal. The pax are from a more traditional time, which is why we enjoyed that trip. To Curt, I kind of think that larger lines with more ships seem to strive to provide a slightly different feel for some of it's ships. With a small line like Cunard having only 3 ships, it would be hard to offer differences when you have only 3 ships, We found the Eclipse to be much similar to Cunard, but would feel that some of the other ships in Celebrity are different in what type of pax choose. Obviously there's real loyalty among Celebrity ships.

 

Sorry, no. What letter?

[keithm]

Sorry, no. What letter?

Sorry,I meant to say blog.

[Scott2.0]

Sorry,I meant to say blog.

 

If you're referring to your post above, yes I read it. That's what I was replying to.

 

As others have said, the only reason the maitre d' would kick someone out for wearing jeans (that aren't ripped or torn) on a non-formal night, would be due to ignorance of the cruise line's dress code. You responded to that by saying that it was on a 14 day cruise on the Eclipse. Again, not seeing your point.

[ImaginationCruiseBride]

I am commenting because I have a cruise booked in a couple months and came here to find information. The teacher in me insists that I do research. I always check out the dress code threads before I pack.

[gek]

The poor old Maître D' is in a no-win situation. If they don't enforce the dress-code strictly (and they may be under orders not to) then people will complain. If they do enforce it then they will attract the ire of those who don't agree with the way Celebrity's dress-code is being interpreted.

 

The jeans question is a perfect example of the dilemma faced by the Maître D'. Not only does the dress code not mention them but there may also be a question as to what jeans actually are. Blue denim jeans are the classic style but jeans come in all colours and other fabrics (such as canvas) as well. My guess is that a Maître D' who decided to ban jeans would only pick up on the blue denim type, but possibly only if they were faded.

[LetsGetWet!]

The poor old Maître D' is in a no-win situation. If they don't enforce the dress-code strictly (and they may be under orders not to) then people will complain. If they do enforce it then they will attract the ire of those who don't agree with the way Celebrity's dress-code is being interpreted.

Maybe so, but that's Celebrity's problem, not mine. It's the same with any rule - don't enforce the non-smoking rule and people will complain, enforce it and attract the ire of those who want to ignore the rules & smoke.

[gek]

Maybe so, but that's Celebrity's problem, not mine. It's the same with any rule - don't enforce the non-smoking rule and people will complain, enforce it and attract the ire of those who want to ignore the rules & smoke.

 

The smoking policy is a poor comparison. I see nothing there that is open to interpretation. Even loopholes like e-cigs have been plugged. Unless Celebrity dictates tuxes and gowns only the dress code will always be open to interpretation - even then some people would probably get upset if someone wore something like a fluoro coloured cummerbund, or even if they were refused entry for wearing a tuxedo t-shirt.

 

Punishing the Maître D' for incorrect enforcement of a policy which is so open to interpretation is just unfair. Sure, if the Maître D' refused to let me in wearing jeans I'd be angry but I would complain directly to Celebrity rather than cutting his gratuities.

[LetsGetWet!]

The smoking policy is a poor comparison. I see nothing there that is open to interpretation. Even loopholes like e-cigs have been plugged. Unless Celebrity dictates tuxes and gowns only the dress code will always be open to interpretation - even then some people would probably get upset if someone wore something like a fluoro coloured cummerbund, or even if they were refused entry for wearing a tuxedo t-shirt.

 

Punishing the Maître D' for incorrect enforcement of a policy which is so open to interpretation is just unfair. Sure, if the Maître D' refused to let me in wearing jeans I'd be angry but I would complain directly to Celebrity rather than cutting his gratuities.

What we're talking about with regards to the dress code isn't open to interpretation either. We're not talking jeans, let alone your absurd example of cummerbund color. We're talking no jacket on formal nights, or shorts or t-shirts allowed for dinner any night.

[cle-guy]

The poor old Maître D' is in a no-win situation. If they don't enforce the dress-code strictly (and they may be under orders not to) then people will complain. If they do enforce it then they will attract the ire of those who don't agree with the way Celebrity's dress-code is being interpreted.

 

The jeans question is a perfect example of the dilemma faced by the Maître D'. Not only does the dress code not mention them but there may also be a question as to what jeans actually are. Blue denim jeans are the classic style but jeans come in all colours and other fabrics (such as canvas) as well. My guess is that a Maître D' who decided to ban jeans would only pick up on the blue denim type, but possibly only if they were faded.

 

I hear what you're saying, that's why I make no issue of the pants worn, as I see it, jeans ARE fine on formal night, all it entails is a jacket worn to dinner. that's a simple rule to follow. "Sir you need a jacket to enter". No fashion police or personal definition of clothing styles or colors, just a jacket need be worn. Tuxedo Jacket, suit jacket, or sport coat or dinner jacket. Some sort of jacket.

 

Hell, I'd even be fine with a 1980's "Member's Only" jacket, so long as they showed initiative, and not an attempt to skirt the policy.

 

The policy doesn't mention NECKTIES let alone cummerbunds. Just a jacket.

Edited January 6, 2015 by cle-guy

[dkjretired]

I am commenting because I have a cruise booked in a couple months and came here to find information. The teacher in me insists that I do research. I always check out the dress code threads before I pack.

 

In answer to one of your earlier comments, I have seen people enter dining room not properly dressed for a couple of reasons. They usually give some leeway for the first night because not everyone gets their luggage. That's why most experienced Celebrity cruisers pack first night smart casual clothes in their luggage.

 

I have also seen situation's where people did not get their luggage at all and were allowed in the dining room.

 

I have seen lots of people refused entry to the dining room over the years.

[cle-guy]

The jeans question is a perfect example of the dilemma faced by the Maître D'. Not only does the dress code not mention them but there may also be a question as to what jeans actually are. Blue denim jeans are the classic style but jeans come in all colours and other fabrics (such as canvas) as well. My guess is that a Maître D' who decided to ban jeans would only pick up on the blue denim type, but possibly only if they were faded.

 

The printed "Celebrity Today" delivered to cabins, allow for jeans, specifically by the name and use of the term "jeans", unless they are "torn or ripped". This isn't on the website, but is printed in the dailies delivered to cabin and on embarkation. So there is no issue as to jeans these days.

[Ma Bell]

I hear what you're saying, that's why I make no issue of the pants worn, as I see it, jeans ARE fine on formal night, all it entails is a jacket worn to dinner. that's a simple rule to follow. "Sir you need a jacket to enter". No fashion police or personal definition of clothing styles or colors, just a jacket need be worn. Tuxedo Jacket, suit jacket, or sport coat or dinner jacket. Some sort of jacket.

 

Hell, I'd even be fine with a 1980's "Member's Only" jacket, so long as they showed initiative, and not an attempt to skirt the policy.

 

The policy doesn't mention NECKTIES let alone cummerbunds. Just a jacket.

 

There is nothing in the dress codes about sport coats. It's just another thing that men get away with. If you actually read the code it is suit, tux or dinner jacket with slacks, all of which would normally be worn with a tie. For most people it's not necessary to detail all the accessories that would go with "formal attire" but common sense prevails for most people.

 

I personally have no problem with sport coats, but they are not formal wear by any stretch of the imagination. The interpretation of what the dress code is, here on Cruise Critic, varies from person to person, it doesn't vary on the website.

[cle-guy]

There is nothing in the dress codes about sport coats. It's just another thing that men get away with. If you actually read the code it is suit, tux or dinner jacket with slacks, all of which would normally be worn with a tie. For most people it's not necessary to detail all the accessories that would go with "formal attire" but common sense prevails for most people.

 

I personally have no problem with sport coats, but they are not formal wear by any stretch of the imagination. The interpretation of what the dress code is, here on Cruise Critic, varies from person to person, it doesn't vary on the website.

 

I pulled the "Celebrity Today" from the November 30th Sailing of Sillie. It says:

Formal: Ladies: Cocktail dress, gown or pant suit; Gentlemen: Tuxedo, suit or jacket with slacks

 

It does not state "DINNER" jacket. Perhaps in the past it did, but no longer is a DINNER jacket a requirement, according to the documents delivered to cabin on a daily basis. I do however like to wear my bright white diner jacket one night, and tuxedo on the other.

 

We all know the celebrity website is a mess with a mishmash of erroneous and often conflicting information., it becomes difficult to point to that as an end-all-be-all source of information. Nuances are even known among the various country websites, making it that much more difficult to count on for good information.

Edited January 6, 2015 by cle-guy

[LetsGetWet!]

That's one argument but there is another. Suppose it is the cruise line who has established a policy of lax enforcement of the dress code? Such a policy would allow them to 'have it both ways'. Those that like dress codes would be comforted by the published code. And, as long as most passengers adhered to the code, those that like dress codes would not be so seriously upset as to take action. Those who do not like dress codes could also be accommodated as long as their dress was not too egregious. If it is the cruise line, then that has long term implications on the future of formal nights.

I think that argument is a HUGE stretch. I'm not willing to assume that the cruise line is going to be so devious and dishonest as to publish one set of rules while explicitly instructing their staff to not enforce those same rules. If you want to make that assumption, go for it - but until & unless I see some actual proof of that, I think that's a huge stretch and unlikely.

If it is the Matre'd, then the long term implications are also not good for formal nights. It would be an economic decision for the Matre'd. Which costs him more in tips? Enforcement? Relaxing the code? How many want it enforced enough to remove tips? How many would remove tips if it were enforced? Yes, I know that there are a lot of Cruise Critic members who would answer that one way but the real question is how would the Matre'd answer? There is also the fact that the Matre'd is purposefully disregarding company policy. Risking his job just for the sake of a few hypothetical tips?

What I've heard argued here on CC over and over again is that the primary reason that dress codes are not enforced in the MDR is that the maitre' d is afraid of losing tips by confronting passengers about improper dress. So, the whole point is to get him thinking about the distinct possibility that he may be losing MORE tips by NOT enforcing the codes than he would be by enforcing them. I can't answer how many would want it enforced enough to remove tips or how many would remove tips if it were enforced any more than you can. But according to the arguments made often here, which have some merit - he may be likely thinking ONLY of those he could lose by confronting improperly dressed passengers and refusing them admittance. Again, the whole goal is to get him thinking that there could be more negative impact to his tips by NOT enforcing the dress codes.

Now, as to selectively removing the tips for the Matre'd. I really don't think the cruise line can effectively do that. It would require a very sophisticated accounting system to be able to track gratuities to the individual level. Remember the tips go into a pool. Just don't think Celebrity can do that but you can ask.... And, JMHO, but I rather doubt the cruise line would tell the Matre'd that a few had selectively removed his tips.

Again, I don't know whether they can or not - if they can't, then it becomes a question as to whether you're willing to remove ALL tips and hand out cash to the others - obviously more work. And, I've already said I'm quite willing to tell him myself - I won't just assume that guest services will communicate that to him.

Assume Celebrities accounting system is capable of selectively removing tips for an individual. The Celebrity website indicates that Silhouette can carry 2886 passengers. Suppose $2PP goes to the Matre'd. That's about $5600 for the Matre'd per voyage. How many passengers would have to selectively remove tips to have a noticeable impact?

How many passengers would have to selectively remove tips for being confronted for improper dress to have a noticeable impact?

Assume Celebrities accounting system cannot selectively track gratuities. If tips are $12PP and $2PP is for the Matre'd, then the Matre'd would actually get 16.67% of the actual amount that went into the pool. That would mean that if you reduce your gratuities by $2PP, the actual reduction to the Matre'd would be about 33 cents. The reduction to the rest of the tip pool would be $1.67. Who are you hurting?

Again, if they can't selectively track, then personally I'm not going to tell them to remove $2 which would be a portion removed for everyone. If they can't selectively track, then I'd consider one of two things - either remove ALL tips and personally tip the other staff I interact throughout the week - or (more likely) hand the maitre' d an envelope at the end of the week with a one dollar bill in it, and tell him I would usually tip significantly more, but was unhappy with his unwillingness to do his job and enforce the written Celebrity dress code policy through the week.

 

One more time - perception - the maitre' d needs to start thinking that his tips in total may end up being lower by NOT enforcing the dress code than by confronting the few who brazenly try to flaunt it. (And like cle-guy, I'm not talking jeans or any other clothing which I may not really like, but which is allowed by the dress code.)

[davekathy]

I pulled the "Celebrity Today" from the November 30th Sailing of Sillie. It says:

 

 

It does not state "DINNER" jacket. Perhaps in the past it did, but no longer is a DINNER jacket a requirement, according to the documents delivered to cabin on a daily basis. I do however like to wear my bright white diner jacket one night, and tuxedo on the other.

 

We all know the celebrity website is a mess with a mishmash of erroneous and often conflicting information., it becomes difficult to point to that as an end-all-be-all source of information. Nuances are even known among the various country websites, making it that much more difficult to count on for good information.

 

This is what Celebrity’s web site list for Formal wear. If I wasn’t familiar with Celebrity‘s dress guidelines this is where I would go to get the correct information for what to pack before leaving for a Celebrity Cruise.

 

Formal" attire includes:

Ladies: Cocktail dress, gown, or dressy pantsuit. Gentlemen: Tuxedo, suit, or dinner jacket with slacks.

Edited January 6, 2015 by davekathy

[Ma Bell]

I pulled the "Celebrity Today" from the November 30th Sailing of Sillie. It says:

 

 

It does not state "DINNER" jacket. Perhaps in the past it did, but no longer is a DINNER jacket a requirement, according to the documents delivered to cabin on a daily basis. I do however like to wear my bright white diner jacket one night, and tuxedo on the other.

 

We all know the celebrity website is a mess with a mishmash of erroneous and often conflicting information., it becomes difficult to point to that as an end-all-be-all source of information. Nuances are even known among the various country websites, making it that much more difficult to count on for good information.

 

So "according to your daily" do you consider jeans, slacks? According to the way you choose to interpret things I suppose they could also wear a denim jacket or maybe even a straight jacket. It doesn't say anything about what kind of jacket. It can all go on and on to the lowest common denominator.

 

That's why these discussions are really worthless. If people don't understand the word "formal" or choose to not understand, the whole point is lost.

 

Fortunately, most people get it and try their best.

Edited January 6, 2015 by Ma Bell

[cle-guy]

So "according to your daily" do you consider jeans, slacks? According to the way you choose to interpret things I suppose they could also wear a denim jacket or maybe even a straight jacket. It doesn't say anything about what kind of jacket. It can all go on and on to the lowest common denominator.

 

That's why these discussions are really worthless. If people don't understand the word "formal" or choose to not understand, the whole point is lost.

 

Fortunately, most people get it and try their best.

 

I do consider jeans as slacks personally. If someone wants to wear a denim jacket, go for it. I doubt many will wear a straight jacket, but that would be fun to see, I'd actually probably ask for a photo with them.

 

oddly enough the definition of slacks:

noun, ( used with a plural verb)

1. men's or women's trousers for informal wear.

 

So celebrity's definition of formal wear actually includes the wearing of some informal garments within it....

[LetsGetWet!]

I do consider jeans as slacks personally. If someone wants to wear a denim jacket, go for it. I doubt many will wear a straight jacket, but that would be fun to see, I'd actually probably ask for a photo with them.

 

oddly enough the definition of slacks:

noun, ( used with a plural verb)

 

 

So celebrity's definition of formal wear actually includes the wearing of some informal garments within it....

Agree for the most part. Too arbitrary to try to enforce "no jeans" and way too arbitrary to try to enforce "no sport coat/jacket. Personally, I wouldn't call it too arbitrary to exclude "Members Only" jackets, windbreaker jackets or similar though.

 

For me, if they'll reasonably enforce the "jacket required" with a collared shirt on formal nights, and enforce the prohibition on shorts, sleeveless t-shirts, flip flops & ball caps EVERY night; I'd be quite happy - and would thank & tip the maitre d for doing so!

[cle-guy]

Agree for the most part. Too arbitrary to try to enforce "no jeans" and way too arbitrary to try to enforce "no sport coat/jacket. Personally, I wouldn't call it too arbitrary to exclude "Members Only" jackets, windbreaker jackets or similar though.

 

For me, if they'll reasonably enforce the "jacket required" with a collared shirt on formal nights, and enforce the prohibition on shorts, sleeveless t-shirts, flip flops & ball caps EVERY night; I'd be quite happy - and would thank & tip the maitre d for doing so!

 

This is exactly how I see it as well.

[dkjretired]

So "according to your daily" do you consider jeans, slacks? According to the way you choose to interpret things I suppose they could also wear a denim jacket or maybe even a straight jacket. It doesn't say anything about what kind of jacket. It can all go on and on to the lowest common denominator.

 

That's why these discussions are really worthless. If people don't understand the word "formal" or choose to not understand, the whole point is lost.

 

Fortunately, most people get it and try their best.

 

Ma is correct about the dinner jacket, the web site is quoted numerous times in this thread. I think that what Cle forgets when citing the Daily is that you can't pack after you have received the daily.

 

A Dinner jacket is not a sport jacket and has been in Celebrity's dress code forever. I believe many think it is a sport jacket but it is not, think James Bond at the Monte Carlo casino. Sports jackets have been accepted for several years on Celebrity ships but they are not definitely not Dinner jacket. I actually was surprised last week when someone on this board said he was packing his Dinner Jacket and I believe he meant a real one. I say this only because they have been rare of late.

 

I might point out that Ma Bell is the one who clarified Jeans on this board about five years ago. I don't remember all the details but she got it from the horse's mouth (ie: President of Celebrity at the time) that jeans were acceptable, this was after Celebrity removed the Jeans prohibition from the web site.

 

As far as definitions of formal or smart casual nothing matters but what Celebrity's definition is, everything else is irrelevant.

 

I don't care what other people wear, have always followed the appropriate dress code and have said for years that Celebrity should either enforce the code or adjust it to something that they can enforce.

Edited January 6, 2015 by dkjretired

[cle-guy]

Ma is correct about the dinner jacket, the web site is quoted numerous times in this thread. I think that what Cle forgets when citing the Daily is that you can't pack after you have received the daily.

 

But what is printed in the daily, is a bit more relaxed than the website (which is always in flux, and often conflicts with itself) packing list, so no one is out here, if the daily had a more restrictive done, then there would be issue, But the printed dailies, allow one to have forgotten a tuxedo, suit or dinner jacket, who may have a sport coat/jacket with them, to participate within the policy on board.

 

However if website said jacket, then one boarded to find a DINNER jacket is a requirement, they'd NOT be within the policy of the evening.

[Ma Bell]

I do consider jeans as slacks personally. If someone wants to wear a denim jacket, go for it. I doubt many will wear a straight jacket, but that would be fun to see, I'd actually probably ask for a photo with them.

 

oddly enough the definition of slacks:

noun, ( used with a plural verb)

 

 

So celebrity's definition of formal wear actually includes the wearing of some informal garments within it....

 

So now the question is what informal means.