Huge brawl on the Legend, with video.

[LuvBNatC]

People love to say the Captain is always to blame when things turn bad. Again, one man or woman and many onboard departments. That is why there are experts that are on Carnival's payroll in charge of security. I can't say what the root cause is for the breakdown of Carnival's security onboard Legend was, but don't blame the visible Captain. The people to truly blame are not onboard.

 

I've watched this video quite a few times now, here and on several TV reports. The sight of the captain sauntering away from the melee is disturbing, to put it mildly. There's NO WAY he should witness that level of violence to and by passengers on this vessel, putting his own crew members at risk of injury, and turn his back on it. No way.

 

 

None of the TV reports I saw mentioned that the stout man in white leaving was the captain. They probably didn't know. If they did, and reported that, Carnival would be having the worst PR nightmare on its hands since Costa's captain, Francesco Schettino, wrecked Concordia and abandoned ship to let everyone fend for themselves. It's the same concept, just to a lesser degree, since the ship itself was never in danger.

[Stateroom_Sailor]

"What do you want me to do about it, throw them overboard?"

 

One woman stated the Captain said this. And she gave plenty of interviews and got plenty of attention. Her 15 minutes of glory.

 

I haven’t seen a video recording of the Captain saying these words.

People just took her words and ran with it.

Only a fool believes everything and everyone that posts on the internet

 

I doubt very much these words came from the captain’s mouth. But I’m open if someone presents me with proof.

 

What do you think the captain did say?

 

"You've had it, we've had it, but none of us have had it enough. As soon as one of you passengers pin one of them down, we'll take over from there."

[Stateroom_Sailor]

All this makes me wonder if I will be safe on my 2 week Alaskan Aug '18. I would think that on a 2 week cruise, we would not get that kind of crowd. I know this cruise was 10 days, but from what I have read on CC boards a 10 day cruise is short for Aussies. I hope I do not regret not canceling.

 

Unlikely anything like this. If someone wanted to get on a cruise to fight, they would pick a shorter and warmer cruise, with more young people.

 

That being said, and I hope it's different for Alaska, some Carnival passengers can get quite grumpy towards the end of a 14 day cruise. Our Journey cruise ended with pushing and shoving in the buffet, with bold and sassy line cutting, someone threw a plate at staff, and some had no qualms about sneezing on each other, or the buffet tongs. The F bomb became common discourse in the pool area, once all the main ports were behind us, and the excitement was over. If attitudes go south, I would avoid the lido deck the last 3 days.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Stateroom_Sailor

[ElaineKeagy]

I doubt that there would be proof. But, I'm curious. Do you doubt her because a) there is no corroborating video or b) because she got plenty of attention and her 15 minutes of glory?

 

 

 

It seems you've already made your judgement on this situation with your blanket statement. I'm more inclined given the reports that are out there that something like this probably was said.

 

 

 

I doubt because only one person has said this and because no one else has backed her up on this. Her teenage son was standing next to her in the interview but heck, as a teenager I’d have never contradicted one of my parents in public. Yeah, I’d love to see some corroborating evidence.

 

And all the so-called “reports” out there I’ve seen all quote this one same woman.

 

Believe what you want. I’ve just been round long enough to know that most people love to get attention and given the opportunity will stretch the truth or outright lie. It’s human nature. We’re all guilty of it at one time or another. But I’m just not a naive person and because you say something I don’t immediately believe it.

 

Maybe this Captain was totally derelict in his duty!! Like the Captain of that Costa cruise ship where 30 some passengers drowned. Who knows?? I don’t. Know. You don’t know. At this time, I’m not passing judgement on anyone but that weird family group.

 

 

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[ElaineKeagy]

What do you think the captain did say?

 

 

 

"You've had it, we've had it, but none of us have had it enough. As soon as one of you passengers pin one of them down, we'll take over from there."

 

 

 

I have no idea what the Captain said. I wasn’t there.

 

 

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[beerman2]

Did we even read the same post? You may have missed this part.

 

"I saw some of the video. They were kicking offenders attacking others as far as I could tell. If not I hope they get some type of punishment as well. Very poor untrained kicks that looked like children. But kicking can be effective and allowed in court.

Really bad situation all around. Seems to be some very poor training and guys got frustrated with some very active trouble makers."

How about this:

"But kicking can be effective and allowed in court",

[les37b]

How about this:

"But kicking can be effective and allowed in court",

 

What court would that be?

[beerman2]

What court would that be?

Might want to go back and read post #665. It came from an American Law Enforcement Officer. ( Or so he claims)

[dwayneb236]

I didn't lie. State of Texas

 

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[les37b]

Might want to go back and read post #665. It came from an American Law Enforcement Officer. ( Or so he claims)

 

So totally irrelevant since American courts or Law Enforcement Officers have no jurisdiction on a Cruise ship sailing in International waters off the coast of Australia. I do believe it was Australian Police that dealt with it.

 

Maybe kicking people held down and restrained in a headlock by policemen is allowed in the US. I'm not in a position to challenge. I would suspect in most countries that would constitute assault. I'm sure a courts views may be different if kicks were made to defend the officer, but hardly what happened is it.

 

But let's put things into perspective. A security guard is not a policeman and his kicks were on someone held down. Some on here have sung their praises like they are heroes which I find a bit disturbing as in my eyes that makes him no different from the thug on the floor.

[dwayneb236]

You obviously didn't read all of my post or chose to ignore the part where I said the security guards looked like they were poorly trained and acting like children

 

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[Doug & Cindy Scrap Hunter]

I have no idea what the Captain said. I wasn’t there.

 

 

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But there was a gal there who did hear the answer. You didn't hear it but you have all the answers for her intention. Woudln't she still get 15 minutes of fame repeating what he really said? What's a better answer he could have given for allowing this for 9 days anyways?

[les37b]

You obviously didn't read all of my post or chose to ignore the part where I said the security guards looked like they were poorly trained and acting like children

 

I am assuming that was aimed at beerman2, since he is the one citing your post with references to things you've said whilst ignoring other parts. Your reply here supports my views. They clearly do need proper training, no disagreement there.

[dwayneb236]

This was to les. You can defend anyone with whatever force is necessary to protect them, but what i saw on the very limited video from the security was not this. But again I'm sure he'll ignore me stating this and talk about how violent we are.

 

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[dwayneb236]

And by force I meant up to the force they are themselves using.

 

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[Aquahound]

So totally irrelevant since American courts or Law Enforcement Officers have no jurisdiction on a Cruise ship sailing in International waters off the coast of Australia.

 

That's not true. If a civil claim were to be made against the cruise line, the venue would be Miami, FL. So yes, American courts are relevant.

 

What court would that be?

 

U.S. District Court, Southern District of Florida

[torcruise]

So totally irrelevant since American courts or Law Enforcement Officers have no jurisdiction on a Cruise ship sailing in International waters off the coast of Australia. I do believe it was Australian Police that dealt with it.

 

Maybe kicking people held down and restrained in a headlock by policemen is allowed in the US. I'm not in a position to challenge. I would suspect in most countries that would constitute assault. I'm sure a courts views may be different if kicks were made to defend the officer, but hardly what happened is it.

 

But let's put things into perspective. A security guard is not a policeman and his kicks were on someone held down. Some on here have sung their praises like they are heroes which I find a bit disturbing as in my eyes that makes him no different from the thug on the floor.

In America police officer can beat, choke, shoot, kill people who are down also so yeah we don't really hold police accountable for excessive force :(

[elliair]

But there was a gal there who did hear the answer. You didn't hear it but you have all the answers for her intention. Woudln't she still get 15 minutes of fame repeating what he really said? What's a better answer he could have given for allowing this for 9 days anyways?[/quote]

 

I could hear his response now: "They were good customers at all the bars. We made a boat load of money off of this group, and we let them have their fun." :D

[elliair]

In America police officer can beat, choke, shoot, kill people who are down also so yeah we don't really hold police accountable for excessive force :(

They will even sic their dog on you too. No criminal likes that idea and panics and gives up, I would too!

[ElaineKeagy]

But there was a gal there who did hear the answer. You didn't hear it but you have all the answers for her intention. Woudln't she still get 15 minutes of fame repeating what he really said? What's a better answer he could have given for allowing this for 9 days anyways?

 

 

 

Gee. I don’t know if she actually even talked to the captain during the cruise. But you obviously believe everything that everyone posts on social media, so I’m very happy for you.

 

 

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[les37b]

This was to les. You can defend anyone with whatever force is necessary to protect them, but what i saw on the very limited video from the security was not this. But again I'm sure he'll ignore me stating this and talk about how violent we are.

 

A bit of a confusing post. I'm not the one picking up anything you've said in any post you've made, so not sure where this "again" bit comes from.

 

I can only comment on what I saw and that was that the security guard kicking someone being held on the floor which we both agree (I think) was poor and the security people in the clip need training.

 

If you are suggesting I think police officers (or security guards) dont have a right to defend themselves, then you're wrong. There is no reason anyone should have to put up being attacked by a thug. But kicking people held on the floor is just plain wrong.

 

I'm left confused, since on one hand you appear agree with me on what we both saw, but then make it clear you're not happy about something.

[firemanbobswife]

They will even sic their dog on you too. No criminal likes that idea and panics and gives up, I would too!

 

Good idea! I think they should have police canines onboard. Maybe that would be deterrent enough.

[les37b]

That's not true. If a civil claim were to be made against the cruise line, the venue would be Miami, FL. So yes, American courts are relevant.

 

U.S. District Court, Southern District of Florida

 

Civil claim?

 

I thought we were talking assault here and kicking someone when held on the floor?

 

Goalposts move much?

 

So are you saying if any charges are made on the thugs or the violent guards, they will be extradited to the US? Really? Hmm OK.

[Aquahound]

Civil claim?

 

I thought we were talking assault here and kicking someone when held on the floor?

 

Goalposts move much?

 

So are you saying if any charges are made on the thugs or the violent guards, they will be extradited to the US? Really? Hmm OK.

 

 

You said American courts are irrelevant. You were wrong. If the person on the ground wants to take action against the security guards, they need to file suit against Carnival in Miami. That's how it works. Don't believe me? Read Carnival's cruise contract.

[declansdad]

So totally irrelevant since American courts or Law Enforcement Officers have no jurisdiction on a Cruise ship sailing in International waters off the coast of Australia. I do believe it was Australian Police that dealt with it.

 

Maybe kicking people held down and restrained in a headlock by policemen is allowed in the US. I'm not in a position to challenge. I would suspect in most countries that would constitute assault. I'm sure a courts views may be different if kicks were made to defend the officer, but hardly what happened is it.

 

But let's put things into perspective. A security guard is not a policeman and his kicks were on someone held down. Some on here have sung their praises like they are heroes which I find a bit disturbing as in my eyes that makes him no different from the thug on the floor.

 

You ask what court and get an answer, then you say that is irrelevant.

 

Some posts on this thread are just too funny.