Formal Dining Dress Code Enforcement - Lack Thereof

[Beardface]

I suppose this debate is more fun than all the old fights we used to have about the ethics of using rum runners. :D

 

Now that you mention it, they do allow us to bring in water bottles, right?

 

:eek:

[poncho1973]

I see. My mistake then. I didn't realize that anything other than, "like you'd look at any normal middle-class sit-down restaurant," would be a weird extreme. :rolleyes:

 

Have you ever been to such a place? I simply added the middle-class sit-down qualifier because there is always some joker who'd say "Well, I can go to the hot dog cart at Home Depot in my bikini!" or "I can hit the drive-thru at McDonald's in my boxers and a t-shirt if I want!"

 

I'd say the dress code at your average Olive Garden, Chili's, or Outback Steakhouse is even a lot more lax than my personal feelings on what's appropriate. However, I'm inclined to believe as long as you wear real clothes most folks will just focus on themselves and their tablemates.

 

That said, if I ever see that old lady wearing the full peacock ball gown again... I will laugh heartily. That was amaze-balls.

[rjrpar]

Ok, time for me to stir the pot a little and vent also. I see a lot of folks in this forum who've been cruising for years so I'd like to see what they have to say about it.

 

Last year I went on my very first cruise. Took the Radiance OTS to Alaska. This was my first cruise, so I didn't know what to expect. Needless to say I enjoyed it immensely. The only fly in the ointment (actually more like a hornet) was what is referred to as "Formal" night in the dining room. I was part of a extended family group, of which included my sister-in-law and her husband, who are experienced cruisers. When she informed me of the dress requirements for dinner on these nights I was extremely upset. I feel that I'm on a vacation, not a business trip. After raising several levels of hell (and my blood pressure) over it, I relented and packed my suit along with a couple dress shirts and tie. :(

 

When the time came, I dutifully put on my suit, dress shoes & shirt, and a tie along with the rest of my party and walked down to the dining room. There were a lot of other folks also in their "Sunday Best". But I also saw a lot of others dressed little better than beach bums who were also allowed to enter and be seated. Needless to say I was about to come unglued! I felt like I'd been played for a fool!:mad: I guess the staff didn't have the gonads to say anything to these folks.

 

If anyone from RCCL management (current or former)monitors this forum, I'd love to hear what they have to say!

 

 

You were played for a fool by whoever told you any Alaskan cruise is anywhere near formal. It is not a staff issue, the dress code is a recommendation.

[peteukmcr]

Just for the record, my Tux with choice of vests and ties will be going with me on our upcoming Southern Caribbean sailing where I hope it's warmer than currently here at home. I've never found the Caribbean too hot for wearing a tux as the dining venues are air-conditioned.

[Paul65]

Have you ever been to such a place? I simply added the middle-class sit-down qualifier because there is always some joker who'd say "Well, I can go to the hot dog cart at Home Depot in my bikini!" or "I can hit the drive-thru at McDonald's in my boxers and a t-shirt if I want!"

 

I'd say the dress code at your average Olive Garden, Chili's, or Outback Steakhouse is even a lot more lax than my personal feelings on what's appropriate. However, I'm inclined to believe as long as you wear real clothes most folks will just focus on themselves and their tablemates.

 

That said, if I ever see that old lady wearing the full peacock ball gown again... I will laugh heartily. That was amaze-balls.

 

I was just trying to point out how hypocritical you come across, by labeling those who think differently than you in your judgmental categories, then following that up the way you did. Seems it was lost on you, though. So, you can just keep on saying such stuff, safe in the knowledge that you're much better than all those other people. :cool:

[alfaeric]

I was just trying to point out how hypocritical you come across, by labeling those who think differently than you in your judgmental categories, then following that up the way you did. Seems it was lost on you, though. So, you can just keep on saying such stuff, safe in the knowledge that you're much better than all those other people. :cool:

 

For the record, your point was not lost just on him. I surely don't see what was posted as being hypocritical.

 

The idea was one step above "no shoes, no shirt, no service" level that is a food safety thing more than anything else.

 

Can you explain better how that is hypocritical? Or, moreso, is an example of someone feeling that they are superior than anyone else? Strong statement, seem to me.

[Brigbound]

Thread starts off as about the MDR Formal Night attire, and turns into a debate about tipping

 

 

 

if this isn't one of the most Cruise Critic discussions, I don't know what is.

 

 

 

That said, who cares how people dress in the MDR. Unless their hygiene is putting your health at risk, who cares. Cruising, much like flying, isn't the get dressed up formal event it used to be. Society has changed.

 

 

 

As for tipping, if you don't tip, you are the problem. The employees on the ships make pennies for what they do and they do rely on tips to make a living. That said, the industry would be much better off eliminating tips, increasing the base salaries for their employees and increasing the base fares for all passengers to cover what would be included with the tips.

 

 

Well, I don't mind abiding by the 'code' and tipping as appropriate..... We drop off our 4 preteens at the Solarium so we can have a romantic meal in the MDR; plus, they hold the lounges for us instead of just leaving a book there like those ghastly, inconsiderate chair hogs!

 

That about covers it. [emoji12]

[alfaeric]

Well, I don't mind abiding by the 'code' and tipping as appropriate..... We drop off our 4 preteens at the Solarium so we can have a romantic meal in the MDR; plus, they hold the lounges for us instead of just leaving a book there like those ghastly, inconsiderate chair hogs!

 

That about covers it. [emoji12]

 

Of course, you do mean that you leave them there overnight, well past the curfew to make sure you have your noon chairs the next day.

 

Then again, it's nice of you to do that before dinner than before desert. ;):p

[Paul65]

For the record, your point was not lost just on him. I surely don't see what was posted as being hypocritical.

 

The idea was one step above "no shoes, no shirt, no service" level that is a food safety thing more than anything else.

 

Can you explain better how that is hypocritical? Or, moreso, is an example of someone feeling that they are superior than anyone else? Strong statement, seem to me.

 

Perhaps you can explain to me why his contention that the dress should be equivalent to a "middle-class, sit-down restaurant" is perfectly fine, but someone who suggests the dress should be in line with the establishment's published guidelines is worthy of ridicule. That's what comes across to me as a somewhat hypocritical double-standard, but perhaps you can explain how it is not.

 

The feeling of superiority is implied by the fact that he started by categorizing those who disagree with him with insulting descriptions. (Perhaps you didn't see it that way, because you don't find the use of terms like crazed hillbillies or geriatric prom as meant to be insulting, but I'm only trying to speculate there.)

[poncho1973]

Today I Learned:

 

Not caring what people other than myself wear, as long as they are wearing real clothes permitted in dining establishments, makes me an elitist hypocrite in the eyes of our dear pal Paul65. Hahaha.

[Paul65]

Today I Learned:

 

Not caring what people other than myself wear, as long as they are wearing real clothes permitted in dining establishments, makes me an elitist hypocrite in the eyes of our dear pal Paul65. Hahaha.

 

Not quite what I said. You started with a string of insults against people who think differently than you. That was what made it, in my opinion, come off as hypocritical. Personally, I think your opinion on what is appropriate is reasonable. I also think the opinion that one should follow the establishment's guidelines is reasonable. On matters of opinion, thinking yours is the right opinion and someone else's is worthy of ridicule is what comes across as hypocritical (I didn't say anything about elitist).

Edited January 11, 2016 by Paul65

[KansasK]

*There are people on these forums who swear that 99% of people on cruises want to dress in complete tuxedos and ball gowns, but are intimidated by crazed hillbillies into not doing so.

*There are some that insist that full formal wear is MANDATORY and anyone not following it should eat in the WJ.

*There are some that say formal when they mean business casual and don't understand the difference.

*There are some that learned what they THINK cruise ship dining means by watching the movie Titanic and don't know that in the last 100 years fashion has changed.

*There are a lot of people who view formal night as some sort of Geriatric Prom® right of passage that MUST be shared by everyone.

 

My guess is that the in-laws fall into one of the above groups.

 

 

 

 

Then there are the rest of us that don't care what you wear as long as it is clean and you look like you'd look at any normal middle-class sit-down restaurant back home.

 

I take exception to the "Geriatric Prom" comment. I have been happily retired for a year and don't feel at all geriatric. The last prom I went to was 47 years ago, and styles have changed. I dress up more than at the "normal middle-class sit-down restaurant back home", which tend to be super casual, and feel comfortable and happy with what I am wearing. I don't care what you wear any night in the dining room as long as it looks clean and does not look like you wore it on the excursion you were on.

[Lanzalady]

It strikes me as odd that you claim that you immediately remove all gratuities once you board the ship in anticipation of bad service. If you have cruised as often as your signature states, which I do not doubt, and you've had problems in the past w/ poor service often enough to develop this type of reponse to tipping, then it may be a situation that you expect way more than possible and/or even deserve. No one is forcing you to tip anyone. One can always remove the gratuities if they felt they received bad service. But removing upfront indicates to me that you just don't want to tip.

 

Tipping is and has been always about quality service. If I don't receive it, I deal with it then, but not upfront. But each to their own.

 

My best to you on all of your future cruises!

 

I know that tipping is almost an obsession for Americans but here in Europe tipping is not obligatory and is considered as a recognition of service over and above the basic. I usually leave a tip if I have enjoyed a meal and feel that I have been treated well and yet may not leave one if I feel that the service has been lacking. I have paid for my meal, which often includes a service charge and so a tip is an extra and not an obligation. I do not go into a restaurant expecting to receive bad service and find that I very rarely receive it. Waiting staff in Europe know that their tips will depend on the service that they have given to their clients and therefore tend to act in a professional manner. If you don't expect your waiting staff to work in a professional way, then they probably won't. Waiting staff should not expect to get something for nothing - they need to earn it!

[alfaeric]

Perhaps you can explain to me why his contention that the dress should be equivalent to a "middle-class, sit-down restaurant" is perfectly fine, but someone who suggests the dress should be in line with the establishment's published guidelines is worthy of ridicule. That's what comes across to me as a somewhat hypocritical double-standard, but perhaps you can explain how it is not.

 

The feeling of superiority is implied by the fact that he started by categorizing those who disagree with him with insulting descriptions. (Perhaps you didn't see it that way, because you don't find the use of terms like crazed hillbillies or geriatric prom as meant to be insulting, but I'm only trying to speculate there.)

 

You and I must be reading something very different. I saw someone who basically explained the various versions of what people complain about here- and all of the various versions of what people have issues with.

 

Yes, there's ridicule- of the various posters who complain about the dress code. And the various versions of those complaints. Big deal. Many posters ridicule people who complain, too. As you are by complaining about the posts.

 

I think you should replace the word speculate with ASSUME. And I'm sure you know what that means.

[alfaeric]

Today I Learned:

 

Not caring what people other than myself wear, as long as they are wearing real clothes permitted in dining establishments, makes me an elitist hypocrite in the eyes of our dear pal Paul65. Hahaha.

 

Lesson 2- don't attempt to summarize what people have complained about in a humorous manner. Nobody seems to realize subjects are complained about so much that there should be a single, sticky thread for the 1000's of posts complaining about too dress and not dressed enough. And all of the descriptions of said level of dress.

[Paul65]

You and I must be reading something very different. I saw someone who basically explained the various versions of what people complain about here- and all of the various versions of what people have issues with.

 

Yes, there's ridicule- of the various posters who complain about the dress code. And the various versions of those complaints. Big deal. Many posters ridicule people who complain, too. As you are by complaining about the posts.

 

I think you should replace the word speculate with ASSUME. And I'm sure you know what that means.

 

I get it. You think it's all fun and games to ridicule people, as long as it's the "other" kind of people...and not your kind of people...being ridiculed. Fair enough. I still see that as hypocritical, but obviously, not everyone is going to agree with me. I was basically advocating for having your own opinion, without having to ridicule someone else, but I give up and will move on.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Paul65

[MustBCruzn]

**sigh** For a moment I thought I was on the Celebrity board. ;)

[Midwestgal]

It's probally the last time the OP comes here to CC as all this mean banter surely makes this place look bad. I will never understand why people need to be rude and ignorant to each other on this site. I don't want to take away from all the very nice and helpful people here as here are many .

 

I understand what the OP was sayin in that they packed the way they did because they thought there was a strict dress code for the MDR. I think the SIL was not clear in their discription of what the dress code was.

I think for the most part people dress decent with some more dressy than others.

Edited January 12, 2016 by Midwestgal

[doones2]

Having been on twenty-six cruises, I have never been able to understand why some folks concern themselves with what others choose to wear. What others wear has no impact on the enjoyment of my cruise whatsoever. I am too busy relaxing, and enjoying my meal and me darling wife's company. And for those who concern themselves with such things, I have never worn a hat or wife beater shirt to the MDR nor have I worn shorts or t-shirts to dinner. On the so called formal nights, I choose to wear a shirt with tie, dark slacks, a jacket and shined shoes, but it is my choice.

 

I totally agree with you. I use to bring long dresses for me and suits for hubby. Not anymore. I dont get the people who post how the folks sitting next to them at dinner were not dressed properly and it ruined their dinner. We have met all kinds of people on board a cruise and we are all there for the same reasons. To relax and enjoy ourselves. Hats off to the people who still dress to the nines for dinner. You all look wonderful. Its just not our thing anymore.

[Paul65]

I dont get the people who post how the folks sitting next to them at dinner were not dressed properly and it ruined their dinner.

 

That's because those people don't really exist, or are at least extremely rare. It's part of the game. Someone says they don't like the fact that people ignore the attire guidelines, and it gets turned into them claiming it "ruined their dinner." I hesitate to say never, but such comments rarely if ever occur, but are frequently claimed to have occurred.

[IndyKid]

It's probally the last time the OP comes here to CC as all this mean banter surely makes this place look bad. I will never understand why people need to be rude and ignorant to each other on this site. I don't want to take away from all the very nice and helpful people here as here are many .

 

I understand what the OP was sayin in that they packed the way they did because they thought there was a strict dress code for the MDR. I think the SIL was not clear in their discription of what the dress code was.

I think for the most part people dress decent with some more dressy than others.

 

Thank You for your gracious reply, you're 1 of few who "gets" what I was trying to say. I will continue to browse and post to CC, I'm not going to let the lack of decorum by a few folks deter me!:)

 

Perhaps my sister-in-law was basing what she told me by what she had experienced on previous tropical cruises, and Alaska is more laid back?

 

My whole point of the my original post was that if you're going to have a dress code, then enforce it. If not, then get rid of it and just say it's smart-casual.

 

To those who said I let it "ruin" my dinner, that was not the case.

 

To the gentleman from Germany who warned me this was a hot-button issue, you weren't kidding!

 

I guess I'm over it as far as this issue is concerned. Now, what's all this fuss about tipping....:D

[LMaxwell]

 

My whole point of the my original post was that if you're going to have a dress code, then enforce it. If not, then get rid of it and just say it's smart-casual.

 

 

I understood your point quite clearly. that is why I suggested to view it as a theme night, like other theme nights; participation is optional. It is not a rigid dress code and the maitre d's are not fashion police.

 

I can understand why you thought it was more rigid than it actually is. The reality is EVERY night is an opportunity to dress up; people just have to choose to do so. Most require prompting from a daily news letter though.

[Biker19]

To the gentleman from Germany who warned me this was a hot-button issue, you weren't kidding!

 

I guess I'm over it as far as this issue is concerned. Now, what's all this fuss about tipping....:D

 

Welcome to Cruise Critic - this is par for the course. If you treat these threads more like a scripted reality show than real reality, you'll be much better off.:cool:

[sparks1093]

Ah, yes, there is always this amusing point made in one of these threads, insulting a bunch of other folks, then taking the stance that you don't care what anyone else wears, as long as it meets your criteria of what is appropriate.

 

I don't care what other people wear, but it's not up to me to enforce the establishment's code/guidelines or whatever. If they chose to allow someone in that doesn't meet "code" my only response (if it truly bothers me) is to not use that establishment any longer.

[poncho1973]

That's because those people don't really exist, or are at least extremely rare. It's part of the game. Someone says they don't like the fact that people ignore the attire guidelines, and it gets turned into them claiming it "ruined their dinner." I hesitate to say never, but such comments rarely if ever occur, but are frequently claimed to have occurred.

 

It's not extremely rare. The person who ranted (and the thread is linked in my sig) about hairy legs putting them off the feed is a bit extreme and rare, but regularly posters complain to a high level about the clothing choices of others ruining their experience.

 

Message boards do tend to be a bit hyperbolic in nature and people tend to use absolutes to make their point of view seem more valid. This lends itself to my statement that many threads do, in fact, get to the point of people claiming their dinner was ruined or it was the worst meal ever.

 

 

The point I was originally making was based on those. The world is ending! The sky is falling! It was a micro-view of how I view the posts of most of the folks who get worked up over what others are wearing.