Ventura diverted

[Josy1953]

9 hours ago, eddie11 said:

A major fault with the design of the whole fleet, it seems, is the lack of lifts.

 

P&O could help with simple changes in labelling and with a brief pep talk, perhaps at muster, on lift function and etiquette.  How many times, per cruise, do you see people pressing up and down and simply getting into the first lift to arrive?  Goodness knows how much that reduces capacity and efficiency.  I have even heard a story of someone pressing down, when they wanted to go up, with the logic that “down” would bring the lift down to them, so they could start their journey!

 

My suggestion would be that one lift in each bank should be exclusively for those relying on wheels - scooter, wheelchair, baby buggy or walker.  They should obviously get priority.  I also think officers should marshall lifts on leaving day, to allow pax free movement up & down to get their breakfast and to allow everyone to move their remaining luggage

 

Of course we should all use the stairs where possible, for all sorts of reasons, including our own health,  but even the fittest find the climb from 5 to 15 etc on the larger ships a bit of a strain and ladies in long dresses and high heels don’t enjoy stairs either

By reserving a lift for scooters wheelchairs buggies etc you are discriminating against those with invisible disabilities. 

 

Like Andy we have faced abuse in P&O lifts ( never had the problem anywhere else ), I very rarely use lifts but my husband has serious health issues so although he looks fit and well he often has to use the lift and depending how I ill he feels I may have to go in the lift with him.  Would you suggest those people with hidden problems collapse and possibly die trying to climb stairs.

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2019 by Josy1953

[CarlaMarie]

1 hour ago, ralphrj said:

I’m currently onboard Ventura. We did divert to La Coruna for a medical evacuation in the early hours of Thursday morning. This put us a little bit behind but the poor weather in the Bay of Biscay has hampered the attempts to catch up and it was not a surprise to hear that the visit to Lanzarote had been cancelled. Ventura is now heading directly to Gran Canaria at reduced speed for comfort as the seas are still rough.

 

Hope you are enjoying your christmas cruise despite the rough weather. 

[eddie11]

empty post - apologies

Edited December 20, 2019 by eddie11

[eddie11]

1 hour ago, Josy1953 said:

By reserving a lift for scooters wheelchairs buggies etc you are discriminating against those with invisible disabilities. 

 

Like Andy we have faced abuse in P&O lifts ( never had the problem anywhere else ), I very rarely use lifts but my husband has serious health issues so although he looks fit and well he often has to use the lift and depending how I ill he feels I may have to go in the lift with him.  Would you suggest those people with hidden problems collapse and possibly die trying to climb stairs.

 

 

 

Did I say that?  Please don’t put words in my mouth
 

I’m suggesting (though I’m not an expert on ‘flow’ and would hope P&O might have,  or could find and contract, experts) that reserving one lift for people dependent on wheels would mean the other lifts might move more efficiently?  Then everyone, 100% fit but reluctant to undertake a 10 deck climb, or with serious but invisible health and mobility issues, could be accommodated, as and when needed. 
 

The fact that this appears to be moving to a contentious topic tends to suggest that all might not be well wrt lifts on P&O vessels

[brillo]

We all pay to use the lifts they are not just there for people with disabilities I for one would take a very dim view if P&O limiting my access to lifts on the ships.

[eddie11]

Odd how threads veer off course & take on a life of their own, isn’t it?  I think perhaps we should all sit down with a pre-festivity sherry and just leave it there.  The facts as far as we know them are that Ventura is currently in lumpy seas and that some lifts are out of service.  That’s it.  
There have been no announcements from P&O about any proposed changes.  One or two of us have been musing about how the current lifts might be operated more efficiently, to help everyone who needs and wants to use them, whenever they need or want to use them.  I don’t suppose the company scans these boards for ideas as to how to run the business, so I don’t anticipate them introducing anything written here ... if they do, it will be purely coincidental 

Nothing to see here.

Merry Christmas everyone

 

 

[terrierjohn]

As someone who uses the lifts because my wife is in a wheelchair, I do not advocate allocating one lift in each group for wheelchair users, if only for the selfish reason that it might preclude us from using any of the other lifts, which at quieter times of the day would be most inconvenient.  I don't especially want any privileges, other than a little extra patience and consideration from other passengers when entering and leaving the lift. 

Lifts are for everyone's convenience, and as users we should respect other passengers needs, whatever their abilities.

[brillo]

10 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

As someone who uses the lifts because my wife is in a wheelchair, I do not advocate allocating one lift in each group for wheelchair users, if only for the selfish reason that it might preclude us from using any of the other lifts, which at quieter times of the day would be most inconvenient.  I don't especially want any privileges, other than a little extra patience and consideration from other passengers when entering and leaving the lift. 

Lifts are for everyone's convenience, and as users we should respect other passengers needs, whatever their abilities.

Exactly !

[terrierjohn]

28 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

As someone who uses the lifts because my wife is in a wheelchair, I do not advocate allocating one lift in each group for wheelchair users, if only for the selfish reason that it might preclude us from using any of the other lifts, which at quieter times of the day would be most inconvenient.  I don't especially want any privileges, other than a little extra patience and consideration from other passengers when entering and leaving the lift. 

Lifts are for everyone's convenience, and as users we should respect other passengers needs, whatever their abilities.

 

17 minutes ago, brillo said:

Exactly !

I should have added that when around the ship on my own I try to use the stairs whenever possible, to help burn off all those calories, and because I like to leave the lifts for those less fit and able than I am.

[P&O SUE]

16 hours ago, ralphrj said:

I’m currently onboard Ventura. We did divert to La Coruna for a medical evacuation in the early hours of Thursday morning. This put us a little bit behind but the poor weather in the Bay of Biscay has hampered the attempts to catch up and it was not a surprise to hear that the visit to Lanzarote had been cancelled. Ventura is now heading directly to Gran Canaria at reduced speed for comfort as the seas are still rough.

 

What a shame, Ventura is indeed not having much luck - and Lanzarote was missed last cruise too!

[ralphrj]

Another bit of excitement this morning as Ventura had a helicopter operation to evacuate a sick crew member. We had to turn around and sail South for around an hour to rendezvous with the helicopter (flying from Lisbon). All finished now and sailing North again. The detour is not expected to delay Ventura’s arrival in Southampton.

[Midland Red]

25 minutes ago, ralphrj said:

Another bit of excitement this morning as Ventura had a helicopter operation to evacuate a sick crew member. We had to turn around and sail South for around an hour to rendezvous with the helicopter (flying from Lisbon). All finished now and sailing North again. The detour is not expected to delay Ventura’s arrival in Southampton.

Excitement?

[ollienbertsmum]

On 12/20/2019 at 6:27 PM, Josy1953 said:

By reserving a lift for scooters wheelchairs buggies etc you are discriminating against those with invisible disabilities. 

 

Like Andy we have faced abuse in P&O lifts ( never had the problem anywhere else ), I very rarely use lifts but my husband has serious health issues so although he looks fit and well he often has to use the lift and depending how I ill he feels I may have to go in the lift with him.  Would you suggest those people with hidden problems collapse and possibly die trying to climb stairs.

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I cannot just let this pass. I am fit and on a ship rarely use the lift.     I find it shocking that anyone would face abuse simply because of doing so.  With or without disabilities, some people use lifts.  They can and I cannot understand that someone else would have the cheek to judge them for it.  

 

I think folk are too quick to pass judgement.  I’m judging judgmental people.  Just remember Thumper’s rule “if you can’t say anything nice, just don’t say anything at all”!!

[tanneralll]

On 12/21/2019 at 7:11 AM, brillo said:

We all pay to use the lifts they are not just there for people with disabilities I for one would take a very dim view if P&O limiting my access to lifts on the ships.

I take it you carry on this policy on land too, after all you don't pay for the lifts in department store, flats, stations exactly so why should you care about disabled folk using those equally ?

 

I speak as someone who stood in heavy rain in Lisbon at a bus stop beside a lady in a wheelchair and her husband who were nice people, waiting for a bus shuttle Even though she was there longest, she did not get on due to the rudeness and arrogance of folk like you, fellow British cruise members, She missed two busses and was drenched. One of my worst experiences with fellow passengers, yet probably routine for her.     A little courtesy can go a long long way.  Especially on a cruise ship where there is more opportunity to take a little bit of time out, get to know folks, even show your good manners, 

 

And yes, we all pay for the lifts, but are you seriously suggesting disabled and wheelchair folk should not have the same equality of access ?

[AndyMichelle]

37 minutes ago, ollienbertsmum said:

 

Sorry, I cannot just let this pass. I am fit and on a ship rarely use the lift.     I find it shocking that anyone would face abuse simply because of doing so.  With or without disabilities, some people use lifts.  They can and I cannot understand that someone else would have the cheek to judge them for it.  

 

I think folk are too quick to pass judgement.  I’m judging judgmental people.  Just remember Thumper’s rule “if you can’t say anything nice, just don’t say anything at all”!!

My view is the problem stems from P&O not supplying/maintaining enough lifts for the amount of passengers needing them. 

We try not to use the lifts wherever possible and have been abused for doing so, but putting the shoe on the other foot, if I was that wheelchair user that does not have the option to use the stairs, I would get frustrated watching lift after lift open to be full of seemingly healthy people. 

Oceana does have priority lifts for disabled passengers, but on 5 of our 7 night cruise recently, neither was working forward.. 

Andy 

 

[Harry Peterson]

Isn’t it just that we’re all very lazy now?  

 

Very few people use stairs wherever you go if there’s a lift or an escalator available, whether we’re talking ships, hotels, shops or offices.  And I’m constantly amazed, living in a small village, how few people choose to walk as short a distance as a quarter of a mile if they can use a car.

 

One of the reasons, of course, why we’re overweight, and why life threatening diseases such as Type 2 diabetes are so common.

[AndyMichelle]

9 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

Isn’t it just that we’re all very lazy now?  

 

Very few people use stairs wherever you go if there’s a lift or an escalator available, whether we’re talking ships, hotels, shops or offices.  And I’m constantly amazed, living in a small village, how few people choose to walk as short a distance as a quarter of a mile if they can use a car.

 

One of the reasons, of course, why we’re overweight, and why life threatening diseases such as Type 2 diabetes are so common.

Of course you are right Harry, but most people we seem to encounter on cruises have the same opinion as us, that they will try to use the stairs wherever possible. 

I can't recall having a conversation with anyone saying that they can't be bothered with stairs, but perhaps they just don't admit it... 

Many of us cruise because of health and many are elderly, so the demand always seems to outway the amount of working lifts supplied... This is where the issues arise. 

Andy 

[ollienbertsmum]

38 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

Isn’t it just that we’re all very lazy now?  

 

Very few people use stairs wherever you go if there’s a lift or an escalator available, whether we’re talking ships, hotels, shops or offices.  And I’m constantly amazed, living in a small village, how few people choose to walk as short a distance as a quarter of a mile if they can use a car.

 

One of the reasons, of course, why we’re overweight, and why life threatening diseases such as Type 2 diabetes are so common.

 

When I was in Tokyo I noticed that in the train stations the stairs had notices saying how many calories you burned per stair.  Maybe we in Europe (and ships) should start doing that.    

 

I think it is sometimes just a habit to use the lift.  We need to be reminded that there are some habits that are better for you.  

[tanneralll]

Basic problem with lifts is they are probably only 10% efficient. 85% of the time they are underused and 5% of the time (meal times, theatre exit times, embarkation, disembarkation they are jammed with impatien folk)

Also their "intelligence" means they will rush to busy areas at times (restaurants,theatres) leaving us poor passengers in the middle decks stranded watching them whizz up and down. 

 

More lifts would be a solution, but this would add a lot to cost.  (I agree P and O do seem to have got it wrong, especially on Britannia, where the main problem seems to be a lack of a central lift). 

 

However, we are all on the same boat (literally ), so make the most of it.  I've had many a pleasant chat with folk waiting for the lift, usually a bit of fun and banter, often with the folk in buggies and chairs. Stay a few minutes longer in the theatre till the rush dies down. or just amuse yourself watching  the ultra stressed folk rushing to and from the lifts. 

 

(PS if the high point of your holiday is the need for the lift to arrive bang on time when you push the button and whisk you straight to your floor in record time, with no crowding,bumps or pushes, then the best time is around 3.30 in the morning. Enjoy.😉)

 

[brillo]

2 hours ago, tanneralll said:

I take it you carry on this policy on land too, after all you don't pay for the lifts in department store, flats, stations exactly so why should you care about disabled folk using those equally ?

 

I speak as someone who stood in heavy rain in Lisbon at a bus stop beside a lady in a wheelchair and her husband who were nice people, waiting for a bus shuttle Even though she was there longest, she did not get on due to the rudeness and arrogance of folk like you, fellow British cruise members, She missed two busses and was drenched. One of my worst experiences with fellow passengers, yet probably routine for her.     A little courtesy can go a long long way.  Especially on a cruise ship where there is more opportunity to take a little bit of time out, get to know folks, even show your good manners, 

 

And yes, we all pay for the lifts, but are you seriously suggesting disabled and wheelchair folk should not have the same equality of access ?

I have no problem with anybody using the lifts they are there for all to use, what I do have a problem with is holier than thou people trying to tell me when I may use them. If they prefer to use the stairs that is up to them but do not try and put your personnel preference on to me, As it happens most of the time I do use the stairs but that is my choice. 

The arragant person here is you I always allow disabled people to go ahead of me you have just made anh assumtion that is both arragant and wrong.

Edited December 28, 2019 by brillo
to add something

[AndyMichelle]

58 minutes ago, tanneralll said:

Basic problem with lifts is they are probably only 10% efficient. 85% of the time they are underused and 5% of the time (meal times, theatre exit times, embarkation, disembarkation they are jammed with impatien folk)

Also their "intelligence" means they will rush to busy areas at times (restaurants,theatres) leaving us poor passengers in the middle decks stranded watching them whizz up and down. 

 

More lifts would be a solution, but this would add a lot to cost.  (I agree P and O do seem to have got it wrong, especially on Britannia, where the main problem seems to be a lack of a central lift). 

 

However, we are all on the same boat (literally ), so make the most of it.  I've had many a pleasant chat with folk waiting for the lift, usually a bit of fun and banter, often with the folk in buggies and chairs. Stay a few minutes longer in the theatre till the rush dies down. or just amuse yourself watching  the ultra stressed folk rushing to and from the lifts. 

 

(PS if the high point of your holiday is the need for the lift to arrive bang on time when you push the button and whisk you straight to your floor in record time, with no crowding,bumps or pushes, then the best time is around 3.30 in the morning. Enjoy.😉)

 

I get the cost issue, more lifts would be helpful but maintaining the existing ones would help enormously. 

I have never been on a P&O cruise where all the lifts are working and they stay out of use for a very long time. This includes Britannia when she was relatively new. 

Britannia does have central lifts, just not a central staircase above floor 7?

Andy 

 

[AndyMichelle]

On 12/28/2019 at 12:33 PM, AndyMichelle said:

I get the cost issue, more lifts would be helpful but maintaining the existing ones would help enormously. 

I have never been on a P&O cruise where all the lifts are working and they stay out of use for a very long time. This includes Britannia when she was relatively new. 

Britannia does have central lifts, just not a central staircase above floor 7?

Andy 

 

Lift update... 

No problems with lifts on Ventura at the moment, all seem to be working, so no arguments about who should and shouldn't be in them as there is plenty of capacity, even at busy times. 

Andy 

 

[kruzseeka]

On 12/28/2019 at 11:33 AM, AndyMichelle said:

I get the cost issue, more lifts would be helpful but maintaining the existing ones would help enormously. 

I have never been on a P&O cruise where all the lifts are working and they stay out of use for a very long time. This includes Britannia when she was relatively new. 

Britannia does have central lifts, just not a central staircase above floor 7?

Andy 

 

 

This is an important issue.  Of course we don't know what the problem is when a lift is taken out of use and not quickly returned to service (perhaps need parts they can't get until the next port/home port) but I was dismayed by the frequency of several lifts on Oceana being out of use on our last cruise - sometimes at the same time.  Irrespective of passengers ability or preference for using lifts, there seemed to me to be a quite an issue with some of the lifts on this ship.  

[AndyMichelle]

4 hours ago, kruzseeka said:

 

This is an important issue.  Of course we don't know what the problem is when a lift is taken out of use and not quickly returned to service (perhaps need parts they can't get until the next port/home port) but I was dismayed by the frequency of several lifts on Oceana being out of use on our last cruise - sometimes at the same time.  Irrespective of passengers ability or preference for using lifts, there seemed to me to be a quite an issue with some of the lifts on this ship.  

We found the same on Oceana, which caused some passengers to get very angry. 

Fortunately, Ventura at the moment is flowing well with no issues. 

Andy 

[happy v]

I agree about Oceana. I almost got stuck in one, on my own 😱, it took so long for the door to open I got out and walked. The person who was waiting for it didn't get in either. Later there was an out of order sign on the door.

This is the only ship we have had any problems with lifts.