Veendam failed latest cdc inspection

[sail7seas]

It is never too late to cancel..... it is a question of whether you are willing to forfeit funds. Most of us, of course, do not wish to do that.

 

Were we to be on a ship that we found intolerable with malfunctioning toilet for days on end, a cabin without air condtioning, and an assortment of other issues, we would leave and go home. The money has been spent anyway but we would decide if we should put up with unhealthy, intolerable conditions on our 'luxury' vacation.

 

When Maasdam cancelled four ports on our seven day second part of our b-to-b, Boston to Montreal to Boston, several years ago and returned to Boston two days early, we left.

 

As soon as the ship was cleared, we went home. We did not seek nor did we receive any refund for those unused days and the hurricane never came to Boston but we were not going to ride out the storm tied up to a dock in Boston when we live nearby. We forfeited the money we had paid for those days and never asked for anything.

 

 

 

 

 

[whogo]

What an embarrassment! Those booked on the Veendam and wishing to cancel might check to see if Holland America will do the right thing and waive cancellation fees. It does not hurt to ask.

[ivoryboi]

Veendam went into Code Red 3 days ago. Expect late embarkation in Boston this Saturday.

[lindaler]

When a resturant gets a bad review, they close the doors until it is cleaned up but it appears that HAL just kept right on sailing. Isn't there something they must do to protect the pax on the next and the next and next sailing date?

[voyageur9]

Just to put this in context, a whole boatload of HAL cheerleaders jumped up and down attempting to defend the line and disparage the CDC last month when this came up on an earlier thread.

 

Until Veendam, ...... Rotterdam had scored worse than any other ship from a major cruise line. Any score below 85 is considered unsatisfactory.

 

Rotterdam was a borderline 86.

 

Rotterdam -- 86

Veendam -- previously 93 -- now with a failing 77

Zaandam -- 93

Amsterdam -- 94

Maasdam -- 95

Westerdam -- 95

Ryndam -- 97

Prinsendam -- 98

Statendam -- 98

Noordam -- 99

Oosterdam -- 99

Volendam -- 99

Zuiderdam -- 99

Eurodam -- 100

Nieuw Amsterdam -- 100

 

Since Jan 1, 2012, a total of 25 ships have scored 100. HAL has two.

The only ship (until Veendam) to rate lower than Rotterdam this year was the MV Yorktown, a 138-passenger ship on the Great Lakes, rated filthiest at 74.

Only one other ship scored 86 -- tied with Rotterdam for second worst -- the Caribbean Fantasy. No other ships scored below 90. (until Veendam)

[Laminator]

I am a little confused about this. The CDC fails a ship and proceeds to let it sail. If the you fail the health department test here they shut you down. This was the perfect opportunity to get the problems fixed. All the CDC has to say is the ship is not sailing until you pass your inspection. This would have gotten HAL's attention quickly and I am guessing numerous problems resolved. Why have teh inspection if there is no teeth to it.

 

So the majority of the PAX who do not follow CC have no clue about the problems but the agency that is responsible for passenger safety fails the ship and then let's it sail on. This does not make alot of sense to me. Why bother with the inspection anyway.

[innlady1]

I just read over over the citations -- somthing like 120??

 

It is hard to believe that in April 2012 -- just 4 months before -- she got a 93.

 

That is amazing. I know that when we were on board the week of May 6, we didn't have any problems nor did we hear of anyone. It is truly hard to believe it could go downhill in such a short amount of time. :eek:

[kazu]

Just to put this in context, a whole boatload of HAL cheerleaders jumped up and down attempting to defend the line and disparage the CDC last month when this came up on an earlier thread.

 

Until Veendam, ...... Rotterdam had scored worse than any other ship from a major cruise line. Any score below 85 is considered unsatisfactory.

 

Rotterdam was a borderline 86.

 

Rotterdam -- 86

Veendam -- previously 93 -- now with a failing 77

Zaandam -- 93

Amsterdam -- 94

Maasdam -- 95

Westerdam -- 95

Ryndam -- 97

Prinsendam -- 98

Statendam -- 98

Noordam -- 99

Oosterdam -- 99

Volendam -- 99

Zuiderdam -- 99

Eurodam -- 100

Nieuw Amsterdam -- 100

 

Since Jan 1, 2012, a total of 25 ships have scored 100. HAL has two.

The only ship (until Veendam) to rate lower than Rotterdam this year was the MV Yorktown, a 138-passenger ship on the Great Lakes, rated filthiest at 74.

Only one other ship scored 86 -- tied with Rotterdam for second worst -- the Caribbean Fantasy. No other ships scored below 90. (until Veendam)

 

Actually Salicia reminded us on the other Veendam thread that the Queen Mary failed in 2011. So other ships have scored below 90.

 

Here's her post (copied and pasted) " All hell broke lost when Queen Mary 2 shockingly failed inspection with a score of 84 in June, 2011. (Scores of 85 or lower are failures.) http://wwwn.cdc.gov/InspectionQueryT...cztPHHPwYEA%3d

 

Happily, QM2 scored 100 on the last two inspections. Here's hoping the Veendam can follow suit and get it's act cleaned up. -S

[iancal]

That miserable 77 score primarily reflects the condition of things that the average cruiser never sees.

 

Some of these unsatisfactory conditions relate directly to the health and well being of the crew and passengers.

 

I am surprised that the news outlets have not picked this up. It is definitely newsworthy.

 

HAL Corporate senior management and the Veendam management team should hang their collective heads in shame.

 

I hope that CDC follows this up shortly with another audit and that the results have improved to at least a passing grade.

[dr.dawg]

well, salacia, if the truth made you laugh, i'm happy. at least you did not deny anything i said; but you can, of course. that would make me laugh, also.

[sail7seas]

I am a little confused about this. The CDC fails a ship and proceeds to let it sail. If the you fail the health department test here they shut you down. This was the perfect opportunity to get the problems fixed. All the CDC has to say is the ship is not sailing until you pass your inspection. This would have gotten HAL's attention quickly and I am guessing numerous problems resolved. Why have teh inspection if there is no teeth to it.

 

<snip>

 

 

 

You say '".... here they shut you down" .........

 

I'm curious. Where is here?

Thanks.

 

[richwmn]

You say '".... here they shut you down" .........

 

I'm curious. Where is here?

Thanks.

 

 

I don't know where LAMINATOR is, but here in Athens the Health Department can and has closed restaurants where customers were eating. If the inspection show that there is a definite, current, hazard it can happen.

[sppunk]

At some point the captain and hotel manager must take responsibility for this.

 

I know the captain on our sailing (when this report was filed, actually) - does anyone know the other Veendam captain?

 

Makes sense a major shake up is needed. And now I know why the crew are praying to get out if their contract; they are working in miserable, insanitary conditions for bosses who clearly don't care.

 

Makes me SO ANGRY to think of those poor crew members so far from home with zero recourse at all.

[sail7seas]

I don't know where LAMINATOR is, but here in Athens the Health Department can and has closed restaurants where customers were eating. If the inspection show that there is a definite, current, hazard it can happen.

 

 

 

Yes, Health Department has done the same in Boston and our local city, as well, for the same reasons.

 

I'm not sure Laminator is necessarily from U.S.

I am wondering if from another country where ship inspection failure denies the ship the ability to board her guests and sail. Can/do they have that power and do they exercise it in Canada, does anyone know?

 

[Salacia]

Yes, Health Department has done the same in Boston and our local city, as well, for the same reasons.

 

I'm not sure Laminator is necessarily from U.S.

I am wondering if from another country where ship inspection failure denies the ship the ability to board her guests and sail. Can/do they have that power and do they exercise it in Canada, does anyone know?

 

 

Sorry, I don't know about Canada, but here's the rules in the US (I posted this on a different thread earlier, so please forgive the repeat for those who have already read it.)

 

Quoted from http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/about_inspections.htm

What happens if a ship fails an inspection?

 

Ships that fail inspections are re-inspected within a reasonable time period of the failure. If a ship fails an inspection because of an imminent public health risk, VSP may recommend that the ship not sail. Imminent public health risks include the following violations:

• inability to properly chlorinate potable water;
  
• inability to keep food within safe temperatures;
  
• inadequate facilities for cleaning and sanitizing equipment;
  
• inability to properly dispose of solid or liquid waste; and
  
• an infectious disease outbreak where continuing normal operations may subject newly arriving passengers to disease.
  

Approximately two thousand passengers, many without seating, were waiting inside and outside the cruise terminal in NYC while boarding was delayed for several hours the day the last published inspection was carried out on 18 August. I can only imagine the mayhem that would have ensued had the ship not been permitted to finally board the waiting passengers; my guess is that step is rarely taken. Regards, S.

 

Edited to add: It just dawned on me that the Captain and others must have know that the ship failed inspection. I would have thought that they would have been extra vigilant after that, but I'm sorry to say that from what I witnessed, was not the case on the Aug 18 Veendam cruise.

[CoronaCRZR]

At some point the captain and hotel manager must take responsibility for this.

 

I know the captain on our sailing (when this report was filed, actually) - does anyone know the other Veendam captain?

 

Makes sense a major shake up is needed. And now I know why the crew are praying to get out if their contract; they are working in miserable, insanitary conditions for bosses who clearly don't care.

 

Makes me SO ANGRY to think of those poor crew members so far from home with zero recourse at all.

 

 

I totally agree, everyone is looking at Seatlle for help, but really first and foremost for this ship it is the Captains responsibility to keep a clean and safe ship. Time to remove this Captain from his duties.

 

Seattle needs to take a hard look at their entire 'aging' fleet and get them all fixed up in order to maintain the ' Signature of Excellence"

[serendipity1499]

I just read over over the citations -- somthing like 120??

 

It is hard to believe that in April 2012 -- just 4 months before -- she got a 93.

 

That is amazing. I know that when we were on board the week of May 6, we didn't have any problems nor did we hear of anyone. It is truly hard to believe it could go downhill in such a short amount of time. :eek:

 

This too amazes & saddens me..We cruised on the Veendam out of NYC in 2008 & the ship was clean as a whistle & we had no problem with AC..

Cheers..Betty

[kakalina]

This is what really bother me. No wonder they are in code red!

 

Item No.: 13

Site: Galley-Warewashing

Violation: Several managers were observed in the area but they did not shut down the outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine for repair before the inspector arrived. Every 1 to 5 seconds, the magnetic sensor on the clean end of the in-use outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine was stopping the machine from running. There was a leak in a water line inside the deckhead directly above the machine and water was dripping into the machine and contaminating the clean dishes after they were sanitized. There was also brown liquid leaking from the deckhead onto the left corner of the clean landing of the machine. Workers were observed taking the contaminated dishes and putting them into clean storage racks.

Recommendation: Because of the risks for foodborne illness inherent to the food operation, ensure the supervisor or person in charge of food operations on the vessel demonstrates to VSP - during inspections and on request - knowledge of foodborne disease prevention, application of the Hazard Analysis Critical Point principles, and the food-safety guidelines in this manual. Ensure that the person in charge demonstrates this knowledge: (1) By compliance with these guidelines

[sail7seas]

I totally agree, everyone is looking at Seatlle for help, but really first and foremost for this ship it is the Captains responsibility to keep a clean and safe ship. Time to remove this Captain from his duties.

 

Seattle needs to take a hard look at their entire 'aging' fleet and get them all fixed up in order to maintain the ' Signature of Excellence"

 

 

I don't know the first thing about who gets blamed first for what but I do wonder........

 

*What if Captain had requested/requisitioned repair parts and pieces repeatedly in order for repairs to be made but they never were delivered to the ship?

 

*What about if they were denied budget to make such repairs and revisions?

 

*What about if the design is such that some of these repairs cannot be made without a drydock which might/maybe be refused by headquarters?

 

*What about if there is a Hotel Manager who just arrived at the ship the week of or even day of the Inspection? Is he responsible for the deficiencies though he wasn't even aboard, possibly, a mere 5 hours?

 

You get my point........

 

Let's NOT point fingers unless we know about what we are speaking.

I do not have those answers but would welcome reliable, responsible information from those who might.

 

[Laminator]

Yes, Health Department has done the same in Boston and our local city, as well, for the same reasons.

 

I'm not sure Laminator is necessarily from U.S.

I am wondering if from another country where ship inspection failure denies the ship the ability to board her guests and sail. Can/do they have that power and do they exercise it in Canada, does anyone know?

 

 

Chicago Area. I believe that the Canadian CDC has that authority. Without that authority why even bother inspecting.

[sail7seas]

Thanks, Laminator.

 

[kazu]

Chicago Area. I believe that the Canadian CDC has that authority. Without that authority why even bother inspecting.

 

Yes, here in Canada if a restaurant or any other public facility that has to health responsible fails - they can be shutdown in a heart beat:D

 

Really, if the ship has failed, why should it be allowed to take on passengers. These people are at a health risk just looking at that report:eek:

[indokiwi]

As far as I know, it's called Canadian Public Health and they have the same sort of inspections. Our family was boarding a ship in Vancouver and they were on board. I believe it was the Ryndam years ago. They passed but the crew was in quite a tizzy. Said that they were just as tough as USPH. :D

[Cruising-along]

This is what really bother me. No wonder they are in code red!

 

Item No.: 13

Site: Galley-Warewashing

Violation: Several managers were observed in the area but they did not shut down the outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine for repair before the inspector arrived. Every 1 to 5 seconds, the magnetic sensor on the clean end of the in-use outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine was stopping the machine from running. There was a leak in a water line inside the deckhead directly above the machine and water was dripping into the machine and contaminating the clean dishes after they were sanitized. There was also brown liquid leaking from the deckhead onto the left corner of the clean landing of the machine. Workers were observed taking the contaminated dishes and putting them into clean storage racks.

Recommendation: Because of the risks for foodborne illness inherent to the food operation, ensure the supervisor or person in charge of food operations on the vessel demonstrates to VSP - during inspections and on request - knowledge of foodborne disease prevention, application of the Hazard Analysis Critical Point principles, and the food-safety guidelines in this manual. Ensure that the person in charge demonstrates this knowledge: (1) By compliance with these guidelines

 

Yes, no wonder! :eek:

[Salacia]

Information regarding Canada's Cruise Ship Inspection Program (CSIP) can be found at http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/travel-voyage/general/ship-navire-eng.php

 

CSIP inspection reports for HAL ships: http://207.6.98.232/Clients/HC-SC/WHPSP/WHPSP_PHB_Website.nsf/Ship-List-All?OpenView&Count=30&RestrictToCategory=92D17A22CBE6F151A85D1EA1FB23A2BE

 

If I'm reading it correctly, the last CSIP inspection of the Veendam was in 2009. -S.