Myanmar, is refund possible after final payment

[ssawjo]

On 3/31/2023 at 11:09 PM, bob brown said:

Also following this with interest…

For those of us on the current full ATW, if “O” decides at some point to divert around Myanmar, while being a disappointment to some, many of us will just take it in stride, as part of the adventure of travel.  Worst case would be an extra three sea days, or better would be extra time in the previous or following ports, or any nearby alternative choices where a berth was available.

I understand the concern of those just booking a segment mainly to reach Myanmar…

 

Bob, please keep us informed as to what transpires about Myanmar.  Whether you skipped the port, had alternate port calls, or just sea days.  Thank you.

[bob brown]

12 hours ago, ssawjo said:

Bob, please keep us informed as to what transpires about Myanmar.  Whether you skipped the port, had alternate port calls, or just sea days.  Thank you.

I’ll try to remember to do that…if not on this thread, I’m sure myself or someone else on board will mention any such notice on our ATW Roll Call thread…

[PaulMCO]

On 3/23/2023 at 7:22 PM, the more ports the better said:

I booked the overland to Bagan on the O website.  It leaves the first morning, tours Yangon then flies to Bagan, stays the night and tours the temples the next day then flies back to Yangon.

 

My only question is that we have sanctions against the military in charge of the country and their airlines.  I wonder how we are going to fly there without violating the sanctions.

You can' if there were complete OFAC Treasury sanctions on the country.  Right now they are only sanctioning the Generals and members of the Junta.

 

We missed Myanmar on our first area sailing (Capetown to Singapore) and made it on the second Hong Kong to Athens).  The first one O cancelled after final payment and substituted Chenai and Sri Lanka stops. O provided zero credits for the changes.

 

At this point it is only the state of political safety that would be the concern.

 

If Oceania offers an overland, it is preferred in case there is a cancellation, change due to tides, or other force majeure issues.

[ssawjo]

Just read several articles that the Myanmar govt. has decided to bomb it's own citizens and suspended elections from this coming August to who knows when.  It is my opinion, FWIW, that Oceania, and other cruise lines will  NOT be calling at Yangon anytime in the near future.

[YWGcruisers]

I don't understand why anyone on board the Insignia right now can't get any information about their week at sea that includes 3 days in Myanmar. They are supposed to be there in a couple of weeks. An alternate plan must already be in place. Whats the big secret?!

 

[vaitape]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/12/myanmar-airstrike-on-civilians-sparks-global-outcry-as-witnesses-describe-attack?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

 

Why isn't Oceania informing us of the alternate plan for Myanmar? As YWGcruisers asked, WHAT'S THE BIG SECRET?

 

If we're just going to float around, tell us. If other ports have been arranged, tell us. 

 

 

 

[bob brown]

As mentioned in similar threads, I’ll attempt to get more information today.

The problem is not the on board crew, but the home office not making it “official” as yet.  
When they finally do, I’m sure we’ll find a letter in our cabin telling us so…🤷‍♂️

[bob brown]

I went to our “ATW Concierge”, and asked her, but (as expected), they could not confirm that we will skip Myanmar until the Miami offices release that decision.

And yes, she is well aware of the frustration that is causing for many, but it is “above her pay grade” to remedy the situation…

 

I suppose I could try to escalate it to the general manager, or even the captain, but I don’t consider it worth the effort, as I am fairly certain we will not be going there, and am content to wait for official word, whenever it comes, perhaps by the time we reach Dubai.

 

If anyone not on board finds that unacceptable, you are welcome to pursue it with the Miami office…🤷‍♂️

[vaitape]

2 hours ago, bob brown said:

I went to our “ATW Concierge”, and asked her, but (as expected), they could not confirm that we will skip Myanmar until the Miami offices release that decision.

And yes, she is well aware of the frustration that is causing for many, but it is “above her pay grade” to remedy the situation…

 

I suppose I could try to escalate it to the general manager, or even the captain, but I don’t consider it worth the effort, as I am fairly certain we will not be going there, and am content to wait for official word, whenever it comes, perhaps by the time we reach Dubai.

 

If anyone not on board finds that unacceptable, you are welcome to pursue it with the Miami office…🤷‍♂️

Bob,

Thank you very much for your efforts.

We can't understand what the deal is with O's lack of communication and respect for their passengers. 

 

 

 

Edited April 14, 2023 by vaitape

[YWGcruisers]

9 hours ago, bob brown said:

I went to our “ATW Concierge”, and asked her, but (as expected), they could not confirm that we will skip Myanmar until the Miami offices release that decision.

And yes, she is well aware of the frustration that is causing for many, but it is “above her pay grade” to remedy the situation…

 

I suppose I could try to escalate it to the general manager, or even the captain, but I don’t consider it worth the effort, as I am fairly certain we will not be going there, and am content to wait for official word, whenever it comes, perhaps by the time we reach Dubai.

 

If anyone not on board finds that unacceptable, you are welcome to pursue it with the Miami office…🤷‍♂️

Hi Bob,

We really appreciate your efforts while you’re on board right now.  

 

I have been writing the Miami office over the last few weeks (copying all senior management) and I’ve escalated it all the way to the Vice President of the company. I finally received a response yesterday that we should hear something soon.  

 

We too, have a vested interest as we have a similar sailing from Dubai to Singapore that includes three days in Myanmar and four days at sea.  We want to know what their plan is before we commit to this segment of the sailing.

Looking forward to hearing from you again soon!

[the more ports the better]

I am the OP, I went ahead and cancelled the Singapore to Dubai sailing next month because of the Myanmar situation, between war and sanctions, it is to risky business wise and personally.  If they would have just told me that they were skipping it, I could have gone on the sailing.  I booked the sailing to see Myanmar and Bagan but would have gone if they refused a refund after announcing the cancellation of the port.  They refused to give an answer on Myanmar so I didn’t even have that option as it became apparent that Myanmar was not going to get better as they claimed so visiting is a non starter.

 

Now that I have cancelled the sailing, airline tickets, hotels, and scheduled normal meetings and deadlines at work, they will cancel Myanmar, probably after everyone arrived in Singapore.
 

O said they could not consider an exception to refunds unless I cancel first so I cancelled the $24k sailing and their answer is they will give us a $5k pp future cruise credit which has to be used in 2023 and will not even refund the Bagan overland which they will obviously not be offering, therefore clearly not paying an operator and pocketing my money.

 

I am out a lot of money due to O’s lack of transparency and it is maddening.  

 

[bob brown]

12 hours ago, the more ports the better said:

I am the OP, I went ahead and cancelled the Singapore to Dubai sailing next month because of the Myanmar situation, between war and sanctions, it is to risky business wise and personally.  If they would have just told me that they were skipping it, I could have gone on the sailing.  I booked the sailing to see Myanmar and Bagan but would have gone if they refused a refund after announcing the cancellation of the port.  They refused to give an answer on Myanmar so I didn’t even have that option as it became apparent that Myanmar was not going to get better as they claimed so visiting is a non starter.

 

Now that I have cancelled the sailing, airline tickets, hotels, and scheduled normal meetings and deadlines at work, they will cancel Myanmar, probably after everyone arrived in Singapore.
 

O said they could not consider an exception to refunds unless I cancel first so I cancelled the $24k sailing and their answer is they will give us a $5k pp future cruise credit which has to be used in 2023 and will not even refund the Bagan overland which they will obviously not be offering, therefore clearly not paying an operator and pocketing my money.

 

I am out a lot of money due to O’s lack of transparency and it is maddening.  

 

Ouch!….I “feel your pain”…that certainly is not a good outcome.

I hope you had “cancel for any reason” trip insurance.  If not, something to consider for future travel plans, especially in questionable places…

[YWGcruisers]

On 4/14/2023 at 10:14 AM, the more ports the better said:

I am the OP, I went ahead and cancelled the Singapore to Dubai sailing next month because of the Myanmar situation, between war and sanctions, it is to risky business wise and personally.  If they would have just told me that they were skipping it, I could have gone on the sailing.  I booked the sailing to see Myanmar and Bagan but would have gone if they refused a refund after announcing the cancellation of the port.  They refused to give an answer on Myanmar so I didn’t even have that option as it became apparent that Myanmar was not going to get better as they claimed so visiting is a non starter.

 

Now that I have cancelled the sailing, airline tickets, hotels, and scheduled normal meetings and deadlines at work, they will cancel Myanmar, probably after everyone arrived in Singapore.
 

O said they could not consider an exception to refunds unless I cancel first so I cancelled the $24k sailing and their answer is they will give us a $5k pp future cruise credit which has to be used in 2023 and will not even refund the Bagan overland which they will obviously not be offering, therefore clearly not paying an operator and pocketing my money.

 

I am out a lot of money due to O’s lack of transparency and it is maddening.  

 

This is very upsetting to read.  Not how you would expect a premium cruise line to take care of their guests.  FYI… marketing at Oceania put your sailing on sale this weekend at 45% off without adjusting the itinerary.  Unbelievable!  
 

[susiesan]

On 4/14/2023 at 10:14 AM, the more ports the better said:

 

 

I am out a lot of money due to O’s lack of transparency and it is maddening.  

 

Maybe you would have recourse from your credit card company to dispute the charge for the overland portion.O Oceania sold you a product that they won't deliver on so you should be able to get your money back on that portion of the charges. Also, go to your state's attorney general office to file a complaint for shoddy business practices.

[RetiredLifer]

Was Bagan an Oceania overland package?
From the Oceania site:

“Packages & Amenities - Cancellation Amount 

• Pre- and post-cruise hotel packages within 60 days prior to departure - 100% of fee
• Pre- and post-cruise land packages within 60 days prior to departure - 100% of fee
• Overland packages within 60 days prior to departure - 100% of fee
• Shore excursions within 36 hours prior to the shore excursion - 100% of fee
• Shore excursion packages on or after embarkation - 100% of fee
• Private transfers within 36 hours of departure - 100% of fee
• Executive Collection - private cars & vans within 36 hours of departure - 100% of fee
• Visa packages within 60 days prior to departure - 100% of fee
• Airfare once ticketed (beginning 60 days prior to departure) - 100% of fare
• Custom air fee once accepted - 100% of fee
• Air supplemental fee within 60 days - 100% of fee
• La Reserve by Wine Spectator or Privée reservations or Culinary Center classes within 36 hours of scheduled reservation or class - 100% of fee”

Correct  me if I am wrong, you did cancel within 60 days prior to departure. Correct?  Not saying it is right, only pointing out what Oceania says.

[the more ports the better]

Yep, it is an overland so I technically shouldn’t get a refund as I cancelled within 60 days but Oceania is 100% going to cancel the overland tour.  They can’t possibly fly to Bagan when the military is air bombing their own citizens on the ground in that region.  O will not pay an airline or tour operator for the overland so why would they keep my $2400?

[bob brown]

I am wondering…if you were aware that by canceling in the penalty period you stood to lose 100% anyway, why not just wait and see if Oceania would cancel it, and then give you all or most back in some form?🤔

[cruisr]

What a shame.  I spent 9 days there in 2013.  The people were so kind and just lovely.  I eschewed touristy stuff and did things on my own such as the Circular Train in Rangoon where I was the only westerner onboard and loved Bagan.  The airports and flights bring a whole new definition to chaos.  I hope it works out for those on the cruise but it doesn’t look like it will.

[bob brown]

It’s now official…

 

[Queen of DaNile]

Not a surprise. Myanmar has been questionable for years. We cancelled our 2022 trip that included it because of serious concerns a few months before O cancelled the entire cruise.

[YWGcruisers]

7 hours ago, bob brown said:

It’s now official…

 

 

Hi Bob,

Thank you for the update.  It’s almost exactly what I had anticipated except for the Port Blair stop in the Andaman islands.

 

We just have to be patient now and wait for them to adjust the itineraries for the remainder of the year so that we can plan alternate shorex.  

Take care and happy sailing!

[FlyerTalker]

On 4/13/2023 at 11:07 PM, vaitape said:

We can't understand what the deal is with O's lack of communication and respect for their passengers.

Maybe, just maybe, it had to do with waiting until alternative arrangements had been firmed up.  It's not like ports just have docks sitting around empty all the time.

 

To support this, look at the revised itinerary posted above.  There's a bunch of backtracking here, as the ship goes south to Sabang, then east to Langkawi, north to Phuket and south again to KL.

 

Thought problem:  Imagine the howls if Oceania said "We're cancelling Myanmar, but have no alternative plans to announce". The cry would be "why can't you do something?"  Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[vaitape]

1 hour ago, FlyerTalker said:

Maybe, just maybe, it had to do with waiting until alternative arrangements had been firmed up.  It's not like ports just have docks sitting around empty all the time.

 

To support this, look at the revised itinerary posted above.  There's a bunch of backtracking here, as the ship goes south to Sabang, then east to Langkawi, north to Phuket and south again to KL.

 

Thought problem:  Imagine the howls if Oceania said "We're cancelling Myanmar, but have no alternative plans to announce". The cry would be "why can't you do something?"  Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Flyer Talk,

Usually I agree with you. You're one of my favorite posters because of your knowledge and insight. But, disagree with on your "thought problem".

 

We would have appreciated knowing that Myanmar was canceled and would have accepted "we have no alternative plans to announce at this time., however we are diligently working on a new itinerary. Your safety is our priority" or something like that.

 

COMMUNIATION is not one of O's strong points.

Edited April 19, 2023 by vaitape

[bob brown]

9 hours ago, vaitape said:

Flyer Talk,

Usually I agree with you. You're one of my favorite posters because of your knowledge and insight. But, disagree with on your "thought problem".

 

We would have appreciated knowing that Myanmar was canceled and would have accepted "we have no alternative plans to announce at this time., however we are diligently working on a new itinerary. Your safety is our priority" or something like that.

 

COMMUNIATION is not one of O's strong points.

Absolutely!

The passengers, (or at least the reasonable ones) could understand and accept the necessity to skip a port and alter an itinerary for their own safety.   They may be disappointed, but would get over it.

What they anguish over the most, is the uncertainty of not knowing, one way or the other.

So yes, @vaitape’s suggestion is what they should have done earlier, and then when settled, release the new itinerary.

[1985rz1]

24 minutes ago, bob brown said:

Absolutely!

The passengers, (or at least the reasonable ones) could understand and accept the necessity to skip a port and alter an itinerary for their own safety.   They may be disappointed, but would get over it.

What they anguish over the most, is the uncertainty of not knowing, one way or the other.

So yes, @vaitape’s suggestion is what they should have done earlier, and then when settled, release the new itinerary.

I'm not so sure about @vaitape's strategy.  While I agree that O's communication skills are lacking, to tell passengers that they are going to skip a port but don't have the alternatives worked out yet would be quite unsettling to many. The anguish over the uncertainty of not knowing is not really relieved but just redirected, and for some that anxiety may be heightened.  I think they feel it's better to have the new itinerary in place before starting all sorts of speculation and discord.  It ain't easy to please everyone.