First North American Cruise Line Vaccine Mandate

[ZoeyVictoria]

51 minutes ago, molly361 said:

You can certainly tell the posters that have children on some of these threads😇

I was reading all posts to the end before I commented that it is very easy to tell who wants their unvaccinated children on a ship.  You beat me to it!  Seriously, reading the comments without looking at the username is a good indicator of those with children (and those who wouldn’t mind an adult only cruise).

[Mapleleafforever]

15 minutes ago, ZoeyVictoria said:

I was reading all posts to the end before I commented that it is very easy to tell who wants their unvaccinated children on a ship.  You beat me to it!  Seriously, reading the comments without looking at the username is a good indicator of those with children (and those who wouldn’t mind an adult only cruise).

And I get the feeling that upwards of 80% of posters here only think that the vaccine is so they can cruise again. My entire Province has been under a stay at home order since Dec 26, there is more to life than cruising. 

[NateUpNorth]

23 minutes ago, Mapleleafforever said:

And I get the feeling that upwards of 80% of posters here only think that the vaccine is so they can cruise again. My entire Province has been under a stay at home order since Dec 26, there is more to life than cruising. 

 

As a fellow resident of that province I am watching the vaccine requirement issue with great interest.
We've done a L&S to end November this year.
Will we even have the option to receive the shot in the arm by that date? 
"More doses per capita......." except the end of that sentence is "paid for but last in line for delivery".

In fact if we can't get this fixed I wonder if the USA will have a no travel order on letting us in to get to the ports........... and what RCL would choose to do in that situation......

Edited February 3, 2021 by NateUpNorth

[A&L_Ont]

1 hour ago, d9704011 said:

There are better odds of the earth being burned up in a supernova than you providing any useful insight on a discussion topic.

I’m starting to think that Smokey’s and Ace are related. 

[lizzius]

2 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Data means nothing when you spend all night in an ICU trying to keep one of your "statistics" alive. I don't have to prove anything to you.

We are *all* a hairs breath away from being that statistic for one reason or another. Life is full of risk... For most kids, COVID is not one of them.

 

[lizzius]

2 hours ago, molly361 said:

Because she's 23/24?😇

I wish! I'm older, and will be fully vaccinated at the end of next week. That age is because that's when the risk of death or hospitalization becomes significantly increased over background.

[Ocean Boy]

41 minutes ago, lizzius said:

We are *all* a hairs breath away from being that statistic for one reason or another. Life is full of risk... For most kids, COVID is not one of them.

 

Right, for most kids and life is full of risks. The problem is those who don't fall into the category of most. The other issue is the unpredictable nature of this virus.

 

It will be intetesting to see if the cruise lines and ports of call are going to risk unvaccinated people aboard their ships or coming onto their islands.

[lizzius]

2 hours ago, ZoeyVictoria said:

I was reading all posts to the end before I commented that it is very easy to tell who wants their unvaccinated children on a ship.  You beat me to it!  Seriously, reading the comments without looking at the username is a good indicator of those with children (and those who wouldn’t mind an adult only cruise).

If only there were lines that catered to "adults only"... 

 

I would like to bring my kids on our scheduled cruise, but we also have one scheduled without them. Some of the rhetoric about when and how vaccines should be required kind of miss the broader point: we are going to have to learn to live with COVID, and while vaccines can get us to an equilibrium point faster, we aren't doing ourselves any favors by pretending we can eliminate the risk entirely.

 

You can also tell with some of the later comments here that some of this is just thinly veiled animosity for parents traveling with children in general. I've seen it here before when the topic of meningitis or other childhood illness malpractice cases come up on cruise ships... A lot of "shame on the parents!" rather than holding cruise lines responsible for making sure they can at least provide adequate care for their passengers. Looks like that chicken is coming home to roost though, and rightfully so.

[Ocean Boy]

2 minutes ago, lizzius said:

If only there were lines that catered to "adults only"... 

 

I would like to bring my kids on our scheduled cruise, but we also have one scheduled without them. Some of the rhetoric about when and how vaccines should be required kind of miss the broader point: we are going to have to learn to live with COVID, and while vaccines can get us to an equilibrium point faster, we aren't doing ourselves any favors by pretending we can eliminate the risk entirely.

 

You can also tell with some of the later comments here that some of this is just thinly veiled animosity for parents traveling with children in general. I've seen it here before when the topic of meningitis or other childhood illness malpractice cases come up on cruise ships... A lot of "shame on the parents!" rather than holding cruise lines responsible for making sure they can at least provide adequate care for their passengers. Looks like that chicken is coming home to roost though, and rightfully so.

Just in case  you have pegged me as one of those you couldn't be any more wrong.

 

The cruise lines actually provide very good medical care for what they do out at sea. Unfortunately, you can't expect the Mass. General to be replicated on deck 1. People who have that sort of expectation should vacation in Boston.

[rimmit]

1 hour ago, Mapleleafforever said:

And I get the feeling that upwards of 80% of posters here only think that the vaccine is so they can cruise again. 

The vaccine has other purposes?

[ZoeyVictoria]

1 hour ago, lizzius said:

If only there were lines that catered to "adults only"... 

 

You can also tell with some of the later comments here that some of this is just thinly veiled animosity for parents traveling with children in general. I've seen it here before when the topic of meningitis or other childhood illness malpractice cases come up on cruise ships... A lot of "shame on the parents!" rather than holding cruise lines responsible for making sure they can at least provide adequate care for their passengers. Looks like that chicken is coming home to roost though, and rightfully so.

There were a few posters at the beginning of the pandemic who repeatedly stated that “old people”  should stay home and let the rest of the country go about their normal lives, including cruising.  I really struggled to refrain from commenting at that time.  Now that there is a lot of discussion about the possibility of vaccination being a requirement, I can’t help but wonder if any of those obnoxious posters have (unvaccinated) children.  

[lizzius]

5 minutes ago, ZoeyVictoria said:

There were a few posters at the beginning of the pandemic who repeatedly stated that “old people”  should stay home and let the rest of the country go about their normal lives, including cruising.  I really struggled to refrain from commenting at that time.  Now that there is a lot of discussion about the possibility of vaccination being a requirement, I can’t help but wonder if any of those obnoxious posters have (unvaccinated) children.  

I certainly wasn't, but we as a society have asked younger people (especially children) to make the bulk of the sacrifices (either financially, with their own health, or their educational future and development) to keep those at-risk safe. It's not really a situation where "fairness" matters, but imagine asking those same young people to wait even longer to rejoin society or travel because they can't get a vaccine they sacrificed to get into your arm.

[not-enough-cruising]

3 minutes ago, lizzius said:

I certainly wasn't, but we as a society have asked younger people (especially children) to make the bulk of the sacrifices (either financially, with their own health, or their educational future and development) to keep those at-risk safe. It's not really a situation where "fairness" matters, but imagine asking those same young people to wait even longer to rejoin society or travel because they can't get a vaccine they sacrificed to get into your arm.

“Wait longer to rejoin society”?? 

That’s a little melodramatic, I don’t know where you are from, but it seems young people have pretty much rejoined society in nearly all aspects of life. 

 

So what, they may need to wait an extra 6 months to cruise.  If you want to cruise with your children or grandchildren in the future, you should jump on the bandwagon of “do whatever possible to get ships sailing ASAP”, or there won’t be a cruise industry for your young ones to return to. 

[ZoeyVictoria]

6 minutes ago, lizzius said:

I certainly wasn't, but we as a society have asked younger people (especially children) to make the bulk of the sacrifices (either financially, with their own health, or their educational future and development) to keep those at-risk safe. It's not really a situation where "fairness" matters, but imagine asking those same young people to wait even longer to rejoin society or travel because they can't get a vaccine they sacrificed to get into your arm.

I am right back where I started from when I struggled to say nothing if I couldn’t say anything nice.  I’m done with this.

[MommaBear55]

5 hours ago, smokeybandit said:

Here's the thing about proof of vaccine, at least in the USA.

 

It's a cheap piece of card stock.  Very easy to fabricate.  Good luck knowing who truly has the vaccine and who doesn't (not specifically cruises, but anything requiring proof of vaccine)

When I got vaccinated, not only did my "card stock" have the vaccine type and lot number, it was put in a federal data base registry

[Ocean Boy]

19 minutes ago, lizzius said:

I certainly wasn't, but we as a society have asked younger people (especially children) to make the bulk of the sacrifices (either financially, with their own health, or their educational future and development) to keep those at-risk safe. It's not really a situation where "fairness" matters, but imagine asking those same young people to wait even longer to rejoin society or travel because they can't get a vaccine they sacrificed to get into your arm.

There has been plenty of sacrifice on the part of multiple age groups, workers, businesses, etc. No ones life has gone untouched. The adults in society did not bring this pox upon the kids.

 

I'm not quite sure what sacrifice those kids made in order to produce the vaccine that you referenced. I do, however, know about the sactifices the people getting those shots have made in the way of paying taxes to provide the education that you referenced.

 

Without adults on the cruise, the kids aren't going. After vaccinated adults go kids can follow when they are vaccinated or the pandemic ends, which ever comes first.

[lizzius]

5 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

“Wait longer to rejoin society”?? 

That’s a little melodramatic, I don’t know where you are from, but it seems young people have pretty much rejoined society in nearly all aspects of life. 

 

So what, they may need to wait an extra 6 months to cruise.  If you want to cruise with your children or grandchildren in the future, you should jump on the bandwagon of “do whatever possible to get ships sailing ASAP”, or there won’t be a cruise industry for your young ones to return to. 

I'm not talking specifically about cruising anymore... These vaccine mandates would have the potential to inhibit travel of any type if applied universally.

 

More broadly, in this thread or others like it you have people advocating for vaccine mandates at most public engagements, treating it almost like it's a "golden ticket". Not so "melodramatic" when you consider that if such an action were taken teenagers or children could essentially be banned from festivals, concerts, parks, or deprived of another 6 months to a year of in-person socialization via school or otherwise. I'm not saying that's what you're advocating for specifically, but you find yourself among that company. 

 

And we have been doing everything we can to keep the people we love safe, even though we are both a.) lower risk thanks to being in our mid 30's and b.) already on the way to being vaccinated since we signed up to be guinea pigs to as you say... Help get the job done faster. Until grandma and grandpa get vaccinated or the science is settled about transmission, that doesn't matter though.

[lizzius]

4 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

I'm not quite sure what sacrifice those kids made in order to produce the vaccine that you referenced. I do, however, know about the sactifices the people getting those shots have made in the way of paying taxes to provide the education that you referenced.

Yikes. See above about "kid haters".

[Ocean Boy]

4 minutes ago, lizzius said:

Yikes. See above about "kid haters".

Not at all, just a reaction to your  overly dramatic post. If you had any idea how much of my time I give to the youth in my town you would then understand just how wrong you are.

[not-enough-cruising]

46 minutes ago, lizzius said:

I'm not talking specifically about cruising anymore... These vaccine mandates would have the potential to inhibit travel of any type if applied universally.

 

More broadly, in this thread or others like it you have people advocating for vaccine mandates at most public engagements, treating it almost like it's a "golden ticket". Not so "melodramatic" when you consider that if such an action were taken teenagers or children could essentially be banned from festivals, concerts, parks, or deprived of another 6 months to a year of in-person socialization via school or otherwise. I'm not saying that's what you're advocating for specifically, but you find yourself among that company. 

 

And we have been doing everything we can to keep the people we love safe, even though we are both a.) lower risk thanks to being in our mid 30's and b.) already on the way to being vaccinated since we signed up to be guinea pigs to as you say... Help get the job done faster. Until grandma and grandpa get vaccinated or the science is settled about transmission, that doesn't matter though.

DRAMA

DRAMA

DRAMA

 

My teenage daughters don't conjur up this much drama

[Hammergirl]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

“Wait longer to rejoin society”?? 

That’s a little melodramatic, I don’t know where you are from, but it seems young people have pretty much rejoined society in nearly all aspects of life. 

 

So what, they may need to wait an extra 6 months to cruise.  If you want to cruise with your children or grandchildren in the future, you should jump on the bandwagon of “do whatever possible to get ships sailing ASAP”, or there won’t be a cruise industry for your young ones to return to. 

Wow - talk about narrow minded. I see you in are in Dallas and I am happy if the kids in your state have rejoined society, but kids in MN have definitely not.

 

1. Our kids in my area the public schools systems are in complete disarray. They went from distance learning from March of last year to about November of 2020, then they let kids come back 2 days a week. That lasted about 3 weeks before they sent everyone back home for distance learning until this month. Now they are letting SOME kids come back to school full-time while others have to continue distance learning. Some districts have already shut that down and returned the kids back to distance leaning. Some districts cannot even come back to school at all because the teachers are refusing to come back to school and teach. We have one 11th grader who loves distance learning so he is doing ok. But our 5th grader....we had to shell out $11,000 to a private school just so she could go to school full-time and get a decent education and not fall behind. 

 

2. Our kids were finally allowed to come back to sports BUT they have to wear masks 100% of the time. Both my kids play basketball were so excited to be able to be with their friends again, so we agreed to let them play. Each game so far, at least one kid on one of the teams have thrown up from having to wear that mask that is basically making them hyper-ventilate. 

 

3. Kids are dealing with MAJOR mental health issues from having to be isolated from friends, teachers....human beings. Suicide is a major problem. 

 

4. We just got the ability go back and eat in restaurants again, but there are rules that come with that too. Weddings, funerals and gatherings and even church have not been able to happen for almost a year, although I think you can have a certain about of people now as of lately. 

 

So I am not exactly sure where you are getting that our kids have rejoined society. These kids have been put through more than enough and I think they deserve a little bit of respect for what they are going through. The distaste for children on this site is so sad to me. We (my husband and I) teach our kids to respect their elders but the way people on here talk about them, it makes me wonder why they should respect you when you clearly have zero respect for them. 

[lizzius]

37 minutes ago, Hammergirl said:

Wow - talk about narrow minded. I see you in are in Dallas and I am happy if the kids in your state have rejoined society, but kids in MN have definitely not.

Inb4 someone tells you to move or some version of "your kids aren't our responsibility" thus missing all of the points completely.

[Hammergirl]

5 minutes ago, lizzius said:

Inb4 someone tells you to move or some version of "your kids aren't our responsibility" thus missing all of the points completely.

Yep totally expect it. Kind of like the pinnacle who sat in the suite lounge giving my kids dirty looks while SHE sat there and clipped her nails and let them fall onto the carpet. 🙄

[not-enough-cruising]

2 hours ago, Hammergirl said:

Wow - talk about narrow minded. I see you in are in Dallas and I am happy if the kids in your state have rejoined society, but kids in MN have definitely not.

 

1. Our kids in my area the public schools systems are in complete disarray. They went from distance learning from March of last year to about November of 2020, then they let kids come back 2 days a week. That lasted about 3 weeks before they sent everyone back home for distance learning until this month. Now they are letting SOME kids come back to school full-time while others have to continue distance learning. Some districts have already shut that down and returned the kids back to distance leaning. Some districts cannot even come back to school at all because the teachers are refusing to come back to school and teach. We have one 11th grader who loves distance learning so he is doing ok. But our 5th grader....we had to shell out $11,000 to a private school just so she could go to school full-time and get a decent education and not fall behind. 

 

2. Our kids were finally allowed to come back to sports BUT they have to wear masks 100% of the time. Both my kids play basketball were so excited to be able to be with their friends again, so we agreed to let them play. Each game so far, at least one kid on one of the teams have thrown up from having to wear that mask that is basically making them hyper-ventilate. 

 

3. Kids are dealing with MAJOR mental health issues from having to be isolated from friends, teachers....human beings. Suicide is a major problem. 

 

4. We just got the ability go back and eat in restaurants again, but there are rules that come with that too. Weddings, funerals and gatherings and even church have not been able to happen for almost a year, although I think you can have a certain about of people now as of lately. 

 

So I am not exactly sure where you are getting that our kids have rejoined society. These kids have been put through more than enough and I think they deserve a little bit of respect for what they are going through. The distaste for children on this site is so sad to me. We (my husband and I) teach our kids to respect their elders but the way people on here talk about them, it makes me wonder why they should respect you when you clearly have zero respect for them. 

Move your kids to Dallas so they can rejoin society then. 
 

Seriously though, how has debating the merits of a completely vaccinated ship turn into “anti children”?  If it gets ships sailing and revenue moving, what’s the problem. Everyone who can’t sail In the he beginning (hypothetically) will survive.  
 

It just goes to show that some on here can turn anything into an insult or an argument., where none exist. 

[Ellaleah]

4 hours ago, lizzius said:

I certainly wasn't, but we as a society have asked younger people (especially children) to make the bulk of the sacrifices (either financially, with their own health, or their educational future and development) to keep those at-risk safe. It's not really a situation where "fairness" matters, but imagine asking those same young people to wait even longer to rejoin society or travel because they can't get a vaccine they sacrificed to get into your arm.

This  is the goofiest post on the board.  I am over 70.  I have been in the house almost exclusively since last March.  I have had a lot of time to think about this.  The kids will be alright.  This will pass and it will become a memory for them.  My contemporaries, on the other hand, are losing the end of our lives.  You are making it sound like kids today are living through Europe during WWII with bombs dropping around them.  It sounds like a lot of people on this board have little experience with Covid.  My whole family has had it and the kids were barely effected, but you don’t have to be old to get very sick.    We are in Arizona and that means that everything is open.  My grandchildren go to school and sports.  I’m not saying that is good, but just bring the kids here us you want them to sacrifice less.    Arizona is the number #1 hotspot for Covid in the country.  It is too dangerous to go to the grocery store.

Children will be vaccinated by the end of the year and I think that is when cruising might resume.  I don’t believe that any cruise line will risk lawsuits allowing anyone on who is not vaccinated.  I continue to be amazed by all the people on here that want to cruise before it is safe.  Do you really need the cruise line or the CDC to tell you that it is not and will not be for quite awhile?