Formal Dining Dress Code Enforcement - Lack Thereof

[The Viking]

We really enjoy the formal evenings and dress in tux and nice evening dress.

 

It gives a very special atmosphere in the dining room and around the ship.

[tbill]

My 2 cents

 

1. Dress code/suggestion... I feel it should be up to the passenger as to what they would like to wear (including shorts if the want to). What difference do clothes make?? To me, none at all!

 

2. Tipping... I resent it whenever anybody has the nerve to tell me when and how much I need to tip. I am totally against auto tipping and remove it immediately upon boarding. It is up to me to determine whom and how much I will tip based on service provided! No!, that doesn't mean I'm cheap and don't tip, but I will adjust my tips according to service provided, which is my right and everyone else's too! It is not my fault that the cruise lines refuse to pay fair wages to their employees but I am not responsible to make up for that. Tipping is and always has been an option... based on service provided.

Edited January 11, 2016 by tbill

[Goodtime Cruizin]

My 2 cents

 

1. Dress code/suggestion... I feel it should be up to the passenger as to what they would like to wear (including shorts if the want to). What difference do clothes make?? To me, none at all!

 

2. Tipping... I resent it whenever anybody has the nerve to tell me when and how much I need to tip. I am totally against auto tipping and remove it immediately upon boarding. It is up to me to determine whom and how much I will tip based on service provided! No!, that doesn't mean I'm cheap and don't tip, but I will adjust my tips according to service provided, which is my right and everyone else's too! It is not my fault that the cruise lines refuse to pay fair wages to their employees but I am not responsible to make up for that. Tipping is and always has been an option... based on service provided.

 

Well resent it all you want, but you've supported the cruiseline industry by sailing on over 25 cruises so yes you indeed are part of the problem not the solution when it comes to tipping. The auto tipping is in play because there are too many people that would walk away from tipping at all.

 

Wowza.

[Paul65]

OP - I think you take this far too seriously. I am one who thinks that, if people want to dining in the MDR, they should try to follow the dress code, whether you think of it as a requirement or a suggestion. It just seems the polite thing to do.

 

That said, the fact that some people choose not to do so really doesn't get me upset, and I don't really think it's appropriate to expect the dining room staff to have to be enforcers. Sorry that you were "extremely upset" that your sister-in-law expected you to dress up for dinner, and were upset again when you realized it wasn't an absolute requirement. My only suggestion is to get over it and move on.

[cruisinfanatic]

My 2 cents

 

1. Dress code/suggestion... I feel it should be up to the passenger as to what they would like to wear (including shorts if the want to). What difference do clothes make?? To me, none at all!

 

2. Tipping... I resent it whenever anybody has the nerve to tell me when and how much I need to tip. I am totally against auto tipping and remove it immediately upon boarding. It is up to me to determine whom and how much I will tip based on service provided! No!, that doesn't mean I'm cheap and don't tip, but I will adjust my tips according to service provided, which is my right and everyone else's too! It is not my fault that the cruise lines refuse to pay fair wages to their employees but I am not responsible to make up for that. Tipping is and always has been an option... based on service provided.

I hear you and don't much like auto tipping either. I do leave it alone though as there are people that you never see that also rely on tips.

As far as your statement that the cruiselines refuse to pay their employees a fair wage you should ask any server in this country what they depend on to get paid. It's not their employer.

[grandgeezer]

I hear you and don't much like auto tipping either. I do leave it alone though as there are people that you never see that also rely on tips.

As far as your statement that the cruiselines refuse to pay their employees a fair wage you should ask any server in this country what they depend on to get paid. It's not their employer.

 

They rely on tips, but they get a whole lot more money, for a whole lot less work from their employer.

[WrittenOnYourHeart]

We sailed Radiance in Alaska a couple years ago, and we found that for that sailing, guests were MUCH less likely to dress formally than on our previous warm-weather sailings.

 

I concluded that it had much to do with the itinerary. Alaska sailings seemed to us to be much more about the scenery and the ports than shipboard life. That was certainly the case for us. Also, people need to bring warmer clothes, leaving less room for formal wear.

 

Just my observation.

 

Exactly. The two Alaska cruises I've gone on have been with a running group, and the escort who goes with us always indicates that Alaska is typically less formal than other itineraries. Even on Holland the majority of people didn't dress formally - and we certainly didn't stay dressed like that for the evening. If we had dressed up at all, after dinner it was to the cabins to change into comfy clothes before heading to our group hang out.

[tbill]

I am not the part of any problem. Nor is it my problem if others tip or not. I will continue and be happy with my current practice when it comes to tipping. I will not be forced and I will not tip for poor service.

 

 

Well resent it all you want, but you've supported the cruiseline industry by sailing on over 25 cruises so yes you indeed are part of the problem not the solution when it comes to tipping. The auto tipping is in play because there are too many people that would walk away from tipping at all.

 

Wowza.

[LMaxwell]

Formal night is now no longer in existence on NCL, Carnival, Celebrity, or Holland America.

 

That leaves Princess and RCI as the hold outs, and RCI is on the fence currently.

 

RCI will have 4 ships in 2016 that do not have any set formal nights (Quantum, Anthem, Ovation, and Empress).

 

RCI has lots of rooms to fill; so they're going to let paying customers have an experience that matches what the guest wants.

 

On the flip side of the coin, when RCI brings back the food, service, events, and caliber of entertainment of "yesteryear" maybe they will have some leverage to get people to participate. It's already optional and unless you want a portrait photo made in formal wear, don't see any reason or occasion worth bothering for.

[Goodtime Cruizin]

I am not the part of any problem. Nor is it my problem if others tip or not. I will continue and be happy with my current practice when it comes to tipping. I will not be forced and I will not tip for poor service.

 

It strikes me as odd that you claim that you immediately remove all gratuities once you board the ship in anticipation of bad service. If you have cruised as often as your signature states, which I do not doubt, and you've had problems in the past w/ poor service often enough to develop this type of reponse to tipping, then it may be a situation that you expect way more than possible and/or even deserve. No one is forcing you to tip anyone. One can always remove the gratuities if they felt they received bad service. But removing upfront indicates to me that you just don't want to tip.

 

Tipping is and has been always about quality service. If I don't receive it, I deal with it then, but not upfront. But each to their own.

 

My best to you on all of your future cruises!

[tbill]

LOL! This is actually amusing. Now you have an opinion on what I may or may not expect or deserve. I don't "expect" anything regarding service, I simply go by what actually happens on the cruise. You are correct, no one is going to force me to tip anyone. That is in fact what they try to do by automatically adding tips. I remove them ( and will continue to do so) at the start of the cruise and then I actually personally hand tips to the people that I would like to tip for services rendered. I give them cash, and most times I give more than the cruise line charged me in the first place. if service was bad or if there was not any service provided at all (i.e. never saw a maiter'd until right before tip time when they make sure they make their presence known) I adjust accordingly. Just because it is not your way does not mean that my way is wrong. ... and yes, my signature is correct in the # of cruises we have taken. For years I worked for a travel agent hosting group cruises. There are actually more, but I only list the cruises that I took with my family. Why even make a comment like that?

 

 

It strikes me as odd that you claim that you immediately remove all gratuities once you board the ship in anticipation of bad service. If you have cruised as often as your signature states, which I do not doubt, and you've had problems in the past w/ poor service often enough to develop this type of reponse to tipping, then it may be a situation that you expect way more than possible and/or even deserve. No one is forcing you to tip anyone. One can always remove the gratuities if they felt they received bad service. But removing upfront indicates to me that you just don't want to tip.

 

Tipping is and has been always about quality service. If I don't receive it, I deal with it then, but not upfront. But each to their own.

 

My best to you on all of your future cruises!

[Beardface]

Thread starts off as about the MDR Formal Night attire, and turns into a debate about tipping

 

if this isn't one of the most Cruise Critic discussions, I don't know what is.

 

That said, who cares how people dress in the MDR. Unless their hygiene is putting your health at risk, who cares. Cruising, much like flying, isn't the get dressed up formal event it used to be. Society has changed.

 

As for tipping, if you don't tip, you are the problem. The employees on the ships make pennies for what they do and they do rely on tips to make a living. That said, the industry would be much better off eliminating tips, increasing the base salaries for their employees and increasing the base fares for all passengers to cover what would be included with the tips.

[tbill]

OMG! Who said I don't tip??? Read the post. I tip after services are rendered, NOT BEFORE, and I tip what I deem appropriate, not what the cruise line demands I tip. Gosh, how insulting. Read the post.

 

 

 

Thread starts off as about the MDR Formal Night attire, and turns into a debate about tipping

 

if this isn't one of the most Cruise Critic discussions, I don't know what is.

 

That said, who cares how people dress in the MDR. Unless their hygiene is putting your health at risk, who cares. Cruising, much like flying, isn't the get dressed up formal event it used to be. Society has changed.

 

As for tipping, if you don't tip, you are the problem. The employees on the ships make pennies for what they do and they do rely on tips to make a living. That said, the industry would be much better off eliminating tips, increasing the base salaries for their employees and increasing the base fares for all passengers to cover what would be included with the tips.

[sparks1093]

I see very few these days

 

Yep, that's why mine is staying home. I will bring a suit though. What others wear doesn't bother me at all.

[poncho1973]

Sounds like you should be more upset with your sister in law and her husband, the "experienced" cruisers. As experienced cruisers they would have known what actually occurs on the ships.

 

*There are people on these forums who swear that 99% of people on cruises want to dress in complete tuxedos and ball gowns, but are intimidated by crazed hillbillies into not doing so.

*There are some that insist that full formal wear is MANDATORY and anyone not following it should eat in the WJ.

*There are some that say formal when they mean business casual and don't understand the difference.

*There are some that learned what they THINK cruise ship dining means by watching the movie Titanic and don't know that in the last 100 years fashion has changed.

*There are a lot of people who view formal night as some sort of Geriatric Prom® right of passage that MUST be shared by everyone.

 

My guess is that the in-laws fall into one of the above groups.

 

 

 

 

Then there are the rest of us that don't care what you wear as long as it is clean and you look like you'd look at any normal middle-class sit-down restaurant back home.

Edited January 11, 2016 by poncho1973

[LSUfan4444]

I am still young in age, but old(er) in heart. I don't like the trend in society that has been down-dressing numerous events but I understand it exists all the same. Opera, broadway style shows, dinner, etc. have all seen this over the last couple decades.

 

On formal nights I no longer wear a tux but always wear a suit with a tie. On casual (or smart casual) nights, I still wear slacks and a collared dress shirt but for the most part, we don't even go to the MDR anymore on non formal nights because of this very issue. As cruises have changed so much the last 30 years and the quality has changed, the clientele and their expectations has changed along with it. The dining room isn't what it once was, and as much as I want it to be, I won't pretend it is something it isn't.

 

I don't mind dressing up and neither does my family but I stopped dragging them from the pool at 4:30 so we can be dressed as we feel appropriate for dinner when so many others don't value it the same way we do. In turn, now we just stay by the pool, do more activities, eat at the buffet and spend less time "getting ready" for dinners we wished were more than what they have become.

[Paul65]

Then there are the rest of us that don't care what you wear as long as . . .

 

Ah, yes, there is always this amusing point made in one of these threads, insulting a bunch of other folks, then taking the stance that you don't care what anyone else wears, as long as it meets your criteria of what is appropriate.

[Emdee]

More cruise lines should be country club casual like a few already are.

[GateGuardian]

Sounds like you should be more upset with your sister in law and her husband, the "experienced" cruisers. As experienced cruisers they would have known what actually occurs on the ships.

 

+1

 

Cruise policies/standards change all the time. If your relatives were real "experienced" cruisers, they would have seen this thread by now and be giving you a call :)

[Beardface]

+1

 

Cruise policies/standards change all the time. If your relatives were real "experienced" cruisers, they would have seen this thread by now and be giving you a call :)

 

No, if they really were "experienced" cruisers, they'd have already emailed Michael Bayley and Richard Fain and been on here complaining about the lack of a reply.

 

:cool:

[poncho1973]

Ah, yes, there is always this amusing point made in one of these threads, insulting a bunch of other folks, then taking the stance that you don't care what anyone else wears, as long as it meets your criteria of what is appropriate.

 

Which is a very basic line that you are warping. There is always a line and you've been on this planet long enough to know that. I hope you know that.

 

The cruise line says no beach attire in the dining. Not a suggestion. Not a guideline. A firm line.

 

You aren't allowed to show up nude or in your underwear. Not a suggestion. Not a guideline. A firm line. No shirt, no shoes, no service is typical on land and on a ship.

 

There is no firm line drawn on dirty or smelly clothes, however, I'm pretty sure that someone who was offensive or revolting in dress would be easy to get removed from a restaurant or dining room.

 

 

 

I think these repeated threads show that the majority of people don't bother worrying about what others are wearing as long as the person doesn't go to some weird extreme.

 

There are many things in life that only have very basic lines. You can't go to a buffet on land or on a ship... walk up to the rolls, take a roll, walk over to a trash can & pitch it, walk back up to the rolls, take another roll, walk over to the trash can & pitch it, on & on a dozen times. At least without getting kicked out or yelled at by the staff. HOWEVER, there isn't a limit on how many rolls you can go up and get provided you are following the basic line. The unlimited drink package still can be cut off if you are over the basic line of drunkenness or foul behavior. HOWEVER, no one is saying "Oh Paul65... you've had 8 fruity umbrella drinks today, you abuser!" unless you cross one of those lines.

 

Even with your closest friends. They can make fun of your bad haircut or your parking job or your luck with the ladies or your ugly sweater or your whatever, but there is a basic line that says making fun of your mother who died of cancer is a friendship ender. No matter how many times you guys laugh together and say that you can tease each other about anything. There is always a basic line.

 

Don't play the "unless they follow your rules" line because there is always some line.

Edited January 11, 2016 by poncho1973

[Paul65]

I think these repeated threads show that the majority of people don't bother worrying about what others are wearing as long as the person doesn't go to some weird extreme.

 

I see. My mistake then. I didn't realize that anything other than, "like you'd look at any normal middle-class sit-down restaurant," would be a weird extreme. :rolleyes:

[tiggeril]

I suppose this debate is more fun than all the old fights we used to have about the ethics of using rum runners. :D

[TravelerThom]

...Last year I went on my very first cruise. Took the Radiance OTS to Alaska. This was my first cruise, so I didn't know what to expect. Needless to say I enjoyed it immensely. The only fly in the ointment (actually more like a hornet) was what is referred to as "Formal" night in the dining room. I was part of a extended family group, of which included my sister-in-law and her husband, who are experienced cruisers. When she informed me of the dress requirements for dinner on these nights I was extremely upset. I feel that I'm on a vacation, not a business trip. After raising several levels of hell (and my blood pressure) over it, I relented and packed my suit along with a couple dress shirts and tie. :(

 

When the time came, I dutifully put on my suit, dress shoes & shirt, and a tie along with the rest of my party and walked down to the dining room. There were a lot of other folks also in their "Sunday Best". But I also saw a lot of others dressed little better than beach bums who were also allowed to enter and be seated. Needless to say I was about to come unglued! I felt like I'd been played for a fool!:mad: I guess the staff didn't have the gonads to say anything to these folks...

Your "experienced cruiser" sister-in-law is the one who played you for a fool, not the cruise line with their SUGGESTION of what to wear on formal night.

So, did YOU have the gonads to say anything to your sister-in-law?:confused:

[mcd2745]

We sailed Radiance in Alaska a couple years ago, and we found that for that sailing, guests were MUCH less likely to dress formally than on our previous warm-weather sailings.

 

I concluded that it had much to do with the itinerary. Alaska sailings seemed to us to be much more about the scenery and the ports than shipboard life. That was certainly the case for us. Also, people need to bring warmer clothes, leaving less room for formal wear.

 

Just my observation.

 

Exactly. The two Alaska cruises I've gone on have been with a running group, and the escort who goes with us always indicates that Alaska is typically less formal than other itineraries. Even on Holland the majority of people didn't dress formally - and we certainly didn't stay dressed like that for the evening. If we had dressed up at all, after dinner it was to the cabins to change into comfy clothes before heading to our group hang out.

 

 

This surprises me. Granted, we have only done Caribbean cruises (though Alaska is definitely on the "bucket list", if you will). However, it seems to me that cooler-weather itineraries would better lend themselves to a more formal evening/dining atmosphere. The Caribbean just screams out "casual" or "laid-back". Suits/tuxes and 85-degree weather just don't go well together.

Edited January 11, 2016 by mcd2745