Service Animals on Celebrity Ship?

[Cruise or Lose!]

It was directed at donaldsc. My apologies for the confusion. I agreed wholeheartedly with YOUR post :-)

 

 

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[wizard-of-roz]

Roz's dog Horton is a real service dog that has been fully trained, including tasks for her physical disability (it is not my place to tell you her medical info.), by Canine Companions for Independence (CCI). Horton is not an emotional support animal.

 

And there is no real national registry for service dogs; almost all dogs registered online are not real service dogs.

 

Quam, thank you.

[wizard-of-roz]

When you use words like "assists me through life and gives me the confidence to continue to work and travel. I couldn't do either without him!" it sounded like the way most people describe their pet dogs. If I misspoke, I apologize.

 

You do have to agree, however, that many people abuse the intent of the service animal law and insist that their animal (whatever species it is) and insist that their pet animal is a service animal because it makes them feel good. There is a big difference between this and a true service animal.

 

 

DON

 

Don, I accept your apology and as Quam stated; Horton and Brenda [my first SD] were both trained, I am proud to say, by Canine Companions for Independence.

 

When I state that Brenda and Horton both have given me "confidence" to go through life.....it's just a very small part of what they do for me. The assistance that they have provided me has allowed me to go into the workplace and out into the world with the ability to meld with the general public. I will always be grateful to them!

 

I know that there are folks who abuse the system. I've seen them. And, I will call them "out" if I see their "pet" misbehave.

 

Corey Hudson, the CEO of Canine Companions is running a campaign, right now, to shut down the web sites that sell phony service dog vests, capes, etc., etc. If you go to the CCI website you too can vote in the campaign.

[fleckle]

Back in post #20 on this thread, I provided a link to a thread on the Disabled Cruise Travel Board titled

 

Cruising With A Service Dog....everything You Ever Wanted To Know!

 

It was started back in 2007 by wizard-of-roz who had a service dog named Brenda at the time, and later a service dog named Horton.

This is apparently the same Roz who posts here as Rolls Royce Lover.

 

 

For the few people on this board who doubted that Roz's dog is really a service dog, I believe that if you read her posts on the Service Dog thread, that will remove all doubts.

 

In particular notice post # 13 on that thread, where she even described some of the chores that her previous dog Brenda performed.

 

[cle-guy]

So I saw a psychologist a couple years ago to help me thru the "midlife crisis" and job change situation.

 

He recommended I get a dog to help with the depression and anxiety in addition to prescribing some medication, and suggesting some other lifestyle changes.

 

So since my doctor recommend the dog, can I bring him on the ship?

 

My understanding is that ADA allows companies to ask only 2 things:

1) Is this a service animal?

2) What

work

does the service animal perform?

 

The law also provides that no proof need be given just a "credible answer" to the questions asked. There is no national "accredited" registry. Any such registry has in essence "self-accredited". There is no need for ID, a vest, special training (although of course generally dogs that provide services do need special training, but ADA does not REQUIRE specialized training per se.) hat the law does not regulate theses things is why places now exist to so readily gain access to such "official" looking documents

 

To me it seems a "comfort" dog as in my situation is NOT covered under ADA guidelines, and organizations that allow them are doing so out of "customer services" reasons, not under the law. I'd say he is NOT covered as he performs no "work" for me, he only comforts me, which is not performing an act for me on my behalf.

 

However if my lovely Tyler is allowed, I will be doing several more cruises each year, much to the dismay of those who love watching him when I do travel now.

[NLH Arizona]

Yes, Curt, Tyler would be allowed on the ship if you say he is a service dog. Celebrity said that they only license or documentation they needed was for health and shots. Businesses are too afraid to confront those that lie about service dogs or have letters from their doctors, because of lawsuits.

Edited August 31, 2014 by NLH Arizona

[New Hampshire]

I'm sure Curt isn't planning on bringing Tyler on a cruise. Curt knows it would be a lie and unethical to do so.

[wizard-of-roz]

Back in post #20 on this thread, I provided a link to a thread on the Disabled Cruise Travel Board titled

 

Cruising With A Service Dog....everything You Ever Wanted To Know!

 

It was started back in 2007 by wizard-of-roz who had a service dog named Brenda at the time, and later a service dog named Horton.

This is apparently the same Roz who posts here as Rolls Royce Lover.

 

 

For the few people on this board who doubted that Roz's dog is really a service dog, I believe that if you read her posts on the Service Dog thread, that will remove all doubts.

 

In particular notice post # 13 on that thread, where she even described some of the chores that her previous dog Brenda performed.

 

 

Yes, I am the Wizard of Roz at my work computer. At home, on my DH's computer I am Rolls Royce Lover.

 

Both my Service Dogs are accredited through Canine Companions for Independence. Brenda passed at age 14 on Feb. 8th. Horton is my Successor Dog.

 

My life is enriched by having a Service Dog in it. It's an obligation to care for a SD but the return is so worth it!

Edited August 31, 2014 by wizard-of-roz

[blindrid]

Horton is not a service dog - he is a pet. Leave him home.

 

DON

 

Totally agree.

 

I feel better being around my son's pit bull. Does that qualify him, no. Pets are wonderful but they do not belong on a cruise ship. If one needs a pets companionship to function, I'm not sure the person should go on a cruise.

[Sloop-JohnB]

Horton is not a service dog - he is a pet. Leave him home.

 

DON

 

Totally agree.

 

I feel better being around my son's pit bull. Does that qualify him, no. Pets are wonderful but they do not belong on a cruise ship. If one needs a pets companionship to function, I'm not sure the person should go on a cruise.

 

Hmmm... BLINDRID

 

Maybe you should have read the whole post (all 258 entries)

 

Cause you missed out in some very important info...

 

Like where DONALDSC apologized to ROLLS ROYCE LOVER (Reply # 246)... for not understanding the credentials that Horton actually has

 

Cheers!

Edited September 2, 2014 by Sloop-JohnB

[NorthernLite]

Don, I accept your apology and as Quam stated; Horton and Brenda [my first SD] were both trained, I am proud to say, by Canine Companions for Independence.

 

When I state that Brenda and Horton both have given me "confidence" to go through life.....it's just a very small part of what they do for me. The assistance that they have provided me has allowed me to go into the workplace and out into the world with the ability to meld with the general public. I will always be grateful to them!

 

I know that there are folks who abuse the system. I've seen them. And, I will call them "out" if I see their "pet" misbehave.

 

Corey Hudson, the CEO of Canine Companions is running a campaign, right now, to shut down the web sites that sell phony service dog vests, capes, etc., etc. If you go to the CCI website you too can vote in the campaign.

 

There are many well trained by the user service dogs out there. When my last companion dog died I looked for a puppy to train as a service dog myself. I did my research and accepted the fact that if like 40% of CCIs dogs she failed I would have a wonderful pet. But as a pup I needed a vest so bought one from a man who trains guard dogs. It stated the dog was in training. After 6 months of solid, repetitive training and reward, plenty of fun time and everything else I realized she would most likely pass every service dog task and test but one; she could not go past another dog without a short friendly hello. While incredibly well trained I would never pass her off as a service dog. She's my pal and she stays with her bff and her owner when we cruise. But I wish CCI would either sell training vests themselves or lay off the self trainers.

 

I do understand that CCI does not allow their dogs that fail to be adopted by disabled people for any possible additional training so no one tries to pass them off as service dogs. It is hard training and any user who wants to try needs to be aware of the failure rate. A true PTSD dog can be a service dog. Try reading Until Tuesday and you'll learn how some military vets are paired with service not emotional support dogs and why.

[Quampapetet]

So I saw a psychologist a couple years ago to help me thru the "midlife crisis" and job change situation.

 

He recommended I get a dog to help with the depression and anxiety in addition to prescribing some medication, and suggesting some other lifestyle changes.

 

So since my doctor recommend the dog, can I bring him on the ship?

 

My understanding is that ADA allows companies to ask only 2 things:

1) Is this a service animal?

2) What

work

does the service animal perform?

 

The law also provides that no proof need be given just a "credible answer" to the questions asked. There is no national "accredited" registry. Any such registry has in essence "self-accredited". There is no need for ID, a vest, special training (although of course generally dogs that provide services do need special training, but ADA does not REQUIRE specialized training per se.) hat the law does not regulate theses things is why places now exist to so readily gain access to such "official" looking documents

 

To me it seems a "comfort" dog as in my situation is NOT covered under ADA guidelines, and organizations that allow them are doing so out of "customer services" reasons, not under the law. I'd say he is NOT covered as he performs no "work" for me, he only comforts me, which is not performing an act for me on my behalf.

 

However if my lovely Tyler is allowed, I will be doing several more cruises each year, much to the dismay of those who love watching him when I do travel now.

 

No, your dog is not a service dog. Service dogs ARE required to be specially trained to do tasks/work that directly relate to the handler's disability. They also must be trained to behave in public (and be housebroken). All this training takes a minimum of six months (not counting the puppy stage) for any dog to really be trained.

 

Dogs who only provide emotional support, comfort, etc. are specifically not service dogs, as is written in the ADA.

 

Also, just having a medical condition does not qualify you as someone covered by the ADA; your condition must be disabling, which means one or more major life activities (seeing, hearing, walking, thinking, etc.) must be substantially limited. Not all cases of depression and anxiety reach that level. Therefore, if you are not disabled, you do not even qualify for an emotional support animal (a regular pet that can live in no-pets housing and fly on planes with you, both requiring a doctor's letter [the airplane one must fit the requirements of the Air Carrier Access Act, including stating you are under the care of the mental health doctor and the letter cannot be older than one year], but cannot go into no-pets public places as service dogs do).

 

You are correct that businesses may ask if the dog is a service dog and what tasks/work the dog has been trained to do that directly relate to the disability. They cannot ask what the actual disability is, of course.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Quampapetet

[alexspepa]

Totally agree.

 

I feel better being around my son's pit bull. Does that qualify him, no. Pets are wonderful but they do not belong on a cruise ship. If one needs a pets companionship to function, I'm not sure the person should go on a cruise.

 

this has to be a candidate for "classless post of the year".

[Cowbell Kingdom]

There is legislation in the works to combat Service Dog Fraud. I'll let you Google for yourselves if you are interested.

 

Service dogs relieve themselves on command and this in a spot of the handler's choosing. Which is immediately dealt with. A sick dog may have issues, but that is rare and the handler would be taking corrective steps.

 

This was clearly not a service dog. But people who have learned the code words to take their PET wherever they please.

 

Vests, badges and other ephemera can be purchased by anyone so that is not an indicator.

 

If it bothers you, join the fight against fraud.

 

 

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[Cowbell Kingdom]

CCI provided a "Puppy In Training" vest for my oh so not qualified puppy. She flunked out. Very much not the right temperament....

 

 

 

 

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[2thesea]

No, your dog is not a service dog. Service dogs ARE required to be specially trained to do tasks/work that directly relate to the handler's disability. They also must be trained to behave in public (and be housebroken). All this training takes a minimum of six months (not counting the puppy stage) for any dog to really be trained.

 

Dogs who only provide emotional support, comfort, etc. are specifically not service dogs, as is written in the ADA.

 

Also, just having a medical condition does not qualify you as someone covered by the ADA; your condition must be disabling, which means one or more major life activities (seeing, hearing, walking, thinking, etc.) must be substantially limited. Not all cases of depression and anxiety reach that level. Therefore, if you are not disabled, you do not even qualify for an emotional support animal (a regular pet that can live in no-pets housing and fly on planes with you, both requiring a doctor's letter [the airplane one must fit the requirements of the Air Carrier Access Act, including stating you are under the care of the mental health doctor and the letter cannot be older than one year], but cannot go into no-pets public places as service dogs do).

 

You are correct that businesses may ask if the dog is a service dog and what tasks/work the dog has been trained to do that directly relate to the disability. They cannot ask what the actual disability is, of course.

 

I think I take issue with your statements. Example - dogs that detect Seizures, Diabetic issues, and comfort/calming for PTSD. ALL medical conditions that can and do require service animals and covered by ADA.

Edited September 3, 2014 by 2thesea

[Fouremco]

The Canadian Service Dog Foundation provides an excellent overview of different categories of dogs providing service, including Emotional Support Animals:

 

http://servicedog.ca/programs/service-dogs

[cle-guy]

I'm sure Curt isn't planning on bringing Tyler on a cruise. Curt knows it would be a lie and unethical to do so.

 

Sadly, this is thru. Sigh.

 

My post was hoping to somewhat clearly differentiate between what the LAW actually does cover (which has many limitations) and what people ASSUME it covers.

[cle-guy]

I think I take issue with your statements. Example - dogs that detect Seizures, Diabetic issues, and comfort/calming for PTSD. ALL medical conditions that can and do require service animals and covered by ADA.

 

Some of these things are covered under the "perform work" clause: those that alert one to an oncoming or ongoing condition provide the "work" of "notifying" the owner of the condition.

 

Calming/PTSD are generally rarely fully qualified under the law (specifically what "work" or "action" do they "perform"?

 

Most businesses just as a course of business, offer exemptions for more than just as subject to the laws of ADA cover, yet still retain the ability to deny access to those costumers, but tend to err on the side of caution than than enforcement in real-life practice.

[A Sixth?]

There is another type of service dog that I love, but wouldn't bring on a cruise. :p:rolleyes:

 

(Couldn't afford his bar tab) :eek:

 

[Project_gal]

My understanding is that ADA allows companies to ask only 2 things:

1) Is this a service animal?

2) What

work

does the service animal perform?

 

I fail to see how this definition would exclude such animals as[for just one example] sheep dogs who both provide a service and do work. Still, perhaps, they could be loaned to the kids club on board ...

Edited September 9, 2014 by Project_gal

[Quampapetet]

I think I take issue with your statements. Example - dogs that detect Seizures, Diabetic issues, and comfort/calming for PTSD. ALL medical conditions that can and do require service animals and covered by ADA.

 

I never said seizure alert, seizure response, and diabetic alert dogs are not service dogs, so I'm not sure where you got that. Comfort/calming dogs are not service dogs, which is expressly written in the ADA. Dogs who are trained to do tasks/work for their mentally disabled handler (PTSD, Major Depressive Disorder, etc.) are service dogs.

 

No condition requires a service dog, but they can be incredibly helpful to those who both qualify for and want one.

[ReneeFLL]

Service dogs are incredible animals...very well trained and they can make a significant quality of life improvement to those that are fortunate enough to have them....I have nothing but admiration for those folks and their dogs.

 

Then there are the scum (sorry if you don't like the word) who get their doctor to write a note that little "nutty" is needed for emotional or other support. They want to be with their pet.

 

Unfortunately there is no waY for celebrity to tell the difference...and if they press, there are some laws that get in the wAy. If you have scum on board, I guess you have to live with the untrained and the uncaring owners. It is unconciable for someone to walk a "service" dog on a ship and expect someone else to pick up the poop....that's real chutzpah!

 

I am a true animal lover, and obviously I have no sympathy for those that decide they are "special".

 

Well said. I'm surprised the crew didn't say anything to them about the poop.

[Sloop-JohnB]

Service dogs are incredible animals...very well trained and they can make a significant quality of life improvement to those that are fortunate enough to have them....I have nothing but admiration for those folks and their dogs.

 

Then there are the scum (sorry if you don't like the word) who get their doctor to write a note that little "nutty" is needed for emotional or other support. They want to be with their pet.

 

Unfortunately there is no waY for celebrity to tell the difference...and if they press, there are some laws that get in the wAy. If you have scum on board, I guess you have to live with the untrained and the uncaring owners. It is unconciable for someone to walk a "service" dog on a ship and expect someone else to pick up the poop....that's real chutzpah!

 

I am a true animal lover, and obviously I have no sympathy for those that decide they are "special".

 

Well said. I'm surprised the crew didn't say anything to them about the poop.

 

Actually...

 

If GHSTUDIOs comments are in reference to a post from a couple of years back, which i think they might be... The cruiseline (think it was Celebrity) did take exception to the "we are special" people and finally put them off the ship at a Port of Call during the cruise

 

Their inappropriate dogs were but one issue... They were all around PITAs for the cruiseline which was easily figured out from their "woe is us" posting on CC after the cruise.

 

As they say... What goes around comes around... And Karma can be a real b!tch (lol a dog reference... That has a lot more weight to it than their "Service Dog" ever had)

 

Cheers!

[Gracie115]

I fail to see how this definition would exclude such animals as[for just one example] sheep dogs who both provide a service and do work. Still, perhaps, they could be loaned to the kids club on board ...

 

Because the "sheep" dog doesn't do a "service" to help a human being's physical/mental limitations...big difference...