The truth about cruise staff working conditions and pay?

[USVI-4-me]

We were happy to have a cabin steward who took regular morning and afternoon "coffee" breaks.

 

Another cabin steward had coverage for sick days.

 

Another cabin steward had coverage for time off to go ashore.

 

We have known dining, cabin and other housekeeping staffers who have been promoted.

 

We've been told it is easier to work through the housekeeping ranks rather than the dining pyramid.

 

We have met ship to shore dining staffers who started working aboard cruise ships and found jobs at Grand Hotels where we have had a designated dining table.

 

I have not seen the program about cruise crew working conditions but I do realize there are many ships in many areas of our world.

 

Fortunately, we can book the nicer mass market cruises and find the crew working hard and looking forward to R&R at home with a another contract at sea.

 

Our general experience has been a more relaxed crew on Princess.

 

-Marisa

[Chunky2219]

We sail on Constellation from Southampton the day of the programme. I bet they won't be showing it on ship's TV!

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[phoenix_dream]

I don't pity them. If working on a cruise ship was, in their opinion, terrible working conditions, then, why are so many signing multiple contracts?

 

I'm sure that many in the US and UK feel they are underpaid, but the crew doesn't have the same cost of living as if they were working and living in those countries.

Why? Do you really need to ask? Maybe because even terrible working conditions (if that is true) are better than the ones at home. Maybe because there are no jobs at home - terrible or otherwise. Maybe because they are willing to put up with terrible working conditions because they desperately need the money to support their families. Caring about this is not the same as showing 'pity'. If conditions are terrible (and I don't know that they are, I am saying if) then as human beings we have an obligation to be aware of them and help affect positive change. It's as simple as that.

[Gig103]

I see it like this. It isn't a job for everyone. Some people do one contract or less, but some people work years and years. I wouldn't be surprised if, by US/UK standards its below standards. But, like Foxconn in China, it is better than other jobs available to these people.

[Hawaiidan]

I am sure that people in the Hamptons or Monticito / Hombly Hills would think my home, car and income as very poor.

EU countries that give 8 week paid vacations and 30 hour work weeks look in agast at how these people are treated.

 

The UK with its social history and unions see almost everyone outside the UK as abused. ( to british papers and reporters are known to state thing sensationaly) If everybody on a cruise ship was paid and got british benifits the cruise fares for 7 days would be $7000

 

I met a waitress in a bar on Holland America who used to teach high school in another country... She said she was earning far more in the ship.

Living conditions on the ship and health conditions, not to mention food, are vastly superior to the conditions back home. Too safety and security

flush toilets, electricity, clean water...laundry

 

Paying everyone the minimun wage of many western nations would be obscene wealth in their country! By their standard they are making more tha you make in your country ! Share the wealth is a load

 

They are there because they fought to get the job over a lot of others. They are tickeled pink to have it.

[Hlitner]

It's too bad that there isn't some magical power to save us all from the so-called "do gooders." So lets put the subject (cruise line working conditions) in proper perspective as carefully explained to me by 2 cruise line employees (a long time waiter and his best friend who is a bartender). Nobody forces anyone to work on a cruise ship! In fact, it is quite difficult (and competitive) to get a job on a modern cruise ship. A majority of the people that work on cruise ships will work multiple contracts and many continue to work in the industry for many years. If they do not like the job (or conditions) they can simply leave after their contract (the cruise line pays their way home) or they could quit at any time (but then they would have to pay their own way home). My cruise employee friend (the waiter) once told me that all he wants from passengers is to be treated with politeness and respect....not with pity :)

 

Hank

[Dick in Falls Church]

Some years ago, we had a dining server who had a Master's degree in City Planning. She said she might make $150 per month in that field- if she could find work, with almost no opportunity for advancement. As a waiter, she had sent her younger sister through college, bought he mother a house with a real floor (as opposed to dirt), and was getting a "new-to-her" car when she finished the contract in a few more weeks. Oh yes, she helped her sister get a job (on another line).

 

Wife met a cleaner--she was cleaning the johns. Her husband was in security on a sister ship. While on that trip, the two ships met, and they got to see each other. And then the ships personnel arranged for them to serve on the same ship. Next time, she was assistant cabin attendant. Now, she is a cabin attendant. She and her husband work the same ship. Her mother has been taking care of the kids--one now in college and the other in high school. She and her husband figure they'll keep doing this for a couple more years.

 

Young man who was cleaning stairs, ceilings, etc. Is an engineering student at home. Cruises, sees some of the world, improves his English, saves his money, and goes back to school until he needs more money.

 

Asked a waitress from Roumania what she would be doing if not on board.

Answer: Looking for work with all my friends.

 

And as rotorhead mentioned, look at the pay for the lower grade enlisted folks--and their duty day is 24 hours, 7 days a week, plus an opportunity to go to some of the nastiest sites in the world, and get shot at for their troubles.

 

While certainly not all the folks are bubbly happy all the time, we've only run into one who openly stated that it was a terrible job, he hated it, had to work too hard and too long,and couldn't wait until he got back home to finish school. His major: Hospitality. We wished him luck!

 

Did meet an American waitress on a cruise. She applied, and was accepted. Because of previous experience (not cruise), she didn't start at the bottom. This caused some problems within the crew. Also, she was subject to US taxes, which of course they weren't. One contract was enough for her--but she said she got to see some amazing things she wouldn't have otherwise.

 

When you get on another ship and someone from the crew recognizes you and speaks up, you've probably treated them decently--and they aren't on their first cruise.

 

Sorry if I've rambled too long.

[streetspirit]

Every cruise we have been on the staff have been totally amazing. My wife and I enjoy talking to them too finding out about their country, interests etc, thus treating them no differently than the other guests on board. Yes they work so hard but they work with a smile on their face. Sometimes we wonder if they only get paid in the tips they receive thus the cruise line putting the onus on the passengers. I hope I'm wrong there? We got the feeling on a P&O cruise a few years ago that the senior officers did look down on the overseas staff which I didn't particulaly like. I know for sure that if the overseas staff were paid more and worked less hours with more staff drafted in my wife and I would not be able to afford to cruise. It's a tough one really with no right or wrong answer.

[Orator]

Some years ago, we had a dining server who had a Master's degree in City Planning. She said she might make $150 per month in that field- if she could find work, with almost no opportunity for advancement. As a waiter, she had sent her younger sister through college, bought he mother a house with a real floor (as opposed to dirt), and was getting a "new-to-her" car when she finished the contract in a few more weeks. Oh yes, she helped her sister get a job (on another line).

 

Wife met a cleaner--she was cleaning the johns. Her husband was in security on a sister ship. While on that trip, the two ships met, and they got to see each other. And then the ships personnel arranged for them to serve on the same ship. Next time, she was assistant cabin attendant. Now, she is a cabin attendant. She and her husband work the same ship. Her mother has been taking care of the kids--one now in college and the other in high school. She and her husband figure they'll keep doing this for a couple more years.

 

Young man who was cleaning stairs, ceilings, etc. Is an engineering student at home. Cruises, sees some of the world, improves his English, saves his money, and goes back to school until he needs more money.

 

Asked a waitress from Roumania what she would be doing if not on board.

Answer: Looking for work with all my friends.

 

And as rotorhead mentioned, look at the pay for the lower grade enlisted folks--and their duty day is 24 hours, 7 days a week, plus an opportunity to go to some of the nastiest sites in the world, and get shot at for their troubles.

 

While certainly not all the folks are bubbly happy all the time, we've only run into one who openly stated that it was a terrible job, he hated it, had to work too hard and too long,and couldn't wait until he got back home to finish school. His major: Hospitality. We wished him luck!

 

Did meet an American waitress on a cruise. She applied, and was accepted. Because of previous experience (not cruise), she didn't start at the bottom. This caused some problems within the crew. Also, she was subject to US taxes, which of course they weren't. One contract was enough for her--but she said she got to see some amazing things she wouldn't have otherwise.

 

When you get on another ship and someone from the crew recognizes you and speaks up, you've probably treated them decently--and they aren't on their first cruise.

 

Sorry if I've rambled too long.

 

Excellent post. More people need to take some time and talk to crew. Met a waiter on Solstice who is working until his wife completes her Pharmacutical degree. Then she will work and he will get his. Met several crew members who have degrees in Engineering. Met a member of the activities staff who has a law degree. An Assistant waitress in Murano on Solstice has a doctorate in medical research. The grant (in Russia) was lost and her job ended so she wants to take some time to see the world.

[d4m]

Excellent post. More people need to take some time and talk to crew. Met a waiter on Solstice who is working until his wife completes her Pharmacutical degree. Then she will work and he will get his. Met several crew members who have degrees in Engineering. Met a member of the activities staff who has a law degree. An Assistant waitress in Murano on Solstice has a doctorate in medical research. The grant (in Russia) was lost and her job ended so she wants to take some time to see the world.

 

Orator, I think you are spot on about talking to people and Dick in Falls Church, you also obviously have the knack for doing just that. We had one room assistant that was about the nicest young man we have met. He took the job because in his country, when couples married the ceremony was two days long and the groom had to pay the entire cost. He was bright, upbeat, spoke wonderful English (said he looks up new words all the time) and never complained one iota that two others on that deck were ill and he had to fill in for both. In another instance talked with a man who was cleaning the rails who said the job was fine although he had a degree in Maritime Engineering. Said it was hard to break into the business and he would work as long as it took to eventually be able to use his degree. Another instance of a waiter and his assistant kept us at a smaller table than we requested simply because they were so competent, friendly, funny and sincere. We didn't ask about family but they told us their stories. Both had family to support, one a wife and three children and the other single but with aging parents. Made me think about how fortunate we are that we can remain at home with our own families.

 

Yes, it is because people take cruises that some people have jobs are able to survive and provide. However, without so many dedicated staff who work long hours for low wages, none of us would ever be able to take the cruises we love.

[uktog]

I have no idea how this programme will pan out, but if as part of their "research" they have placed someone with UK based attitudes to employment and employment rights into a role that is not usually done on a ship by UK persons (ie waiting/bar) it would not matter what cruise line they were on, there would be sobbing about working time directives, minimum wage, rights etc etc.

 

It is actually a nightmare in the UK to get people to do hospitality roles, even with a minimum wage in place. My son has been trying to recruit to bar vacancies in his hotel for over a month now and the only applicants other than the Job Centre rejects who are applying to keep their benefits entitlement alive have been Eastern Europeans, who sadly looked like very hard workers but lacked the language skills at the level he required. As a result, those who do work there work very very long hours - so an on land fly in the wall would be just as interesting!

[compman9]

Hear, hear.

 

My DD has just finished her third contract with Celebrity. I'd love to repeat what she has told me over the years.

 

She'll watch the programme and compare it with her own experiences. Should be interesting!

 

Yes, we would love to hear some of the stories as well - why don't you tell us some?

 

This is called Cruise Critic, after all.

[compman9]

Thanks to the OP - I have now set up the Sky+ to tape.

 

Hopefully a big issue will be made of how the staff are paid, rather than how much they are paid.

 

I would like to see gratuities stopped, the cost added to the cruise price, and the company owners pay their employees, rather than the guests.

[nordski]

Based upon this thread, anecdotally it seems the cruise lines have nothing to fear from any publicity.

 

I agree that virtually all the crewmembers I have met have been superb in attitude. I also realize, how lucky I was to be born at a time and a place where I could start a professional career without facing the choices that they encounter.

 

I doubt I would be so resilient.

[gkny]

I've always wanted to work on a cruise line and applied to all of them. Even as a deck hand or assistant waiter, cabin steward, security, etc. Maybe because of my age in the 50s, I was turned down. I've been in law enforcement all my life in NYC and I can't fathom the idea, why any cruise line hasn't offered me a job. I don't care about the salary since I get my pension from NYC. I know that this is off subject. Have a nice day.

[bluemarble]

According to this article from travelweekly.co.uk, the programme which is the subject of this thread includes filming aboard the Celebrity Eclipse.

 

Celebrity Cruises saddened over 'biased' documentary

 

Regards,

John.

[Ma Bell]

Excellent post. More people need to take some time and talk to crew. Met a waiter on Solstice who is working until his wife completes her Pharmacutical degree. Then she will work and he will get his. Met several crew members who have degrees in Engineering. Met a member of the activities staff who has a law degree. An Assistant waitress in Murano on Solstice has a doctorate in medical research. The grant (in Russia) was lost and her job ended so she wants to take some time to see the world.

 

One of the great pleasures of cruising is getting to meet and enjoy the wonderful people who work on the ships. There are many amazing stories if you take the time to get to know them. I feel fortunate to stay in contact with many of those we have met through the years as they continue their careers at home.

[tercar]

I think you hit the nail on the head. These jobs are better than those back home in many countries. They have advantages (pay, seeing much of the world) and disadvantages (long stretches of time away) like almost any job. As far as I know they aren't drafted into these jobs and they do get paid, so we shouldn't pity them.

I do pity them, a lot of the people who serve us are very well educated people, for example we have had accountants, teachers, engineers serving us. why??? because they can't get a decent job in their own countries. and to think waiting on tables etc working very long hours can give them more money than doing the jobs they are trained to do is very disheartening for them. One thing I admire them for is they work away from home to try and educate their own families so they can have the oppotunity for a better life. Asfor seeing the world, they dont get the chance to get off the ship and explore many places, some of them need to pay for a visa to get off the ship in some countries too.

[Orator]

I hope some who sees the broadcast will post a detailed review on Cruise Critic. I know that I would appreciate the information. It would also be interesting to me to read any comments from anyone who experienced the asst. waiter who was undercover.

[NLH Arizona]

Why? Do you really need to ask? Maybe because even terrible working conditions (if that is true) are better than the ones at home. Maybe because there are no jobs at home - terrible or otherwise. Maybe because they are willing to put up with terrible working conditions because they desperately need the money to support their families. Caring about this is not the same as showing 'pity'. If conditions are terrible (and I don't know that they are, I am saying if) then as human beings we have an obligation to be aware of them and help affect positive change. It's as simple as that.

Phoenix_dream, you mentioned that we should help affect positive change. What would you do to assist in making positive changes?

[FortyNinerLiz]

One of the great pleasures of cruising is getting to meet and enjoy the wonderful people who work on the ships. There are many amazing stories if you take the time to get to know them. I feel fortunate to stay in contact with many of those we have met through the years as they continue their careers at home.

Once we identify the best of the "visible" employees on the ship, we start tipping. That is the key to financial stability for them and their families back home. It also creates a "friendly" service environment.......

[Alg63]

Why do you "pity" them? Do you pity the bank teller who has a degree in engineering? The grocery store manager who has an MBA? The hotel front desk clerk who has an accounting degree? Te husband who spends the weeknights away from his family because he can't find a local job, can' afford to sell his house? Do you tip your grocery bagger / front desk clerk / garbage ollector / hotel cleaner / mailman "so you can get taken care of" ? Yes they work hard but they are not forced to do these jobs. Cruise ship employees get to see the world, put money away, get excellent training and have wonderful career opportunities. They work long shifts and do work hard for months but have long periods of "off" time, tickets to go home etc.

Most love their jobs and i would like to see some of our welfare recipients get off their a$$es and take advantage of the many opportunities that are out there with the cruise lines.

no one is diputing their efforts, but a pity party is really not necessary.

[NLH Arizona]

Once we identify the best of the "visible" employees on the ship, we start tipping. That is the key to financial stability for them and their families back home. It also creates a "friendly" service environment.......

How will this change their working conditions on the ship, which I believe is what should be improved? More tips will only help a select few that the passengers see, what about those behind the scenes?

[CI66774]

I don't "pity" any of the cruise workers. This is what this is what they choose to do - work hard and make good money in comparison to what others are making in their country. I just got off a Disney cruise (doing the Relection in January) and they readily told me how lucky they were to work for Disney.

[Aus Traveller]

A few comments on some of the earlier posts -

 

1. Crew do not pay for visas for countries the ship visits. The cruiseline does.

2. Tips are divided among a particular group of crew (stewards, waiters, head waiters). Behind the scenes crew are paid a wage and are not part of the tips pool.

3. On Princess (sorry I don't know about Celebrity) all crew have to fill in a time sheet every day showing the hours they worked and the hours of rest. There is a maximum number of hours in any one day and a maximum for a week. Yes - these are longer hours than usually worked in Australia and (I am sure) in USA or the UK.

4. Crew have a few other benefits including free health care on the ship. They also have an active social life 'below-decks'.

 

I admire their work ethic, but I don't feel sorry for them. :):)