Are we buying "a pig in a poke"?

[TeeRick]

Ok good to know. That date is more than 6 months from final payment for most people who already booked. Plenty of time to cancel the Pig In The Poke cruise if they don't like what is offered.

[PatC]

It's more like two years in advance. So they do the initial reveal in March, I booked in April, Eden reveal in June, and then...nothing, and then...nothing. It's now mid-January. Still nothing new. (Meeting space reveal means nothing to anyone already booked) Additional positive reinforcement every few months for booked passengers would be really reassuring. Lack of ANY more details - doesn't have to be everything - is really frustrating!

Agree. At LEAST dining venues. This is frustrating. Yes it's a new build with new innovations but come on. Nothing since the conference rooms?

[PatC]

i really hope half the ship is not Eden inspired. in all honesty, if they're marketing to my husband and i's age group (we're 33) I won't have much interest in Eden-inspired everything. I think the Eden concept is a little strange (but all cruise ships have their own interesting spaces that some may enjoy but I find strange) and a luxury experience is important to me. celebrity has been my favorite line since I was 16, and I sailed when cruising was still quite traditional. I know times are changing but it's dangerous to stray too far from the ideals of their larger customer base. I am hoping they revealed those spaces first in an attempt to appeal to my group (if they think that's what we want :rolleyes:), but then still have their usual offerings to cater to their regulars. it only makes sense, because they last thing they want to do is alienate their loyal customers.

 

WELL SAID. That has been the point I have tried to make. New is good, innovative is better but don't cut off the hand that fed you, so to speak. Waiting to see.

[CruisingTheWaves]

Considering the high prices being listed for Edge, Azamara is starting to look more appealing.

 

i have confidence that once the hype and newness of these ships wears off, prices will come back down because there won't be so much mystery and excitement. i got great deals on solstice on her 3rd cruise when they launched S-class, but it was almost like it was a secret. i didn't feel that many people knew about it (i had been a loyal M-class cruiser), and i'll tell you my first cruise on solstice and eclipse certainly didn't feel as jammed packed with passengers as my last reflection sailing did, and that only indicates that those ships probably weren't full. cruising has been marketed to the masses since then, and celebrity's S-class was hugely popular and the most modern ships at sea. all those who "jumped ship" from other lines to experience what all the fuss was about loved it, and are now waiting for edge. that's A LOT OF PEOPLE. celebrity definitely took advantage of that and is really hyping up edge. this ship is no secret (besides what they're still hiding) so they're hiking costs because they can. i am anticipating a fair amount of cancellations before final payments, and then there might be some leeway for last minute bookers if they want to fill ships. the first ship in a new class is ALWAYS an experiment. they made several changes on sister ships in the S-class when they saw what was popular and what was not. i think celebrity saw a demand for suite-based perks, so they're making changes for that. but if it hurts them, i don't doubt they will make more changes on edge's sister ships. a new class is always a trial of new concepts. it's just the way the cookie crumbles.

[Lastdance]

I think the proof will be in the pudding and the postings when the very first cruise sails. I am anxiously awaiting to hear what the first passengers have to say, before I depart on the first TA. Yes, I did book a suite the very first hour, but IMHO, it will not always be this way in the future, nor was it several years ago. But I must confess, I do enjoy suite life on Celebrity; my DH could care less...however, we all do need more reveals to keep up our interest...and hopefully, most of us will enjoy the cruise and share wonderful experiences!

 

I am hoping for "no pig in the poke!"

Edited January 27, 2018 by Lastdance
My glass is half full!

[floridatravelersforlife]

We are taking a baby step with one of those short cruises on the Edge this December. We have been on a number of pig on poke cruises over the last 20 years where expectations were not met. For us the discriminator will be service, food and ambiance. Decor will be interesting to us. From what we can see some of it reminds us of mid century modern.

[C-Dragons]

The last notable ship of the 20th century built with "class system" was QE2 ocean liner (1969).

 

The first cruise ship with class system built since then is MSC Fantasia (2008)

 

When a passengers cruise fare includes access to exclusive areas of a ship, there is in essence, a “class system”. Speaking from personal experience, having sailed on the QM2 in 2005 in a Princess' Grill Suite, Cunard's “class system” was definitely evident.

[jsea]

I would humbly argue that there is not a fine line between "suite perks" and "class division".

 

While NCL, MSC and Celebrity offer venues which are reserved for suite class guests only, so do many other lines. What varies is the degree to which these venues are isolated from other areas of the ship, the number of venues and the services provided within.

[jsea]

The line does exist.

You can touch it physcally when you are on select NCL and MSC ships.

You'll see locked gates.

You won't find locked gates anywhere on Cunard and (so far!) Celebrity ships.

 

I will start a new thread for this specific topic so that it does not sparkle in different threads over and over.

I look forward to a spirited discussion on the new thread!

 

Is a staff member manning the entrance to prime theater seats for suite class guests with a velvet rope not a "locked gate"? Is a private suite class sun deck where credentials are checked not a "locked gate"? Is a set of doors with a concierge waiting immediately behind to turn away non-suite class guests from the suite lounge not a "locked gate"?

 

[Denny01]

Well, getting back to the ‘pig in the poke’ subject.......Those that want to know exactly what the ship looks like and to see the full layout, do wait. But be aware, many are booking now and some of us who have cruised on many of the Celebrity class ships are more than willing to ‘take a chance’ that this will be a great cruising experience.

 

If you do wait, do realize the ship is selling well. we booked three Edge cruises and an Infinity Balcony type SR, and those SRs look like they are being grabbed up. For our 24 Mar East Carribean cruise, we booked a Concierge C1 SR. I checked today and there are no C1’s left. The E1 Infinity SRs have some left. Of the 120 SRs, there are 8 left. On the 31 Mar W Carribean cruise of the 74 C1 SRs available, there are 17 left. For our E Med cruise in Aug, there are 24 of 57 C2’s left. I maybe off on the numbers a bit, but I think that should give you a cut on how popular the Edge cruises are and my subjective opinion is this means the SR costs will go up as SR availability goes down. Could be wrong, but I decided not to make that bet because i couldn’t see the specific deck layout yet.

 

Personally I plan to enjoy exploring a whole new experience. And I’ll join in on the guessing of what the current deck plans indicate. It shows a Spa Pool and appears to be an inside one. If that means it’s a saltwater pool such as the one on the M-Class, I’ll be in heaven! Hope someone has seen a video that gives more specifics on that.

 

Den

[vtcruising]

Well, getting back to the ‘pig in the poke’ subject.......Those that want to know exactly what the ship looks like and to see the full layout, do wait. But be aware, many are booking now and some of us who have cruised on many of the Celebrity class ships are more than willing to ‘take a chance’ that this will be a great cruising experience.

 

If you do wait, do realize the ship is selling well. we booked three Edge cruises and an Infinity Balcony type SR, and those SRs look like they are being grabbed up. For our 24 Mar East Carribean cruise, we booked a Concierge C1 SR. I checked today and there are no C1’s left. The E1 Infinity SRs have some left. Of the 120 SRs, there are 8 left. On the 31 Mar W Carribean cruise of the 74 C1 SRs available, there are 17 left. For our E Med cruise in Aug, there are 24 of 57 C2’s left. I maybe off on the numbers a bit, but I think that should give you a cut on how popular the Edge cruises are and my subjective opinion is this means the SR costs will go up as SR availability goes down. Could be wrong, but I decided not to make that bet because i couldn’t see the specific deck layout yet.

 

Personally I plan to enjoy exploring a whole new experience. And I’ll join in on the guessing of what the current deck plans indicate. It shows a Spa Pool and appears to be an inside one. If that means it’s a saltwater pool such as the one on the M-Class, I’ll be in heaven! Hope someone has seen a video that gives more specifics on that.

 

Den

 

I'm also glad we booked early and got a decent fare. For the preview cruises, I am ready to embrace the adventure, warts and all. For me, it will be the discovery of new things. Now my husband may not be so forgiving - he tends to have higher expectations. He has been warned that the preview cruises will have glitches and that I am going for the adventure of it. Hopefully, with some sunshine, a good book and the Premium Beverage Package, he will be happy on the Edge. ;)

 

Here is a little info from the FAQs sheet regarding the Solarium:

 

Also on the expansive Resort Deck, which stretches from bow to stern of the ship, is one of the most popular spaces on any Celebrity ship – the adults-only Solarium. Celebrity Edge continues the tradition of offering a covered pool area where adults can unwind in modern luxury style.

 

The Solarium is home to one of Celebrity’s most popular culinary offerings, The Spa Café and Juice Bar, which offers a creative take on healthy cuisine, featuring an eclectic blend of offerings that are both flavorful and healthy.

 

The three-dimensional art wall that represents the beautiful colors of sea glass and water-swept textures of the ocean is the perfect complement to the serene atmosphere where guests can restore both their tan and their peace-of-mind.

 

FAST FACTS / F E ATURES

• Solarium Total Square Footage: 3,360 sq. ft.

 

• Pool Dimensions: 40 ft. L x 30 ft. W

 

• The ultra-durable ETFE Solarium roof weighs about 1% the weight of glass, making it very lightweight

 

• The eco-friendly, 100% recyclable Solarium roof can be lit internally, creating an awe-inspiring glowing effect.

 

 

It doesn't mention whether it is salt water.

[Lastdance]

Too late. I am not impressed with the direction Celebrity is now going and no longer am looking at them first. Fortunately, there are several options available to all cruisers to find their best fit.

 

To answer the OP's question - yes, people ARE buying "a pig in a poke". Spending that much money on a cruise without knowing all the details about the ship itself is exactly that.

 

But what if you are wrong? I cancelled my inaugural due to the changed date and the fact that I am booked on the TA...booked the first hour and got a great price IMHO...you certainly cannot take the money with you or can you? Isn't it an opportunity choice, as to how you spend your own money? Just my thoughts!

[DachshundsRule]

Well, when the 3 day cruises came up, we cancelled our week-long cruise and replaced it with a mini. My frustration comes more from the lack of info on cabins. We booked a Royal Suite and the layout does not jive with the description - is there a hot tub on balcony or not? (Description says yes, floor plan says no.) That’s pretty important information when purchasing and no one seems to know? I seriously doubt it - the engineering guys know if they have installed plumbing for a hot tub or not - a fully formed ship floated out this month so why withhold that kind of information?

[C-Dragons]

Well, when the 3 day cruises came up, we cancelled our week-long cruise and replaced it with a mini. My frustration comes more from the lack of info on cabins. We booked a Royal Suite and the layout does not jive with the description - is there a hot tub on balcony or not? (Description says yes, floor plan says no.) That’s pretty important information when purchasing and no one seems to know? I seriously doubt it - the engineering guys know if they have installed plumbing for a hot tub or not - a fully formed ship floated out this month so why withhold that kind of information?

 

I have been studying the Edge stateroom descriptions and have not found anything stating that the Royal Suites will have a hot tub.

The Iconic suites have a circular hot tub, while the Villas have a “plunge pool” and the Penthouses have a hot tub similar to those on the S-class ships.

What I found interesting is in the description of the Royals they mention that the bathroom has a large “soaking tub” and a sliding panel that opens to views of the sea. Perhaps this is supposed to be an alternative to an actual hot tub on the verandah?

 

 

From Celebrity website:

“Spacious two room suites feature a large living and dining area with floor to ceiling panoramic windows that provide stunning views from every angle. The master bedroom has a king-sized bed that faces the panoramic window and overlooks the private veranda and the sea beyond.

 

The master bathroom offers a large soaking tub with a separate shower, double sink vanity, and a sliding panel that opens to views of the sea. Royal Suites are located close to the Retreat that features a private restaurant, exclusive lounge, and a private pool area complete with its own pool bar. Traveling with a large family or group of friends? We’ve got the perfect solution—connect a Royal Suite directly to one of our new Iconic Suites.”

[DachshundsRule]

Right, but under Stateroom Details in the booking process, there is this:

 

When you stay in a Royal Suite, you'll enjoy the luxury of European-style butler service. This includes assistance with unpacking and packing. In-suite lunch and dinner service. Afternoon tea. Evening hors d'oeuvres and complimentary in-suite espresso and cappuccino from Café al Bacio. Separate living room and dining area and a veranda with whirlpool and luxurious lounge seating.

[C-Dragons]

Right, but under Stateroom Details in the booking process, there is this:

 

When you stay in a Royal Suite, you'll enjoy the luxury of European-style butler service. This includes assistance with unpacking and packing. In-suite lunch and dinner service. Afternoon tea. Evening hors d'oeuvres and complimentary in-suite espresso and cappuccino from Café al Bacio. Separate living room and dining area and a veranda with whirlpool and luxurious lounge seating.

 

Yeah, that's X's world renowned website for you...

How many times have CC members found mistakes in the amenities listed under the different stateroom categories?

I finally found what you are referencing, but I believe it's a generic statement covering the current ships in the fleet and has not been updated regarding the Royals on Edge. I agree with you it would be disappointing if X is eliminating the hot tubs from the Royal Suites.

[DachshundsRule]

I agree with you, it’s likely old wording and I won’t count on a tub. That’s a heck of a way to sell a product though. I must say, the pace of the reveal seems odd to me.

[MacMarauder]

One thing to keep in mind is that the ship will cost Celebrity approximately $1 billion dollars. This is a long term investment for the company, not a quick sale. There is no way Celebrity is going to make their money back on the initial sailings or even the first few years. If their strategy was to release a substandard product but conceal as much as possible (ie "pig in a poke") just to get the first bookings that wouldn't be a very good business strategy.

[TeeRick]

One thing to keep in mind is that the ship will cost Celebrity approximately $1 billion dollars. This is a long term investment for the company, not a quick sale. There is no way Celebrity is going to make their money back on the initial sailings or even the first few years. If their strategy was to release a substandard product but conceal as much as possible (ie "pig in a poke") just to get the first bookings that wouldn't be a very good business strategy.

 

Yes you are logically correct of course. But this thread seems to be more about feelings. There is angst by some who have booked and are waiting patiently for more of the final details like dining to be revealed. Speaking for myself, I expect Edge to be a really beautiful and well equipped ship and would be shocked if it is a substandard product.

[sloopsailor]

One thing to keep in mind is that the ship will cost Celebrity approximately $1 billion dollars. This is a long term investment for the company, not a quick sale. There is no way Celebrity is going to make their money back on the initial sailings or even the first few years. If their strategy was to release a substandard product but conceal as much as possible (ie "pig in a poke") just to get the first bookings that wouldn't be a very good business strategy.

 

Yes you are logically correct of course. But this thread seems to be more about feelings. There is angst by some who have booked and are waiting patiently for more of the final details like dining to be revealed. Speaking for myself, I expect Edge to be a really beautiful and well equipped ship and would be shocked if it is a substandard product.

 

No one is expecting a substandard product. It is that we don't know what the over all atmosphere of the completed product will be yet. Considering some of the unique designs of the spaces and features we have been shown so far, there is a concern that the remainder of the product will be too "far out" for some of us. In other words, too much of a departure from what some of us long term Celebrity customers would find appealing.

 

For instance, the concept of Eden seems to be aimed at the younger demographics. The theater design we have seen so far may be heading towards the same demographic with productions with lots of flashy backdrop effects and lighting. Will these areas, and the rest of the ship, be too "over the top" for some of us? What about the restaurants? Will they be familiar venues, or be unique, one of a kind, venues with odd "trendy" items on the menu, as the promotional information for Eden dining suggests. We don't know yet. And some of us aren't ready to spend our money on a product that we don't know if we will like or not.

Edited February 9, 2018 by sloopsailor

[Denny01]

Not sure how ‘fancy wow features’ don’t add to the cruising experience; I’d think it does. Well appointed common areas and new design approaches will add to my enjoyment. I guess it depends on what ‘cruising experience’ we are looking for.

 

As to the ‘except the baloncies’ which don’t add to the inside cabin experience, the Edge inside cabins are 181sqft and the S-class are 170sqft. Not a big addition but it is an increase in area.

 

Yup, I’m trying the Infinity Veranda to see if it adds to my enjoyment of being at sea. Hope it does. But that is coming from a ‘half full view of life’ guy.

 

Den

[MacMarauder]

Yes you are logically correct of course. But this thread seems to be more about feelings. There is angst by some who have booked and are waiting patiently for more of the final details like dining to be revealed. Speaking for myself, I expect Edge to be a really beautiful and well equipped ship and would be shocked if it is a substandard product.

 

Oh yea I get that for sure, of course there is an emotional investment as well. That's the reason we get excited about new ships and visit Cruise Critic trying to find info on them! And I do think it's fair that there is concern about the direction of the ship and if it's something that will appeal to certain demographics. I have my own questions, particularly on the infinite verandas - I'm very interested to hear first hand experiences after Edge sails. My issue was with the OP asking if we are being sold a "pig in a poke", which to me is the old switcharoo - Celebrity selling us one thing and then at the last minute putting something different/worse in it's place.

 

I agree that pace of the reveal is frustrating but the the reveal, buildup and initial sailings are only a part of the larger picture for Celebrity - their main concern needs to be making sure the ship will be a success 10+ years from now.

[hcat]

I look forward to a spirited discussion on the new thread!

 

Is a staff member manning the entrance to prime theater seats for suite class guests with a velvet rope not a "locked gate"? Is a private suite class sun deck where credentials are checked not a "locked gate"? Is a set of doors with a concierge waiting immediately behind to turn away non-suite class guests from the suite lounge not a "locked gate"?

 

 

This photo reminds me of a cruise we took on Royal some years ago

( maybe Navigator) .They had a whole section of the pool deck area going up a few levels blocked off for suites and a staff person was there to check status, But when the sun was beating down, those places were empty and one assumes the suite guests took up spots below that had more shade, Sunlovers would be excluded if not in a suite..,did not really make sense to me,

 

In the theatre there was an area roped off and guarded in the theater, They never filled them and never opened them up to folks who were looking for a seat!

 

Seems better for a ship to have a private suite area so others don't feel roped out in a public area!

[TeeRick]

No one is expecting a substandard product. It is that we don't know what the over all atmosphere of the completed product will be yet. Considering some of the unique designs of the spaces and features we have been shown so far, there is a concern that the remainder of the product will be too "far out" for some of us. In other words, too much of a departure from what some of us long term Celebrity customers would find appealing.

 

For instance, the concept of Eden seems to be aimed at the younger demographics. The theater design we have seen so far may be heading towards the same demographic with productions with lots of flashy backdrop effects and lighting. Will these areas, and the rest of the ship, be too "over the top" for some of us? What about the restaurants? Will they be familiar venues, or be unique, one of a kind, venues with odd "trendy" items on the menu, as the promotional information for Eden dining suggests. We don't know yet. And some of us aren't ready to spend our money on a product that we don't know if we will like or not.

 

Yes agree. Two simple choices for most. 1) Book early and take a chance for the experience and excitement of enjoying a new ship. 2) Wait for the final reveals and the early passenger reviews before you decide to book or not. Choice 1 (if you are already booked) can be cancelled prior to the final payment date or shifted to another ship if Edge is too far off your comfort level after everything is revealed.

[Denny01]

Im not trying to sell Edge reservations, just pointing out that even when reviews come in and someone states the ship is ‘too fancy’ or ‘catering to a younger crowd’ or some description that it differs from the S-Class/M-C;ass to much, so what. I hope it does differ from the other Class’s. I’d like some variety in a Line we enjoy. And we’d have no idea if that reviewer’s taste is anything such as our own. As I said before, I’ve loved what Celebrity has done with the S-/M-Class ships so I’ll bet on the Come LIne that the E-Class is something I’ll enjoy. Could be wrong, but I’ll decide after actually experiencing it.

 

Yes, I do use overall reviews and haven’t gone on a few Lines because of the description, not of the ships themselves that much but more of the appraoch and emphasis of the Line.

 

Should be interesting, and I agree we all have the choice of booking now and maybe cnx after reviews (if that is what you’d base your decision on) or wait. But unless you are going to wait for reviews in December, and then find an available cruise and good SR, not sure that works too well.

 

Our March 14 cruise appears to only have about 20+ Standard (E-category) Infinity Verandas left and only 7 Conciearge Infinity and that cruise is over a year away. So you may be more limited on your choices of cruise dates and certainly cabin location if you wait.

 

Personally, I’m booked on 3. I’ll be ‘stuck’ with the 2nd B2B Caribbean cruise if for some reason we don’t like the ship, but I’ll bet we do. And I’ll have enough ‘faith’ in Celebrity to be able to choose my cruise and cabin location.

 

To each their own approach. I look forward to something different but still based on the approach Celebrity has shown it has catered to since it was established. And as to catering to a bit younger crowd? Since we’ve cruised on Celebrity on and off for 20 years, I’d hope they wouldn’t just ‘cater’ to me and my contemporaries or they will be out a lot of money as we slow down and sit in front of our TV’s yelling at it!

 

Den