Don’t go on a cruise!

[navybankerteacher]

5 minutes ago, sharic96 said:

These have nothing to do with today. I think we've had a few developments in medicine since WW1 and The Civil War. I'm going on a 4 day in mid May. RCCL has listed on its website that you can cancel up to 48 hours prior to your cruise and get full credit towards a new cruise you book up until 12/2021. So if you are that concerned you can just wait out the virus and go next year instead and you won't lose your vacation investment.

Of course there have been developments in medicine - just as there has been evolution among viruses (along with weakening of the effectiveness of many medicines due to overuse).

 

 I do wonder how  the cruising public will react when surcharges are added to fares to cover the testing and quarantines required if cruising continues until we “wait out the virus”.  After all, airline passengers now pay for the post 9/11 security procedures with surcharges —- there is no reason for cruise passengers not to pay for such required health procedures.

[GlamorousGirl]

53 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

As a practical matter, if cruises continue to sail to/from US ports, a special fee should be added to each fare to cover the costs to the US Government involved in testing and quarantining passengers - much like the fees added to all tickets to cover the costs of 9/11 related Homeland Security scanning by TSA and related activities.  There is no reason for the average tax payer to have to cover the costs incurred by the US Governnent involved in cruise-related activity on the part of the small fraction of the public which enjoys cruising.

There is no reason for the average tax payer to pay for a lot of the things the government pays for, including things we may not even approve of. I think spending our money on taking care of health issues involving our own people is a heck of a lot more worthwhile than the billions of dollars we send to foreign countries to benefit people who are not even US citizens and are the responsibility of their own governments, not ours. As for the quarantine costs, that’s a waste of money and no one should pay. It is clearly not working.

[sharic96]

14 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

Of course there have been developments in medicine - just as there has been evolution among viruses (along with weakening of the effectiveness of many medicines due to overuse).

 

 I do wonder how  the cruising public will react when surcharges are added to fares to cover the testing and quarantines required if cruising continues until we “wait out the virus”.  After all, airline passengers now pay for the post 9/11 security procedures with surcharges —- there is no reason for cruise passengers not to pay for such required health procedures.

     Well they haven't started yet. If they do it probably will be included in port charges. As such it will depend on the surcharge and overall value for the cruise. I remember the fuel surcharges they imposed years ago. People were outraged, they said they'd never cruise again and it would destroy the industry... How'd that work out for them.

     I also remember post 9/11. We had a cruise early October 2001 and the cruise companies were offering half off to stay on the ship an extra week because they couldn't sell the cabins. Again there were cries of it will be the end of not just cruises but the entire travel industry (much like today), 19 years later and people still travel. As all things this will eventually pass. The sky is not falling and the horsemen of the apocalypse have not broken over the horizon yet.  

     If you go on a cruise, use your head, wash your hands and if you go to the buffet watch the people around you. If you see someone doing something wrong like sneezing in the salad, tell a crew member. Also don't eat the salad. Just use common sense. If not you will succumb to the hype and live in fear inside your home, use tissue boxes as slippers and pee in jars and save your finger and toenail clippings in plastic bags. Ok that may be a little over the top, but we are all gonna die sooner or later and we don't know how, why or when. So I for one will continue to enjoy my life to the fullest and do what makes me happy. 

     I understand that others may feel differently and everyone's entitled to their opinion so please do not think I completely disagree with you or am slighting your comments. Just giving my 2 cents worth.

[navybankerteacher]

8 minutes ago, GlamorousGirl said:

There is no reason for the average tax payer to pay for a lot of the things the government pays for, including things we may not even approve of. I think spending our money on taking care of health issues involving our own people is a heck of a lot more worthwhile than the billions of dollars we send to foreign countries to benefit people who are not even US citizens and are the responsibility of their own governments, not ours. As for the quarantine costs, that’s a waste of money and no one should pay. It is clearly not working.

You should make yourself aware of reality. The US government spends well over a trillion $ per year on domestic health (over 18% of all expenditures) and less than 50 billion on foreign aid (about 1.2%).  And much of that foreign aid is for our benefit - keeping allies able to assist us, helping other countries fight contagion (ever hear of Ebola ?, which makes corona seem like the sniffles, and which could spread here if we did not stop it in Africa).  

 

Do you really think that if there there were no efforts to isolate carriers of corona there would be no difference in its spread?  Very few efforts in any field are 100% effective.

[MicCanberra]

Until Governments actually ban cruise ships from leaving the embarkation ports, there will still be cruises. Just like you can still fly to anywhere even to countries that have major issues, yes you can still fly to China if you wish (obviously there would be quarantining and such on return). Many countires have stopped cruises from visiting their ports but there are still many cruises that can occur, especially domestic cruises where they are visiting the same countries ports (not every country has a PVSA rule).

[Charles4515]

5 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

Until Governments actually ban cruise ships from leaving the embarkation ports, there will still be cruises. Just like you can still fly to anywhere even to countries that have major issues, yes you can still fly to China if you wish (obviously there would be quarantining and such on return). Many countires have stopped cruises from visiting their ports but there are still many cruises that can occur, especially domestic cruises where they are visiting the same countries ports (not every country has a PVSA rule).

Shutting down cruise ships is being discussed. 
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/09/azar-cruise-ship-shutdown-coronavirus-124645

[MicCanberra]

Perhaps, but is it worldwide?

If they do they should ground all aircraft and depot all trains and buses as well.

[navybankerteacher]

10 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

Perhaps, but is it worldwide?

If they do they should ground all aircraft and depot all trains and buses as well.

There is a difference between necessary, sometimes essential, travel and purely recreational travel (such as cruising). Of course much employment might vanish if travel stopped;  but aside from employment in one sector of the economy, If all travel were stopped, human activity would be seriously jeopardized.  If just cruising were stopped , people would only have to find another way to spend their free time.

 

[MicCanberra]

7 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

There is a difference between necessary, sometimes essential, travel and purely recreational travel (such as cruising). Of course much employment might vanish if travel stopped;  but aside from employment in one sector of the economy, If all travel were stopped, human activity would be seriously jeopardized.  If just cruising were stopped , people would only have to find another way to spend their free time.

 

I would think people are more likely to catch something on trains, buses and planes than on cruise ships. Perhaps Italy and China has the right response, shut down everything for a period of time.

[navybankerteacher]

5 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

I would think people are more likely to catch something on trains, buses and planes than on cruise ships. Perhaps Italy and China has the right response, shut down everything for a period of time.

You may be right about the likelihood of catching something on trains, busses and planes - and it may make sense to shut down everything for a period of time.  But, if you are going to consider shutting  down all transport - including that which is necessary to commerce and day to day living: getting to work, buying food, etc. - you sure as hell should start with the obviously unnecessary, purely recreational,  cruise business.

[MicCanberra]

3 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

You may be right about the likelihood of catching something on trains, busses and planes - and it may make sense to shut down everything for a period of time.  But, if you are going to consider shutting  down all transport - including that which is necessary to commerce and day to day living: getting to work, buying food, etc. - you sure as hell should start with the obviously unnecessary, purely recreational,  cruise business.

I do not agree why it should be a start but do agree they should be included if there is a blanket ban on travel.

[ycl]

On 2/17/2020 at 8:30 PM, Lois R said:

I have 2 cruises booked for April..TA crossing from Ft. Lauderdale to Barcelona....been paid for and am ready

to go! ..this is a retirement trip and recovery from radiation treatments I am going through right now. Actually,

one I arrive in Barcelona, I am flying to Lisbon for another cruise.....a river cruise on The Douro!

 

Cancelling these cruises because someone on Fox said "don't cruise"..…..NO, nope, nope.

Several days have passed since your post.  Things have taken a considerable turn for the worst in Italy and throughout Europe.  https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6
The hospitals are so overwhelmed there, they are having to prioritize who gets care. My relatives had to abruptly cut short their tour of the Holy Land and all on the tour are currently flying home through multiple cities because of cancelled flights.  Their dream vacation turned into a nightmare.  This is not the time to fly to Europe particularly for someone in a very high risk category.  The risk of infection is high and growing exponentially at this point. Your risk for serious complications is low based on your health.  The best case scenario is a 14 day quarantine when you return based on Current CDC guidelines.   I urge you to reconsider your decision. Please, postpone your cruise.  

BTW, Three cases of the virus in Ft. lauderdale are employees of Port Everglades company Metro Cruise services. Their employees help check in and board cruise passengers.  https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-10/cluster-of-florida-coronavirus-cases-linked-to-same-cruise-port

[Lois R]

1 hour ago, ycl said:

Several days have passed since your post.  Things have taken a considerable turn for the worst in Italy and throughout Europe.  https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6
The hospitals are so overwhelmed there, they are having to prioritize who gets care. My relatives had to abruptly cut short their tour of the Holy Land and all on the tour are currently flying home through multiple cities because of cancelled flights.  Their dream vacation turned into a nightmare.  This is not the time to fly to Europe particularly for someone in a very high risk category.  The risk of infection is high and growing exponentially at this point. Your risk for serious complications is low based on your health.  The best case scenario is a 14 day quarantine when you return based on Current CDC guidelines.   I urge you to reconsider your decision. Please, postpone your cruise.  

BTW, Three cases of the virus in Ft. lauderdale are employees of Port Everglades company Metro Cruise services. Their employees help check in and board cruise passengers.  https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-10/cluster-of-florida-coronavirus-cases-linked-to-same-cruise-port

Good morning,  you are correct.  When I posted that I had every intention of taking my cruises.  My feelings

have definitely changed. ...That post was on Feb 17th?  It has been 3 weeks? Yes, the entire thing has taken

a much more negative effect and I am in the process of making a final decision. I am most probably not going

but haven't cancelled anything as of yet.

[navybankerteacher]

9 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

I do not agree why it should be a start but do agree they should be included if there is a blanket ban on travel.

But wouldn’t you agree that common sense dictates that non-essential travel (such as cruises) should be seen as more disposable than that which serves a purpose other than recreation.   I know why people are on this site:  they like cruising —- but that does not warrant treating cruising as some sort of sacred cow.  

 

Anything which contributes to the spread of an illness (and adds to the growing costs of containing that spread) without supporting necessary  activity should be the first to go. Obviously it is highly unlikely that there will be a 100% ban on travel:  medical personnel, police and fire, truly necessary commercial such as food delivery, etc. will continue.

 

Airlines are already cancelling many flights.

[mayleeman]

But, but, but...."anything I WANT to do just MUST be more vital than anything anyone else NEEDS to do!!"

 

"I have C&A status!"

 

"I am importance personified!"

 

"I WANT, THERFORE I AM!"

 

Sorry...just been storing up all these attitudes seen in various threads for years...

[sharic96]

19 minutes ago, mayleeman said:

But, but, but...."anything I WANT to do just MUST be more vital than anything anyone else NEEDS to do!!"

 

"I have C&A status!"

 

"I am importance personified!"

 

"I WANT, THERFORE I AM!"

 

Sorry...just been storing up all these attitudes seen in various threads for years...

Lol too funny. We do all seem to feel that way sometimes. I can admit to loosing my cool from time to time and acting in a childish way. All we can do is watch what’s happening closely and make the decision that’s best for each of us.

I am happy with the way Royal is dealing with this situation. I may not get my money back specifically but I won’t loose it either. I was already planning another trip in 2021 anyway. So this way I’ll have some of that pre paid if I can’t go on my scheduled cruise in May.

[MicCanberra]

4 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

But wouldn’t you agree that common sense dictates that non-essential travel (such as cruises) should be seen as more disposable than that which serves a purpose other than recreation.   I know why people are on this site:  they like cruising —- but that does not warrant treating cruising as some sort of sacred cow.  

 

Anything which contributes to the spread of an illness (and adds to the growing costs of containing that spread) without supporting necessary  activity should be the first to go. Obviously it is highly unlikely that there will be a 100% ban on travel:  medical personnel, police and fire, truly necessary commercial such as food delivery, etc. will continue.

 

Airlines are already cancelling many flights.

I am not against stopping cruises but if they do that then it should be one of many actions, like shutting schools and sports events and any gatherings of more than 1 person.

[MicCanberra]

3 hours ago, sharic96 said:

Lol too funny. We do all seem to feel that way sometimes. I can admit to loosing my cool from time to time and acting in a childish way. All we can do is watch what’s happening closely and make the decision that’s best for each of us.

I am happy with the way Royal is dealing with this situation. I may not get my money back specifically but I won’t loose it either. I was already planning another trip in 2021 anyway. So this way I’ll have some of that pre paid if I can’t go on my scheduled cruise in May.

Royal Caribbean seem to be the slowest with cancelling cruises, there are still many that are only cancelled within the week of sailing and many more which have not been cancelled but cannot go to any of the ports.

[MicCanberra]

4 hours ago, mayleeman said:

But, but, but...."anything I WANT to do just MUST be more vital than anything anyone else NEEDS to do!!"

 

"I have C&A status!"

 

"I am importance personified!"

 

"I WANT, THERFORE I AM!"

 

Sorry...just been storing up all these attitudes seen in various threads for years...

LOL, welcome to CC.

[pacruise804]

3 hours ago, sharic96 said:

Lol too funny. We do all seem to feel that way sometimes. I can admit to loosing my cool from time to time and acting in a childish way. All we can do is watch what’s happening closely and make the decision that’s best for each of us.

I am happy with the way Royal is dealing with this situation. I may not get my money back specifically but I won’t loose it either. I was already planning another trip in 2021 anyway. So this way I’ll have some of that pre paid if I can’t go on my scheduled cruise in May.

 

While I hope we will be able to cruise in 2021 (heck, I even hope to be able to take my scheduled May cruise too), I'm not confident that if I cancel my current cruises a future cruise would be able to happen - too much is still uncertain.  

 

We do not book a cruise unless we can afford to lose the cruise fare.  Obviously we would like the cruise for the money spent, but if we can't go for whatever reason there is at least the savings of gratuities, excursions, drinks, etc.

[sharic96]

6 minutes ago, pacruise804 said:

 

While I hope we will be able to cruise in 2021 (heck, I even hope to be able to take my scheduled May cruise too), I'm not confident that if I cancel my current cruises a future cruise would be able to happen - too much is still uncertain.  

 

We do not book a cruise unless we can afford to lose the cruise fare.  Obviously we would like the cruise for the money spent, but if we can't go for whatever reason there is at least the savings of gratuities, excursions, drinks, etc.

We live in S. Florida. We usually don't book a cruise leaving out of Miami, Ft. Lauderdale or Orlando until at least 90 days before it to maximize our savings. We can go at the drop of a hat because of our location in proximity to the ports, which is very advantageous. So as long as RCCL gives us full credit. I'm confident we will be able to book another sailing at a later date. If I lost the money it wouldn't put me in the poor house either, however if you paid the fare and can't go on the cruise due to no fault of your own you should expect something from the cruise company.  

[pacruise804]

Fair enough.  Hopefully you are correct that there will be cruises next year and ports that will accept visitors 🙂 

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, MicCanberra said:

I am not against stopping cruises but if they do that then it should be one of many actions, like shutting schools and sports events and any gatherings of more than 1 person.

I do not know what is happening in Australia, but schools here ARE already being closed,  sporting events are taking place - but many with nobody attending - only the players.

When Boston, Mass. cancels the St. Patrick’s Day parade - and New York is also considering cancelling theirs, it is obvious that the situation is being taken seriously.

 

Large gatherings are being restricted - the next debate in the Presidential campaign will have no audience.  Calling for cancelling gatherings of more than one before cancelling cruises is a stupid concept - people could not buy food or meds.  

 

But to to argue that cruising — putting thousands of people together in rather enclosed environments for many day at a time — should continue until EVERY OTHER meeting of two or more is cancelled indicates a terminal condition of cruise addiction.  Remember, of course: cruising is the ultimate exercise of unnecessary travel - involving putting thousands of people together in close quarters —- for purely recreational purposes.

 

Just plain DUMB.

[MicCanberra]

1 hour ago, navybankerteacher said:

I do not know what is happening in Australia, but schools here ARE already being closed,  sporting events are taking place - but many with nobody attending - only the players.

When Boston, Mass. cancels the St. Patrick’s Day parade - and New York is also considering cancelling theirs, it is obvious that the situation is being taken seriously.

 

Large gatherings are being restricted - the next debate in the Presidential campaign will have no audience.  Calling for cancelling gatherings of more than one before cancelling cruises is a stupid concept - people could not buy food or meds.  

 

But to to argue that cruising — putting thousands of people together in rather enclosed environments for many day at a time — should continue until EVERY OTHER meeting of two or more is cancelled indicates a terminal condition of cruise addiction.  Remember, of course: cruising is the ultimate exercise of unnecessary travel - involving putting thousands of people together in close quarters —- for purely recreational purposes.

 

Just plain DUMB.

Who is arguing, I thought it was a discussion.

BTW, I didn't say until then, I said that there should be many actions taken of similar nature, not just cruises.

I am not sure why you feel one is better or worse than another. Why would a cruise be worse for contagions than a church mass or a shopping mall, or going on a bus or train or plane.

All have groups of people, but some have them in a much closer proximity to each other than a cruise may have.

[navybankerteacher]

56 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

Who is arguing, I thought it was a discussion.

BTW, I didn't say until then, I said that there should be many actions taken of similar nature, not just cruises.

I am not sure why you feel one is better or worse than another. Why would a cruise be worse for contagions than a church mass or a shopping mall, or going on a bus or train or plane.

All have groups of people, but some have them in a much closer proximity to each other than a cruise may have.

What you seem to fail to recognize is that cruising is the least essential form of travel - and you continually emphasize that it should not be curtailed until everything else is.  Sure, non-essential travel of any sort should be curtailed - but equating cruising with all other gatherings of people does not make sense - prolonged proximity in close quarters is almost the ideal recipe for contagion.

 

Cruising IS worse than travel to work, it is worse than taking public transport to obtain food or medical care.  Your continually equating it with all other sorts of public gatherings - many of which have already been curtailed - is difficult to understand — and, in my mind, not worthy of further discussion.