Holland America Line pop quiz

[chengkp75]

2 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Great training for everyone involved however, "live" MOBs have since been replaced by "dummies" / mannequins and/or life buoys  

Don't believe ISM accepts the risks involved with this.  😜

[Copper10-8]

4 hours ago, ski ww said:

If they have a hard time finding a dummy dressed in orange I can see where it would be difficult finding some one who fell off a ship & the only thing showing is a head bobbing in the swells.

 

Right you are! There are some incredible stories of MOB's being found alive after several hours in open seas. One that come to mind was an individual with military survival training who took off his pants and shirt, tied the end of the legs/ams together, got air in them, tied off the waist, and used it as a personal flotation device.

 

Most, unfortunately, are not that ingenious and/or lucky however. If we, as passengers, see anyone go overboard on a cruise, throw a nearby life buoy overboard, get someone around you, if available, to try to keep an eye on the MOB and direction last seen, and get to a house phone ASAP to call 911 via the officer of the watch immediately. As stated, 911 calls go directly to the bridge on HAL

Edited March 17, 2022 by Copper10-8

[Copper10-8]

So, for today; where does the HAL crew have their meals?

[rafinmd]

There's a crew mess which I believe is one deck below the tender gangway.  Some officers and people like entertainers get to dine in the lido.

 

Roy

 

 

[rafinmd]

14 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Right you are! There are some incredible stories of MOB's being found alive after several hours in open seas. One that come to mind was an individual with military survival training who took off his pants and shirt, tied the end of the legs/ams together, got air in them, tied off the waist, and used it as a personal flotation device.

That's a skill that's also practiced by the Boy Scouts (now Scouts, BSA) as part of Swimming Merit Badge.

 

Roy

[chengkp75]

13 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

So, for today; where does the HAL crew have their meals?

Likely the officer's dining room, one or two crew messes, and others variously named on different lines;  duty mess, staff mess, PO mess.  But, don't count me, I'm a ringer.

Edited March 17, 2022 by chengkp75

[USN59-79]

43 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Right you are! There are some incredible stories of MOB's being found alive after several hours in open seas. One that come to mind was an individual with military survival training who took off his pants and shirt, tied the end of the legs/ams together, got air in them, tied off the waist, and used it as a personal flotation device.

 

Most, unfortunately, are not that ingenious and/or lucky however. If we, as passengers, see anyone go overboard on a cruise, throw a nearby life buoy overboard, get someone around you, if available, to try to keep an eye on the MOB and direction last seen, and get to a house phone ASAP to call 911 via the officer of the watch immediately. As stated, 911 calls go directly to the bridge on HAL

I was once the Officer of the Deck on a Navy repair ship steaming from the Philippines toward Vietnam when a sailor who was painting fell off the port side.  Received the call "Man Overboard!" and started a Williamson Turn by turning the ship sharply to port.  After the ship turns about 90 degrees you turn the wheel the opposite way.  By that time the senior watch officer came to the bridge to relieve me.  We were able to pick up the sailor and bring him onboard in about half an hour.  I remember hearing about the same time that a sailor had fallen from a destroyer in that area at night and hadn't been missed until the next morning.  I believe he did the same thing with his trousers that Copper mentioned as he was found alive by a passing ship the next day.  Luckily the waters in that area are warm.

Ray

[Copper10-8]

6 minutes ago, USN59-79 said:

I was once the Officer of the Deck on a Navy repair ship steaming from the Philippines toward Vietnam when a sailor who was painting fell off the port side.  Received the call "Man Overboard!" and started a Williamson Turn by turning the ship sharply to port.  After the ship turns about 90 degrees you turn the wheel the opposite way.  By that time the senior watch officer came to the bridge to relieve me.  We were able to pick up the sailor and bring him onboard in about half an hour.  I remember hearing about the same time that a sailor had fallen from a destroyer in that area at night and hadn't been missed until the next morning.  I believe he did the same thing with his trousers that Copper mentioned as he was found alive by a passing ship the next day.  Luckily the waters in that area are warm.

Ray

 

Thanks for your story and for your service to our country, Ray!

 

[chengkp75]

Williamson turns, along with the Anderson and Sharnov turns are still taught, and still required to be trained in, but are falling out of use these days.  They were designed to get the ship back on the original course line, on the reciprocal heading, so you theoretically end up closest to the point the man went overboard.  Now, the bridge's ECDIS (Electronic Chart Data & Information System), which incorporates a digital chart, radar inputs, and GPS locations, has an "emergency marker" button, that when pushed (when the OOW receives word of man overboard), and that position is kept on the ECDIS display, so they can steer directly for the exact spot, not just the old course line.

 

You also commence any of these turning maneuvers by turning in the direction that the man fell overboard.  If he is on the port side, you turn to port, as this moves the propellers further to starboard, and away from the man.

Edited March 17, 2022 by chengkp75

[USN59-79]

7 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Williamson turns, along with the Anderson and Sharnov turns are still taught, and still required to be trained in, but are falling out of use these days.  They were designed to get the ship back on the original course line, on the reciprocal heading, so you theoretically end up closest to the point the man went overboard.  Now, the bridge's ECDIS (Electronic Chart Data & Information System), which incorporates a digital chart, radar inputs, and GPS locations, has an "emergency marker" button, that when pushed (when the OOW receives word of man overboard), and that position is kept on the ECDIS display, so they can steer directly for the exact spot, not just the old course line.

 

You also commence any of these turning maneuvers by turning in the direction that the man fell overboard.  If he is on the port side, you turn to port, as this moves the propellers further to starboard, and away from the man.

It would have been nice to use modern technology, but my ship was built in 1944 and this happened in 1972.  Since our ship had twin screws, I and the other junior officers trained to qualify as OOD by driving a twin screw tug boat that was owned by the U.S. Army stationed out of Okinawa.  We learned the Williamson and Anderson turns, but have not heard of the Sharnov turn.  Incidentally, still have my copy of Knight's Modern Seamanship that was issued to me at that time.

[0bnxshs]

8 hours ago, ski ww said:

On a Baltic cruise a passenger saw what he thought was a person in the water & called man over board, the ship stopped and we got to watch as they recused him. Turns out it was a dummy, dropped, fell, forgot from a passing ship,

 

I well remember this!  I was so very impressed with the immediacy of the response by the ship and crew that it sticks out in my mind to this day!  We were all relieved when it was announced that it was a lost dummy and life ring from a ship that had likely not been able to recover it during a drill and how the Captain stated that particular (un-named) vessel was in for some good natured razzing and round-buying.  All was well that ended well. 

 

But I now know that this is treated with all the seriousness it deserves by ships at sea.  Other vessels in sight (cargo ships) also made maneuvers to assist in recovery too, or so it appeared.  I was proud of Prinsendam's crew and HAL for that.

 

Thanks, John, for this thread!  And everyone for all the lessons!

[Copper10-8]

9 hours ago, rafinmd said:

There's a crew mess which I believe is one deck below the tender gangway.  Some officers and people like entertainers get to dine in the lido.

 

Roy

 

 

 

9 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Likely the officer's dining room, one or two crew messes, and others variously named on different lines;  duty mess, staff mess, PO mess.  But, don't count me, I'm a ringer.

 

 

Yes on both! So, usually located on A-Deck behind the "Crew Only" doors, every HAL ship has a Crew Mess (for ratings), a Petty Officer (PO) Mess (for supervisors) and an Officer Bar (OB) (tough one, yes for officers) where meals are taken (4x daily in the Crew Mess, incl. a late meal for those working a night shift). In addition, the larger ships have a separate  "Dirty Officers Mess" off the P.O. mess. "Dirty Officers so, primary the engineering officers can have their meals there while still dressed in their work overalls. Lastly, and as has been stated, those with officer status, incl. the contract employees such as the shoppies, spa employees, casino, photo, art, etc., are allowed to consume their meals in the Lido. Officers can host tables on "gala nights" in the main dining room and have limited privileges in the specialty restaurants

 

The Crew Mess is a multi-purpose room, also used for training, meetings, and get togethers/socializing, i.e. the always popular crew bingo nights. On certain occasions, i.e. Christmas Eve, Indonesian and Filipino Independence Day celebrations, officers, incl. the ship's captain, will take shifts serving food to the crew. Most of the OB's have an Irish Pub decorum and a small "kitchenette" in between it, and the adjoining P.O. Mess.   

[ski ww]

Watched an excellent show on the Smithsonian the other night about a WW1 troop ship called the SS Justicia it has a connection to the Holland America Line. Can Copper10-8 fill in the details.

[VMax1700]

11 minutes ago, ski ww said:

Watched an excellent show on the Smithsonian the other night about a WW1 troop ship called the SS Justicia it has a connection to the Holland America Line. Can Copper10-8 fill in the details.

https://www.titanicbelfast.com/history-of-titanic/ship-fact-files/justicia-fact-file/

[VMax1700]

Here is a bit more info and photo of the wreck.

Good 'Irish' connection from 'start' to 'finish'. 😭

https://coastmonkey.ie/ss-justicia/

[Sir PMP]

Noticed Captain Bos in there..

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, Sir PMP said:

Noticed Captain Bos in there..

 

Good eyes Meneer uit Den Haag! Great captain, one of the best, loved by his crew! Retired March 2018, four years already, Almost forgot, a huuuuuge Formula One racing fan, no doubt ecstatic about the current world champion 😉 

 

Edited March 18, 2022 by Copper10-8

[rafinmd]

A little piece of trivia from me.  Captain Bos will be my captain with the longest span of years, first on Rotterdam V in 1997 and last on Veendam in 2013.

 

Roy

[Copper10-8]

3 hours ago, ski ww said:

Watched an excellent show on the Smithsonian the other night about a WW1 troop ship called the SS Justicia it has a connection to the Holland America Line. Can Copper10-8 fill in the details.

 

Statendam II was ordered by HAL in December 2011 and launched from the Harland & Wolf yard in Belfast, Northern Ireland on July 6, 1914. She had four full decks and six cargo holds however, never sailed for HAL. Due to the start of World War I and Great Britain entering in it in August 1914, all work on her was suspended until 1916. During that year, the laid up hull was seized by the British Government with the intention of completing her as a troopship with a capacity of 4,300 men. Upon her completion and entry into service on April 7, 1917 under the name ss (steam ship) Justicia, she was the sixth biggest ship in the world.  The name was chosen in line with the then Cunard system in which all ship names ended in the letter "a"

 

Justicia did not serve with Cunard however, because the White Star Line (think Titanic) had a complete crew available from the torpedoed Britannic and therefore management of the Justicia was handed over to them. They kept her name; otherwise she would have been renamed with a name ending in "ic" 

 

On Friday, July 19, 1918, while sailing in convoy underway from Liverpool to New York, Justicia was attacked by the Kaiserliche Marine / German Imperial Navy submarine / unterseeboot (under sea boat) UB-64 under the command of Kaptitanleutnant Otto von Schraeder some 20 miles north of Skerryvore, a remote island that lies off the west coast of Scotland.

 

The first torpedo hit at 1350 hours (1:50 PM). followed by four more around 1600 hrs. (4 PM) One of them missed and two were diverted by gunfire. The fourth caused more damage and disabled Justicia's powerplant. Around 2000 hrs. (8 PM) Justicia was taken under tow by HMS Sonia, ex-Limburg, a hired rescue tug with a course set for Lough Swilly, between the western side of the Inishowen Peninsula and the Fanad Pensinsula, County Donegal, in the Republic of Ireland. Meanwhile, UB-64 was located by Royal Navy vessels, attacked, presumably damaged, and chased off.

 

Like sharks that smell blood in the water however, Justicia under tow, was attacked a second time on the following day, July 20, 1918 at 0910 hours (9:10 AM) by German U-boat UB-124 which fired two torpedoes which struck Justicia on the port side of Holds No. 3 and No. 5. Justicia sank three hours later near Malin Head, the most northerly point of mainland Ireland, located in the townland of Ardmalin, on the Inishowen Peninsula, in County Donegal. One officer, a 3rd engineer, and 15 firemen lost their lives in the attacks. UB124 was later sunk by cannon fire from the Royal Navy destroyers HMS Marne (G35), HMS Milbrook (G08) and HMS Pigeon (H67). The Justicia was the second largest ship during World War I. Her wreck lies 28 miles north-west of Malin Head in waters 223 feet deep.

 

  

 

 

 

 

 

[Copper10-8]

The quiz for today; how many house flags has HAL had in its history?

[1ANGELCAT]

7 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

The quiz for today; how many house flags has HAL had in its history?

6

[Copper10-8]

2 hours ago, 1ANGELCAT said:

6

 very close, Cat............but it's actually five (5)! There have been five (5) house flags in HAL's history

 

The first one, under HAL's forerunner NASM (Nederlandsch Amerikaansche Stoomvaart Maatschappij), Dutch for Netherlands American Steam Navigation Company from 1873 until 1971, complete with the Green/White/Green bands/official colors of the city of Rotterdam, its birthplace. Those same green/white/green bands could by found on the yellow colored funnels of NASM/HAL's ships. NASM was soon called Holland Amerika Lijn (Dutch spelling for America and Line) which was officially adopted in 1896

 

#2 - This new house style (1971-1983) included new hull colors (from gray to dark blue), the new flag and a new funnel logo (three stylized waves - light blue/white/light blue - on an orange background; orange being the official family name of the Dutch Royal Family, the House of Oranje-Nassau, as well as the clors most Dutch national sports team compete in, in other words; the color most associated with the Netherlands). This flag and logo soon acquired the nickname of "the three slugs".

 

#3 - (1983-2000) The first appearance of the HAL logo that now included Henry Hudson's sailing ship "De Haelve Maen" (The Half Moon) superimposed on "The Darling of the Dutch," the Nieuw Amsterdam II from 1938 with a dark blue hull, once again on an orange background.

 

#4 - (2000-2016) - Similar to its predecessor but with the orange background replaced by three royal blue/white/royal blue bands for the background and the Nieuw Amsterdam II's hull "lightened up" in similar blue colors

 

#5 - (2016-present) De Haelve Maen was removed from the logo, the Nieuw Amsterdam II "modernized" somewhat with darker colors and a more stylized ocean, and the blue/white/blue bands changed into a now solid, darker blue background     

Edited March 18, 2022 by Copper10-8

[Copper10-8]

For 97 years (1873-1970) HAL operated with pretty much all Dutch crews in all positions onboard. In the Fall of 1970, that all changed primarily due to a very progressive Dutch tax system. What was the nationality of the new crew members who joined Ryndam II in that year?

 

[Sir PMP]

48 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

For 97 years (1873-1970) HAL operated with pretty much all Dutch crews in all positions onboard. In the Fall of 1970, that all changed primarily due to a very progressive Dutch tax system. What was the nationality of the new crew members who joined Ryndam II in that year?

 

British..

[Alphen]

52 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

For 97 years (1873-1970) HAL operated with pretty much all Dutch crews in all positions onboard. In the Fall of 1970, that all changed primarily due to a very progressive Dutch tax system. What was the nationality of the new crew members who joined Ryndam II in that year?

 

🇮🇩Indonesia

Edited March 19, 2022 by Alphen