Veendam 'too big' to get into St Georges, Bermuda

[Guest LoveMyBoxer]

According to the Bermudia tentative calendar of ships in port for our sailing in August, we will be the only ship in either St. Georges or Hamilton. So even if they can't make it through Town Cut, both berths at Hamilton will be available:

http://www.rccbermuda.bm/portal/server.pt/gateway/PTARGS_0_2_994_282_1765_43/http%3B/ptpublisher.gov.bm%3B7087/publishedcontent/publish/ministry_of_tourism_and_transport/marine_and_ports/dept___marine_and_ports___new_links/articles/2010_draft_cruise_ship_schedule__updated_november_20th__2.pdf

 

Last year in October when we sailed on the NCL Dream, which was the largest ship to sail through Town Cut to date, the winds were extremely high and we ended up in Hamilton. So if there aren't any other ships scheduled to stop in Hamilton, I don't see what the problem is. Like someone said in a previous post, maybe HAL is watching these boards to have us do their work for them!

[jollyjones]

Just to make it quite clear - there is only one remaining cruise dock in Hamilton, known as No. 6 Shed. The schedule shows 5/6 because cruise ships are long enough to cover the dockside previously occupied by No. 6 shed and No. 5 shed but No. 5 was demolished long ago.

 

The other cruise berth in Hamilton was No. 1 Shed but that was demolished last year and is now a car park and dock for passenger ferries serving the new Heritage Wharf in Dockyard.

 

Whilst not as stringent as for Town Cut at St Georges, there are limitations on the size of ships that can pass through Two Rock Passage into Hamilton Harbour.

 

There are two cruise berths in St Georges for ships small enough to get to them - Ordinance Island and Penno's Wharf; or ships can anchor to the north of Fort St Catherine in Murray's Anchorage.

 

There are two cruise berths at Dockyard - King's Wharf and Heritage Wharf both of which can take the bigger ships; or ships can anchor at Grassy Bay in the Great Sound.

[FireIce0010]

I hate what Carnival Corp is doing to these ships. The Rotterdam looks horrible now but not as bad as this ship. They are nothing more than square looking boxes.

[AtomixNYC]

Tender Required is posted for SG on the website, which I didn't think was there last week either.

 

Not to mention, the price seemed to had gone up just in the recent day(s).

 

I was so excited about this itin up until reading this thread...

[RichNY]

Tender Required is posted for SG on the website, which I didn't think was there last week either.

 

Not to mention, the price seemed to had gone up just in the recent day(s).

 

I was so excited about this itin up until reading this thread...

 

 

Don't let this thread scare you off. The only thing we know for sure it that we wont dock in St George, the rest is pure conjecture. Tendering isn't that bad.

 

This itin is still better than NCL's since we'll be Hamilton not the Dockyard like the Dawn. We also have an extra day in Bermuda..

 

As far as the prices go I haven't been following them so I can't help you .

 

We are booked and staying..

[ziggypup]

Tender Required is posted for SG on the website, which I didn't think was there last week either.

 

Not to mention, the price seemed to had gone up just in the recent day(s).

 

I was so excited about this itin up until reading this thread...

 

They just added that TR (Tender Required) denotation a few days ago. The prices went up? LOL

[ziggypup]

Well my Travel Agent called Holland and this was the response:

 

"I finally reached someone in HAL who knew what they were talking about. As of now, the scooters will not be able to board the tender. I did tell them that a supervisor told me that the scooters will be allowed on. They took his name and will deal with his misinformation. There also is no change to the itinerary at this time to dock in Hamilton for the whole cruise. I was told that due to the refurbishing of the Veendam that they recalculated the tonnage and were told that they cannot dock in St. Georges. I am not confident that Holland will change anything to accommodate those in scooters and wheelchairs. Let me know if you still want to hold these reservations."

 

Just wonderful..................:(

[DFD1]

I find it incredible that HAL committed Veendam to Town Cut before knowing what changes in her draft might be caused by the additional weight added in refit.

 

That seems like incompetance to me.

 

IMO, only.

[DRWhit]

We are going in July. Here is how I would rank the possible fixes>

 

1. Take another S ship that will fit. To me, this would be best, since you would get to dock as originally planned. I am not sure how fully they are booked by now, but there might be some problems with accommodating those already booked, because not as many cabins would be available. But I prefer the original S class look and extra pool over the refit Veendam anyway.

 

2. Dock in Hamilton, and offer free bus shuttle to St. Georges. The free transportation should ensure enough people go to St Georges, which is what the Bermuda gov wants, and it would probably quicker, more efficient and less costly than using the one big tender.

 

3. Dock in Hamilton, no free bus service. We would probably go up there anyway, even if we had to pay. But maybe not.

 

4. Use the tender and anchor off St. Georges. If there was a quick and efficient tender service offered well into the evening hours, it might not be so bad. But one big tender only makes me worry about long lines and wait times. Also, as someone has pointed out, the nice thing was not having to worry about getting back on board the ship by a set time.

[Vic The Parrot]

I find it incredible that HAL committed Veendam to Town Cut before knowing what changes in her draft might be caused by the additional weight added in refit.

 

That seems like incompetance to me.

 

IMO, only.

 

 

 

I don't think it's incompetance.

 

It's more of HAL mgmt "biting off more than they could chew .." :rolleyes:

[doncarlos]

I have a suggestion: lets take the holidays off and drop this subject for a few weeks and give HAL and Gov. Bermuda time to work this is out.....We are on the first trip [[ April 25]] so we have at least the same urgency that all posters have .......and , in the interest off full disclosure , we favor skip ST.G.and the risk of a wind related aborted tender trip and do extra night in Hamilton...................but it needs to be resolved in Seattle and Hamilton not on cruise critic so......................lets resurface in mid Jan. [[[[ wow, if the US Senate could just get the same memo LOL :rolleyes:]]]] Happy New Year , Don Carlos

 

 

PS:ziggypup, which trip are you on ? I see you posting this subject many rollcalls, the main Hal blog, the bermuda blog............I get dizzy !:confused:

[ziggypup]

PS:ziggypup, which trip are you on ? I see you posting this subject many rollcalls, the main Hal blog, the bermuda blog............I get dizzy !:confused:

 

June 13 Carlos. I'm just floating around the boards looking to see if anyone has any further info or rumors. LOL

 

After my agent spoke with a HAL "supervisor" today and was told that no scooters would be allowed on the tender/ferry, well that pretty much put the kabosh on the cruise. My disabled family members don't want 2 additional days at sea being stuck on the ship while everyone else is in town. So either we will find some other vacation option or we won't. One of my family members just mentioned to me a few minutes ago something about renting a houseboat on lake Mead for a week. I guess the water theme is still in effect. LOL

[DFD1]

I believe someone posted suggesting that perhaps HAL might tender into the evening hours.

 

Others may correct me about this, but I somehow doubt that HAL would attempt to tender after dark.

 

Seems to me the danger posed when getting passengers moved from the tender to the ship or the other way around would be significantly increased after dark.

 

Frankly, I would not be thrilled to tender at night even though I don't have any mobility issues....yet.

[sapper1]

I believe someone posted suggesting that perhaps HAL might tender into the evening hours.

 

Others may correct me about this, but I somehow doubt that HAL would attempt to tender after dark.

 

Seems to me the danger posed when getting passengers moved from the tender to the ship or the other way around would be significantly increased after dark.

 

Frankly, I would not be thrilled to tender at night even though I don't have any mobility issues....yet.

It would be no different than tendering in dense fog----which we did on the Eurodam's visit to the Gaspe Peninsula last fall. The tenders are equipped with radar and the operators can "see" where they are going, come darkness or fog. The tenders also have running lights so they can be seen by other boats at night.

Don't get me wrong---I hate tendering with a passion but I am used to being on the water at night and in the fog and think nothing of it, safety wise. I would just hate it equally---day or night.:)

[foodsvcmgr]

Tendering to St. Georges, while making some interesting photo ops, will

undoubtedly be a bit of a hassle.

 

Switching to an unaltered "S" ship sounds like good idea, but how would

they handle people (like myself) booked in Lanai cabins? I don't want a

regular outside cabin and don't care to pay the large premium for a true

Veranda. Somehow I doubt they would give a free upgrade, particularly

because they also have more people booked in Verandas than the other

ships actually have available.

 

Probably better to just go to Hamilton - or, dare I say it, maybe one night

at the Dockyard?:eek:

[ziggypup]

Tendering to St. Georges, while making some interesting photo ops, will

undoubtedly be a bit of a hassle.

 

Switching to an unaltered "S" ship sounds like good idea, but how would

they handle people (like myself) booked in Lanai cabins? I don't want a

regular outside cabin and don't care to pay the large premium for a true

Veranda. Somehow I doubt they would give a free upgrade, particularly

because they also have more people booked in Verandas than the other

ships actually have available.

 

Probably better to just go to Hamilton - or, dare I say it, maybe one night

at the Dockyard?:eek:

 

I am not to familar with HAL's fleet of ships, but are their any available "S" class ships?

[RuthC]

Seems to me the danger posed when getting passengers moved from the tender to the ship or the other way around would be significantly increased after dark.

 

It would be no different than tendering in dense fog----which we did on the Eurodam's visit to the Gaspe Peninsula last fall. The tenders are equipped with radar and the operators can "see" where they are going, come darkness or fog. The tenders also have running lights so they can be seen by other boats at night.

Sapper, I suspect DFD was referring to the actual transfer between ship and tender as the danger. For someone with a mobility problem it might be more difficult in the dark than in daylight, even foggy daylight.

 

If the tender is like the ones on HMC, it should be an easy transfer, at least in daylight. But it can get tricky playing "bobbing for boats".

[TPKeller]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, while in Bermuda (docked in Hamilton) on Empress of the Seas, we had to tender for the last day and a half we were there. The tenders ran all night, but when it got late it was just once every hour or two. I think it was more "as needed" than a particular schedule.

 

Here is a picture I took from the deck above one of the tenders at night. It was fairly well lit, and should be noted that we were tied up to a dock at the time as well. Lots different than in the open ocean.

 

Theron

[sail7seas]

Tendering to St. Georges, while making some interesting photo ops, will

undoubtedly be a bit of a hassle.

 

Switching to an unaltered "S" ship sounds like good idea, but how would

they handle people (like myself) booked in Lanai cabins? I don't want a

regular outside cabin and don't care to pay the large premium for a true

Veranda. Somehow I doubt they would give a free upgrade, particularly

because they also have more people booked in Verandas than the other

ships actually have available.

 

Probably better to just go to Hamilton - or, dare I say it, maybe one night

at the Dockyard?:eek:

 

 

 

What about the guests who are booked on this 'other S class ship' you suggest they swap out? They booked a cruise on the ship of their choice; not the Veendam. ;) In order to make Veendam guests happy, they would be making guests from this other not named "S" ship unhappy to swap off with a ship they didn't choose. We would not be agreeable about that. JMHO......

 

 

 

 

I am not to familar with HAL's fleet of ships, but are their any available "S" class ships?

 

 

Available "S" class ships? :D :confused:

 

 

All have itineraries and guests booked on them unless in dry/wet docks. No such thing as ships just sitting tied up. A ship that isn't full and sailing makes no money.

[DFD1]

Point well taken, Sail.

 

I expect it will wind up being a tendering operation in spite of all the good suggestions in this thread.

 

Merry Christmas, everybody.

[sapper1]

Sapper, I suspect DFD was referring to the actual transfer between ship and tender as the danger. For someone with a mobility problem it might be more difficult in the dark than in daylight, even foggy daylight.

 

If the tender is like the ones on HMC, it should be an easy transfer, at least in daylight. But it can get tricky playing "bobbing for boats".

You have a good point. I wish there was an easy answer. I know you are booked on one of these cruises as well and I understand you have mobility issues.

I imagine this thread will continue until HAL comes up with a definitive answer. Since we are also booked on one of these cruises I will follow the thread with great interest. My real preference would be to tie up in Hamilton for the duration.

 

 

Someone out there who knows how to start a poll-----why don't you start one re three nights in Hamilton versus two nights in Hamilton and tendering in St. Georges? Maybe the results would sway HAL's decision.

[RichNY]

I'm not sure how many of you saw this...evidently there was a time when the Veendam would be able to get through the cut...then came the alterations..

 

In 2008, a computer simulation of the ‘Veendam’ was conducted and Holland America Line commenced with marketing and selling the twin-port Bermuda cruises. Although Holland America was confident the ‘Veendam’ could safely navigate Town Cut Channel, it was decided to conduct additional simulations of the ship. Two other simulations were conducted in July and November 2009 and it was concluded that it would be unsafe for the ‘Veendam’ to navigate Town Cut in 2010.

 

 

Here's my guess as to how things will go....

 

The Veendam will clear the surrounding reef in the vicinity of the cut as all other ships do..If the weather at that time is good enough to tender then they will anchor and tender into St George...If the weather is not good enough to tender they will continue to Hamilton to dock..This is the same thing that would happen if the ship was docking at St George and weather would not allow passage...I would guess that the decision to anchor or not will be made long before we even reach the cut..

[DFD1]

Rich, I think you have it right. The Veendam was likely committed to dock in St. Georges before the refit. I expect the realizaton that she would no longer clear Town Cut came after the refit.

 

Now, it's punt time!

 

Many years ago, before Town Cut existed, I sailed out to Bermuda on Cunard Countess, had the roughest night at sea imaginable, docked at Hamilton in bright sunshine next mornng and spent three wonderful days there.

 

I'm a believer in the Bermuda Triangle, but docking in Hamilton is really quite nice and should provide a much better cruise experience than tendering into St. Georges.

 

IMO

[AtomixNYC]

Don't let this thread scare you off. The only thing we know for sure it that we wont dock in St George, the rest is pure conjecture. Tendering isn't that bad.

 

I'm trying to have a positive outlook. family needs a vacation, we've never been to Bermuda, we love to cruise, had good experiences with HAL, and sailing out of NY = short cab ride and no flying hassles.

 

We've no mobility problems, but do have an infant son. he'll be around 7 months @ the time we plan on going. That will be a challenge in itself. I was looking for a relaxing itin, which we can hop on/off easily, and decide to do as much/as little as we want. Wife is also not very good in smaller boats/rough seas. Not sure about weather condition during May/June timeframe. If the tender proves problematic with the wife and kid, then there's a chance we'll miss the whole port.

 

I didn't read all the posts. Anyone knows how long the tender takes?

[ziggypup]

I didn't read all the posts. Anyone knows how long the tender takes?

 

Someone had mentioned earlier in the thread that the actual travel time would be 30 to 40 minutes. I don't know if that has been verified yet. Plus the time it would take to load and unload the ferry.

 

Check out post #30