Celebrity Dress Code Discussion Thread

[RocketMan275]

I think that argument is a HUGE stretch. I'm not willing to assume that the cruise line is going to be so devious and dishonest as to publish one set of rules while explicitly instructing their staff to not enforce those same rules. If you want to make that assumption, go for it - but until & unless I see some actual proof of that, I think that's a huge stretch and unlikely.

 

What I've heard argued here on CC over and over again is that the primary reason that dress codes are not enforced in the MDR is that the maitre' d is afraid of losing tips by confronting passengers about improper dress. So, the whole point is to get him thinking about the distinct possibility that he may be losing MORE tips by NOT enforcing the codes than he would be by enforcing them. I can't answer how many would want it enforced enough to remove tips or how many would remove tips if it were enforced any more than you can. But according to the arguments made often here, which have some merit - he may be likely thinking ONLY of those he could lose by confronting improperly dressed passengers and refusing them admittance. Again, the whole goal is to get him thinking that there could be more negative impact to his tips by NOT enforcing the dress codes.

 

Again, I don't know whether they can or not - if they can't, then it becomes a question as to whether you're willing to remove ALL tips and hand out cash to the others - obviously more work. And, I've already said I'm quite willing to tell him myself - I won't just assume that guest services will communicate that to him.

 

How many passengers would have to selectively remove tips for being confronted for improper dress to have a noticeable impact?

 

Again, if they can't selectively track, then personally I'm not going to tell them to remove $2 which would be a portion removed for everyone. If they can't selectively track, then I'd consider one of two things - either remove ALL tips and personally tip the other staff I interact throughout the week - or (more likely) hand the maitre' d an envelope at the end of the week with a one dollar bill in it, and tell him I would usually tip significantly more, but was unhappy with his unwillingness to do his job and enforce the written Celebrity dress code policy through the week.

 

One more time - perception - the maitre' d needs to start thinking that his tips in total may end up being lower by NOT enforcing the dress code than by confronting the few who brazenly try to flaunt it. (And like cle-guy, I'm not talking jeans or any other clothing which I may not really like, but which is allowed by the dress code.)

 

I appreciate your thoughtful comments.

 

I would add this. Organizations do have both written and unwritten policies which may contradict each other so it's not really such a "huge stretch" to think Celebrity might be the same. This is the equivalent of a police department directing it's officers to only issue tickets to those going x MPH over the posted limit.

 

I know there has been a lot of speculation here on cruise critic about why the code is not enforced. CC posters, in general, support dress codes. Blaming it on a Matre'd looking for tip money has certain advantages to those CC posters. If the problem is with the Matre'd, that's an enforcement problem that can easily be fixed. But if you accept that maybe the Matre'd is only following cruise line policy, then is an altogether different problem and it is unlikely to be resolved in favor of strict enforcement of the dress code.

 

I guess it's a matter of opinion whether Celebrity directing lax enforcement is more likely than a Matre'd taking it on himself to purposefully disregard portions of the code. The more widespread the reports of lax enforcement, the more likely it is cruise line policy.

 

I understand that there are many who want to maintain a tradition that they enjoy so well and I wish them well. Wife and I do not spend a lot of time in the MDR and would certainly not violate either the spirit or the letter of the code. I'm not arguing for ignoring the code or for even changing the code. I am only providing my opinion that society, for good or bad, no longer values formal wear, however that may be defined.

[Ma Bell]

But what is printed in the daily, is a bit more relaxed than the website (which is always in flux, and often conflicts with itself) packing list, so no one is out here, if the daily had a more restrictive done, then there would be issue, But the printed dailies, allow one to have forgotten a tuxedo, suit or dinner jacket, who may have a sport coat/jacket with them, to participate within the policy on board.

 

However if website said jacket, then one boarded to find a DINNER jacket is a requirement, they'd NOT be within the policy of the evening.

 

In all the years I've been sailing on Celebrity, since 1993, I've never seen the website in flux or contradict itself regarding the definition of formal wear. The only change ever made was the removal of the word dark in relation to a suit, and that was a long time ago.

 

The only thing that has changed is people on Cruise Critic telling others what they may be able to get away with and the Maitre'ds not wanting to confront the passengers.

Edited January 6, 2015 by Ma Bell

[dkjretired]

But what is printed in the daily, is a bit more relaxed than the website (which is always in flux, and often conflicts with itself) packing list, so no one is out here, if the daily had a more restrictive done, then there would be issue, But the printed dailies, allow one to have forgotten a tuxedo, suit or dinner jacket, who may have a sport coat/jacket with them, to participate within the policy on board.

 

However if website said jacket, then one boarded to find a DINNER jacket is a requirement, they'd NOT be within the policy of the evening.

 

That is actually happened a couple of years ago, people were boarding and finding some ships had changed the dress code to make it more stringent once on board which many had not packed for. Point is the web site and the booklets Celebrity issues are the best source not the dailies.

Edited January 6, 2015 by dkjretired

[Beanb41]

The reality of life is that more informal dress is taking over from formal dress. Those who continue to look back to the twenties when every evening meal was formal should really get into the 21st century. Evolution means that things and times change, just as attitudes to cruising changes. One can look backwards all forlorn if one wishes but I would rather look forward to how we can have a better time. If cruise lines wanted the "Elite" and "Upper Crust" to be their prime customers they wouldn't be offering free OBC, free drink packages, no gratuities, on board surfing ( that on the water) and other incentives to get people to join them. Competition is very fierce for the recreational dollar and if the difference between a passenger taking a particular cruise is wearing a tuxedo / suit at an evening meal or a more casual approach then the tux is going to go.

I must admit to having a perverse sense of pleasure reading about how people should change cruise lines if they don't like the tux/suit dress on 3 formal nights out of 14. If one wants to dress up to the nines then please by all means do so but please don't impart your predugices on me.

[davekathy]

The reality of life is that more informal dress is taking over from formal dress. Those who continue to look back to the twenties when every evening meal was formal should really get into the 21st century. Evolution means that things and times change, just as attitudes to cruising changes. One can look backwards all forlorn if one wishes but I would rather look forward to how we can have a better time. If cruise lines wanted the "Elite" and "Upper Crust" to be their prime customers they wouldn't be offering free OBC, free drink packages, no gratuities, on board surfing ( that on the water) and other incentives to get people to join them. Competition is very fierce for the recreational dollar and if the difference between a passenger taking a particular cruise is wearing a tuxedo / suit at an evening meal or a more casual approach then the tux is going to go.

I must admit to having a perverse sense of pleasure reading about how people should change cruise lines if they don't like the tux/suit dress on 3 formal nights out of 14. If one wants to dress up to the nines then please by all means do so but please don't impart your predugices on me.

 

I could be wrong (not agreeing or disagreeing with your comments) but IMO these so called dress code threads/blogs are not about living or preserving the past. They are about complying with the printed Cruise Lines evening suggested dress guidelines for the MDR. We are those that will comply. We however could give a rats you know what how other chose to dress. We always dine at a table for two and we always stay dressed in what we went to the MDR in for the entire evening. That’s us and again we don’t care what others do or what others may think of us. We also believe the Cruise lines need to either enforce their own dress guidelines, change the wording or do away entirely with the dress guidelines. That will probably never happen. If it was my Cruise Line, shorts every evening but it’s not so we play by their guidelines. Again that’s just us.

[dkjretired]

I could be wrong (not agreeing or disagreeing with your comments) but IMO these so called dress code threads/blogs are not about living or preserving the past. They are about complying with the printed Cruise Lines evening suggested dress guidelines for the MDR. We are those that will comply. We however could give a rats you know what how other chose to dress. We always dine at a table for two and we always stay dressed in what we went to the MDR in for the entire evening. That’s us and again we don’t care what others do or what others may think of us. We also believe the Cruise lines need to either enforce their own dress guidelines, change the wording or do away entirely with the dress guidelines. That will probably never happen. If it was my Cruise Line, shorts every evening but it’s not so we play by their guidelines. Again that’s just us.

 

I agree with everything you said and I would add one more thing in response to the poster that you quoted. He/she speaks of the dress code threads and may/may not realize that these threads are almost always started by someone asking a question about the dress code. It is then followed by people making comments without knowing the dress code (note this thread about Jeans), telling people to wear whatever you want (even though they might not be allowed in a venue). Granted there are people who try to get others to dress the way they want but there are just as many who make fun of or won't accept what the code actually is.

 

Follow the CELEBRITY dress code, not NCL, Princess, Royal or Dear Abby. Use common sense and most of all enjoy your cruise. One other thing, the Dress code for smart casual says "smart casual and above" and the emphasis should be on above so you can do whatever you wish within the dress code including wearing a tux to the buffet.

Edited January 6, 2015 by dkjretired

[vulcan1971]

The reality of life is that more informal dress is taking over from formal dress. Those who continue to look back to the twenties when every evening meal was formal should really get into the 21st century. Evolution means that things and times change, just as attitudes to cruising changes. One can look backwards all forlorn if one wishes but I would rather look forward to how we can have a better time. If cruise lines wanted the "Elite" and "Upper Crust" to be their prime customers they wouldn't be offering free OBC, free drink packages, no gratuities, on board surfing ( that on the water) and other incentives to get people to join them. Competition is very fierce for the recreational dollar and if the difference between a passenger taking a particular cruise is wearing a tuxedo / suit at an evening meal or a more casual approach then the tux is going to go.

I must admit to having a perverse sense of pleasure reading about how people should change cruise lines if they don't like the tux/suit dress on 3 formal nights out of 14. If one wants to dress up to the nines then please by all means do so but please don't impart your predugices on me.

 

1) Being offered a variety of incentives to book a cruise helps to maintain a full ship of passengers and has nothing to do with what type of crowd that Celebrity is trying to attract.

 

2) Having incentives offered to passengers to book a cruise does not make a cruise ship more casual.

 

3) If you are looking for an "informal dress standard", then maybe NCL or Royal Caribbean or even Carnival is more your style.

 

4) At the end of the day, if you choose to cruise with Celebrity, then you choose to abide by their policies and passenger code of conduct.

[keithm]

If you're referring to your post above, yes I read it. That's what I was replying to.

 

As others have said, the only reason the maitre d' would kick someone out for wearing jeans (that aren't ripped or torn) on a non-formal night, would be due to ignorance of the cruise line's dress code. You responded to that by saying that it was on a 14 day cruise on the Eclipse. Again, not seeing your point.

Sorry, it was a formal night. The reason I'm stating what I've said is simple: On Eclipse 14 day trips, the age of the pax is well over 65(most well over 70)A lot of pax that age still like to follow the past traditions of "oceanliner" travel. In other words they dress up more than your standard pax. My partner & I(though not in that age group)always like to dress more formal than most. It's why we've chosen the Eclipse over other Solstice class ships.

[keithm]

I do consider jeans as slacks personally. If someone wants to wear a denim jacket, go for it. I doubt many will wear a straight jacket, but that would be fun to see, I'd actually probably ask for a photo with them.

 

oddly enough the definition of slacks:

noun, ( used with a plural verb)

 

 

So celebrity's definition of formal wear actually includes the wearing of some informal garments within it....

Hannibel Lechter wheeled into the MDR in a straight jacket. Hmmm. That would get the pax to pause for a moment.

[keithm]

Agree for the most part. Too arbitrary to try to enforce "no jeans" and way too arbitrary to try to enforce "no sport coat/jacket. Personally, I wouldn't call it too arbitrary to exclude "Members Only" jackets, windbreaker jackets or similar though.

 

For me, if they'll reasonably enforce the "jacket required" with a collared shirt on formal nights, and enforce the prohibition on shorts, sleeveless t-shirts, flip flops & ball caps EVERY night; I'd be quite happy - and would thank & tip the maitre d for doing so!

I'd only allow it for Chris Hemsworth! Uh, just a personal observation,you understand.

[patty1955]

Hannibel Lechter wheeled into the MDR in a straight jacket. Hmmm. That would get the pax to pause for a moment.

I've seen some passengers who almost need to be wheeled in. Whoops, that wasn't nice!

[keithm]

Ma is correct about the dinner jacket, the web site is quoted numerous times in this thread. I think that what Cle forgets when citing the Daily is that you can't pack after you have received the daily.

 

A Dinner jacket is not a sport jacket and has been in Celebrity's dress code forever. I believe many think it is a sport jacket but it is not, think James Bond at the Monte Carlo casino. Sports jackets have been accepted for several years on Celebrity ships but they are not definitely not Dinner jacket. I actually was surprised last week when someone on this board said he was packing his Dinner Jacket and I believe he meant a real one. I say this only because they have been rare of late.

 

I might point out that Ma Bell is the one who clarified Jeans on this board about five years ago. I don't remember all the details but she got it from the horse's mouth (ie: President of Celebrity at the time) that jeans were acceptable, this was after Celebrity removed the Jeans prohibition from the web site.

 

As far as definitions of formal or smart casual nothing matters but what Celebrity's definition is, everything else is irrelevant.

 

I don't care what other people wear, have always followed the appropriate dress code and have said for years that Celebrity should either enforce the code or adjust it to something that they can enforce.

I think one of those navey blue blazers with the brass buttons could qualify as a sport jacket.

[keithm]

So now the question is what informal means.

To me:Khakis & short sleeve dress shirt or nice polo shirt. Still with nice shoes(boat shoes work fine)

[keithm]

The reality of life is that more informal dress is taking over from formal dress. Those who continue to look back to the twenties when every evening meal was formal should really get into the 21st century. Evolution means that things and times change, just as attitudes to cruising changes. One can look backwards all forlorn if one wishes but I would rather look forward to how we can have a better time. If cruise lines wanted the "Elite" and "Upper Crust" to be their prime customers they wouldn't be offering free OBC, free drink packages, no gratuities, on board surfing ( that on the water) and other incentives to get people to join them. Competition is very fierce for the recreational dollar and if the difference between a passenger taking a particular cruise is wearing a tuxedo / suit at an evening meal or a more casual approach then the tux is going to go.

I must admit to having a perverse sense of pleasure reading about how people should change cruise lines if they don't like the tux/suit dress on 3 formal nights out of 14. If one wants to dress up to the nines then please by all means do so but please don't impart your predugices on me.

Seems you're quite willing to impart yours on others.

[keithm]

I've seen some passengers who almost need to be wheeled in. Whoops, that wasn't nice!

Yup, had more than one crunched foot..Ouch!

[Ma Bell]

To me:Khakis & short sleeve dress shirt or nice polo shirt. Still with nice shoes(boat shoes work fine)

 

This is another word when used for dress codes that is very misleading and was used for many years in Celebrity's dress code. If you Google the meaning for informal dress this is the kind of thing you will see. Informal is actually a step up from smart casual. Surprise!

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Informal_attire

Edited January 6, 2015 by Ma Bell

[LetsGetWet!]

The reality of life is that more informal dress is taking over from formal dress. Those who continue to look back to the twenties when every evening meal was formal should really get into the 21st century. Evolution means that things and times change, just as attitudes to cruising changes. One can look backwards all forlorn if one wishes but I would rather look forward to how we can have a better time. If cruise lines wanted the "Elite" and "Upper Crust" to be their prime customers they wouldn't be offering free OBC, free drink packages, no gratuities, on board surfing ( that on the water) and other incentives to get people to join them. Competition is very fierce for the recreational dollar and if the difference between a passenger taking a particular cruise is wearing a tuxedo / suit at an evening meal or a more casual approach then the tux is going to go.

I must admit to having a perverse sense of pleasure reading about how people should change cruise lines if they don't like the tux/suit dress on 3 formal nights out of 14. If one wants to dress up to the nines then please by all means do so but please don't impart your predugices on me.

Seems you're quite willing to impart yours on others.

I must admit that was my first thought after reading his/her post too.

[vulcan1971]

Apparently the term "smart casual" can be ambiguous.

 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smart_casual

 

 

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus on the T-Mobile 4G LTE Network using Tapatalk Pro

[LetsGetWet!]

I happened to see this posted on Facebook today, and confess the first thought that crossed my mind is that the people posting those twitter comments are often the same ones who want every single dinner on their cruise to be "shorts/t-shirts/flip flops." :)

 

Kanye West and the legendary Paul McCartney release a song together. Kanye fans are impressed by their star's selfless promotion of an unknown artist.

[vulcan1971]

I happened to see this posted on Facebook today, and confess the first thought that crossed my mind is that the people posting those twitter comments are often the same ones who want every single dinner on their cruise to be "shorts/t-shirts/flip flops." :)

 

 

 

Wow... I hope this was satire... Because otherwise this really says a lot about the prospects of our future youth.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus on the T-Mobile 4G LTE Network using Tapatalk Pro

[dkjretired]

Apparently the term "smart casual" can be ambiguous.

 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smart_casual

 

 

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus on the T-Mobile 4G LTE Network using Tapatalk Pro

 

Once again, the only definition of Smart Casual is what Celebrity defines it as, everything else is irrelevant. Jeans are allowed, period.

[dkjretired]

Wow... I hope this was satire... Because otherwise this really says a lot about the prospects of our future youth.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus on the T-Mobile 4G LTE Network using Tapatalk Pro

 

Its not, I saw it on the news.....

[vulcan1971]

Once again, the only definition of Smart Casual is what Celebrity defines it as, everything else is irrelevant. Jeans are allowed, period.

 

 

I know... and I'm not anti-jeans.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus on the T-Mobile 4G LTE Network using Tapatalk Pro

[davekathy]

Once again, the only definition of Smart Casual is what Celebrity defines it as, everything else is irrelevant. Jeans are allowed, period.

 

I agree and it's just that simple.

[gek]

I happened to see this posted on Facebook today, and confess the first thought that crossed my mind is that the people posting those twitter comments are often the same ones who want every single dinner on their cruise to be "shorts/t-shirts/flip flops." :)

 

 

Really? The most liked photo of all time on Instagram features Kanye West in a tuxedo. I imagine most of his fans would be in favour of formal wear.