Why are amateur radios prohibited?

[ldubs]

I don't do HAM radio as a hobby. Don't want to contribute to the discussion on who is in charge.   But I am still kind of curious.   For someone who might actually know, why would a SW receiver not be allowed? 

 

Edit: Emphasis on "receiver".  

Edited May 24, 2019 by ldubs

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, ldubs said:

I don't do HAM radio as a hobby. Don't want to contribute to the discussion on who is in charge.   But I am still kind of curious.   For someone who might actually know, why would a SW receiver not be allowed? 

 

Edit: Emphasis on "receiver".  

I believe Andy has posted the reasons very well in post #14.  While a SW receiver may actually be allowed, it is subject to approval by the Captain in order to meet the flag state and other regulatory requirements for radio equipment onboard ships.

[MBP&O2/O]

In my years at sea I never saw anyone who had a problem bringing their own personal multi-band radio receiver on board. Good commercial receivers such as Grundig and Eddystone were your only form of entertainment on long passages.  The company had rules and regulations as to where they could be used ... all of which fell into the ‘common sense’ category 😀

[K32682]

2 hours ago, ldubs said:

I don't do HAM radio as a hobby. Don't want to contribute to the discussion on who is in charge.   But I am still kind of curious.   For someone who might actually know, why would a SW receiver not be allowed? 

 

Edit: Emphasis on "receiver".  

 

Here is the precise wording of what is a prohibited item on Carnival-owned ships.  It specifies "wideband receivers." 

 

"Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacons (EPIRB), communication scanners, wideband receivers, satellite phones, transformers, lasers and laser pointers." 

 

There would however seem to be no consistent definition of "wideband" which is a technical term.   What are commonly described as "wideband receivers" are radios/scanners that receive a "wide" range of frequencies including those much higher than commercial AM, FM and SW frequencies. 

 

Based on this lack of clarity in the terminology and my conclusion a small SW receiver is not a "wideband receiver" I shall continue to bring my well-travelled Sony on board and use it during a cruise without troubling the dictator on the bridge. 

 

 

Edited May 24, 2019 by K32682

[MicCanberra]

8 hours ago, K32682 said:

Sure.  And when he runs his ship into "uncharted" rocks he can claim he "fell" into a lifeboat by accident ahead of he passengers and didn't go back to the ship because it was "too dark."  LOL.

  

Please don't take the Schettino out of the that unfortunate event.😋

[MicCanberra]

7 hours ago, DirtyDawg said:

How did I ever miss 'ship captain' on those career  aptitude tests I did in high school?

 

Dictatorial powers were my # 1 criteria, and my sex disqualified me from the 'wife' occupation. 😁

 

Not today it doesn't, wives can be of any gender.

[ldubs]

6 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

I believe Andy has posted the reasons very well in post #14.  While a SW receiver may actually be allowed, it is subject to approval by the Captain in order to meet the flag state and other regulatory requirements for radio equipment onboard ships.

 

Gotcha.   I thought many an interference issue, which wouldn't  apply to receivers.  Then thought maybe a security thing.  Anyway, thanks for clarifying (you too Andy -- missed some of your comments in 14).  

 

 

Edited May 25, 2019 by ldubs

[Heidi13]

On 5/24/2019 at 1:25 PM, K32682 said:

 

Here is the precise wording of what is a prohibited item on Carnival-owned ships.  It specifies "wideband receivers." 

 

"Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacons (EPIRB), communication scanners, wideband receivers, satellite phones, transformers, lasers and laser pointers." 

 

There would however seem to be no consistent definition of "wideband" which is a technical term.   What are commonly described as "wideband receivers" are radios/scanners that receive a "wide" range of frequencies including those much higher than commercial AM, FM and SW frequencies. 

 

Based on this lack of clarity in the terminology and my conclusion a small SW receiver is not a "wideband receiver" I shall continue to bring my well-travelled Sony on board and use it during a cruise without troubling the dictator on the bridge. 

 

 

My interpretation of wideband receiver is anything outside of the broadcast AM/FM, especially if it meets the criteria included in the International Radio Regulations.

 

We have attempted to provide information and the pertinent regulations that govern the use of radios, both Tx/Rx on commercial ships. Whether you heed this advice is totally up to you, but I assume your sense of entitlement will negate the information both the Chief and I have provided.

 

Just remember that the Master, who you refer to as the dictator on the Bridge, leads a team of highly qualified officers, both on the Bridge & Engine Room that are responsible for your safety.

 

Sadly, the chance of being caught with prohibited equipment is low, but if you did get caught, you will very quickly experience the powers available to the Master of a vessel. When pax are caught contravening regulations, they get the same treatment as the crew. BTW - yes, I have requested passengers be charged.

[SRF]

On 5/24/2019 at 2:22 PM, ldubs said:

I don't do HAM radio as a hobby. Don't want to contribute to the discussion on who is in charge.   But I am still kind of curious.   For someone who might actually know, why would a SW receiver not be allowed? 

 

Edit: Emphasis on "receiver".  

 

All receivers actually transmit a bit.

 

There are 1 or more oscillators that generate an RF signal that is mixed with the incoming signal as part of the filtering.

 

A bit of those signals do leak out.

[K32682]

2 hours ago, Heidi13 said:

My interpretation of wideband receiver is anything outside of the broadcast AM/FM, especially if it meets the criteria included in the International Radio Regulations.

 

We have attempted to provide information and the pertinent regulations that govern the use of radios, both Tx/Rx on commercial ships. Whether you heed this advice is totally up to you, but I assume your sense of entitlement will negate the information both the Chief and I have provided.

 

Just remember that the Master, who you refer to as the dictator on the Bridge, leads a team of highly qualified officers, both on the Bridge & Engine Room that are responsible for your safety.

 

Sadly, the chance of being caught with prohibited equipment is low, but if you did get caught, you will very quickly experience the powers available to the Master of a vessel. When pax are caught contravening regulations, they get the same treatment as the crew. BTW - yes, I have requested passengers be charged.

 

The definition of "wideband" varies and there would appear to be no consensus on what the term means when applied to receiving radios. Unless you can provide the specific criteria in the IRR or even a definition from a cruise line specifying what the term means to them your personal "interpretation" is simply personal opinion.

 

[NLH Arizona]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

The definition of "wideband" varies and there would appear to be no consensus on what the term means when applied to receiving radios. Unless you can provide the specific criteria in the IRR or even a definition from a cruise line specifying what the term means to them your personal "interpretation" is simply personal opinion.

 

Maybe it is just me, but I would guess that the only opinion that counts on the ship, is the opinion of the Captain and his/her officers.  A passenger's personal opinion, basically counts for nothing on the ship.

[K32682]

11 hours ago, NLH Arizona said:

Maybe it is just me, but I would guess that the only opinion that counts on the ship, is the opinion of the Captain and his/her officers.  A passenger's personal opinion, basically counts for nothing on the ship.

 

Ultimately that is correct.  Given the lack of clarity on the rules and definitions however it is an entirely reasonable conclusion that a narrow-band SW receiver does not fall within the proscriptions.  Therefore, I will not trouble the "Master" for his all-powerful verdict but will humbly beg forgiveness should his minions object to the faint tones of Deutsche Welle echoing in the hallway near my cabin. 🙄

 

 

Edited May 28, 2019 by K32682

[chengkp75]

13 hours ago, NLH Arizona said:

Maybe it is just me, but I would guess that the only opinion that counts on the ship, is the opinion of the Captain and his/her officers.  A passenger's personal opinion, basically counts for nothing on the ship.

And that is what Andy (Heidi13) is, a former passenger ship Captain.

2 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

Ultimately that is correct.  Given the lack of clarity on the rules and definitions however it is an entirely reasonable conclusion that a narrow-band SW receiver does not fall within the proscriptions.  Therefore, I will not trouble the "Master" for his all-powerful verdict but will humbly beg forgiveness should his minions object to the faint tones of Deutsche Welle echoing in the hallway near my cabin. 🙄

 

 

Hopefully you never have to rely on that Captain's "all powerful" ability  to command, that you treat so cavalierly, in order to save your life.

[Mary229]

I assume for the same reasons you can't use one on an airplane.  😉

[sparks1093]

14 hours ago, SRF said:

 

All receivers actually transmit a bit.

 

There are 1 or more oscillators that generate an RF signal that is mixed with the incoming signal as part of the filtering.

 

A bit of those signals do leak out.

Exactly. That's one of the reasons we weren't allowed to have personal radios in Radio Central in the Navy.

[leaveitallbehind]

2 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

Ultimately that is correct.  Given the lack of clarity on the rules and definitions however it is an entirely reasonable conclusion that a narrow-band SW receiver does not fall within the proscriptions.  Therefore, I will not trouble the "Master" for his all-powerful verdict but will humbly beg forgiveness should his minions object to the faint tones of Deutsche Welle echoing in the hallway near my cabin. 🙄

 

 

Really? Your thread title indicates an understanding that they are not allowed, so going into this you already know you should not bring one.  But apparently you did not hear what you are rationalizing as convincing enough information to support this and are looking desperately for a loophole in which to hide, choosing instead to ignore the advice of those in the industry with direct knowledge and clear explanations to support what you already seemed to realize but don't want to believe.  You are also choosing to support your actions by avoiding any further investigations with the cruise lines(s) or their ship's Master so as not to hear what you do not want to hear, falling back instead on some irresponsible notion of "gee officer, I didn't realize I couldn't do this".  Well I guess as long as you get to do what you want to do, all is right with the world. Not too arrogant.....

Edited May 28, 2019 by leaveitallbehind

[K32682]

33 minutes ago, leaveitallbehind said:

Really? Your thread title indicates an understanding that they are not allowed, so going into this you already know you should not bring one.  But apparently you did not hear what you are rationalizing as convincing enough information to support this and are looking desperately for a loophole in which to hide, choosing instead to ignore the advice of those in the industry with direct knowledge and clear explanations to support what you already seemed to realize but don't want to believe.  You are also choosing to support your actions by avoiding any further investigations with the cruise lines(s) or their ship's Master so as not to hear what you do not want to hear, falling back instead on some irresponsible notion of "gee officer, I didn't realize I couldn't do this".  Well I guess as long as you get to do what you want to do, all is right with the world. Not too arrogant.....

 

I understand why and that transmitters are not allowed.  The rules and definitions of a "wideband" receiver however are unclear. There are times when it is better to seek forgiveness than permission.  This is one of them. 

  

[Mary229]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

I understand why and that transmitters are not allowed.  The rules and definitions of a "wideband" receiver however are unclear. There are times when it is better to seek forgiveness than permission.  This is one of them. 

  

I disagree.  They will simply confiscate his radio equipment and who knows how it will come out of storage.  It is one thing to have a surge protector confiscated but I think a radio is not something you want strangers handling.  

[Heidi13]

18 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

The definition of "wideband" varies and there would appear to be no consensus on what the term means when applied to receiving radios. Unless you can provide the specific criteria in the IRR or even a definition from a cruise line specifying what the term means to them your personal "interpretation" is simply personal opinion.

 

You may consider it as my personal opinion, but it comes with 40 + years of experience, with 30 years in the position that you so eloquently describe as the dictator on the Bridge. 

 

 

[leaveitallbehind]

4 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

I understand why and that transmitters are not allowed.  The rules and definitions of a "wideband" receiver however are unclear. There are times when it is better to seek forgiveness than permission.  This is one of them. 

  

No its not.  The responsible thing to do if you really wanted to be sure and understand the policy, would be to contact the cruise line in question and seek their answer. And if the facts then support what you already acknowledge and what so many others with direct knowledge have already indicated, then leave the receiver at home.  Pretending you don't know better or believing that you have somehow found what to you is a loophole and then bringing it on board to then seek forgiveness for your error if caught is nothing less than selfish and ignorant.

 

But its clear you are going to do whatever you want regardless, so anything I think clearly won't matter.  Keep in mind your receiver may also be confiscated by security at embarkation if it is not allowed.  What then - will you then demand to talk with Captain.....?

Edited May 28, 2019 by leaveitallbehind