LOUSY CRUISE ON ZUIDERDAM

[Mary229]

On 12/4/2022 at 5:30 PM, Florida_gal_50 said:

If I have used a future cruise deposit and canceled before final I've gotten it back or are you talking after final in the case of a last minute cancelation?  Thanks.

 

On 12/4/2022 at 5:35 PM, kazu said:

Any Future Cruise Deposit I have bought has been refundable up to final payment  / penalty date.  I’ve been buying them for decades.

 

Edited to say - posting at the same time - I am very surprised you had one where it would not be refundable unless you bought “Best Price” which is a non refundable deposit.  In that case, whatever the deposit is  will not be refundable.

Updating.  So I had my agent cancel the cruise today.  Yes, it was indeed a non-refundable fare and my $100FCD was taken.  

[Florida_gal_50]

14 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

 

Updating.  So I had my agent cancel the cruise today.  Yes, it was indeed a non-refundable fare and my $100FCD was taken.  

Thanks, that does make sense in the case for a non refundable fare.

Edited December 6, 2022 by Florida_gal_50

[kazu]

4 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

 

Updating.  So I had my agent cancel the cruise today.  Yes, it was indeed a non-refundable fare and my $100FCD was taken.  

 

Ah ha.  Thanks.  That makes sense.  A non refundable forfeits the deposit - FCD or cash.  Appreciate the update.

[riverrat]

On 12/5/2022 at 8:52 AM, dchip said:

We had this type of medical evacuation on the Zuiderdam 45 day SouthPacific voyage this November. We were 5 hours flight time from San Diego. There were two helicopters and two airplanes for refueling. Praying whoever was evacuated is now okay. 
 

I know you were right under that helicopter as were we. It was so loud and INTENSE being aft. That was some day! I watched from the Crow's Nest with naval friends then came back to the room right before the helicopter lifted them all off the lido deck. Hope all is well. Miss seeing you guys in the hall. 🙂 

 

[Tampa Girl]

On 12/5/2022 at 12:56 AM, Copper10-8 said:

 

 

There is no rhyme or reason, no pattern to predict how many, or when, medical disembarkations take place on HAL, or other cruise lines. I have worked itineraries (the security officer is very much involved in all medical disembarkations), anything from regular one week long Carib or Alaska cruises, to Atlantic and/or Pacific crossings, to two-week Panama Canal transits, to a full world cruise where we went weeks without medical disembarkations. Then the next week, on the same itineraries, there were multiple! Of course, the longer the itinerary, i.e. a grand world voyage, the higher the odds you will have a, or multiple, med. disembarks however, you can never tell ahead of time how many, if any, you will have!  

 

Just a bit as to how a medical disembark works; the ball starts rolling with one of the two physicians onboard - each HAL ships has two; one with primary responsibility for the passengers/guests; the other for the crew. The doctor(s) will be presented with patient who suffered a medical emergency. The infirmary on the ships, and the staff who run it (doctors and nurses) are there to stabilize the patient, similar to an E.R. on Terra firma. Yes, the docs are E.R./trauma hospital qualified as are most of the nurses; they can run blood and many other tests onboard, take X-rays, administer meds from their on-board pharmacy, place patients on oxygen, apply splints, get you crutches and a wheelchair, etc. but they are not specialists in all forms of medicine like you'll find in a Level 1/II trauma hospital on land such as LAC Harbor-UCLA Medical Center in my particular area.

 

 

 

 

Question:  By "running blood" you are not referring to a transfusion, I assume.  But does the ship's infirmary carry O negative, or whatever constitutes the universal donor?  Or doe the ship have to depend on the med evac units to supply the emergency transfusion?  I understand that many or most of the evacuation helicopters and ambulances do carry this blood in order to stabilize the patient until he/she can get to the hospital.

[Sea42]

4 minutes ago, Tampa Girl said:

Question:  By "running blood" you are not referring to a transfusion, I assume.  But does the ship's infirmary carry O negative, or whatever constitutes the universal donor?  Or doe the ship have to depend on the med evac units to supply the emergency transfusion?  I understand that many or most of the evacuation helicopters and ambulances do carry this blood in order to stabilize the patient until he/she can get to the hospital.

I think he was referring to running blood tests, not transfusions.

[Copper10-8]

2 minutes ago, Tampa Girl said:

Question:  By "running blood" you are not referring to a transfusion, I assume.  But does the ship's infirmary carry O negative, or whatever constitutes the universal donor?  Or doe the ship have to depend on the med evac units to supply the emergency transfusion?  I understand that many or most of the evacuation helicopters and ambulances do carry this blood in order to stabilize the patient until he/she can get to the hospital.

 

I was referring to running routine blood tests. Not sure what types of blood, if any, the infirmaries' carry on board for potential transfusions. I do know there is a "shelf life" for stored/refrigerated blood. I also know, when working, that a request went out to crew and pax to come down to the infirmary to donate a specific kind of blood type. I was one of the ones who did it. We were on a trans-Atlantic crossing far from land at the time. I will attempt to find out if blood is carried on board for transfusions and get back to ya

[Tampa Girl]

2 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

I was referring to running routine blood tests. Not sure what types of blood, if any, the infirmaries' carry on board for potential transfusions. I do know there is a "shelf life" for stored/refrigerated blood. I also know, when working, that a request went out to crew and pax to come down to the infirmary to donate a specific kind of blood type. I was one of the ones who did it. We were on a trans-Atlantic crossing far from land at the time. I will attempt to find out if blood is carried on board for transfusions and get back to ya

 

Thanks, Copper.  We have recently had good reason for the question.  

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, Tampa Girl said:

 

Thanks, Copper.  We have recently had good reason for the question.  

 

Just received a response to your query; There is no blood stored in the infirmary for potential transfusions for various reasons. As I thought, in case blood is needed for that purpose, the medical dept. will rely on voluntary donations from either crew an/or guests which has not been a problem in the past

[cruisemom42]

4 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Just received a response to your query; There is no blood stored in the infirmary for potential transfusions for various reasons. As I thought, in case blood is needed for that purpose, the medical dept. will rely on voluntary donations from either crew an/or guests which has not been a problem in the past

 

Just wanted to say what a great source of information you are for almost all things aboard HAL ships. I really appreciate your answers to so many out-of-the-ordinary questions.  (And your sense of humor ain't bad either!)

[Tampa Girl]

4 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Just received a response to your query; There is no blood stored in the infirmary for potential transfusions for various reasons. As I thought, in case blood is needed for that purpose, the medical dept. will rely on voluntary donations from either crew an/or guests which has not been a problem in the past

 

Appreciate your response.  That makes sense.

[Robbie555]

On 11/21/2022 at 5:14 PM, FLcruiser2011 said:

From that point, it would be hard to find things that have gone well.  One of the planned Central American stops had been cancelled in favor of a sea day weeks before the cruise, and a few days before the cruise, we were told the Nicaragua stop had also been cancelled and we would have another sea day. 

 

Then this morning came the latest medical emergency (the ship has been having one or more daily) and we sat off the Mexican coast for a half dozen hours waiting for the passenger to be taken ashore. The result of that is yet another stop cancelled this one, Huatulco, Mexico, in favor of (guess what) yet another sea day.

 

We understand the need to make changes, but when a total of three ports have been cancelled in favor of sea days, we might expect to be told we will get free internet perhaps, or free drinks, or something to make up for it.  Not a word.

I'm so sorry to hear that this cruise ended up being a bad one and that you had to miss three ports of call. It looks like in the end you only had four ports of call on a 14-night cruise. What was the first missed port of call before Nicaragua and Huatulco?

 

Did the captain provide a detailed explanation as to exactly what happened to that sick passenger which prevented everyone from making the port-of-call in Huatulco? Passengers get sick on cruise ships all the time. Couldn't that sick passenger simply be disembarked and sent to a hospital in Huatulco and (hopefully) the sick passenger had travel insurance to pay for all the medical expenses?

[HALcruiser2001]

On 12/4/2022 at 5:59 PM, Mary229 said:

At one point early in the pandemic there was a discussion if cruise lines would start requiring physicians letter  for those over a certain age.  The people medically evacuated I witnessed would definitely not been onboard , there is no way a physician would have approved travel for them

 

Curious why you say this.

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, bdd123 said:

 

Curious why you say this.

As I stated earlier I had knowledge of their condition. Both were only one week before in hospital for open heart surgery then flew to Europe 

[Ride-The-Waves]

On 11/22/2022 at 9:03 AM, Hlitner said:

We have a suggestion for those in high risk categories.  Before you cruise (or travel) ask your own family physician if he/she would advise you to take Paxlovid in the event you tested positive for COVID.  If so, simply explain you will be cruising/traveling and request a prescription.  We carry our own supply (for 2 persons) of Paxlovid along with several home testing kits.  For us, a big advantage of getting Paxlovid at home is that we have a prescription program that pays for the drug.  As very frequent international travelers we carry a pretty decent drug supply to handle most common issues.  

 

Hank

As discussed on other threads Paxlovid is a prescription medication that is prescribed for a specific instance and use.  Self-medicating using Paxlovid is not only dangerous, but likely illegal in  most places.  Doctors who prescribe it "just in case" need to be reported to state and federal medical authorities.  That said, most cruise ships carry it these days.

[Ride-The-Waves]

On 11/22/2022 at 9:03 AM, Hlitner said:

We have a suggestion for those in high risk categories.  Before you cruise (or travel) ask your own family physician if he/she would advise you to take Paxlovid in the event you tested positive for COVID.  If so, simply explain you will be cruising/traveling and request a prescription.  We carry our own supply (for 2 persons) of Paxlovid along with several home testing kits.  For us, a big advantage of getting Paxlovid at home is that we have a prescription program that pays for the drug.  As very frequent international travelers we carry a pretty decent drug supply to handle most common issues.  

 

Hank

As discussed on other threads Paxlovid is a prescription medication that is prescribed for a specific instance and use.  Self-medicating using Paxlovid is not only dangerous, but likely illegal in  most places.  Doctors who prescribe it "just in case" need to be reported to state and federal medical authorities.  That said, most cruise ships carry it these days.

[Hlitner]

4 hours ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

As discussed on other threads Paxlovid is a prescription medication that is prescribed for a specific instance and use.  Self-medicating using Paxlovid is not only dangerous, but likely illegal in  most places.  Doctors who prescribe it "just in case" need to be reported to state and federal medical authorities.  That said, most cruise ships carry it these days.

On this we can disagree, and I say this having spent a lot of my life in and around our healthcare system.  Physicians need to assess each circumstance, based on their best judgement.  Those of us who are involved in extensive international travel may not always have easy access to the appropriate treatments.  Certain antivirals, such as Paxlovid, need to be used very early in the disease process to be most effective.  This is not a situation of "self medicating" but a simply a physician's determination to trust his/her patient to properly follow instructions.  In the case of Paxlovid our instructions are to use it if we are symptomatic and have two consecutive positive COVID tests.  Being high risk, our risk using the drug is far less than not using the drug.  I would add that in a prior life I was a certified paramedic, worked hundreds of hours assessing patients in the ER and our physician is aware of this background.

 

By the way, in the case of drugs like Paxlovid, a lot of prescribing is being done based on a phone call or text message.  Many physicians prefer to keep folks, testing positive for COVID, out of their office unless they are experiencing severe symptoms (in which case they might suggest the patient go directly to an ER or Urgent Care).   This seems to be a trend that goes back to when Tamiflu became a pretty common antiviral for flu.   The reality is that physicians are so overwhelmed that it can several days just to get an appointment, by which time the best time to use antivirals would have passed.  An alternative is to go to Urgent Care, but many folks with COVID or Flu are not  the best folks to be traveling to facilities and exposing others.  I think healthcare has become much more complicated and self-care accompanied with a consult has become more common.  Even on cruise ships we have seen posts of folks who spent days in a quarantined cabin with no visits from medical staff.  They often had to settle for a daily phone call.

 

Hank

 

Hank

 

We may well be 

[shack]

8 hours ago, Mary229 said:

As I stated earlier I had knowledge of their condition. Both were only one week before in hospital for open heart surgery then flew to Europe 

Erm, that would be pure and plain BAD JUDGMENT.  The cruises will still be there when healthy.

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, shack said:

Erm, that would be pure and plain BAD JUDGMENT.  The cruises will still be there when healthy.

Well, yeah but in both cases we missed a highly desirable port because we had to turn around to deliver them to safety.  I have not sympathy 

[retiredyoungLV]

On 11/27/2022 at 1:22 PM, Tampa Girl said:

With all these complaints, I will be curious to see if Zuiderdam's impending drydock will bring the ship up to the standard that the "23 WC's expect.  If not, the complaints herein will mushroom exponentially!

When is the planned drydock? I was ready to book the Zuiderdam 73 day Africa for 2023, but after reading this....yikes!

[Boatdrill]

On 12/4/2022 at 4:59 PM, Mary229 said:

The people medically evacuated I witnessed would definitely not been onboard , there is no way a physician would have approved travel for them

May be their doctor didn't approve travel for them, but they cruised anyway.  

It's not our business.

Edited January 3, 2023 by Boatdrill

[Laminator]

7 hours ago, Hlitner said:

On this we can disagree, and I say this having spent a lot of my life in and around our healthcare system.  Physicians need to assess each circumstance, based on their best judgement.  Those of us who are involved in extensive international travel may not always have easy access to the appropriate treatments.  Certain antivirals, such as Paxlovid, need to be used very early in the disease process to be most effective.  This is not a situation of "self medicating" but a simply a physician's determination to trust his/her patient to properly follow instructions.  In the case of Paxlovid our instructions are to use it if we are symptomatic and have two consecutive positive COVID tests.  Being high risk, our risk using the drug is far less than not using the drug.  I would add that in a prior life I was a certified paramedic, worked hundreds of hours assessing patients in the ER and our physician is aware of this background.

 

By the way, in the case of drugs like Paxlovid, a lot of prescribing is being done based on a phone call or text message.  Many physicians prefer to keep folks, testing positive for COVID, out of their office unless they are experiencing severe symptoms (in which case they might suggest the patient go directly to an ER or Urgent Care).   This seems to be a trend that goes back to when Tamiflu became a pretty common antiviral for flu.   The reality is that physicians are so overwhelmed that it can several days just to get an appointment, by which time the best time to use antivirals would have passed.  An alternative is to go to Urgent Care, but many folks with COVID or Flu are not  the best folks to be traveling to facilities and exposing others.  I think healthcare has become much more complicated and self-care accompanied with a consult has become more common.  Even on cruise ships we have seen posts of folks who spent days in a quarantined cabin with no visits from medical staff.  They often had to settle for a daily phone call.

 

Hank

 

Hank

 

We may well be 

This is only if you have had a renal and hepatic function test done in the last 12 months. If your DR has those results and they are ok then by all means take paxlovid. If your DR does not have those results in the last 12 months then he should not be prescribing paxlovid. That comes straight from the MFR of the drug!

[HALcruiser2001]

16 hours ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

As discussed on other threads Paxlovid is a prescription medication that is prescribed for a specific instance and use.  Self-medicating using Paxlovid is not only dangerous, but likely illegal in  most places.  Doctors who prescribe it "just in case" need to be reported to state and federal medical authorities.  That said, most cruise ships carry it these days.

 

If you talk to your Dr and he/she approves you for use if you test positive all your comments are inaccurate and irrelevant.

 

People have said on this board, that they cannot get it on the ship.

Edited January 3, 2023 by bdd123

[Mary229]

7 hours ago, Boatdrill said:

May be their doctor didn't approve travel for them, but they cruised anyway.  

It's not our business.

And that goes back to the originally referenced discussion about doctor’s notes.  Unfortunately Cruise Critic does not have nesting so the gist of conversation is easily lost as is the follow up

[Tampa Girl]

12 hours ago, retiredyoungLV said:

When is the planned drydock? I was ready to book the Zuiderdam 73 day Africa for 2023, but after reading this....yikes!

 I believe that it was just done in December, 2022.  For  up-to-date info on the condition of the ship, follow one of the '23 WC's blogs, i.e. The Inside Cabin, and there are several others.  They are boarding today.