HAL not honoring tour price

[Sea42]

I think HAL should honor it.

 

In the US merchants do not have to honor “gross errors”, at least prior to purchase. If a used car is advertised for $10.00 and it was supposed to say $10,000 it’s a gross clerical error that should be obvious as a mistake.

 

However, as far as the excursion, you purchased it, HAL’s a big company making money by you being on the cruise. It’s good customer service to honor that price and no, I don’t think you are being a cheapskate. I would send an email to customer service. It’s a one off issue, not like you paid $10.00 for the cruise.

 

 

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Agreed. It's seems like a no brainer on HAL's part.

[bd1958]

OP: I don't know if you're cheap but I do think you're creating your own aggravation. You say you aren't trying to cheat HAL. But you knew the price was dramatically wrong when you booked it. Now you're claiming principle that they won't honor the mistaken price. Where are your principles? Do principles only work one way? It's pretty clear this was not bait and switch. You had a choice. You could have simply alerted HAL to their mistake and then felt good about doing the right thing. Instead you are putting this on the web stirring indignation.

 

If you were a business owner and you made a mistake, maybe you would honor it to the aggrieved customer. But wouldn't it make your day if someone pointed it out rather than take advantage of the situation? Wouldn't such a kind gesture renew (just a bit) one's faith in honor and integrity?

 

Right now, more than ever, we need to heed the call of integrity.

 

Sincerely,

Bruce Deveau

[Epicureangirl]

Sir, we mispriced your cruise. It was not $999 per person for a 7 day Caribbean cruise, our mistake, it was $9,999 per person. We'll just charge your credit card for your convenience.

 

Oh my! Thank you for correcting that, kind Sir! :')

[dee2673]

OP: I don't know if you're cheap but I do think you're creating your own aggravation. You say you aren't trying to cheat HAL. But you knew the price was dramatically wrong when you booked it. Now you're claiming principle that they won't honor the mistaken price. Where are your principles? Do principles only work one way? It's pretty clear this was not bait and switch. You had a choice. You could have simply alerted HAL to their mistake and then felt good about doing the right thing. Instead you are putting this on the web stirring indignation.

 

 

 

If you were a business owner and you made a mistake, maybe you would honor it to the aggrieved customer. But wouldn't it make your day if someone pointed it out rather than take advantage of the situation? Wouldn't such a kind gesture renew (just a bit) one's faith in honor and integrity?

 

 

 

Right now, more than ever, we need to heed the call of integrity.

 

 

 

Sincerely,

 

Bruce Deveau

 

 

 

I agree with this poster. While I do think HAL should have honored the price, you knew it was wrong. You’ve been on the same excursion so you REALLY knew it was wrong. From a customer service standpoint HAL is wrong. But ,if it had been me, I would have called HAL. I love a bargain as much as anyone and don’t think it’s cheap. I may have asked if they’d honor the price but doubt I’d argue if they didn’t.

 

 

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[Epicureangirl]

OP: I don't know if you're cheap but I do think you're creating your own aggravation. You say you aren't trying to cheat HAL. But you knew the price was dramatically wrong when you booked it. Now you're claiming principle that they won't honor the mistaken price. Where are your principles? Do principles only work one way? It's pretty clear this was not bait and switch. You had a choice. You could have simply alerted HAL to their mistake and then felt good about doing the right thing. Instead you are putting this on the web stirring indignation.

 

If you were a business owner and you made a mistake, maybe you would honor it to the aggrieved customer. But wouldn't it make your day if someone pointed it out rather than take advantage of the situation? Wouldn't such a kind gesture renew (just a bit) one's faith in honor and integrity?

 

Right now, more than ever, we need to heed the call of integrity.

 

Sincerely,

Bruce Deveau

 

Yikes. From reading the first sentence I thought it was a bit harsh but wow, you are knocking this out of the park (looks like a home-run to me!). I'm not sure who exactly is "stirring indignation" here. Do you work for HAL? Is this a political commentary?

[JRG]

OP: I don't know if you're cheap but I do think you're creating your own aggravation. You say you aren't trying to cheat HAL. But you knew the price was dramatically wrong when you booked it. Now you're claiming principle that they won't honor the mistaken price. Where are your principles? Do principles only work one way? It's pretty clear this was not bait and switch. You had a choice. You could have simply alerted HAL to their mistake and then felt good about doing the right thing. Instead you are putting this on the web stirring indignation.

 

If you were a business owner and you made a mistake, maybe you would honor it to the aggrieved customer. But wouldn't it make your day if someone pointed it out rather than take advantage of the situation? Wouldn't such a kind gesture renew (just a bit) one's faith in honor and integrity?

 

Right now, more than ever, we need to heed the call of integrity.

 

Sincerely,

Bruce Deveau

 

This moral argument is correct. Taking advantage of a typo and crying foul later is just not an honorable principle to stand behind. This does not mean the OP is not honorable, that is not what I am saying.

 

From an emotional point of view, a lot of users would like to see you get the deal, but you didn't and that is not that big a deal after all and you'll probably never make that mistake again anyways.

[AmazedByCruising]

"It was listed at $9.95 for a bus into Bristol from the port and a tour at a restored historic ship (SS Great Britian)."

 

That's a superdeal, maybe even an error you should notice, IF you're on a cruise ship AND you are used to cruise ship excursion prices. Apparently, OP falls into that category.

 

But: the normal entrance is 14 pounds, $19, before discounts for groups. A bus ride with 50 other people sounds like $5 per person. Probably a "free toilet stop" at the local souvenirshop, and lunch at "the best restaurant of Bristol", could turn it into a nice profit.

 

I'm not sure it's that obvious that 9.95 was an error.

[doublebzz]

 

The only way that the OP would have to pay for HAL's mistake would be if HAL forced him to pay the correct price and take the excursion. I am assuming that the OP has the option to pay the full price or cancel the tour. If so, no harm, no foul.

 

I don't know whether this has ever been clarified. After the price error was uncovered, was the op given the chance to cancel or was the charge ex post facto?

[Aquahound]

I agree completely with bd1958. As I read post after post before this, I was beginning to think that I was the only one who felt that way.

 

No, you're not the only one. If the OP actually thought this tour was $9.95 and that it was only a transfer, I would side more with them. But that's not what happened. They knew it was a mistake, gambled on HAL not catching it, and now they want to turn to social media for some sort of internet justice when it didn't go their way.

[Epicureangirl]

Spot on, bd1958!!! For me the red flag was OP's claim that "It's the principle of the thing", when any sentient human being could see (from the rest of the Post) that it was all about the money!

I guess I'm not a "sentient human being" then. ;) When a business makes a mistake, it is common business practice to first acknowledge it was their mistake and make it right with the customer (not go go ahead and adjust the bill). The length of time that passed before they rectified their mistake, was an opportunity cost for the OP to make other arrangements. If a tour operator cancels on me two months later (unless I pay 10 times the price!), that could actually cost me time and money to find alternate tours or transportation. If this was my dear old Nan, she would have not known the price was wrong ($10 sounds reasonable to go see an old boat with a huge bus load of people). True, this isn't my dear old Nan, but I certainly don't think the OP or HAL is the villain here (despite how darn mean-spirited this thread is beginning to read). I also don't think the OP is coming here for some sort of social-justice. If someone can't post their experience without having their character attacked in the process, it's pretty sad (and that is not directed at you Avian777, just a comment based on what I'm seeing on many threads here). There was a mistake made, and it would have been nice to see a win-win here but there was no happy ending for anyone.

[*Miss G*]

Spot on E-Girl. You have hit the nail on the head. I think HAL could even offer a meal in Canaletto to mitigate their error. If it's as good as they say, it could drum up business in that venue as well as help with feelings of good will.

[Tampa Girl]

I guess I'm not a "sentient human being" then. ;) When a business makes a mistake, it is common business practice to first acknowledge it was their mistake and make it right with the customer (not go go ahead and adjust the bill). The length of time that passed before they rectified their mistake, was an opportunity cost for the OP to make other arrangements. If a tour operator cancels on me two months later (unless I pay 10 times the price!), that could actually cost me time and money to find alternate tours or transportation. If this was my dear old Nan, she would have not known the price was wrong ($10 sounds reasonable to go see an old boat with a huge bus load of people). True, this isn't my dear old Nan, but I certainly don't think the OP or HAL is the villain here (despite how darn mean-spirited this thread is beginning to read). I also don't think the OP is coming here for some sort of social-justice. If someone can't post their experience without having their character attacked in the process, it's pretty sad (and that is not directed at you Avian777, just a comment based on what I'm seeing on many threads here). There was a mistake made, and it would have been nice to see a win-win here but there was no happy ending for anyone.

 

But there is a win-win here, assuming that OP is not going to be penalized for cancelling this excursion. From a legal standpoint, I doubt if a customer would win a breach of contract claim under the facts of this case. This is particularly true when the customer knew, or should have known that the price was wrong. And OP knew that it was incorrect. She had been on that excursion or, at least, to the site of the excursion, and realized that it should have cost more.

 

The bottom line is that OP is not out anything but her hopes that HAL would honor their mistake. There is no reason why HAL should fulfil her unrealistic hopes, even under the theory of "good business." IMHO, it is unreasonable to expect otherwise.

[*Miss G*]

As for the tone in a major portion of the threads here, I think many should be ashamed of themselves, though they will not. Numerous times I have seen where members say they rarely post here due to the tone. I feel that way myself. But I seem to have some sort of Pollyanna complex where I think good will win out. I have to wonder whether some of the accusatory and pontificating members are the very ones I hear moaning on the ships. I would certainly not want to be stuck with them at my table.

[Cruzaholic41]

As for the tone in a major portion of the threads here, I think many should be ashamed of themselves, though they will not.

 

Ashamed for what?

[WpgCruise]

As for businesses making mistakes ........ If a cashier accidentally gives me change for a twenty instead of a ten ----- is it okay for me to keep the extra money because it was THEIR error and not my business to correct them? Just asking.

 

This comment for me summarizes the situation very well.

 

The O.P. knew the price was wrong, wanted to take advantage, got caught, and now claims foul.

 

It disappoints how many support that position. What ever became of honesty ? Sad, very sad.

[3rdGenCunarder]

It wasn't an issue of honesty/dishonesty. It was an experiment, a test of HAL's organization and ability to manage themselves. I wanted to see what would happen. I booked it expecting the booking to fail right away. It took them 2 months to find this error. Whether they honor the price or not, it shows that they are sloppy. I posted here because I found it disappointing that good will has so little value to HAL.

 

I'd love to know how many other people booked the tour at this price. Probably most will cancel because of the change. I hope anyone who does cancel because of the price goes on their own because the SS Great Britain is a fascinating ship and museum.

 

Frankly, I don't give the south end of a north-facing rat that I won't get the tour for that price. I was curious about what would happen, and now I know. Thought I'd share the experience.

 

To answer some questions, I have never taken that tour before--never been to Bristol on a cruise before, only on independent land trips. It's two years after our last visit to the Great Britain, so I didn't remember what the entry fee had been, and I didn't bother to look it up until after HAL's email about the price change. I have never taken a European cruise with HAL, so I had no sense of what their tours typically cost. 9.95 was too low, but I didn't expect 99.95, either. But as more tours have been loaded onto the website in the intervening months, I see that it is comparable to what HAL charges, which is high IMO. It's a ship tour, subject to the usual cancellation option, so I was able to cancel it and not lose any money. Just a little skin from the flaying I took here. Frankly, I expected worse.

[Epicureangirl]

But there is a win-win here, assuming that OP is not going to be penalized for cancelling this excursion.

We'll have to agree to disagree here on what constitutes a win-win in a customer service scenario I guess. How would you suppose they penalize HER for cancelling this excursion? Keep her $10? Give her a dungeon-stateroom when onboard? :confused: Edited January 5, 2018 by Epicureangirl
Kathy is a HER not a HIM. ;) Apologies, Kathy!

[Tampa Girl]

We'll have to agree to disagree here on what constitutes a win-win in a customer service scenario I guess. How would you suppose they penalize HIM for cancelling this excursion? Keep his $10? Give him a dungeon-stateroom when onboard? :confused:

 

Exactly. If HAL keeps her $10, that is a penalty. Losing the chance on not having HAL catch their error is hardly a penalty. Consequently, OP has not been harmed. Just disappointment.

[Epicureangirl]

As for the tone in a major portion of the threads here, I think many should be ashamed of themselves, though they will not. Numerous times I have seen where members say they rarely post here due to the tone. I feel that way myself. But I seem to have some sort of Pollyanna complex where I think good will win out. I have to wonder whether some of the accusatory and pontificating members are the very ones I hear moaning on the ships. I would certainly not want to be stuck with them at my table.

I did have the thought -- about this being a dreadful-dinnertime conversation onboard my next cruise. It scares me... I might go check my roll-call again. Shame you're not on it Miss G.

[CI66774]

They are not required to honor pricing mistakes. Now - should they? That's up for debate. Why not appeal to a higher up?

[doublebzz]

I certainly don't think the OP or HAL is the villain here (despite how darn mean-spirited this thread is beginning to read). I also don't think the OP is coming here for some sort of social-justice. If someone can't post their experience without having their character attacked in the process, it's pretty sad

These type of threads come up fairly often and its often the same group of HAL loyalists or self-righteous moralists who assault the character of the thread originator. Of course, we will never know what their views would be if they are placed in similar situations.

[cruisemom42]

Understandably, there are a lot of viewpoints on issues like this one. But even though we may feel sympathetic toward the person affected by the "mistake", HAL makes it very clear on their website exactly what the rules are in this situation. Under their Terms and Conditions for their website, it says:

 

"Holland America Line reserves the right not to honor any published prices that it determines were erroneous due to printing, electronic or clerical error. Holland America Line shall have the right to refuse or cancel any bookings made at an incorrect price whether or not the order has been confirmed and your credit card charged. If your credit card has already been charged for the purchase and your order is canceled, Holland America Line shall immediately issue a credit to your credit card account in the amount of the incorrect price."

 

So to me it seems that one has to accept the (perhaps unpleasant) truth that HAL is not obligated to do more for the OP than they have done, unless they did not issue a credit prior to the rebooking at correct price.

 

I think this falls into the same category as sticking to the rules regarding the refunding of a cruise fare after the cancellation window closes -- while a poster may have a story that deserves sympathy, the cruise line generally "holds the line" according to their terms, and most of us would agree that they must. Hence the need for insurance.

 

I also did a little more digging on the topic, since someone had suggested the OP involve a consumer advocate. I looked at elliott.org, since that one was specifically mentioned. Their take on this issue basically boils down to this: In a retail environment, in general, a store has up until it accepts your payment to discover a pricing error. Once payment is accepted, you can likely challenge any attempt to change the price after the fact. (However, if the customer knew it was a pricing error, then there is some wiggle room in interpretation....)

 

The same doesn't hold true, unfortunately, in the online world. Again according to elliott.org, most websites now include language in their Terms and Conditions that allow the cancellation of orders with pricing errors even after payment is made. And HAL clearly has this, as noted above.

 

One can debate how this could or should have been handled -- some type of courtesy offer -- maybe something like 10% off the "correct" price of the tour -- would have been nice and good customer relations. But I don't think one can argue that HAL is required to do anything other than what was done.

 

The relevant page on elliott.org: http://www.elliott.org/advice-you-can-take/get-company-honor-incorrect-price-maybe/

[bd1958]

I assume the comments about tone and shame are related to me. I admit to a snarky tone in the opening sentence to my comments. Apologies. I would edit it out but it's been copied several times so to change it would be irrelevant.

 

I do not feel shame nor do I feel as if I've disrespected the OP. She opened with an ethical argument and I responded with an ethical argument. OP (I believe your name is Kathy) admits she took advantage of the situation and also that she engaged in an experiment. I'm just saying that doing so invites negative feelings in one's life and in the world. My point gets to a larger piece of cultural criticism which suggests these kinds of actions are choices with predictable outcomes.

 

What if the 'experiment' was simply to point out the error to HAL and call it a day, getting to feel good about doing the right thing. That's a predictable, positive reaction, and we would not be having this conversation. Maybe we would be having a different conversation about something more important or joyful or interesting.

 

Kathy, i'm sorry you feel bruised and I will stop if you want.

 

Regards,

Bruce

[doublebzz]

Understandably, there are a lot of viewpoints on issues like this one. But even though we may feel sympathetic toward the person affected by the "mistake", HAL makes it very clear on their website exactly what the rules are in this situation. Under their Terms and Conditions for their website, it says:

 

"Holland America Line reserves the right not to honor any published prices that it determines were erroneous due to printing, electronic or clerical error. Holland America Line shall have the right to refuse or cancel any bookings made at an incorrect price whether or not the order has been confirmed and your credit card charged. If your credit card has already been charged for the purchase and your order is canceled, Holland America Line shall immediately issue a credit to your credit card account in the amount of the incorrect price."

 

 

Cruisemom - You make a very articulate and sensible argument without invoking personal invective and I tend to agree with you. The only thing I would question, which is not included in HAL's disclaimer, is whether upon recognizing the price error, HAL automatically charged OP's credit card the higher price without first obtaining his approval.

[cruisemom42]

Cruisemom - You make a very articulate and sensible argument without invoking personal invective and I tend to agree with you. The only thing I would question, which is not included in HAL's disclaimer, is whether upon recognizing the price error, HAL automatically charged OP's credit card the higher price without first obtaining his approval.

 

Good point and I agree they should obtain approval.