Israel Next week Voyager

[roninman]

2 hours ago, Pcardad said:

I think the final offers will be much improved. Just opinion.

I'd suggest they think long game and make their final offer now.  Heck, make their final offer last week.   Too many have already felt forced to cancel, or been made to jump through hoops to even arrive at the new debarkation that the cruise line assigned in the middle of a large city-wide sporting event, or have had stomach aches trying to understand what to do.

 

If final offers had been clear by now people would have been much happier.  And if final offers had been made by now, people who accepted intermediate offers, or believed in the cruise lines original final offer of (no credit, no refunds), would not feel cheated they did not wait for the next final offer.

 

What is possibly gained by waiting to make a final offer?

[cruiseluv]

2 minutes ago, roninman said:

I'd suggest they think long game and make their final offer now.  Heck, make their final offer last week.   Too many have already felt forced to cancel, or been made to jump through hoops to even arrive at the new debarkation that the cruise line assigned in the middle of a large city-wide sporting event, or have had stomach aches trying to understand what to do.

 

If final offers had been clear by now people would have been much happier.  And if final offers had been made by now, people who accepted intermediate offers, or believed in the cruise lines original final offer of (no credit, no refunds), would not feel cheated they did not wait for the next final offer.

 

What is possibly gained by waiting to make a final offer?

Agree! All this unnecessary angst!

[Sunprince]

1 hour ago, pingpong1 said:

Sunprince - I absolutely agree with you.  And Melbox4 - I think this is a really important point!  Ever since I first joined CC and in particular, since following along on all the Regent Forum discussions for those years...the constant/consistent/never ending/"written-on-a-stone-tablet" justification for using Regent Air (rather than "going it alone") has always been that if there's "Ever Any problem at all" with your air transportation (arranged/booked paid for through Regent)...Regent was always going to be your "best buddy", that they'd move heaven and earth for you, and that they would provide immediate hands-on assistance...no matter what...to "get you to that ship - come heck or high water!"

 

And so now Mel is telling us that they seemingly have just "cut him loose" and told him to call Lufthansa on his own.  And to add the final insult...gave him a Lufthansa "non-weekend" phone number to call... that won't even be answered until 2 more precious and time-critical days have elapsed?

 

Tell me again (anyone) why I should ever rely on Regent Air to get me to/from the ship, rather than arranging my own flights - personally and directly - with my own favorite choice/s of airlines?  Did I also understand (from one of the previous posts) that Regent Miami was "finding it difficult" to contact the Voyager in order to "see if it was okay" for the delayed passenger/s (delayed through no fault of their own) to board the ship in a subsequent 2nd/3rd port, if they couldn't make it to Istanbul before the ship left (which the now won't)?!  "Asking Permission", really?!  Boy, I really don't understand "that one!"  🤔

 

By this time (actually way before now), someone way up the Regent "food chain", and in an actual "decision-making position", should have been offering these major-affected folks a full refund PLUS FCC's to use towards a new/later/future cruise!  In the "big scheme of things", that goodwill compensation would be a tiny fraction of their gross yearly revenue!

 

Maybe I need to stop posting on this thread...it's cranking up my BP way too high! Time to pet the cat! 😺    Best Regards to all.

100% agree with your comments pingpong! What has changed at Regent? A new President, financial pressures or incompetence? Where is the President in this mess? What about FDR? It used to be that people at the top were actively managing major problems…but now where are they? 

[Sunprince]

1 hour ago, kathy49 said:

I think what they are really saying is we are rethinking this whole deal.  I can understand they have people at airports and a ship to get off tomorrow. I think anyone calling on Monday will have better response if you have cancelled.

I certainly hope the response improves! Waiting til Monday is unacceptable. I feel sorry for all those people in limbo, needed to make financial decisions re thousands of $ without any support from Regent.

 

I don’t mean to be overly negative here, but I would have never thought I would be reading these types of comments about Regent. 

[cruiseluv]

6 minutes ago, Sunprince said:

100% agree with your comments pingpong! What has changed at Regent? A new President, financial pressures or incompetence? Where is the President in this mess? What about FDR? It used to be that people at the top were actively managing major problems…but now where are they? 

I might be wrong, but didn’t FDR retire?

[kathy49]

30 minutes ago, rallydave said:

Regent does not refund port charges for missing ports nor add  port charges for new more expensive ports since port charges are not separately listed in the booking.  That is what has historically occurred and doubt any changes for this change.

 

Plus as far as looking at SEC reports to see if cash flow problems for Regent, that simply won't work as Regent is under the NFLH banner and reports are only for NCLH as the parent of Regent, Oceania and NCL.

Okay so if you miss lets say two ports due to weather and instead have two sea days you get no port taxes back???? That seems really odd and different from most lines.

[CrushIt]

12 minutes ago, cruiseluv said:

I might be wrong, but didn’t FDR retire?

Different FDR. 

[CrushIt]

17 minutes ago, Sunprince said:

I certainly hope the response improves! Waiting til Monday is unacceptable. I feel sorry for all those people in limbo, needed to make financial decisions re thousands of $ without any support from Regent.

 

I don’t mean to be overly negative here, but I would have never thought I would be reading these types of comments about Regent. 

We immediately put the financial issue in its own box. Not that it isn’t important. But, not close to the main issues. 

[PaulaJK]

13 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

Okay so if you miss lets say two ports due to weather and instead have two sea days you get no port taxes back???? That seems really odd and different from most lines.

That was our experience in Sept 23.

[NYC-London]

18 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

Okay so if you miss lets say two ports due to weather and instead have two sea days you get no port taxes back???? That seems really odd and different from most lines.

Regent does not list port fees and taxes as a separate line item, it is included in the "all inclusive" fare and over the years we have missed many ports and never received one penny back

[GeorgiaPeach51]

I have been following this with interest because we are in the same boat, but on Oceania.  Someone posted that they were curious what other cruise lines were doing, so here it is.  Our first O attempt, so unimpressed. I will attach our two itineraries for our Nov. 1 cruise.

 

Basically, in this “Holy Land and Treasures” cruise, we lost 2 days in Israel, of course.  We also lost Antalya, Turkey; Limosoll, Cypress; and Cairo.  They added an overnight in Alexandria, and Athens, Santorini and Mykonos.  So, not even a shadow of what we paid huge bucks for.  Whether Egypt remains is anyone’s guess, but I am not hopeful.  Maybe.

 

So, currently, five of eight ports lost.  If Egypt goes, it will be six out of eight.  The only unchanged ports are the ones in Tunisia and Malta.  🙄

 

We requested an FCC and the answer came back that it was “a hard NO.”  The original is the yellowish one.  The new one is the white one.

 

Joanie

 

 

[rallydave]

1 hour ago, pingpong1 said:

Sunprince - I absolutely agree with you.  And Melbox4 - I think this is a really important point!  Ever since I first joined CC and in particular, since following along on all the Regent Forum discussions for those years...the constant/consistent/never ending/"written-on-a-stone-tablet" justification for using Regent Air (rather than "going it alone") has always been that if there's "Ever Any problem at all" with your air transportation (arranged/booked paid for through Regent)...Regent was always going to be your "best buddy", that they'd move heaven and earth for you, and that they would provide immediate hands-on assistance...no matter what...to "get you to that ship - come heck or high water!"

 

And so now Mel is telling us that they seemingly have just "cut him loose" and told him to call Lufthansa on his own.  And to add the final insult...gave him a Lufthansa "non-weekend" phone number to call... that won't even be answered until 2 more precious and time-critical days have elapsed?

Hi Pingpong 1.  we haven't conversed in a long time but, believe you will remember when in the past many people thought the same thing you posted about Regent taking care of their air customers and I always posted as I am now that just like many other T's and C's that protect Regent and are on display in this thread., the T's and C's regarding third parties including airlines is that Regent takes no responsibility for third parties.  

 

Others including the one alluded to in previous posts about how well this thread is moving along would respond that not withstanding the T's and C's clearly saying that Regent booked third parties are not  Regent's responsibility mentioned how Regent did take responsibility in the past.

 

And I would say yes that has happened but, does not always like in this case of nobody in the office to handle delays on this momentous day.  Just another reason to think twice about booking Regent in the future.   Have a great day Pingpong 1

[roninman]

6 minutes ago, rallydave said:

the T's and C's regarding third parties including airlines is that Regent takes no responsibility for third parties. 

Technically I can understand that Regent is not responsible for the airlines- how can they be?  However, Regent is responsible for arranging transportation to get you to your boat.   In its brochures it states that airfare is included, hence they need to make suitable arrangements to transport you.   When you pay $175pp for a deviation they are renewing the commitment.   When you pay an extra $75 for the privilege of speaking directly with the air team, they are upping the responsibility again.

 

If they can't get the pax to the embarkation port in a reasonable fashion, it seems a refund is due (at a minimum).  Or, as Regent- and now Oceania- seem to like to tell people:  "read the contract."

[edgee]

46 minutes ago, CrushIt said:

Different FDR. 

What do you mean "different FDR?" If you are thinking of of the retired FDR's son, he works elsewhere in the NCLH corporation (Oceania) and has zero to do with Regent.

[rallydave]

15 minutes ago, roninman said:

Technically I can understand that Regent is not responsible for the airlines- how can they be?  However, Regent is responsible for arranging transportation to get you to your boat.   In its brochures it states that airfare is included, hence they need to make suitable arrangements to transport you.   When you pay $175pp for a deviation they are renewing the commitment.   When you pay an extra $75 for the privilege of speaking directly with the air team, they are upping the responsibility again.

 

If they can't get the pax to the embarkation port in a reasonable fashion, it seems a refund is due (at a minimum).  Or, as Regent- and now Oceania- seem to like to tell people:  "read the contract."

You are partially correct and my previous explanation was not complete.  Regent is responsible for arranging transportation to get you to your boat.  After that arrangement they are not responsible for delays, etc.  I will poste a copy paste from the ticket contract so everyone can see the exact words.

 

We assume no responsibility in whole or in part for any delays, delayed departures or arrivals, missed connections, loss, death, damage or injury to person or property or accident, mechanical defect, failure or negligence of any nature whatever caused in connection with any accommodations, transportation, services or facilities, substitution of hotels, common carriers or equipment with or without notice or for any additional expenses occasioned thereby. We reserve the right to choose the air carrier, routing and gateway locations, as well as the right to substitute charter flights for scheduled service and vice versa. If the entire Cruise or CruiseTour is canceled by Us for any reason, Guests shall have no claim other than for a full refund of the Cruise Fare or the CruiseTour Fare, whichever is applicable. The airlines and other transportation companies concerned are not to be held responsible for any act, omission or event during the time You are not on board their conveyances. This Ticket/Contract constitutes the sole agreement between Carrier and You, it being understood that the various independent contractors otherwise participating in the Cruise or CruiseTour will enter into their own separate contractual arrangements with You, and that You assume the risk of utilizing the services and facilities of those independent contractors. Any penalties, change fees or cancellation fees that result from changes to or cancellation of air arrangements are the sole responsibility of the Guest.

 

 

Yes pretty strong language and in the past Regent has gone out of their way as many have asked in this thread but, like many other issues herein, legally from the above they are not legally responsible once they have booked your flight.

 

This is NOT to say the agent who told the person whose initial flight was cancelled to wait until Monday or to phone a Lufthansa number not working on the weekend.

Edited October 14, 2023 by rallydave

[kathy49]

1 hour ago, GeorgiaPeach51 said:

I have been following this with interest because we are in the same boat, but on Oceania.  Someone posted that they were curious what other cruise lines were doing, so here it is.  Our first O attempt, so unimpressed. I will attach our two itineraries for our Nov. 1 cruise.

 

Basically, in this “Holy Land and Treasures” cruise, we lost 2 days in Israel, of course.  We also lost Antalya, Turkey; Limosoll, Cypress; and Cairo.  They added an overnight in Alexandria, and Athens, Santorini and Mykonos.  So, not even a shadow of what we paid huge bucks for.  Whether Egypt remains is anyone’s guess, but I am not hopeful.  Maybe.

 

So, currently, five of eight ports lost.  If Egypt goes, it will be six out of eight.  The only unchanged ports are the ones in Tunisia and Malta.  🙄

 

We requested an FCC and the answer came back that it was “a hard NO.”  The original is the yellowish one.  The new one is the white one.

 

Joanie

 

 

I say there should be a % of ports eliminated prior to sailing (ie not weather related)  that  should result in an automatic FCC for the passenger if they want to cancel. I don't think you will be going to Alex either....most are pulling out of there and to be honest Tunisia could have so many demonstrations pro Palestine that that is a big question mark too. Wow hope they come to their senses...that sounds like a cruise they should just cancel.

Edited October 14, 2023 by kathy49

[Pcardad]

17 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

I say there should be a % of ports eliminated prior to sailing (ie not weather related)  that  should result in an automatic FCC for the passenger if they want to cancel. I don't think you will be going to Alex either....most are pulling out of there and to be honest Tunisia could have so many demonstrations pro Palestine that that is a big question mark too. Wow hope they come to their senses...that sounds like a cruise they should just cancel.

Believe it or not, I also think the offer of a FCC is appropriate here. I have seen these types of interruptions in the past and know, from this experience, that the process can take multiple steps with the final decision being more favorable for the clients than the initial decision. 

[pingpong1]

35 minutes ago, rallydave said:

Hi Pingpong 1.  we haven't conversed in a long time but, believe you will remember when in the past many people thought the same thing you posted about Regent taking care of their air customers and I always posted as I am now that just like many other T's and C's that protect Regent and are on display in this thread., the T's and C's regarding third parties including airlines is that Regent takes no responsibility for third parties.  

 

Others including the one alluded to in previous posts about how well this thread is moving along would respond that not withstanding the T's and C's clearly saying that Regent booked third parties are not  Regent's responsibility mentioned how Regent did take responsibility in the past.

 

And I would say yes that has happened but, does not always like in this case of nobody in the office to handle delays on this momentous day.  Just another reason to think twice about booking Regent in the future.   Have a great day Pingpong 1

Hi Dave...Thanks for the "shout out"!   😉  Yes, I certainly do remember our past/earlier conversations, along with all the great advice and suggestions you provided to me - especially during my "early Regent days"!  Even now, I'm always happy to see your posts and I always look forward to the continuing advice and insights you provide on this forum!  Best Regards.

 

[GeorgiaPeach51]

1 hour ago, Pcardad said:

Believe it or not, I also think the offer of a FCC is appropriate here. I have seen these types of interruptions in the past and know, from this experience, that the process can take multiple steps with the final decision being more favorable for the clients than the initial decision. 

The difference, for me, is that when a ship is at sea and encounters for or high winds or even civil unrest, anyone with common sense knows it is unavoidable and not the fault of the cruise line, so you carry on.

 

But, in our case, the cruise is clearly ALREADY nowhere near what we purchased.  That this is known by Oceania well ahead of time calls for them to err on the side of passengers who wish an FCC.  And I would say the same to every cruise line regarding cruises that are grievously altered.

 

So, @Pcardad, I so hope you are right.  Your wisdom far exceeds mine!  Thanks for your post.  It gives me hope!

 

Joanie

[CheapIrish]

4 hours ago, cruiseluv said:

I might be wrong, but didn’t FDR retire?

Yes in the summer according to an article I Googled trying to find his email. 

[Sunprince]

15 minutes ago, CheapIrish said:

Yes in the summer according to an article I Googled trying to find his email. 

Yes, FDR Sr retired a few months ago, but he is still a “senior advisor” to the NCL Board until 2025. So I guess he took his money and ran after the pandemic and now he has no further influence on how the company operates. 

[CheapIrish]

3 minutes ago, Sunprince said:

Yes, FDR Sr retired a few months ago, but he is still a “senior advisor” to the NCL Board until 2025. So I guess he took his money and ran after the pandemic and now he has no further influence on how the company operates. 

Not much of an advisor then. 🤣

[Sunprince]

1 hour ago, GeorgiaPeach51 said:

The difference, for me, is that when a ship is at sea and encounters for or high winds or even civil unrest, anyone with common sense knows it is unavoidable and not the fault of the cruise line, so you carry on.

 

But, in our case, the cruise is clearly ALREADY nowhere near what we purchased.  That this is known by Oceania well ahead of time calls for them to err on the side of passengers who wish an FCC.  And I would say the same to every cruise line regarding cruises that are grievously altered.

 

So, @Pcardad, I so hope you are right.  Your wisdom far exceeds mine!  Thanks for your post.  It gives me hope!

 

Joanie

Good luck with your Oceania cruise Ms. GeorgiaPeach! We all have enjoyed your previous Regent posts/blogs and know you to be a fair and reasonable person….so what you are expecting is not unreasonable. Unfortunately, there seems to be a new era in cruising where cruise lines are unilaterally abiding by their legal contract to the detriment of the consumer (and future/ loyal business from that consumer)

Edited October 15, 2023 by Sunprince

[PhD-iva]

On 10/10/2023 at 3:12 PM, PhD-iva said:

The cynic in me suggests that Regent is trying to minimize the number of pax who cancel prior to embarkation. The more pax who go on the cruise, the fewer “refunds/FCC” R will eventually need to pay out to fewer clients.

Outlandish thought?

You read it here first! My prediction!

[Sunprince]

3 hours ago, Pcardad said:

Believe it or not, I also think the offer of a FCC is appropriate here. I have seen these types of interruptions in the past and know, from this experience, that the process can take multiple steps with the final decision being more favorable for the clients than the initial decision. 

I agree that a FCC is appropriate, but it depends on the offer. But my question is…why is it acceptable business practice to put your customers through multiple hoops and iterations to get to the end state? Especially in this more stressful circumstance? It seems Regent has previous experience of how to take care of customers, so why is there so many obstacles now to get to the final decision?? That IMO, is extremely poor management. Something has seriously changed within the Regent/NCL management.