HAL continuing to downgrade its product

[LAFFNVEGAS]

46 minutes ago, Destiny0315 said:

Right, even NCL offers an exclusive Studio Lounge for the pax in their Studio inside staterooms that is very similar to the Neptune Lounge in some ways with complimentary snacks and refreshments, a large screen TV, and available room service from there, at a considerably lower price point.

As well as Suites with NCL and the Haven is Night and Day different Experience from HAL. Far premium experience from NCL with price point being pretty much the same for the same itinerary and number of days.While it is a year since I was last on NCL Haven Suite I will be returning this weekend and can have a fresh experience of what NCL offers to Suite.

[BetsyS.]

5 minutes ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

As well as Suites with NCL and the Haven is Night and Day different Experience from HAL. Far premium experience from NCL with price point being pretty much the same for the same itinerary and number of days.While it is a year since I was last on NCL Haven Suite I will be returning this weekend and can have a fresh experience of what NCL offers to Suite.

Bon Voyage!

[Mary229]

49 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

How about charging people for cruises.  I pay plenty for mine.  I get super tired of this charge more attitude.  When you book your next cruise get them to add another $500 or $1000 to the total.

That is what I was inadequately implying.  A consistent, quality, mid market cruise for the traveler at a price.  I am fine with packages such as spa packages, drink packages, etc….   I don’t like the piecemeal method of charging for a shrimp here or a lobster there. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by Mary229

[Florida_gal_50]

1 hour ago, oaktreerb said:

Some things I can get if I ask for them, like chocolates, towel animals, and slippers.  I feel silly asking for towel animals.  We have to go to upgrade to Club Orange/Neptune Suite for fresh orange juice and Sel de Mer for lobster. 

 

The chocolate extravaganza was wasteful.  The Orange Party may have replaced it.  

 

Gratuity for specialty dining?  When did that start?

I’ve heard people say they’ve gotten chocolates by asking.  I haven’t had that luck.  As a matter of fact last November you couldn’t even get them on dressy nights.  I heard every excuse in the book.  These stewards where almost the worst I’ve had on a hal ship so that might have been part of the issue.  I had a lovely female steward last time but I just get tired of having to beg for small things.

[Laminator]

51 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

How about charging people for cruises.  I pay plenty for mine.  I get super tired of this charge more attitude.  When you book your next cruise get them to add another $500 or $1000 to the total.

We got through this all the time. I am in a business where an association of some sort or the other will purchase a piece of equipment for a school or school district. Although the school receives the equipment I still get paid for it. Same with HAL. They are getting their money. Obviously these pax are doing something to get these offers. And obviously you are not. I got another offer for another Free Neptune Suite today. My wife received the same offer. I am willing to give you one of these Free Neptune Suites. Maybe once you can see what we do that gets us the offers you will have a better understanding. 

 

[Florida_gal_50]

3 minutes ago, Laminator said:

We got through this all the time. I am in a business where an association of some sort or the other will purchase a piece of equipment for a school or school district. Although the school receives the equipment I still get paid for it. Same with HAL. They are getting their money. Obviously these pax are doing something to get these offers. And obviously you are not. I got another offer for another Free Neptune Suite today. My wife received the same offer. I am willing to give you one of these Free Neptune Suites. Maybe once you can see what we do that gets us the offers you will have a better understanding. 

 

Nope.  Random people that haven’t sailed much or recently are getting these offers.  They have nothing to do with the casino.  Since we’ve gone over it so much you shouldn’t be confused.  Remember you get offers because you spend $2 or 3 hundred K per trip or maybe per hand 😛😂🤪.

[PACD_JG]

10 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

I’ve heard people say they’ve gotten chocolates by asking.  I haven’t had that luck.  As a matter of fact last November you couldn’t even get them on dressy nights.  I heard every excuse in the book.  These stewards where almost the worst I’ve had on a hal ship so that might have been part of the issue.  I had a lovely female steward last time but I just get tired of having to beg for small things.

 

[Wakepatrol]

[Florida_gal_50]

14 minutes ago, PACD_JG said:

 

Do you ever say anything nice?   I guess you are posting a self portrait here.  You post nothing but nasty comments about everyone.  

[PACD_JG]

5 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

Do you ever say anything nice?   I guess you are posting a self portrait here.  You post nothing but nasty comments about everyone.  

If I "Like" or "Thanks" a comment, that's me saying something nice.  Relax...although rare considering the amount of comments you make per day, I have "Like"d or "Thanks"d some of yours.

[maryandmarge]

I can't say anything but good things about our room stewards on the Nieuw Amsterdam for 17 days.   They came and introduced themselves when we received our luggage and asked for our requests while being on ship.    We asked for morning service and not evening -  ice twice a day - towel animals - and chocolates.   We received excellent service along with our requests all 17 days.   From the second day on they were calling us by our names each time we saw them.    They would go out of their way to acknowledge us in the hallway and asked if we needed anything else.    We remember the food being more variety in past Holland cruises.    

[cruisemom42]

1 hour ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

As well as Suites with NCL and the Haven is Night and Day different Experience from HAL. Far premium experience from NCL with price point being pretty much the same for the same itinerary and number of days.While it is a year since I was last on NCL Haven Suite I will be returning this weekend and can have a fresh experience of what NCL offers to Suite.

 

Of course that assumes you're sailing only for the accommodations. While NCL does offer some interesting destinations, they don't really measure up to HAL...

[Destiny0315]

5 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

Of course that assumes you're sailing only for the accommodations. While NCL does offer some interesting destinations, they don't really measure up to HAL...

I agree on the fact that HAL will take you to places that NCL will never venture to but even the destination cruisers are looking for things that make travelling to those destinations more interesting and valuable than just another "ride on the boat".

[AFNavigator]

10 hours ago, Mary229 said:

I would rather they raise prices or charge for extra service than to reduce the quality.  It is going to have to happen one way or the other.  Judging by the reaction of many level headed veteran cruisers here on CC perhaps they should pull off the bandaid and raise prices 

Keep inflation in mind when thinking about the nickel and dime cost increases or loss of previous services or amenities.

 

It would be interesting to hear from veteran cruisers what a typical HAL cruise, let's say a 7 night to St Thomas, cost 15 years ago compared to today's base price, inflation adjusted.  US inflation over that 15 year span equates to a 38% cost increase.  If the inflation-adjusted base cruise fare is lower now, that would be one explanation of losing some of the amenities that used to be included or are still available but now have a fee.

 

If you look at just since the COVID shutdown began, inflation has increased 14%.  That equates to a $700 increase on a $5,000 cruise.  Many passengers booked on cruises happening right now may still be using up FCC that they received from cruises booked pre-COVID--plus 25% bonus FCC for not asking for a refund.

 

HAL, as well as other cruise lines, has also had to eat significant COVID-related costs both in terms of shipboard costs (sanitation/filtration changes, restricted booking capacity, operating over a year without passengers, etc.) and in direct passenger related compensation such as FCC for COVID-positive cancellations pre-cruise, FCC for onboard quarantine days, and reimbursement for post cruise quarantine costs.  In the past, if you are sick, sorry you are sick, but you don't get any compensation for being sick pre/during/post cruise.

 

I'm not defending HAL nor am I saying HAL isn't nickel and diming customers--they are and it is certainly annoying.  I'm just trying to say costs are going up everywhere and something has to give if the cruise fares aren't keeping pace with inflation.  Look at airfares--they are double or more on many common routes compared to a couple years ago.  Cruise fares haven't increased at anywhere near that rate.

Edited November 1, 2022 by AFNavigator
Added Information

[LAFFNVEGAS]

42 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Of course that assumes you're sailing only for the accommodations. While NCL does offer some interesting destinations, they don't really measure up to HAL...

When was last time you sailed on NCL? Do you have first hand eperience and knowledge or is it hear ay? Just curious??

[cruisemom42]

3 minutes ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

When was last time you sailed on NCL? Do you have first hand eperience and knowledge or is it hear ay? Just curious??

 

Not sure you understood what I was saying. I am talking about itineraries. I don't need to have sailed with NCL recently to realize that their itineraries overall are not as interesting as HAL's.

 

In the interests of full transparency, I did have an NCL cruise booked -- an interesting one -- that included Iceland and Greenland that would have sailed in August. But I ended up canceling it because of the toxic attitude of so many NCL cruisers about sharing a table at dinner. As a solo cruiser, I do not want to sit by myself at a table night after night -- especially not on a cruise of two weeks or longer. But once I started reading experiences, I realized that a large number of NCL passengers avoid the practice of dining with others like the plague.

 

I cruise on many different lines, not just HAL. Recent cruises have mostly been Celebrity.  The only point I was trying to make is that suites and suite amenities are not of interest to everyone. Other factors may be much higher on my list. 

 

Frankly, I don't even miss most of the things that have been trotted out (again). Library? I bring my Kindle. Yum-yum man -- really?  Never ever once got something from that cart. Never wear the provided robe or slippers and towel animals I find creepy. Food quality does concern me but as already mentioned that is hardly unique to HAL in these post-COVID times.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

they don't really measure up to HAL...

No its the "They don't really measure up to HAL" I am commenting on. Unless you have sailed on NCL how would you know???

[Destiny0315]

Well one thing that can be said about NCL is that they were one of the first to start implementing added costs for this and that while onboard, some of which was worthy of it, some not. Their customer base has been seeing that for years now and has adjusted to it, while the HAL customer base has seen some things just disappear with no options offered.

[LMaxwell]

12 hours ago, DaveOKC said:

The list of things I noticed is too long to list here 

 

 

 

Seems like the most appropriate place and as much space as you could need to list your observations. I have no context for your claims otherwise. 

[LMaxwell]

4 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Now available (as of 2020) at the Ocean Bar at HH time which is 4:00 P. M.

 

 

Sorry, I just got off Nieuw Amsterdam and went to Ocean Bar AND Billboard for Happy hours; all they have is honey roasted peanuts. 

[LMaxwell]

3 hours ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

Nope.  Random people that haven’t sailed much or recently are getting these offers.  They have nothing to do with the casino.  Since we’ve gone over it so much you shouldn’t be confused.  Remember you get offers because you spend $2 or 3 hundred K per trip or maybe per hand 😛😂🤪.

If you get a free offer, turn it down then out of principle. 

[Florida_gal_50]

6 hours ago, LMaxwell said:

If you get a free offer, turn it down then out of principle. 

I have no desire to sit in a casino inhaling smoke when I can be outside in the warmth with the sound of the ocean.  Not much of a decision.   

[Mary229]

8 hours ago, AFNavigator said:

It would be interesting to hear from veteran cruisers what a typical HAL cruise, let's say a 7 night to St Thomas, cost 15 years ago compared to today's base price, inflation adjusted

Even in fixed dollars the prices have not increased much or at all.   It is sort of strange that many cruises now cost less than the flight to get to them, even domestic.  In 2019 I flew round trip DFW to FLL for a 12 night southern Caribbean with HAL.  The cabin was $799 pp and the flight was $250 pp.  that same inside cabin today would be about the same price but the flight would be double or more .

 

Many of us remarked in 2020 that travel was going to be more expensive.  I understand that.

 

 DH is very loyal to HAL and he never sees the invoice so he doesn’t care but he wants his standard of quality and service. Recently that quality has diminished.  I have been generous allowing some latitude for the restart and supply chain issues.   Our next cruise is a grand voyage segment, I am hoping for a memorable, unmarred voyage.

[AFNavigator]

1 minute ago, Mary229 said:

Even in fixed dollars the prices have not increased much or at all.   It is sort of strange that many cruises now cost less than the flight to get to them, even domestic.  In 2019 I flew round trip DFW to FLL for a 12 night southern Caribbean with HAL.  The cabin was $799 pp and the flight was $250 pp.  that same inside cabin today would be about the same price but the flight would be double or more .

 

Many of us remarked in 2020 that travel was going to be more expensive.  I understand that.

 

 DH is very loyal to HAL and he never sees the invoice so he doesn’t care but he wants his standard of quality and service. Recently that quality has diminished.  I have been generous allowing some latitude for the restart and supply chain issues.   Our next cruise is a grand voyage segment, I am hoping for a memorable, unmarred voyage.

My point exactly.  Inflation is driving up cruise line costs so either they increase fares or they peel off or charge for formerly included amenities and services.  Holding fares and services in a high inflation environment is a recipe for a business going broke.

 

Comparing to airlines again, most domestic US airlines have gone to "basic economy" where you now need to pay extra for assigned seating and carry-on luggage privileges.  Virtually all (except Southwest, notably) now charge for checked bags.  Many are now charging for beverages and snacks that used to be included.  Major hotel chains are no different.  Most now only provide daily housekeeping on request.

[ontheweb]

8 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Not sure you understood what I was saying. I am talking about itineraries. I don't need to have sailed with NCL recently to realize that their itineraries overall are not as interesting as HAL's.

 

In the interests of full transparency, I did have an NCL cruise booked -- an interesting one -- that included Iceland and Greenland that would have sailed in August. But I ended up canceling it because of the toxic attitude of so many NCL cruisers about sharing a table at dinner. As a solo cruiser, I do not want to sit by myself at a table night after night -- especially not on a cruise of two weeks or longer. But once I started reading experiences, I realized that a large number of NCL passengers avoid the practice of dining with others like the plague.

 

I cruise on many different lines, not just HAL. Recent cruises have mostly been Celebrity.  The only point I was trying to make is that suites and suite amenities are not of interest to everyone. Other factors may be much higher on my list. 

 

Frankly, I don't even miss most of the things that have been trotted out (again). Library? I bring my Kindle. Yum-yum man -- really?  Never ever once got something from that cart. Never wear the provided robe or slippers and towel animals I find creepy. Food quality does concern me but as already mentioned that is hardly unique to HAL in these post-COVID times.

I'm with you on based on our past experience, NCL is not our favorite cruise line. Also, I was the one that started threads asking about sharing tables, and was just as annoyed as you about the general attitude. However, we now have an NCL cruise booked, and it was because both DW and I were blown away by the itinerary which starts in London (Southampton) and ends in Reykjavik with ports in Belgium, Amsterdam, 3 in Norway, and 3 in Iceland ending with an overnight in Reykjavik. Despite, some misgivings about NCL we intend to have a wonderful cruise including celebrating an anniversary on a sea day.