Raising gratuities again!

[Snowrose]

no.

I was told by the Hotel Director that ALL tips go towards the crew.

 

a vast majority of it go directly into their pockets. the amount varies by person depending on their performance reviews.

 

The tips go to the crew *after* you've sailed, when your cruise is over. If you pay ahead of time, you've given NCL a free loan of your money until that time.

[Greciangirl]

Since ncl opened this can or worms with their email today here is another perspective tho not necessarily my own... Since the change to ala carte specialty restaurants and ncl's comment to being more online with land based restaurants....how many of you go to a fine dining restaurant and tip more than one person there? Do you tip your server knowing they have to tip out the bartender wine sommelier or bus boy how about the dishwasher or the cleaning people? What about the complimentary valet? To those who only eat the buffet do we compare that to fast food on land or a buffet restaurant do you tip there where the staff removes your plate each time you refill?

[Greciangirl]

The same goes in a hotel when was the last time you left a tip for the room cleaning staff?

[LMaxwell]

Since ncl opened this can or worms with their email today here is another perspective tho not necessarily my own... Since the change to ala carte specialty restaurants and ncl's comment to being more online with land based restaurants....how many of you go to a fine dining restaurant and tip more than one person there? Do you tip your server knowing they have to tip out the bartender wine sommelier or bus boy how about the dishwasher or the cleaning people? What about the complimentary valet? To those who only eat the buffet do we compare that to fast food on land or a buffet restaurant do you tip there where the staff removes your plate each time you refill?

10% at buffet restaurants.

 

15-20% for friendly service at a restaurant. More for truly gracious service.

 

Whoever the server has to tip out and whatever back of the house arrangement they have worked out is between them and their management and staff.

 

Not sure what that has to do with a cruise though where I've already paid for service and a meal that I am skipping to eat in specialty.

[Greciangirl]

Let me be clear i do not believe the increase in gratuities is out of line but i do think that the amount of the raise was not thought out with two raises in 5 months. I wish i would get a raise twice a year instead of just once! Lol

Edited July 17, 2015 by Greciangirl

[Greciangirl]

What im trying to say is if you take each meal you eat on board whether buffet or specialty and imagine what that same meal would cost on land and figure what you would normally tip, the cruise tips are far less... alternatively i cant remember the last time i tipped the cleaning staff in a hotel where ive stayed multiple days....

Edited July 17, 2015 by Greciangirl

[rochelle_s]

When I started working on ships in 1974, the average "suggested" tips came to a total of $27.00 per person per day.

 

When I enter that number in an online inflation calculator, it becomes $137.23 per person per day in today's dollars.

 

It looks like we are slowly - very slowly - returning to those "good old days of cruising" that everybody is always talking about.

 

When I started cruising in the mid 80's and even up to 2008/2009 the recommended tipping was under $10 pp per day and this was on various lines including Celebrity, HAL and NCL.

 

Not sure which cruise lines you were working on in the 70's.

 

 

Rochelle

[LMaxwell]

What im trying to say is if you take each meal you eat on board whether buffet or specialty and imagine what that same meal would cost on land and figure what you would normally tip, the cruise tips are far less... alternatively i cant remember the last time i tipped the cleaning staff in a hotel where ive stayed multiple days....

 

Tips on land go up commensurate with cost which usually, but not always, indicates better service and quality. That is to say, you are likely to get better quality food and service at a $80 dinner than you are at a $20 dinner. I think most people understand and agree with that basic generalization.

 

Yes, the cruise tips are cheaper than land based, but they have gone up 12.5% in the last few months for basic service and there has been no increase in quality of food or service. If they want to increase rates for service by 12.5% isn't it fair for me to ask for a 12.5% increase in quality of product and service? When there was a 20% increase in bar gratuities there was no improvement in services (some say services actually got worse). Why is the customer always wrong these days for expecting to get what they have paid for?

[LMaxwell]

When I started cruising in the mid 80's and even up to 2008/2009 the recommended tipping was under $10 pp per day and this was on various lines including Celebrity, HAL and NCL.

 

Not sure which cruise lines you were working on in the 70's.

 

 

Rochelle

 

The cruise industry "average" suggested tip was never $27 per person per day. The person who made the claim then told others to go find the info themselves which is usually the biggest red flag there is that a claim is bogus.

[JimHam4]

I think the problem here isn't the amount of the increase, it is the way it was instituted, along with the other changes NCL has been making. When I booked my family's cruise we were told were getting certain thing in exchange for a certain dollar amount we were willing to spend. Since that booking we have seen two increases in service fees, charges for room service, a policy change on taking out food (with a retraction), a change in the port time for one of our stops, and an email telling us the overcrowding may prevent my niece from going to the kid's club. A lot of minor changes but I could argue this is no 'll longer the same cruise I booked

 

We'll go, well have a great time, but the confusion leading up this cruise has left a bad taste in this first time NCL cruiser's mouth.

 

BTW, I was able to log in to my account this afternoon and the old rate for service fees showed up, so I prepayed. The prepay option wasn't available a few days ago, but luckily it was back today, even though we are past final payment.

[NYteacher]

As of our April cruise, we are three days shy of being Platinum. Our trip were part of the lucky Breakaway crowd that had the room service charge added to their voyage unexpectedly. Although we were in a suite and the charges didn't apply to us, I was appalled by the change from a complimentary service to a fee service after final payment.

 

At the time there was a giant debate about what the cruise contract actually provided vs. consumer fraud and bait and switch deceptions.

 

This past voyage was the first time in seven years that we did not buy a future cruise credit. Once the room service fee was added, I felt I could no longer trust NCL to adhere to providing me with the same cruise for which I already paid. I felt that NCL could sell me a Haven suite, and then one week before my cruise change the policy so that suite passengers would now have the exclusive opportunity to buy a Haven pool pass at a very reasonable fee.

 

I have been mostly absent from the NCL board since April, but thought I'd stop by and see what's new. Wow!

 

I have no intentions at all of booking any NCL cruise in the next couple of years. I would like SOME kind of pricing/policy stability before I book with them again.

[janpo]

The same goes in a hotel when was the last time you left a tip for the room cleaning staff?

 

Every single morning we leave a tip for the maids. If you leave it at the end of your stay it might not be the same person who cleaned your room the previous days. So yes , we do tip the maids but NCL is just getting out of hand.

[newmexicoNita]

I'm all for paying the hard working crew but I'm not at all convinced the crew is on the receiving end of these gratuity increases. It seem like a money grab by NCL. They're constantly looking at how to exploit the customers lately and this seems like a method of doing so but using crew as an excuse. :mad:

 

I wonder the same but we will never know for sure. My travel agent told us about the increase yesterday morning and we got the Email from NCL as well. I am upset with the increase on just becaue of the 2 raises so close together, not the amount so much. It would have beee better just to stick it to us all at once and it would be over. Now, we will again, go through the ranting stage. We are pre paying ours on July 25th when final payment is due.

[newmexicoNita]

What im trying to say is if you take each meal you eat on board whether buffet or specialty and imagine what that same meal would cost on land and figure what you would normally tip, the cruise tips are far less... alternatively i cant remember the last time i tipped the cleaning staff in a hotel where ive stayed multiple days....

You point is well taken with the meals, but on land you would, most likely not eat the same way daily, we do on ships. On the other hand, we do tip our housekeeper whenever we stay at a hotel, we do this on a dailiy basis, regardless of the stay being 1 night or several nights. I don't think most of us are as upset with the increase in the DSC as we are about the way it has been done. Will it stop us from sailing NCL? nope, for many reasons, are we upset? You bet, just on gerneral principle.

[newmexicoNita]

When I started cruising in the mid 80's and even up to 2008/2009 the recommended tipping was under $10 pp per day and this was on various lines including Celebrity, HAL and NCL.

 

Not sure which cruise lines you were working on in the 70's.

 

 

Rochelle

 

Totally agree: our first cruise was in 1984 I think. The average tip was probably about $7 to $8 per day, per person. Where anyone got $27 is a huge stretch of someone's imagination.

[biker@sea]

The same goes in a hotel when was the last time you left a tip for the room cleaning staff?

 

Every time.

 

Don't you??

 

Even tho I worked on the road on the co. dime.

 

Work paid for the room.

I tipped for the service as did my crew.

 

.

[jenseib]

We do too and just got the email this morning. A little pi$$ed off. We're a family of five and convinced be brother in laws family to join us so now eight of us have increased grants. Being past final payment according to the email we're stuck. First cruise with NCL and trying to stay positive but everything keeps changing and not sure what to expect when we get on board. Considering going to guest services and changing to the original amount at the end of the cruise, and I usually tip on top of the autos.

 

Not true at all. You can still prepay. I just did last night and it was still the old rate.

 

Not according to the email I got. Once your past final payment there is no prepay option anymore.

 

Nope, not true....you can still prepay. I sail in 2 weeks and went in yesterday and prepaid.

[sjbdtz]

ahh.. yup, I said similair sentiments in my post.

 

Enough already. I think you win the award for the most new threads.

 

As for the Golden Age of Sheehan? Remember cancelling pillow chocolates? Removing arrival champagne? Hiring a guy from Darden (home of mediocrity in food) to run the food?

 

I liked Sheehan, and some of his changes...but they weren't all great. Veitch was no different...try one thing, remove another, etc.

 

Nothing is more constant, than change.

 

 

 

What if A, B, C, D each got a 4 rating? Wouldn't there be a shortfall by your math?

 

What if A, B, C, D each got a 2 rating? Wouldn't there be an overage by your math?

 

If A.B.C.D all got 4 ratings and there is only $10, they each only get $2.50? How is that fair when A and B otherwise would get $4 each?

 

If A.B.C.D all got 2 ratings they would all get $1 each? Where does the other $6 go? Or do they all get $2.50 for their 2 rating or 4 rating irregardless? Because if that is the case the crew have NO incentive to work harder; in fact they are discouraged from being "above and beyond" and will all collectively "sandbag" to game the system.

 

 

That's easy:

 

If they all get 2 ratings, then you have total ratings of 8. Each rating becomes worth $10/8 = $ 1.25.

 

So if the crew collaborate to ALL earn low ratings, then they make more money. :rolleyes:

 

 

If they all get 4 ratings, then you have total ratings of 16. Each rating is worth $10 / 16 = $ 0.625 So each crew member is really incentivized to undercut their co-workers' ratings. :rolleyes:

 

 

 

The real way it works, is you get a certain percentage sliver of the total pool. If the pool goes up, your take-away goes up. If the pool goes down, etc.

 

You can increase your RELATIVE share by earning higher performance rankings & ratings. Yes, that comes at the expense of somebody else....because it's all relative shares.

 

Superstars make more than slackers.

 

 

.

[LMaxwell]

 

You can increase your RELATIVE share by earning higher performance rankings & ratings. Yes, that comes at the expense of somebody else....because it's all relative shares.

 

 

Yes, and when everyone earns the top ratings there isn't enough to go around and when everyone earns a low rating NCL keep the money.

 

If 4 people are rated a 4 and have a $10 pot to split, they each get $2.50.

 

If 4 people are rated a 3 and have a $10 pot to split, maybe they each get $2? Someone else that earned a 4 is not suddenly going to get $2.50 + the $2 remainder from this group. NCL will take that money.

 

NCL is not an independent an unbiased agent because they have potential revenue on the line here. It's not in their best interest to give it all out. If they DID give it all out they wouldn't need performance ratings.

[Cruisercl]

Enough already. I think you win the award for the most new threads.

 

As for the Golden Age of Sheehan? Remember cancelling pillow chocolates? Removing arrival champagne? Hiring a guy from Darden (home of mediocrity in food) to run the food?

 

I liked Sheehan, and some of his changes...but they weren't all great. Veitch was no different...try one thing, remove another, etc.

 

Nothing is more constant, than change.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's easy:

 

If they all get 2 ratings, then you have total ratings of 8. Each rating becomes worth $10/8 = $ 1.25.

 

So if the crew collaborate to ALL earn low ratings, then they make more money. :rolleyes:

 

 

If they all get 4 ratings, then you have total ratings of 16. Each rating is worth $10 / 16 = $ 0.625 So each crew member is really incentivized to undercut their co-workers' ratings. :rolleyes:

 

 

 

The real way it works, is you get a certain percentage sliver of the total pool. If the pool goes up, your take-away goes up. If the pool goes down, etc.

 

You can increase your RELATIVE share by earning higher performance rankings & ratings. Yes, that comes at the expense of somebody else....because it's all relative shares.

 

Superstars make more than slackers.

 

 

.

 

Really good discussion here; it is good (for me) to hear others' opinions. I have a couple of thoughts (of course) :p:

 

-I always tip in hotel room service people, daily

-I am still not convinced that all of the increased DSC will go to the stated intended

-I also would love to get a raise twice a year; and a nice one which NCL has indicated they are giving out

-Why is NCL using, already given DSC/gratuities, to the intended people as a 'reward' like parties etc.? Shouldn't it be a given that they have already earned it unless something is said to the contrary? This looks like stealing already earned money. IMO not a good company to work for.....

-IMO, the 'perceived' superstars get more than slackers.........we all know those kind of people, so things aren't always fair, as this doesn't seem to be either. Especially when this money has already been earned.

 

Happy and safe cruising all!!!:D

[padrek]

Personally I thin k NCL is making a mistake with these constantly changing and increasing service charges. I also suspect that there will be a backlash. They seem to be embracing the "European model" of tacking a service charge onto the total bill for everything. Personally I much prefer to pay "upfront", in other words make a trip all inclusive, at least as far as tips are concerned. I would prefer to pay a higher upfront fare and not have to contend with 18% "service charges", high daily tips, charges on Room Service orders etc. I want to know the cost of a trip before I leave, not be "nickeled and dimed" to death while aboard. Their a la carte charges in many restaurants will also come back to haunt them. Personally I dislike the "cover charges" and only reluctantly tolerate them, but will not go and pay a la carte charges when I have already paid for my meals in my cruise fare. Unfortunately cruise companies believe that it is all about their "lead in" fares, but experienced cruisers are not duped.

[boopsahoy]

Personally I thin k NCL is making a mistake with these constantly changing and increasing service charges. I also suspect that there will be a backlash. They seem to be embracing the "European model" of tacking a service charge onto the total bill for everything. Personally I much prefer to pay "upfront", in other words make a trip all inclusive, at least as far as tips are concerned. I would prefer to pay a higher upfront fare and not have to contend with 18% "service charges", high daily tips, charges on Room Service orders etc. I want to know the cost of a trip before I leave, not be "nickeled and dimed" to death while aboard. Their a la carte charges in many restaurants will also come back to haunt them. Personally I dislike the "cover charges" and only reluctantly tolerate them, but will not go and pay a la carte charges when I have already paid for my meals in my cruise fare. Unfortunately cruise companies believe that it is all about their "lead in" fares, but experienced cruisers are not duped.

 

People used to say NCL was nickel and diming and I used to stick up for NCL but no more. THIS is nickel and diming-adding gratuities, increasing dsc, a la carte, room service charges... Raise the fare and stop with the annoying add ons.

[hpecorari]

Raise the fare and stop with the annoying add ons.

 

 

But....that's already been done....and not by just a few bucks!

 

Harriet

[Cauzneffct]

Personally I much prefer to pay "upfront", in other words make a trip all inclusive, at least as far as tips are concerned. I would prefer to pay a higher upfront fare and not have to contend with 18% "service charges", high daily tips, charges on Room Service orders etc. I want to know the cost of a trip before I leave, not be "nickeled and dimed" to death while aboard.

 

The more I think about it, the more I'd like if there were "Experience Tiers." One could pay the base fare as they do now, and it would include what it (currently) includes: entertainment, meals at the (currently) free venues, etc. People could also choose an Enhanced Tier, where they could add on things such as the UBP, UDP, etc., either individually or in packages, to make it more "all-inclusive." And you could have a Value Tier (or something snazzier sounding) where people could opt out of things, so if you're fine with just the buffet and don't want to see any theater shows, you could opt out of the associated costs for the things you don't use (with the ability to buy passes to individual shows or MDR or whatever).

 

Might be a logistical nightmare, but it would make things more "freestyle." Of course, that assumes NCL wouldn't just start charging for everything ala carte.

Edited July 17, 2015 by Cauzneffct

[Proud Grandparents]

Not sure how you came up with the dollar number. We are in a balcony...increase is 55 cents/person/day. I come up with $13.20 for the two of us on a twelve day cruise.