Diamond Princess passenger "tested positive for Wuhan coronavirus"

[kathy49]

Shocking headlines there was a "whistleblower" doctor who warned about this virus... Chinese .government silenced him and now he has died of the virus. Can't make this stuff up.

Edited February 6, 2020 by kathy49

[cruisemom42]

It would be really helpful if folks reporting random "facts" would also provide sources.  At times like these, where there is a lot of very high-level knowledge and understanding required (e.g., viral transmission, government regulations, etc), reporters do get things wrong. (Or take facts out of context.)

[DivotMaker]

14 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

Shocking headlines there was a "whistleblower" doctor who warned about this virus....government silenced him and now he has died of the virus. Can't make this stuff up.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51403795

[kathy49]

7 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

It would be really helpful if folks reporting random "facts" would also provide sources.  At times like these, where there is a lot of very high-level knowledge and understanding required (e.g., viral transmission, government regulations, etc), reporters do get things wrong. (Or take facts out of context.)

i get what you are saying and true no one here has a "high level" knowledge but all I intended in my post is to raise the question of the wisdom of staying in such a small space with air circulating for these people. Time will tell.  Somehow I think at some point a different move may be made...again no "high level" knowledge but just common sense.

[mtfasls]

Does anyone know who the captain is?

[carmania]

Go to the WHO Webpage to read how they assess the danger of the new Corona Virus. It seems not much more dangerous than the traditional seasonal flu viruses. Nevertheless the impact on traveling und now also on cruising is startling. Quarantine actions of this size must be avoided through preventive screenings, otherwise the cruise industry will get a big problem. 

Hope the passengers of Diamond Princess will be released soon!

[cruisemom42]

17 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

i get what you are saying and true no one here has a "high level" knowledge but all I intended in my post is to raise the question of the wisdom of staying in such a small space with air circulating for these people. Time will tell.  Somehow I think at some point a different move may be made...again no "high level" knowledge but just common sense.

 

I wasn't trying to particularly single you out. I just find it frustrating when someone posts a single fact and without any context around it, it is difficult to understand.....that's all. 

[amajaa]

2 hours ago, luckyinpa said:

 

i am curious about something. in general regarding all cruises that have english on the menus etc. how do the people who dont speak english even order from menus and stuff?  i had always assumed that if you travel on an english ship you would be able to communicate. personally id never go on a ship that wasnt  my native language or one i didnt speak. would scare me not to be able to read/communicate

We have been on The Sapphire Princess sailing from Southampton U K several times but she also sails out of China, all the signs around the ship are in English and one of the Chinese languages, possibly Mandarin.  Even in the cabin things are written in Chinese so I’m sure they have menus and I expect in numerous languages you just have to ask. They will have them ready depending on which nationalities they know will be on board. 

 

[dog]

39 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

what if the captain wanted to just sail away ? Not sure where he would go but the Christmas Island option sounds better than this.

 

 

I do not know   My guess is the gov’t / Health org have the say 

[capriccio]

44 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

what if the captain wanted to just sail away ? Not sure where he would go but the Christmas Island option sounds better than this.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, dog said:

I do not know   My guess is the gov’t / Health org have the say 

 

Not to mention the government of Christmas Island.  Why would they accept a ship with active cases?

[nobog]

Another perspective on the subject:

https://www.askthepilot.com/air-travel-and-disease/

[dog]

Menus on my cruise were English or Japanese on my Japan cruise. They also brought on Japanese crew re: entertainment, announcements in both languages 

[kathy49]

9 minutes ago, carmania said:

Go to the WHO Webpage to read how they assess the danger of the new Corona Virus. It seems not much more dangerous than the traditional seasonal flu viruses. Nevertheless the impact on traveling und now also on cruising is startling. Quarantine actions of this size must be avoided through preventive screenings, otherwise the cruise industry will get a big problem. 

Hope the passengers of Diamond Princess will be released soon!

Yes I think this entire situation begs a serious discussion. Not unusual for a ship to have a rapid spread of a noro virus etc. and precautions are taken but some screening upon embarkation may have to be the norm? It is one thing on a plane for xxx number of hours but these cruises are long...some very long...these passengers were about to disembark and be flying all over the world in another day or so and had that one case not surfaced in HK and been traced they would have done just that.

[koolforkatz]

Reports now of a third cruise ship, HAL's Westerdam, with passengers not being allowed to disembark in Japan.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7974721/Japan-blocks-foreigners-disembarking-cruise-ship.html?ico=pushly-notifcation-small

 

 

[caribill]

2 minutes ago, kathy49 said:

Yes I think this entire situation begs a serious discussion. Not unusual for a ship to have a rapid spread of a noro virus etc. and precautions are taken but some screening upon embarkation may have to be the norm? It is one thing on a plane for xxx number of hours but these cruises are long...some very long...these passengers were about to disembark and be flying all over the world in another day or so and had that one case not surfaced in HK and been traced they would have done just that.

 

What kind of screening? The person whose case caused all of this had no symptoms at all when starting his cruise or even when he finished his cruise.

 

The only thing implemented since then is to not allow anyone who has been in China in the previous two weeks from boarding the ship.

[Harry Peterson]

1 hour ago, perditax said:

 

Source please. 

Certainly:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000dqz3

 

Around 2:30 minutes in - that's where there's a reference to a possible transmission range of 200 feet.

 

Released On: 30 Jan 2020 Available for over a year
With the recent coronavirus outbreak spreading around the world, and concerns about people being infectious before they exhibit any symptoms. Professor of Virology at Nottingham University Jonathan Ball explains infection rates, quarantines and why he's worried about it spreading to the developing world.

https://www.nottingham.ac.uk/news/expertiseguide/life-sciences/professor-jonathan-ball.aspx

Edited February 6, 2020 by Harry Peterson

[kathy49]

7 minutes ago, koolforkatz said:

Reports now of a third cruise ship, HAL's Westerdam, with passengers not being allowed to disembark in Japan.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7974721/Japan-blocks-foreigners-disembarking-cruise-ship.html?ico=pushly-notifcation-small

 

 

I was following this one on roll call and they have jerked these people around so bad...they embarked in HK and knew there would be problems....they would not let people cancel either.

[dog]

Holland America’s Westerndam now affected

[Jzx1103]

17 minutes ago, koolforkatz said:

Reports now of a third cruise ship, HAL's Westerdam, with passengers not being allowed to disembark in Japan.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7974721/Japan-blocks-foreigners-disembarking-cruise-ship.html?ico=pushly-notifcation-small

 

 

This is Holland America's own fault, the reason Westerdam was denied stops at all ports they've been to so far was because they wanted to make extra $$$ and picked up the 800+ passengers from HK instead of cancelling and refunding them. This was well after everything already went to $@!t in China. Word is other passengers onboard were pissed at HAL, since HAL was literally gambling with people's lives by picking up the HK passengers. Now they can't stop anywhere because of it. So far I don't think there's actually any known cases of Coronavirus onboard the Westerdam, but no one is gonna let the ship dock knowing so many people onboard are from an infected area.

Edited February 6, 2020 by Jzx1103

[kathy49]

12 minutes ago, Jzx1103 said:

This is Holland America's own fault, the reason Westerdam was denied stops at all ports they've been to so far was because they wanted to make extra $$$ and picked up the 800+ passengers from HK instead of cancelling and refunding them. This was well after everything already went to $@!t in China. Word is other passengers onboard were pissed at HAL, since HAL was literally gambling with people's lives by picking up the HK passengers. Now they can't stop anywhere because of it. So far I don't think there's actually any known cases of Coronavirus onboard the Westerdam, but no one is gonna let the ship dock knowing so many people onboard are from an infected area.

yes a total money grab and those that were smart enough to cancel lost their money....I smell class action suit.

[jamesboat]

21 minutes ago, Jzx1103 said:

This is Holland America's own fault, the reason Westerdam was denied stops at all ports they've been to so far was because they wanted to make extra $$$ and picked up the 800+ passengers from HK instead of cancelling and refunding them. This was well after everything already went to $@!t in China. Word is other passengers onboard were pissed at HAL, since HAL was literally gambling with people's lives by picking up the HK passengers. Now they can't stop anywhere because of it. So far I don't think there's actually any known cases of Coronavirus onboard the Westerdam, but no one is gonna let the ship dock knowing so many people onboard are from an infected area.

 

Of course Holland America and Princess are both owned by the same company - Carnival.

[perditax]

36 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

Certainly:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000dqz3

 

Around 2:30 minutes in - that's where there's a reference to a possible transmission range of 200 feet.

 

Released On: 30 Jan 2020 Available for over a year
With the recent coronavirus outbreak spreading around the world, and concerns about people being infectious before they exhibit any symptoms. Professor of Virology at Nottingham University Jonathan Ball explains infection rates, quarantines and why he's worried about it spreading to the developing world.

https://www.nottingham.ac.uk/news/expertiseguide/life-sciences/professor-jonathan-ball.aspx

 

Good news, more recent info from pretty much every source out there indicates the maximum spread is about six feet, not 200 feet. 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/about/transmission.html

https://medical.mit.edu/news/2020/01/2019-novel-coronavirus-updates-1

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-new-coronavirus-what-we-do-and-dont-know-2020012518747

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-51325192 :

 

Who qualifies as a close contact?
Anyone who is within two metres of the infected person for 15 minutes.

 

This is typical for coronaviruses.

Fear-mongering doesn't help anyone. 

Edited February 6, 2020 by perditax

[kathy49]

2 minutes ago, jamesboat said:

 

Of course Holland America and Princess are both owned by the same company - Carnival.

good point

[Harry Peterson]

12 minutes ago, perditax said:

 

Good news, more recent info from pretty much every source out there indicates the maximum spread is about six feet, not 200 feet. 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/about/transmission.html

https://medical.mit.edu/news/2020/01/2019-novel-coronavirus-updates-1

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-new-coronavirus-what-we-do-and-dont-know-2020012518747

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-51325192 :

 

Who qualifies as a close contact?
Anyone who is within two metres of the infected person for 15 minutes.

 

This is typical for coronaviruses.

Fear-mongering doesn't help anyone. 

I'm afraid the information is conflicting, and nobody yet knows the real answer, but it's as likely that Professor Jonathan Ball (an expert in the field) is right on this as the other sources you quote.

 

The two metres/15 minute criterion, for example has little relevance - it's just a convenient measure used to identify those most at risk when trying to identify contacts after a known case is identified.  The 200 foot criterion would make it far too wide a field.

 

But in reality, nobody yet knows whether it's 200 feet or not - though even if it's half that it's a cause for concern.

[cruisemom42]

2 hours ago, Harry Peterson said:

....with a transmission range for the infection reported by leading virologists as 200 feet!

 

15 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

I'm afraid the information is conflicting, and nobody yet knows the real answer, but it's as likely that Professor Jonathan Ball (an expert in the field) is right on this as the other sources you quote.

 

The two metres/15 minute criterion, for example has little relevance - it's just a convenient measure used to identify those most at risk when trying to identify contacts after a known case is identified.  The 200 foot criterion would make it far too wide a field.

 

But in reality, nobody yet knows whether it's 200 feet or not - though even if it's half that it's a cause for concern.

 

You do realize that what you said initially and what you said in the second post are vastly different???? 

 

If folks are going to summarize information please do so appropriately and provide the reference.