Princess Fine Art Auctions...Buyer Beware!

[Nebr.cruiser]

What's a buyer's premium? Do you mean you have to pay them extra for the privilege of buying the artwork?

[MercedMike]

Princess Fine Art Auctions...Buyer Beware!

 

If you're planning to attend an art auction on one of the Princess cruise ships, I'd like to warn you of the pit-falls of buying their art based on my recent experience.

 

My husband and I had purchased several works of art on previous cruises and had been impressed by both the promises of the auctioneers and the follow-up by Princess Fine Art. We'd spent about $80,000 total and, as promised, had been allowed to return one piece for a full refund and another to be reframed. In another case, Princess asked us to return a Picasso etching because they were no longer sure of its authenticity. In that case, they gave us an additional 15% because our money had been tied up in it for almost two years. Long story short, our previous experiences had been good, so we didn't hesitate to spend more money when we took a cruise on the Star Princess in the fall of 2006.

 

During our cruise in the fall, we purchased (or rather attempted to purchase): 1) an Alexandra Nechita painting, which we selected from a photograph because the painting was on another ship, 2) an Alexandra Nechita sculpture at an auction on the ship, and 3) a Roxy lithograph that was not on the ship but which we'd seen before. Here's how each of those purchases turned out...

 

1) Alexandra Nechita painting, $42,000 plus buyer's premium of $4200.

When we received the painting and saw it in person, we decided that we did not want it, partly because the colors were not as vibrant as we expected and partly because we decided we wanted something larger (which we WOULD have bought on a future Princess cruise). Although we'd been told we had 90 days to return the painting for a full refund, I received a message from Princess on January 15th saying that they would NOT refund the $4200 buyer's premium. Fortunately for us, their accounting department screwed up and I had already received a check for the full amount a couple of days prior to their message.

 

2) Alexandra Nechita sculpture, $13,500 plus buyer's premium of $1350. We were led to believe we were buying the sculpture on the ship, as they supposedly had three in their inventory; however, six weeks later when we still hadn't received it, I inquired as to where it was and found out that they were waiting on additional sculptures from the artist and that it would be approximately SIX MONTHS before we would receive it. Initially I was told that our buyer's premium would be forfeited if we cancelled the order, but after I pointed out that selling one piece of fine and delivering another constitutes fraud, I did receive a message that the full amount would be returned. I finally received a check on February 23rd, approximately six weeks after I asked for a refund and over four months after we had paid for the sculpture in full.

 

3) Roxy lithograph, approximately $200. This was another piece I had to inquire about after six weeks, only to find out they had no record of the purchase. After I provided proof, they did send it promptly; however, the frame was damaged and the glass scratched. They offered to reframe it, so I returned it, and it was then sent back in another frame that was also damaged, but we decided to just live with it.

 

While I still believe you can SOMETIMES get good prices on the artwork from Princess, you really have to do your research. For example, shortly before our fall cruise we had been to a Nechita show at a local gallery, and so we knew the prices on the less expensive works (like the lithos) were a good deal, but the paintings were selling right at the same price. The other advice I'd give is: 1) Don't buy anything unless you're absolutely sure you want to keep it forever or are willing to sell it through a third party, 2) Don't believe anything the auctioneers tell you...there's a reason it's not in writing, and 3) Don't believe that Princess Fine Art values you as a customer, no matter how much you spend.

 

HMMM?? It appears to me that at least six times they have done everything you asked of them. The only complaint left, after reading through all you say above, seems to be a scratched frame on a $200 painting that you decided to live with.

 

It appears to me that the Art Company (Park West, I think ...?) really values you as a customer and rolls over on its back to accomodate you, even when you decide you just don't like the colors.

 

I certainly agree with all your final points, and personally I restrict my on board purchases to t-shirts, but I don't understand why you feel unvalued as a customer.:confused:

[Another ship trip]

Yes, like most auctions there is a buyer's premium. Kind of silly, huh? No sales tax but this premium is like double tax!

 

First auctions I saw on cruise ships were in early 1993. They were a novelty and interesting initially. I learned early that these probably rivaled the casino for most money taken in. What a superb salesman the art autioneer has to be as he "educates" his audiences.

 

I played in the casino on my last cruise with a guy who tossed away about 10 grand on average a night. (He would win but would usually spend it all back plus thousands). He was an art dealer for one of these major places like Park West. Said there was lots of money to be made in the "art business." Interpret as you will...

[Times Prince]

All things considered, despite the hassle factor, you appeared to work most of your issues out with Princess. It does seem that you did your research, but one is not going to get the same degree of customer satisfaction in dealing with a large organization as you would with a local gallery. This is not to be unexpected. And it is reflected in the lower price that you paid than you would otherwise (by your own admission).

Most of us buy relatively inexpensive pieces of art and do not have the same issues regarding buyers premiums and items not in stock.

I think I can say - without going out on a limb- that your purchases are not typical of those of most of us on CC. I think it is going for us to be hard to relate to your dissatisfaction.

My experience agrees with Jacqueline's conclusion. We have been totally satisfied with both the quality of the artwork and framing, as well as the post sales experience.

 

Our purchases have been across the price range (sorry, I won't divulge the contents of my house on a public forum), and we have always purchased art that pleases us. Any auction is a buyer beware proposition, and it is best to do some homework before making major investments.

 

The Invoice form one signs onboard ship contains the clause

 

" Some pieces are limited editions and/or are of limited availability and therefore we cannot absolutely guarantee fulfillment of your order. In the event we cannot fullfill your order, purchaser's sole and exclusive remedy shall be a refund of any amounts paid. Images used for the purpose of sale may not be the actual piece from the edition you receive unless so stated on this invoice."

 

It would appear that Princess fulfilled the letter of the agreement, but we can understand your disappointment at not being able to display the artwork you liked.

 

Princess Cruises Fine Arts also accompanies the purchases with a letter stating "Rest assured with the knowledge that all of your artwork is guaranteed 100% by Princess Cruises and we care very much about your satisfaction." This letter is signed by the Director of Princess Cruises Fine Arts and includes contact information.

 

For the other CC readers, remember that not everyone will be satisfied every time with a purchase. There are a lot of people who have furnished their living spaces with appealing art from this somewhat unexpected source.

[AAAAmerican]

An example.. the TV Commercial which shows the lad selling washer fluid by the gallon jug in an arrid climate and very rural... the man and friend pull up he asks for two and the boy tells him SORRY Last One...

 

Then the boys mom(presuption) pulls up in a vehicle and loads out a few more cases of jugs/bottles of Washer Fluid ... and asks how are sales..?

 

 

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Get the point >>>>>>>>>>:eek:

 

Hi Karen -

 

Which Roxy litho did you purchase? I just got off the Isalnd Princess where we purchased the Las Vegas litho and we had the impression it may have been one of the last ones in the Princess collection. (If anyone has contrary information, I would love to hear from you).

 

We were on the Regal Princess in December/January of this year with Shari Bohlmann-Hatchett and got to know her during that time.

[Roxilla]

I like the art auctions. I go for the free champagne.

 

I go for the free champagne AND I have won a picture at two different art auctions (one aboard ship). I have never bought anything though.

[septrack]

We have found better deals on our favorite art at Park West's land auctions. Granted we buy art priced in the hundreds, not thousands, but more expensive pieces are also available. They come to Portland Oregon about 3-4 times a year for a 2 day show, and they always send a nice color catalog prior. They main diference is on land, all art comes framed. The prices usually go for less than at sea and the auctioneers are great. (They too joke, why would anyone buy at sea...) Its always a fun time!

 

Personally we like their artist better than Princess's. Corect me if I'm wrong, but longtime classic artist with Park West (Tarkay, Fanch Ledon, and Linda Lekinf) styles seem to have been copied by several Princess artist..ie... Patrice etc. (I don't remember the other names)

 

Mark

[spongerob]

Reading this, the only thing I think most people have to be wary about is all those stupid art auction flyers that show up each evening. We could do without those, and save a few trees in the process.

[Colo Cruiser]

Reading this, the only thing I think most people have to be wary about is all those stupid art auction flyers that show up each evening. We could do without those, and save a few trees in the process.

 

 

I agree, between that, the photo gallery, and the spa stuff they put in your mailbox they could save a forest. :eek:

[AAAAmerican]

Putting your Comments on the Comment card at the Voyagfe End is vital to Princess Cruise Lines. They do read them and follow suit if enough do say things.. what a great inexpensive marketing tool ..

 

Put your comments down and if you need more room as they are small attach a letter/note written on the stationary they do provide everyone with.

;)

 

Yes Express yourselves. Good times too tell them about..

[Spikesgirl]

I find it interesting that EXACTLY that same post is issued under another cruise site by the same person and again, it is the person's only post on the site. Kinda makes me think the only reason the poster was here was to complain and do as much damage as possible.

 

if I was going to buy art, I'd do it through a gallery, especially spending $80,000. Good grief!

 

Charlie

[Cruisin' Chick]

Just as soon not to attend the art auction, hear about it over the PA system or see tons of "last chance" flyers in my inbox. Or have to navigate around art pieces in the passage way.

[AAAAmerican]

Is some of it called Art..? I thought most was four letters...

C R A _.

 

No Crayon has more..

 

 

 

I have seen people trip over there junk before which does block the passengers way and walks..

 

It would be a shame if some of the things were turned around or sent overboard.,...:eek: :rolleyes:

 

Is there a way to stop the UnSolicited JUNK Cruise Mail ?

 

Like a do not Junk Mail Drop me list... what a waste of natural resources...having that list would save tons of paper!

 

 

 

Just as soon not to attend the art auction' date=' hear about it over the PA system or see tons of "last chance" flyers in my inbox. Or have to navigate around art pieces in the passage way.[/quote']

[spongerob]

Is some of it called Art..? I thought most was four letters...

Any wonder that they have to serve you free alcohol to get you to buy it?

 

Is there a way to stop the UnSolicited JUNK Cruise Mail ?

 

Like a do not Junk Mail Drop me list... what a waste of natural resources...having that list would save tons of paper!

Now we're talkin'!

[texascots]

has anyone ever seen any 'Thomas Kincaid' art for sale on one of the ships?

texascots

[famski740]

I have purchased a Thomas Kinkade painting "Cobblestone Brooke" while on the Coral Princess a few years ago.

I bought it because I liked the painting. Since then I have found through his galleries that it has doubled in price.

There have been many Thomas Kinkade paintings on various cruises that I have been on.

I have never had a problem with art from Princess. I have purchased a couple dozen pieces over the last few years and have no complaints whatsoever. In fact after one cruise they called me to tell me that one of the paintings I puchased could not be sent immediately because they had to wait for the ship to return to get the piece off of it. For my trouble they sent me an extra piece (free) by Doyle since his was the piece I was waiting for. ;)

[partybarbie]

I have purchased and won over a dozen pieces and never had a problem with any of them. In one case, I spoke to the artist on the the phone and confirmed that the works were his and that they were authentic.

 

I would never spend $80,000 without verification by an art appraiser though. It is still buyer beware. Do your research and you will be fine.

 

If you don't like the auctions, don't go. No one is making you. I don't gamble, but I would never say get rid of the Casino. Some of us like looking at the artwork on the ship. If it's a safety issue and blocking the walkway, stop complaining and notify the purser's desk.

[Fuzzzy]

I have to admit I also enjoy some of the commentary of the art dealers. We did talk to one dealer outside the auction about bying a piece.

 

But than you all who do buy for providing the champagne.

Hey AZbb. I too have enjoyed the commentary. I have actually learned things about artists. I think of the auctions as "unofficial" Scholarships at Sea!

[Fuzzzy]

I have had only one very small problem and it was taken care of swiftly and completely to my satisfaction..

[Charles4515]

Thank you for sharing your experiences and frustrations.

 

I still can't see why anyone would purchase fine art on a ship-just as I can't understand why one would have their teeth whitened on a ship! I guess to each his own, but it's not for me.

 

It isn't even fine art. It is produced in factories.

[Charles4515]

has anyone ever seen any 'Thomas Kincaid' art for sale on one of the ships?

texascots

 

They sell it on ships. His work is all made in factories. I saw the PBS show on him. The original gets printed out in many copies then workers put some paint strokes over that. LOL.

[Soak up the Sun]

Texascots:

Yes, you can get Thomas Kincaid art at the ship art auctions. If they don't have any out on display just talk to the art dealer and if they have some on board they will bring it out for the auction. We love Thomas Kincaid's work and have many of his prints.

 

We do a little research before the cruise by looking on-line at the price for the art we are interested in. We get much better pricing at the art auctions at sea than if we bought from a gallery or on-line.

 

We buy art on the ship because we don't have the time to go shopping together for art. We like the convenience of buying it on the cruise and it arrives at our home!

[GoodAsGold]

Champagne? Is that what that was??? :eek:

 

 

I like the art auctions. I go for the free champagne.

[Colo Cruiser]

Champagne? Is that what that was??? :eek:

 

 

:D :D :D

[karen78739]

I find it interesting that EXACTLY that same post is issued under another cruise site by the same person and again, it is the person's only post on the site. Kinda makes me think the only reason the poster was here was to complain and do as much damage as possible.

 

if I was going to buy art, I'd do it through a gallery, especially spending $80,000. Good grief!

 

Charlie

 

So, if I post another complaint, it will somehow validate this one? Okay, I think the free champagne is gawd-awful.

 

The purpose of my post was to share my experiences so that others would beware the possible pitfalls, NOT to say you shouldn't buy at the art auctions under any circumstances. I think it's clear from the other postings that people have had both good and bad experiences buying art at the auctions. I believe if you know what the pitfalls are, you'll be more likely to have a good experience.

 

First of all, if you see something you absolutely love and it's in a price range where you don't care about it's appraised value and whether it will some day end up in a garage sale, I think you should definitely buy it. It's no different from the t-shirts. For example, when we bought our son his first Roxy lithograph, we didn't know a thing about the artist. We bought because he loved it, and to us, it was worth a few hundred bucks to buy something he'd want to hang in his room now and take with him to his first apartment. I later checked out Shari's website and saw these lithos sell for over a thousand dollars, but it wouldn't have mattered if they were selling for the same price. We've since bought a second one, and if I ever go on a Princess ship again and they have New York City--Red, White, and Blue, I'll buy that one too, despite the fact that it may come in a banged up frame.

 

Second, as I previously said, I know you CAN get good deals on investment quality art. Contrary to what many posters have expressed, not all the artwork on cruise ships are "copies" or "created in factories." Just because a piece of art is one in an edition doesn't make it invaluable. It's value is based on who the artist is, how large the edition is, etc. If you have any doubt about the possible value of these "copies," go price some of Andy Warhol's limited editions. Besides the limited editions, the Princess ships do carry some original artwork. (I don't have any experience with Park West.) We bought a Peter Max painting on canvas for around $15,000 on the Diamond Princess several years ago. Less than a year later, a local gallery had a Peter Max show, where another painting from that series was $25,000. We bought one of his paintings on paper at the show (as paper was what we could afford in the gallery), and he personally signed the backs of both for us. Obviously, he wouldn't have done that on a forgery of his work (or a copy produced in a factory). Am I glad I bought it? Absolutely. Would I do it again in the future? No. Even though I know it's possible to have perfectly satisfactory experiences with Princess, I know it can also turn into a nightmare. Based on a couple of comments about how everything worked out in the end, I think I did not properly describe just how many calls I made, how many emails I wrote, how difficult and expensive it was to find a shipper to insure these pieces when returned. It was extremely time-consuming, and FYI, the head of Princess Fine Art, Mark Bronson, NEVER returned a call or responded to an email. For me, it's just not worth the risk of having to go through that hassle again.

 

I noticed this isn't the only post recommending local galleries (which we do buy from also). While I whole-heartedly agree that their customer service is far superior, this isn't the end-all, be-all solution either. The art business is tough, and galleries--even those that are highly reputable--go out of business regularly. You really should be careful when buying fine art PERIOD.

 

That said, there's still nothing more wonderful than having a home full of art you love, regardless of how much you spent or where you purchased it. Getting something you couldn't afford otherwise on a ship is great, as is supporting local galleries and local artists (in fact, nothing is more enjoyable than buying art DIRECTLY from the artist). I would never want this discussion to dissuade anyone from buying art. I'm just trying to caution that buyers need to be careful.

 

If you don't want to listen to me because I didn't post about how I thought the cabins were nice but the drinks were too expensive, then don't.