Scattering of human remains at sea

[Pyrate13]

Also agree with dressing the way you feel is right. just my thoughts but I would ask myself, what would he be enjoying on the cruise and how would he be dressed for the day? If my family were doing this for me I would want them to be celebrating my way of enjoying the trip, dressing as I would have been dressed, and having a good time. But again, that's just me. 

[Shmoo here]

2 hours ago, Pyrate13 said:

If my family were doing this for me I would want them to be celebrating my way of enjoying the trip, dressing as I would have been dressed, and having a good time. But again, that's just me. 

Not just you.  That's exactly why my mother-in-law wore pink at father-in-law's memorial service.  He liked her in pink, so that's what she wore.  She also asked the family "not to dress in black" as he (specifically) had mentioned that to her in the past.

 

 

[XBGuy]

I might be disagreeing with the consensus, here.  Also, I may be speculating on the poster's actual question.  She thought that shorts and flip flops would be inappropriate.  Clearly, she will not be wearing shorts and flip flops. A memorial service is for the living as much as for the departed.  As the deceased's closest survivor, can she to ask the other attendees to "dress appropriately?"  I think the answer to that question is, "Yes."

[CPT Trips]

XBGuy hit the nail on the head. The ceremony is for the living respecting the expressed desires of the deceased. OP can certainly request the attire desired. 
 

 

[Kmkub]

On 1/16/2022 at 8:46 AM, Ferry_Watcher said:

I was at a funereal home with a relative helping to chose a burial urn and one of the options available was a biodegradable sea turtle container.  As weird as it sounds, the turtle made me smile thinking that the turtle with the ashes inside would just float off and soon disappear under the waves.  It just seemed peaceful.

 

We spread both my mom's and dad's ashes is the same spot off the Florida Keys. We scattered dad's ashes, but we saw the biodegradable container for mom, so we went with that. We were so disappointed when the container sunk to the bottom and just sat there. 

 

On 1/15/2022 at 9:26 PM, navybankerteacher said:

I believe this is the operative phrase.  Dumping a sealed package of ashes, rather than “scattering” the loose ashes — the end result is the same, it is just that the image is less photogenic.

 

What is being disposed of consists essentially of little chunks of calcium (bone) not the sort of  dust-like “ashes” you see in an ashtray.

 

First hand experience, here. No chunks; just grey dust.

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, Kmkub said:

 

We spread both my mom's and dad's ashes is the same spot off the Florida Keys. We scattered dad's ashes, but we saw the biodegradable container for mom, so we went with that. We were so disappointed when the container sunk to the bottom and just sat there. 

 

 

First hand experience, here. No chunks; just grey dust.

Your experience is yours - not necessarily universal.

 

The fact that disposal from a ship usually involves dropping a sealed water soluble container over the side  prevents that "grey 'dust" from being blown about, makes the point (in this context: cruise ship disposals} academic. 

[mom says]

1 hour ago, Kmkub said:

We were so disappointed when the container sunk to the bottom and just sat there. 

 

Did you expect it to instantly dissolve? That's not what they are designed to do. Biodegradation takes a while, depending on what they're made of and their environment.

[Kmkub]

6 minutes ago, mom says said:

Did you expect it to instantly dissolve? That's not what they are designed to do. Biodegradation takes a while, depending on what they're made of and their environment.

No. The funeral director told us it would float for awhile and slowly sink down.

 

It went down like a lead balloon.

 

 

[navybankerteacher]

14 minutes ago, Kmkub said:

No. The funeral director told us it would float for awhile and slowly sink down.

 

It went down like a lead balloon.

 

 

The remains weigh about five or six pounds (at least) - typically in a container about the size of a two pound coffee can — that weight in that volume is not going to be buoyant.

[Kmkub]

8 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

The remains weigh about five or six pounds (at least) - typically in a container about the size of a two pound coffee can — that weight in that volume is not going to be buoyant.

 

Thank you for the lesson. Grieving people are going to take the funeral director at their word, and not try to map out the physics in their heads.

 

 

[navybankerteacher]

Just now, Kmkub said:

 

Thank you for the lesson. Grieving people are going to take the funeral director at their word, and not try to map out the physics in their heads.

 

 

Your earlier post made it clear that taking funeral directors at their word is not necessarily a better idea.

[Kmkub]

5 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

Your earlier post made it clear that taking funeral directors at their word is not necessarily a better idea.

Thank you for the lesson.

[navybankerteacher]

Just now, Kmkub said:

Thank you for the lesson.

You are very welcome.

[CPT Trips]

Edited February 2, 2022 by CPT Trips

[OVgirl]

11 hours ago, Kmkub said:

No. The funeral director told us it would float for awhile and slowly sink down.

 

It went down like a lead balloon.

 

 

I have read the suggestion that when transferring remains to the biodegradable bag to leave some extra air in the bag to increase buoyancy. This should help it float a little longer.

[chengkp75]

20 hours ago, Kmkub said:

We spread both my mom's and dad's ashes is the same spot off the Florida Keys. We scattered dad's ashes, but we saw the biodegradable container for mom, so we went with that. We were so disappointed when the container sunk to the bottom and just sat there. 

This statement, that you saw the urn sitting on the bottom, begs a question from me.  How far offshore were you when you held the ceremony?  Federal law requires the scattering (with or without urn) be done at least 3 miles offshore, and while I am aware of the beautiful water clarity of the water at the Keys, I would think that at 3 miles, it was too deep to see the bottom.  Also, the EPA is required to be notified if the remains are scattered within 12 miles of shore.

[navybankerteacher]

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

This statement, that you saw the urn sitting on the bottom, begs a question from me.  How far offshore were you when you held the ceremony?  Federal law requires the scattering (with or without urn) be done at least 3 miles offshore, and while I am aware of the beautiful water clarity of the water at the Keys, I would think that at 3 miles, it was too deep to see the bottom.  Also, the EPA is required to be notified if the remains are scattered within 12 miles of shore.

Valid question — it I seems very likely that very few people who dispose of cremated remains themselves would do so in compliance with EPA (and/or local) requirements.   Getting a small boat more than three miles off shore is an effort — and who would know how to, or even think of, making required formal notification of such disposal.

 

Although, it can be argued that such requirements applied to properly cremated remains are excessive — when compared with regulations governing pet feces, food refuse, etc. which clearly represent much greater threats to the environment.

[CPT Trips]

10 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

This statement, that you saw the urn sitting on the bottom, begs a question from me.  How far offshore were you when you held the ceremony?  Federal law requires the scattering (with or without urn) be done at least 3 miles offshore, and while I am aware of the beautiful water clarity of the water at the Keys, I would think that at 3 miles, it was too deep to see the bottom.  Also, the EPA is required to be notified if the remains are scattered within 12 miles of shore.

Based on a very small sample size, I’d say most such ceremonies are accomplished close to shore and may not even be from a boat (think paddle out).

 

 

 

[rkacruiser]

5 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

Valid question — it I seems very likely that very few people who dispose of cremated remains themselves would do so in compliance with EPA (and/or local) requirements.   Getting a small boat more than three miles off shore is an effort — and who would know how to, or even think of, making required formal notification of such disposal.

 

Although, it can be argued that such requirements applied to properly cremated remains are excessive — when compared with regulations governing pet feces, food refuse, etc. which clearly represent much greater threats to the environment.

 

For those who choose to have their remains be scattered at sea, maybe it is time to add a bit more to the old cliche that one cannot escape taxes, death, and government regulations after death.  

[chengkp75]

15 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

For those who choose to have their remains be scattered at sea, maybe it is time to add a bit more to the old cliche that one cannot escape taxes, death, and government regulations after death.  

Even on land, you're not free of government regulations after death, as there are laws about where you can/can't scatter ashes on land, and where you can bury someone.  In Maine, you can bury someone in your yard, but you must declare it a private cemetery, and meet requirements for registering it as a deed, and how to mark/enclose it, etc.

[navybankerteacher]

23 hours ago, CPT Trips said:

Sometimes a courteous, opaque, reply is the best response to sarcasm.

[Thecat123]

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Even on land, you're not free of government regulations after death, as there are laws about where you can/can't scatter ashes on land, and where you can bury someone.  In Maine, you can bury someone in your yard, but you must declare it a private cemetery, and meet requirements for registering it as a deed, and how to mark/enclose it, etc.

 

Even here in New Zealand I was asked if my mother had died in the house when I went to sell it by the Real Estate person as some religions would not then  buy it

[navybankerteacher]

11 minutes ago, Thecat123 said:

 

Even here in New Zealand I was asked if my mother had died in the house when I went to sell it by the Real Estate person as some religions would not then  buy it

That is a common problem -- especially if a homicide was involved.  Nicole Simpson's house was a drug on the market, and the house where the Sandy Hook (CT) school shooter lived could not be sold at any price at all,  and wound up having to be torn down -- despite the fact that it was in excellent condition.  In fact, just being near a cemetery or a funeral home hurts sale value .   People are kind of stupid, superstitious, or whatever -- but they let the colleywobbles they feel come with human mortality govern much of their lives.

[ldubs]

13 hours ago, Thecat123 said:

 

Even here in New Zealand I was asked if my mother had died in the house when I went to sell it by the Real Estate person as some religions would not then  buy it

 

That would be a standard disclosure for many cultures here where I live too.  Not at all unusual and hopefully I will not be called names, but one that we personally would want disclosed.   

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, ldubs said:

 

That would be a standard disclosure for many cultures here where I live too.  Not at all unusual and hopefully I will not be called names, but one that we personally would want disclosed.   

Of course, proximity in time makes a big difference.   Any house having had human occupancy for much more than 100 years is fairly likely to have had a death occur within its walls.  There may not be many that old in California, but in New England there are plenty dating back to the 1700's --- well before there were nursing homes, when a whole lot of people died at home. 

 

Then, too, in England, an old house whose history includes a centuries-old murder is actually likely to sell at a premium.