Allure and propulsion problems.

[Brandonclan]

As long as the ship can safely get you from point A to point B without issue, why should you care how it does?

We care! Is it really bothering you that we do?

 

As has been said, the center Pod has an issue. They are not using it unless they absolutely need to. It still works and can be called into service if they need it, but they are saving it.

You KNOW this info to be true? or are you simply stating what you THINK and have heard from CC members? We would like some facts from RCI.

 

 

 

The ship is not going to rock any more than it did whether it had one pod, two pods or three pods. Pods are merely propulsion devices, and the ship is not going to rock anymore given the same weather conditions.

How do you know this? Hard to beleive that an underpowered ship would not be more affected by the seas.

All anyone here is asking for are some facts, and some common sense.

If you cannot help with any of this ............

[oneputt18]

That's not good... unless they were retrofitted to X series features.

 

According to this article the Celebrity Reflection was the first ship fitted with XOs

 

http://www.rivieramm.com/article/abb-marine-supplies-latest-generation-azipod-xo-to-celebrity-reflection-12923

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Forums mobile app

[bilyclub]

Found the reference for what ship has what azipod.

 

 

VO Allure of the Seas STX Europe RCI Cruise vessel 20 3 VO2300 2010

 

 

 

http://cruisewithchris.blogspot.com/2013/03/azipod-problems-for-carnival-legend.html

[broberts]

The azipods on Allure and Oasis are 20MW, so they must be the V series, the XO's are 17.5MW.

 

Just so. If you have PowerPoint and look at slide 20 of http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&ved=0CDkQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww02.abb.com%2Fglobal%2Fabbzh%2Fabbzh250.nsf%2F041c9590e18b53eac1257148004393a5%2F191ba9b7c2ceb32cc125790500314d23%2F%24file%2Fazipod%2B-%2Benergy%2Befficiency%2Bin%2Bmarine%2Bpropulsion%2Bfinal.pptx&ei=nH50UuDTCe-kyAGNqYAQ&usg=AFQjCNEIf3yJuXnCd8lV8nSDXmtWieaR9A&bvm=bv.55819444,d.aWc (I hope the link works) you will see confirmation of this.

[reedl]

How do you know this? Hard to beleive that an underpowered ship would not be more affected by the seas.

All anyone here is asking for are some facts, and some common sense.

If you cannot help with any of this ............

 

Again, as I have said many times before in other threads, I do something rather novel when I state things. I ask the people who know. When I was on the Allure, I actually chatted with both a few senior people and a few others who know (who will remain nameless to protect their identity) about the whole issue. The center pod has a bearing issue. In normal operation the center pod is not needed to propel the ship up to speeds of 20 knots or so. It is only when needing to go faster that the center pod is needed.

 

Now as to stability issues, remember a pod just propels a ship forward. So whether there are two or three pods propelling that ship forward as long as it is going the same speed, it will not change the dynamics of the ship's movement in the ocean in any appreciable way. Again, this is stated after talking with people who know this stuff, not the average CC poster.

 

But of course you will not understand that I actually know what I am talking about and am speaking with some authority on the subject. You will bounce back to your "will the ship be rocky?" question again and again. I can say that the ship will be not smooth if the weather is not smooth. If there are high winds, or large waves, it will have an effect on the mechanics of the ship. OTOH, the number of pods being used will not.

Edited November 2, 2013 by reedl

[sweetpee_1993]

@reedl, I think I read somewhere along in all of this that the rockier ride that someone mentioned was because the stabilizers were not being extended. Something about the drag they caused slowing the ship further. I could be mistaken but I'm pretty sure I read that in association with all this Allure propulsion issue stuff. Would that hold water, so to speak? Would it make sense?

[CarnieAddict]

Maybe they are just trying to save money on fuel. .

[FLACRUISER99]

Again, as I have said many times before in other threads, I do something rather novel when I state things. I ask the people who know. When I was on the Allure, I actually chatted with both a few senior people and a few others who know (who will remain nameless to protect their identity) about the whole issue. The center pod has a bearing issue. In normal operation the center pod is not needed to propel the ship up to speeds of 20 knots or so. It is only when needing to go faster that the center pod is needed.

 

Now as to stability issues, remember a pod just propels a ship forward. So whether there are two or three pods propelling that ship forward as long as it is going the same speed, it will not change the dynamics of the ship's movement in the ocean in any appreciable way. Again, this is stated after talking with people who know this stuff, not the average CC poster.

 

But of course you will not understand that I actually know what I am talking about and am speaking with some authority on the subject. You will bounce back to your "will the ship be rocky?" question again and again. I can say that the ship will be not smooth if the weather is not smooth. If there are high winds, or large waves, it will have an effect on the mechanics of the ship. OTOH, the number of pods being used will not.

No, I've been told by a reliable source that there is abnormal wear on a pod bearing. The ship is fully operational and can attain full speed in an emergency. They are slowing the speed to arrest further damage. This may or may not be true.

 

 

I agree with this information as it is basically exactly what I posted in post #238 above. Maybe we have the same source?

Edited November 2, 2013 by FLACRUISER99

[CRUISEFAN0001]

I agree with this information as it is basically exactly what I posted in post #238 above. Maybe we have the same source?

I pretty much also agree along with you on the information reedl conveyed.

 

The only added information is that in normal use, the propellers on the pods actually pull the ship through the water in contrast to traditional methods to push it. It's really neat technology.

 

If the bearings need replacing...that's not a small/quick job - they have to remove the prop and access the bearings (which are large) in a defined process to assure the repair works the first time around.

 

There was actually a Smithsonian Channel TV segment about the pods and how this repair process worked - it was quite interesting.

[Ocean Boy]

Again, as I have said many times before in other threads, I do something rather novel when I state things. I ask the people who know. When I was on the Allure, I actually chatted with both a few senior people and a few others who know (who will remain nameless to protect their identity) about the whole issue. The center pod has a bearing issue.

 

Maybe RCI Miami should call the people who know and find out what is going on with their ship. And if the problem is not going to be fixed until the next sheduled dry dock then they can let all of us know that this is a two year issue.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Ocean Boy

[Brandonclan]

Reedl I appreciate your explaination of your comments about stability, and the validity of the info. Others have been told things from ships officers also and there is definately a problem.

I can only say that I've been on the water in many types of vessels and speed definately affects stabilty. the slower the vessel goes the more it will be affected by the surrounding conditions. With the correct speed a vessel can overcome adverse conditions to a certain degree.

 

If the ship can maintain it's "normal" cruising speed then there would be no affect on it's stability. If the ship is being forced to slow down then it's stability is affected. Maybe only slightly, because they have only slowed slightly, but it will still be affected. Doesn't matter how many pods are used....speed affects stability.

Also, if they cannot extend the stabilizers, because of the drag they cause, then it will definately affect the stability. I would think the remaining two azipods would have enough tourque to operate with the stabilizers extended. I could be wrong about that though.

 

The ship has been slowed down enough to alter itineraries on the Eastern swing. It is possible that it will have an affect on it's stabilty, I personally don't think it has been slowed down enough to cause adverse stability.

My only real concerns are that RCI is not acknowledging the problem enough to notify passengers soon enough to alter thier plans, and I'm also worried they will need to dry dock the ship to make reapirs thus cancelling my cruise in May.

[janeyzee]

I would love to miss Nassau been on 50 cruises and been there so many times we don't even get off but we are booked on the Allure and thinking of cancelling not because of her actual problem we don't mind going slower but I wonder whether the ship is rocky because of the problem. If the ship is unstable I sure as heck going to cancel because two people in my family (we have four rooms total) are prone to sea sickness if a ship is rocky. Can anybody comment whether the ship was rocky more than normal?

 

I believe as long as the stabilizers are functioning, one azipod not running shouldn't change the stability of the ship, just the speed a little bit. Being wider by 30 feet than other cruise ships makes her more stable too. I've never felt a lot of movement on Oasis or Allure, not like the smaller ships. I tend to get seasick on small boats and/or smaller cruise ships, but never on Allure or Oasis. Those stabilizers are great at keeping the pitch and roll to the very minimum. At least that has been my experience.

[yankee46]

Just got off Allure 10/27 there are no problems with speed etc the TV showed 24 knots on several occasions. There was no rocking or rolling anf we were in a storm or two. movement was minimal get a life people.

[jktheangel]

I went to a land based vacation in August 2011 to arm pit ( IMO ) Bahamas so when we went on our allure cruise in oct 2011 we did not get off for Nassau Also IMO the allure sucked and rccl is not a favorite of mine anymore the Allure has many passengers with too few employees I have a cruise for next year on navagator. The main. Reason is because I have a cruise credit ( from the bad allure cruise ) I don't want to waste. After the navagator cruise. I will decide if I cruise rccl. Their lack of customer service is horrendous and this issue with the pods just proves it all the more

 

 

Jamie

[jcl410]

If the ship can maintain it's "normal" cruising speed then there would be no affect on it's stability. If the ship is being forced to slow down then it's stability is affected. Maybe only slightly, because they have only slowed slightly, but it will still be affected. Doesn't matter how many pods are used....speed affects stability.

 

 

But in reality, ships cruise at the speed needed to reach their next destination on time. I took a look at the Allure's track from St. Thomas to St. Marteen this week. She maintained 10 knots all night long. Those 2 ports are only 130 miles apart; there is no reason to go any faster.

 

As she was leaving St. Marteen, I saw her makin 18.5 knots.

 

It's not unusual for ships to even stop and drift if their next port is close. (For this, the seas have to be pretty calm.)

 

To sum it up; a ship is stable through a very broad range of speeds.

 

Aloha,

 

John

[reedl]

Also keep in mind that the weather affects the stability of the ship much more than the propulsion can offset it. If the wind is blowing 30 knots from the north, and the seas are not calm, the ship is going to move no matter what. There is nothing that could possibly be done to prevent that.

 

So for those who worry about the ship being "rocky", the weather has a much great effect than some propulsion issue.

[broberts]

I went to a land based vacation in August 2011 to arm pit ( IMO ) Bahamas so when we went on our allure cruise in oct 2011 we did not get off for Nassau Also IMO the allure sucked and rccl is not a favorite of mine anymore the Allure has many passengers with too few employees I have a cruise for next year on navagator. The main. Reason is because I have a cruise credit ( from the bad allure cruise ) I don't want to waste. After the navagator cruise. I will decide if I cruise rccl. Their lack of customer service is horrendous and this issue with the pods just proves it all the more

 

 

Jamie

 

It would be interesting to know if there was ever a vacation that was enjoyed.

 

It would also be illuminating to read how mechanical issues are affected by one's perception of customer service.

[jktheangel]

If your asking if I have enjoyed a vacation. Yes. Reread what I said I was talking about the allure ship and mechanical has everything to so with customer service when rccl can't pull their heads out of their rears and inform people of possible issues or shortened port times. Like the person said previously on her... Why isn't the media all over rccl. Hmm connections somewhere to keep things quiet

 

 

Jamie

[Cruisegirl6]

I don't believe a word jktheangel says!! This poster just signed up on cc just to bash RC and create lies.

[jktheangel]

Lundamr

 

I don't care what you believe as I am not here to please you. I have cruised 3 times with rccl and the allure was the worse. I never had any issues with the others but that was also long ago when they cared about the cruisers and not the bottom dollar I have high hopes that the navagator cruise will be like my other rccl cruises prior to allure cruise I did sign up recently which has NOTHING to do with with "bashing" rccl. So know what your saying or close the mouth Some people on here are just plain rude and ignorant

 

 

Jamie

[Cruisegirl6]

Troll

[FLACRUISER99]

I'm now going to disagree with premise that slowing the ship makes the ship less stable. Nothing could be further from the truth, in fact the faster a ship travels the less stable it is. That's why sea going vessels go slower in bad weather & rough seas.

[Knolmom]

I am not a troll. I have enjoyed many vacations with Royal since 1996.I am not spreading any lies or mis stating any facts. Right now, there is definitely an issue with the Allure. She has propulsion problems and cannot use all of her azipods unless there is an emergency. This problem was discussed openly by the Allure's Captain with pax on the ship during a Q & A about two weeks ago. She can make all the ports on her western Carib itinerary without cutting the time in port short. However, when she sails the eastern itinerary, going to Nassau, st Thomas and St Martin, she cannot make her times using two azipods only, and must arrive late to St Thomas and leave early from Nassau, drastically affecting the customer experience in these ports. This fact was reported not only by passengers aboard the ship to the cruise critic boards on two different sailings, and the Allure was also viewed on the ship's webcam arriving at St Thas At 11:30 AM.

Royal knows that this abbreviated itinerary is likely to continue until the problem is fixed. Rather than be upfront with cruisers and allow them to rearrange tours, Royal media relations prefers to stonewall cruisers, the media and social media. Apparently they enjoy quite a cozy relationship with cruise critic, otherwise we would see at least some coverage of this problem in the cruise news heading on the forum. I would hope that if Cruise Critic enquired about the problem and they were either stonewalled or the abbreviated time in port was denied, they would report it here. Cruise CRITIC?

[Nick67]

Knolmom: to be fair, I think lyndamar called jktheangel a troll, not you

[Brandonclan]

I'm now going to disagree with premise that slowing the ship makes the ship less stable. Nothing could be further from the truth, in fact the faster a ship travels the less stable it is. That's why sea going vessels go slower in bad weather & rough seas.

 

Depending on conditions you are correct. Think of it this way, if you are floating, you are more affected by surrounding waves than if you are moving forward. That is why I said correct speed will overcome certain surrounding conditions. That said, Allure does not need full speed capability to be stable. It is why I said that the reduced speed is probably not enough to cause unstability. We were on Oasis last May in some storms, she was very stable without slowing down. She could have slowed some and not become any more unstable. Had she slowed to a crawl we would have felt her move more with the rough seas.

Ships slow down in rough seas for various reasons. First and foremost is the unpredicability of said rough seas. It stresses the ship more to try and maintain high speeds in rough seas. Their cargo takes more of a beating at higher speeds in rough seas. It burns more fuel to try and maintain higher speeds in rough seas. Etc. etc. etc.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Brandonclan