HAL no longer requires formal dress

[cruz chic]

At least it isn't a birthday suit. On a Hal cruise, I may lose my appetite looking at so many wrinkled bodies.

 

Unless it's a nude cruise, which cruise lines allow you to walk around nude?

Edited August 18, 2015 by cruz chic

[POA1]

Sorry L - Didn’t read your whole post before I answered. I've deleted my response.

Edited August 18, 2015 by POA1

[Globaliser]

Sorry, but what are you reading as "distortion"? Both of these sntiments have been expressed multiple times in this thread...

Many people who like "formal" dress on formal nights like everyone to be similarly dressed because that adds to the "formal night" ambience, and there is little point in being one of only a few people who have made the effort to dress up in a room where most people aren't.

 

Your post distorted both aspects of that sentence. It has nothing to do with imposing one's will on anyone else, nor of insecurity.

 

The counter-argument is usually: "You can wear whatever you like, and it shouldn't matter to you what I wear." That ignores the fact that what people wear affects and changes the ambience of the room.

 

Or, at least in some people's view, it does. As I said before:-

I did once ask someone here whether a room full of people in jeans and T-shirts looks as good as a room full of people in dinner suits / tuxedoes and ball gowns.

 

I think they said yes.

If HAL wishes to attract an audience that does not see the difference that it makes to a room's ambience, then that is HAL's prerogative. There will be many who will welcome that.

 

But those people don't do themselves any favours if they misunderstand or misrepresent the opinions of those who prefer the former "formal nights".

[SurferJoe57]

"Growl, baby" (in my Austin Powers voice.)

[voyageur9]

Clearly some have a preference for 'formal' nights and the ambiance that a room full of people dressed to some prescribed standard creates.

 

Two possible solutions:

1) Those who feel so inclined should attempt, perhaps in a roll call or some similar pre-cruise group communication, to book one of the specialty restaurants for a 'formal' night.

 

2) If there really is sufficient demand then HAL could, likely would, set a price for those willing to pay a premium to dine with others so inclined in a area sized to meet the demand.

 

What seems unlikely (just as the tradition of women absenting themselves after dinner so men can enjoy their cigars) is a return to requiring all passengers, many of whom clearly don't want to bother, to wear formal dress in the MDR

[RuthC]

Many people who like "formal" dress on formal nights like everyone to be similarly dressed because that adds to the "formal night" ambience, and there is little point in being one of only a few people who have made the effort to dress up in a room where most people aren't.

There are many people who understand that fully. There are others who never will.

[Globaliser]

Two possible solutions:

 

1) Those who feel so inclined should attempt, perhaps in a roll call or some similar pre-cruise group communication, to book one of the specialty restaurants for a 'formal' night.

 

2) If there really is sufficient demand then HAL could, likely would, set a price for those willing to pay a premium to dine with others so inclined in a area sized to meet the demand.

The real solution is to cruise on a different cruise line.

 

As I've said, there's one more cruise for me; if HAL is no longer right for me, I'll be off somewhere else, but it'll be a shame.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

I totally understand what many of you that are Pro Formal Night are saying BUT..... it has been many years now since HAL Has enforced Formal nights and when most were wearing truly Formal attire. For so many years DH and I have dressed quite Formal, my avatar is from our last cruise just a few months ago in May. TRUST ME we were the only passengers dressed very Formal but this goes back to even 8 years ago when we had our 30 year Renewal of Vows, again you could practically count on one hand how many men were wearing a Tux. So I guess some of us or at least for me cannot get over what the big deal is and the complaining. Just because HAL stated it was a Formal night certainly did not mean people dressed that way for a very long time now. I think HAL is just waving the White Flag. I personally do not think much is going to change because the percentage that actually read these board is quite small compared to the number of HAL cruisers. Then the percentage that actually read the Know Before you Cruise is even less. Most for a long time will assume HAL has the same dress code as they always have. I think what we have seen for Formal night will continue for Gala with some dressed up and most not just like it has been for many years.

[RocketMan275]

Many people who like "formal" dress on formal nights like everyone to be similarly dressed because that adds to the "formal night" ambience, and there is little point in being one of only a few people who have made the effort to dress up in a room where most people aren't.

 

Your post distorted both aspects of that sentence. It has nothing to do with imposing one's will on anyone else, nor of insecurity.

 

 

If "only a few people who have made the effort to dress up", that should say something about the popularity of formal nights and the future direction of dress codes.

 

Anytime someone tries to control someone's behavior, it certainly does have something "to do with imposing one's will".

 

When I was a college freshman, it was considered a "requirement" to wear sports coat and tie to a football game. Wearing a suit to class was not uncommon. Things change.

[cruz chic]

I totally understand what many of you that are Pro Formal Night are saying BUT..... it has been many years now since HAL Has enforced Formal nights and when most were wearing truly Formal attire. For so many years DH and I have dressed quite Formal, my avatar is from our last cruise just a few months ago in May. TRUST ME we were the only passengers dressed very Formal but this goes back to even 8 years ago when we had our 30 year Renewal of Vows, again you could practically count on one hand how many men were wearing a Tux. So I guess some of us or at least for me cannot get over what the big deal is and the complaining. Just because HAL stated it was a Formal night certainly did not mean people dressed that way for a very long time now. I think HAL is just waving the White Flag. I personally do not think much is going to change because the percentage that actually read these board is quite small compared to the number of HAL cruisers. Then the percentage that actually read the Know Before you Cruise is even less. Most for a long time will assume HAL has the same dress code as they always have. I think what we have seen for Formal night will continue for Gala with some dressed up and most not just like it has been for many years.

 

If they have truly waved the white flag then why not end it instead of a wishy washy policy?

[LAFFNVEGAS]

If they have truly waved the white flag then why not end it instead of a wishy washy policy?

 

Because of those that are still complaining hoping they will still consider it Formal Night. Many will and will continue to cruise as thee always have.

[EbayCruiser]

I totally understand what many of you that are Pro Formal Night are saying BUT..... it has been many years now since HAL Has enforced Formal nights and when most were wearing truly Formal attire. For so many years DH and I have dressed quite Formal, my avatar is from our last cruise just a few months ago in May. TRUST ME we were the only passengers dressed very Formal but this goes back to even 8 years ago when we had our 30 year Renewal of Vows, again you could practically count on one hand how many men were wearing a Tux. So I guess some of us or at least for me cannot get over what the big deal is and the complaining. Just because HAL stated it was a Formal night certainly did not mean people dressed that way for a very long time now. I think HAL is just waving the White Flag. I personally do not think much is going to change because the percentage that actually read these board is quite small compared to the number of HAL cruisers. Then the percentage that actually read the Know Before you Cruise is even less. Most for a long time will assume HAL has the same dress code as they always have. I think what we have seen for Formal night will continue for Gala with some dressed up and most not just like it has been for many years.

 

Aren't you violating the board policy by having the cruise company name for which you work in your signature? Just asking ...

[swin26]

My DH has typically worn a tux on formal nights, but for our next cruise he is seriously considering not bringing a coat and tie and wearing a long sleeve dress shirt and pants on gala nights. We eat at many very nice restaurants at home and when traveling and coats and ties are not required. It does not take away from our enjoyment. I will likely wear a dress (not formal) or black slacks and a dressier top. I like the new policy very much. We go to numerous black tie events a year for work and I'm glad I don't need to get this dressed up on vacation

[Wakepatrol]

It takes an extreme case of ignorance or a jumbo set of kahunas to show up in a track suit on formal night.

 

Just between you and me- nobody showers then puts on a track suit

[cruz chic]

Because of those that are still complaining hoping they will still consider it Formal Night. Many will and will continue to cruise as thee always have.

 

I'm having a hard time understanding your reply. Those that enjoy formal have had that experience eroded whether posters understand that or not. Saying "well you can still dress up" doesn't sweeten the pot while sitting next to dude in his cargo pants and golf shirt or worse. Even the playing field and have all smart casual. At least there won't be so much disparity it the way people dress.

[Topsham]

We've had two "incarnations" with HAL, and I'm talking about our recent HAL experiences. (last six years, I think) We sailed with them late 70s, early 80s, and yes, formal night was taken seriously, as it was on all lines. Not all men wore tuxes, but they wore suits w in love with QE2, so we didn't follow HAL to other homeports.

 

When HAL came back to the NY-Bermuda run, we came back to HAL for the first season on Veendam. From HAL's description, we expected formal nights to be like they had been before. DH wore his tux and was disappointed that we saw only a handful of other men in tuxes. And we saw shorts and flipflops at the show on formal night, despite HAL's "out of respect for your fellow guests..." line. So somewhere in the gap between our early cruises and more recent cruises, formal night started slipping.

 

Thanks Kathy.

 

When Saga started in 1998 with the first ship SAGA ROSE... ex SAGAFJORD they knew what they wanted. The top management were all Cunard people. On board... Captain, Ch. Engineer, Hotel Director, Purser, Cruise Director and on an on... all Cunard people. So here they are... still formal and informal and casual. Tried casual with one little ship, SPIRIT OF ADVENTURE and it was a flop. On the first cruises the passengers came to dinner dressed formal. They quickly went back to the old system.

 

If I'm on a casual ship I will go with the casual dress.... if formal... then I'll go to do that... with Cunard and Saga.

 

Stephen

[maimeo]

In the past, Gala (read Formal) Nights were not just about guests' dress code. The dining room got dressier with white covers on the chairs. The menu was more upscale with lobster, steak, classic dishes. Photographers set up backdrops for taking portraits. A more festive atmosphere.

 

It will be interesting to see how that plays out before and on our next cruise in November (Nieuw Amsterdam Eastern Caribbean).

 

Any comments by recent cruisers would be helpful.

[iancal]

Just packed, leaving for a land trip in Greece. Five collared shirts, three pairs of shorts, and of course the one pair casual slacks and sweater that I will wear on the flight. Plus the usual underwear/shaving items.

 

We may pick up a last minute cruise....who knows. This is how we travel.

 

HAL's policy was not a show stopper for us, and is not with the change. Lido is fine on gala nights but now it appears that we will be able to go to Pinnacle or Tamarind. No biggie for us.

 

From our perspective there is really not very much formal or gala about those nights on HAL...before or after the change. As others have said...HAL really does not make an effort to make it special so why would they expect their customers to make a big deal out of it.

[RocketMan275]

I'm having a hard time understanding your reply. Those that enjoy formal have had that experience eroded whether posters understand that or not. Saying "well you can still dress up" doesn't sweeten the pot while sitting next to dude in his cargo pants and golf shirt or worse. Even the playing field and have all smart casual. At least there won't be so much disparity it the way people dress.

 

Saying you can always go to a specialty restaurant or eat in the buffet if you don't want to dress up "doesn't sweeten the pot" either does it?

 

I fully understand that some think their experience (ambiance) has been "eroded". I do not understand why some think that justifies controlling someone else's behavior.

[Irish Eyes Are Sailing]

I know some folks like to dress up, and we have in the past. Cruises have been leaning to a more informal code of dress for a while now, whether within the rules or outside of them, and maybe if they go to a "all smart casual" dress code, it would not be such a bad thing.

I say this in the spirit of packing lighter, due to airline restrictions on luggage weight, etc. Change is never easy, but sometimes it works out for the best in the end. It will be interesting to see what HAL ultimately does.

[mudscraper]

In the past, Gala (read Formal) Nights were not just about guests' dress code. The dining room got dressier with white covers on the chairs. The menu was more upscale with lobster, steak, classic dishes. Photographers set up backdrops for taking portraits. A more festive atmosphere.

 

It will be interesting to see how that plays out before and on our next cruise in November (Nieuw Amsterdam Eastern Caribbean).

 

Any comments by recent cruisers would be helpful.

 

I agree with your post. What will be next? Remove the tablecloths and linen napkins from the MDR? And those dam vases with flowers in them take up way too much room on the table. HAL could put the paper napkin dispenser there instead.

[3rdGenCunarder]

If "only a few people who have made the effort to dress up", that should say something about the popularity of formal nights and the future direction of dress codes.

 

Anytime someone tries to control someone's behavior, it certainly does have something "to do with imposing one's will".

 

When I was a college freshman, it was considered a "requirement" to wear sports coat and tie to a football game. Wearing a suit to class was not uncommon. Things change.

 

HAL set the dress code, not the cruisers who like formal night. So don't blame other passengers for HAL's rules.

 

There was a time when HAL had stricter rules and enforced them. When we started cruising, cruise lines didn't even have to enforce the dress code. People just knew to dress up when they were asked to.

 

And this wasn't only HAL. NCL, now known for casual dress, used to have a dress code for formal nights, and everyone dressed up. Not all tuxes and ballgowns, more suits and long dresses or cocktail dresses. But passengers participated in the evening and followed the dress code (without changing clothes after dinner). The first time I saw "changers" on a cruise was on NCL in 1999. I was accustomed to seeing everyone stay dressed up all evening, and that was quite a surprise.

 

As times changed and people didn't want to dress up, HAL still had a formal night dress code. But some people stopped following the dress code, in essence, breaking HAL's rules. (Now who's imposing their own will?) Sometimes HAL's dress code was enforced, sometime it wasn't.

 

And now HAL has given up trying, giving in to the will of people who didn't want to dress up. Their new dress code is "we'd like you to dress up but you don't have to." I don't like it, but OK, I'll adjust my packing and go with the flow.

 

I'm betting that on cruises over the next few months, the first gala night will be dressier than the second. I expect that some passengers will dress up because they interpreted the dress code as "you should dress up." They will look around the MDR and see how many people did not dress up for the gala night, and say "look at that, I didn't have to dress up after all."

[3rdGenCunarder]

If they have truly waved the white flag then why not end it instead of a wishy washy policy?

 

If it walks like a chicken and it clucks like a chicken...

 

HAL is afraid to admit they're going formal optional. I suspect they'll look at what people choose to wear to dinner when there's no dress code (or what little there is isn't being enforced) and maybe refine the wording to fit what really happens.

 

What bothers me (and I suspect this is your main complaint, too) is not that they're going casual. It's the pretense that they aren't.

[cruz chic]

Saying you can always go to a specialty restaurant or eat in the buffet if you don't want to dress up "doesn't sweeten the pot" either does it?

 

I fully understand that some think their experience (ambiance) has been "eroded". I do not understand why some think that justifies controlling someone else's behavior.

 

Who is doing that? I want an end to the formal policy. Perhaps a review of my posts would help.

[cruz chic]

If it walks like a chicken and it clucks like a chicken...

 

HAL is afraid to admit they're going formal optional. I suspect they'll look at what people choose to wear to dinner when there's no dress code (or what little there is isn't being enforced) and maybe refine the wording to fit what really happens.

 

What bothers me (and I suspect this is your main complaint, too) is not that they're going casual. It's the pretense that they aren't.

 

Exactly.