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Well, now this is interesting.....Looks like Florida may have gotten it's way.


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2 hours ago, Tampa Girl said:

Florida AG has just petitioned the Supreme Ct., on an emergency basis, to block CDC's protocols on cruise ships.  Hmm....  And if that should be granted, does our governor not envision the possibility that ships could sail from other ports that might be convenient to U.S. customers?  

You would think they would have better things to do in Florida right now given their growing Covid rates.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/22/2021 at 7:16 PM, Daniel A said:

Has anybody heard boo from the two judges who stayed the injunction?  They said opinions to follow.  If they had a literally last minute opinion last Saturday night, they should have been able to articulate their decision in a day or two.  It is looking like a decision in search of a rationale.

Now we have heard from all three judges: The stay issued by the 11th Circuit panel was just vacated by them and the same three judges have now DENIED the motion made by the CDC.  It looks as if it is now the Conditional Sail Suggestions in Florida.

Edited by Daniel A
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1 hour ago, Daniel A said:

Now we have heard from all three judges: The stay issued by the 11th Circuit panel was just vacated by them and the same three judges have now DENIED the motion made by the CDC.  It looks as if it is now the Conditional Sail Suggestions in Florida.

Hold my shocked 😲 face. How often does a circuit panel vacate its own stay?

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

What does this mean??

The two judges on the 11th Circuit panel who were on the side of the 2-1 decision to stay Judge Merryday's order should have filed their opinions in a timely fashion.

 

As you may recall, the stay was issued at around midnight on a weekend. Opinions, which should have been forthcoming, were never issued.

 

Then - magically - well after hours** on a Friday night, same judges vacated their own decision. (Technically only 2, because there was one against already.)

 

For those of you who are just tuning in, Florida was ready to appeal to the Supreme Court.
They announced it roughly an hour before.

 

I'm sure the CDC is keeping its powder dry. They're going to unleash all the studies that support their position when the time is right.

 

** You may shocked to hear that the Court was not in the building at these times.

Edited by POA1
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glad we no longer fly  & no longer seek  cruising from the florida ports . San Diego is our home port & we could drive to San Pedro or  Long Beach with in 1.5 hours to catch a local cruise   .Even  sailing from San Francisco is  quite a long drove but rather that than fly & from there we can see Alaska for the 6th time  

 

 We wish that we could cruise like to New Zealand or Australia ,spend some time there & cruise back 

 

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, POA1 said:

The two judges on the 11th Circuit panel who were on the side of the 2-1 decision to stay Judge Merryday's order should have filed their opinions in a timely fashion.

 

As you may recall, the stay was issued at around midnight on a weekend. Opinions, which should have been forthcoming, were never issued.

 

Then - magically - well after hours on a Friday night, same judges vacated their own decision. (Technically only 2, because there was one against already.)

 

For those of you who are just tuning in, Florida was ready to appeal to the Supreme Court.
They announced it roughly an hour before.

 

I'm sure the CDC is keeping its powder dry. They're going to unleash all the studies that support their position when the time is right.

Mask wearing  imo is imminent on all cruise ships ;as well as social distancing . To be relatively safe ,we can not see ships cruising with full ships of pax  in the future  .not only this Delta variant that  can cause illness in vaccinated people ;but the variants that follow could even be worse 

 

 As long as there are great numbers of people unvaccinated the cruise industry will have to suck it up  & tighten  their belts . Then ultimately will the cruise experience be relatively the same or worse than past experiences  for all of us .This imo is what we really want to know about . 

 

 Unfortunately ,it is going to take a long time if ever to vaccinate this world not just the USA ,Canada , Europe & other favorite cruise destinations .Check out the mask wearing at the Olympics this Friday  July 23rd & they are for the most part young & in great physical shape 

 

 

Edited by mcrcruiser
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9 hours ago, POA1 said:

Hold my shocked 😲 face. How often does a circuit panel vacate its own stay?

First there was a CSO

And then there was no CSO

And then???????

 

To be sung to the tune of First There Was a Mountain by Donovan

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, KirkNC said:

This thing is a circus 🤡 

I disagree! A circus is fun and meant to be entertaining. This is just a farce being played out by our court system.

Edited by ontheweb
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6 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

Mask wearing  imo is imminent on all cruise ships ;as well as social distancing . To be relatively safe ,we can not see ships cruising with full ships of pax  in the future  .not only this Delta variant that  can cause illness in vaccinated people ;but the variants that follow could even be worse 

 

 As long as there are great numbers of people unvaccinated the cruise industry will have to suck it up  & tighten  their belts . Then ultimately will the cruise experience be relatively the same or worse than past experiences  for all of us .This imo is what we really want to know about . 

 

 Unfortunately ,it is going to take a long time if ever to vaccinate this world not just the USA ,Canada , Europe & other favorite cruise destinations .Check out the mask wearing at the Olympics this Friday  July 23rd & they are for the most part young & in great physical shape 

 

 

You may well be right. If so, our cruising days are over. I’ll be damned if I am going to spend all that money and have to go back to wearing a mask because of the idiots who have refused to be vaccinated. 

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I really don't think this changes anything. All it means is the CDC can only recommend, not mandate. I believe the cruise lines will continue following the recommendations as they have until now.

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28 minutes ago, jimmy2x said:

You may well be right. If so, our cruising days are over. I’ll be damned if I am going to spend all that money and have to go back to wearing a mask because of the idiots who have refused to be vaccinated. 

The problem is even though we are vaccinated ,we can still get sick but not so ill that we wind up in a hospital in the majority of cases   .when a community gets a load of non vaccinated population ,even vaccinated folks would be wise to wear a mask . Los angeles county ,the most populated county in the USA has recently reinstalled Mask wearing indoors .Thus ,we can see the need  to wearing a mask like going to the dining room  & in the theatre & casino &  any areas where a lot of people might congregate 

 

 Some of us will never cruise with a mask mandate & yet many will cruise with that mandate in place . There is no self serve in the buffet any longer

 

 Just seems to me cruising will be going forward but with more regulations in place for the safety of every one on the ships 

 

 We have resigned  ourselves that if we want to cruise we most likely will be wearing our masks in some locations on the ship 

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50 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I disagree! A circus is fun and meant to be entertaining. This is just a farce being played out by our court system.

Your right!  And at the end of the day the cruise lines will follow the CDC guidelines regardless of the out come in court.

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39 minutes ago, jimmy2x said:

You may well be right. If so, our cruising days are over. I’ll be damned if I am going to spend all that money and have to go back to wearing a mask because of the idiots who have refused to be vaccinated. 

I’ll be surprised if some mask wearing is not required for a while.  Hopefully it will be limited but at ports it’s not up to the cruise lines.  I don’t think we have even begun to understand the changes we will see in cruising.

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4 minutes ago, KirkNC said:

Your right!  And at the end of the day the cruise lines will follow the CDC guidelines regardless of the out come in court.

Kurt  you are right they got to follow the CDC  guidelines to stay healthy  or fail  &  that would be it for cruising as we all know it   . The unfortunate fact is that this virus will not go away & will continue to mutate as long as there are people in the world that are not vaccinated

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40 minutes ago, deliver42 said:

I really don't think this changes anything. All it means is the CDC can only recommend, not mandate. I believe the cruise lines will continue following the recommendations as they have until now.

Yes, they want to have safe cruises. They do not want the public relations disaster a highly infected cruise would turn into. They want to work with the CDC to keep things safe as possible.

 

I do think they would rather there be CDC rules rather than recommendations since if passengers complained, they could say we have to follow the CDC rules.

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22 minutes ago, KirkNC said:

Your right!  And at the end of the day the cruise lines will follow the CDC guidelines regardless of the out come in court.

And that makes this whole court battle even more of a farce. There are good reasons the cruise lines did not join Florida in this law suit. I bet they just wish it would go away.

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26 minutes ago, KirkNC said:

I’ll be surprised if some mask wearing is not required for a while.  Hopefully it will be limited but at ports it’s not up to the cruise lines.  I don’t think we have even begun to understand the changes we will see in cruising.

It is going to be interesting as we all venture forward in cruising ,Kurt .  imo ,you are right we have not seen nor experienced the changes 

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Regarding the "mask wearing is imminent" comment this is not true for Seabourn on their current Greek Island cruises (out of Pireaus).  While the crew does wear masks it is not required of the passengers.  I believe that the Celebrity Apex (also cruising the Greek Islands) also does not require mask wearing.

 

As to Florida's winning it's court case this means that cruise lines embarking out of Florida ports are free to implement their own policies without interference from the CDC.   It will be interesting to see what the cruise lines do.  One immediate impact is that the CDC's ridiculous mandate that cruise lines could not have cruises longer then 7 days no longer exists.

 

Hank

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17 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

Under the topic “be careful what you wish for”:

 

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/cdc-says-mask-rules-apply-022106563.html

That's an interesting article.  I don't believe Judge Merryday will permit the CDC inflicting punishment on only those ships that do not comply with the CSO.  That on its face is making it a mandatory requirement rather than medical guidance.  It clearly flies in the face of the injunction.  The CDC response to the lifting of the stay sounds more like an intemperate child having a tantrum.  If CDC wants to implement these provisions across the board on all cruise ships, that's one thing, but this article says these rules will only apply to those ships not voluntarily complying with the CSO.

 

Additionally, the rule only applies to the first and last 12 miles out of Florida.

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1 hour ago, KirkNC said:

I’ll be surprised if some mask wearing is not required for a while.  Hopefully it will be limited but at ports it’s not up to the cruise lines.  I don’t think we have even begun to understand the changes we will see in cruising.

You and some of the other folks may be right. We are booked for 21 days on the Nieu Statendam beginning 2/23.  We can live with a few reasonable restrictions so long as we can hangout at the stern pool without being required to wear a mask. 

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Posted (edited)

Common sense ideally should prevail about whether to wear a mask or not on any cruise ship . imvho  while these variants are around because the world is not vaccinated  sufficiently  ,cruise ships are & always have been a petrie dish for viruses   .All we all need to look at how many ships have come down with the  stomach virus    over the past years .  Reason  people  have been  careless in  good hygene   by not thoroughly washing their hands before entering the buffet or other food venues that is serve one self 

 

 The  difference   between  the noro virus   & the   covid variants is that  folks don't usually die of noro but ,they do of covid 

Edited by mcrcruiser
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