No Sail Order - does anyone know what has happened to crew members?

[Mercury]

When I look back on my cruises, I always remember crew members who stood out and made the cruise even more special.

 

I think now of all the ships that are unable to sail and I am wondering what has happened to all the crew members? Obviously there will be some essential staff who are required to be on board but what about the staff like the Waiters, Cabin attendants, Shore excursion staff, Entertainment staff etc?

Have they all been able to go home to their families?

[www3traveler]

Little by little some staff have been able to go home.

[chengkp75]

In addition to the estimated 80,000 cruise ship crew on ships in or near the US, there are the 1.6 million merchant mariners currently on ships. These mariners represent about 100,000 crew changes per month, all year long, and just like the cruise ship crews, they are basically stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.  Many ports around the world will not allow crew changes, many countries will not allow flights to/from the crews' home countries, and in the US, now cruise ship crew need to be on charter aircraft paid for by the cruise line to get permission to land crew for repatriation.  While the shutdown of the cruise industry will have a profound effect on tourism in many places, an extended shutdown of crew changes on the 54,000 merchant ships around the world will stifle the 80% of the world's trade that travels by sea, as the onboard crew reach their statutory work limit (11 months), and ships stop due to lack of crew.

[Mercury]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

In addition to the estimated 80,000 cruise ship crew on ships in or near the US, there are the 1.6 million merchant mariners currently on ships. These mariners represent about 100,000 crew changes per month, all year long, and just like the cruise ship crews, they are basically stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.  Many ports around the world will not allow crew changes, many countries will not allow flights to/from the crews' home countries, and in the US, now cruise ship crew need to be on charter aircraft paid for by the cruise line to get permission to land crew for repatriation.  While the shutdown of the cruise industry will have a profound effect on tourism in many places, an extended shutdown of crew changes on the 54,000 merchant ships around the world will stifle the 80% of the world's trade that travels by sea, as the onboard crew reach their statutory work limit (11 months), and ships stop due to lack of crew.

 

Thank-you for your post. You raise some interesting points with regards to the crew on cruise ships:

1) Most cruise ship crew are stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.

As many of the crew are paid via the tips passengers are required to pay as part of their cruise fare, I wonder how the crew are now being remunerated?

2) What will happen to crew who have reached the statutory work limit and cannot get home? I think on cruise ships, many crew sign up for 7 month contracts so it is even less than the Merchant ship limit of 11 months.

Will they just stay on the ship and not get any pay?

I can imagine this is a dilemma for both the crew and cruise lines.

 

[chengkp75]

28 minutes ago, Mercury said:

 

Thank-you for your post. You raise some interesting points with regards to the crew on cruise ships:

1) Most cruise ship crew are stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.

As many of the crew are paid via the tips passengers are required to pay as part of their cruise fare, I wonder how the crew are now being remunerated?

2) What will happen to crew who have reached the statutory work limit and cannot get home? I think on cruise ships, many crew sign up for 7 month contracts so it is even less than the Merchant ship limit of 11 months.

Will they just stay on the ship and not get any pay?

I can imagine this is a dilemma for both the crew and cruise lines.

 

While under normal circumstances, the crew in the DSC pool get paid a combination of wage and DSC, with DSC being the majority, the law requires a minimum wage for all seafarers of $618/month (for a 40 hour work week), plus overtime for hours worked over 40/week.  So, if DSC is reduced, or in this case removed completely, to the point where the normal wage is less than the minimum, then the company is required to make up the difference to the minimum.  So, I would suspect that most crew are either not working at all (on ships in quarantine), or working only the 40 hour week, so they are getting paid the minimum.

 

The 11 month limit applies to all seafarers, even cruise ship crew.  The 7-10 month contracts the cruise ship crew sign are determined by collective bargaining between the cruise lines and the "unions"/staffing agencies in the crew's home countries.  If crew reach the statutory limit and cannot get off the ship, this will be brand new territory.  My assumption is that the MLC provides that if you are on the ship, you get paid the minimum, even if you cannot work due to your time being up.  The IMO and ILO may feel the need to keep mariners working to keep the ships moving, so they may pass exemptions to the maximum time limit.  The problem is that it has been shown that after 10-11 months on ship, especially when the length of service is not known for sure, that accidents increase dramatically, especially serious or fatal accidents.  Seafaring is a dangerous business, and there are many ways to get yourself killed if you lose focus from being onboard too long.

[Mercury]

Thanks so much chengkp75 for your very informative post.

 

At least if the crew is not able to get home they at least get paid something. I really do feel for them. 

So many people struggling through this pandemic.

[TrumpyNor]

Regarding crew from NCL in particular, a friend of me who works on Norwegian Star posted this on her FB a few days ago:

Edited April 13, 2020 by TrumpyNor

[KateQ22003]

I spoke to an NCL bartender friend yesterday; he said they are spending their time cleaning and enjoying some time without guests 🙂 I told him I was surprised he hadn't been sent home, and he said that getting flights home has been a challenge.

[Mercury]

Great that NCL is helping the crew with repatriation - thanks for that TrumpyNor

[mking8288]

Royal Caribbean is using some of their ships currently in other parts of the world to relocate/bring some of the crew members home or close to their home countries, instead of using charter flights.

 

Maybe, just maybe, NCL can find space onboard those repo ships. 

[jaxw17]

Terrible times for all. Crew the cruise companies and all who would have thought we would have been in the middle of this when we all welcomed the new year in. Stay safe everyone 

[YVRBassElectric]

6 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

In addition to the estimated 80,000 cruise ship crew on ships in or near the US, there are the 1.6 million merchant mariners currently on ships. These mariners represent about 100,000 crew changes per month, all year long, and just like the cruise ship crews, they are basically stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.  Many ports around the world will not allow crew changes, many countries will not allow flights to/from the crews' home countries, and in the US, now cruise ship crew need to be on charter aircraft paid for by the cruise line to get permission to land crew for repatriation.  While the shutdown of the cruise industry will have a profound effect on tourism in many places, an extended shutdown of crew changes on the 54,000 merchant ships around the world will stifle the 80% of the world's trade that travels by sea, as the onboard crew reach their statutory work limit (11 months), and ships stop due to lack of crew.

WOW - thanks for that information! In Canada we are already having Supply chain issues, can't imagine how bad it will get if Cargo ships stop

[npcl]

6 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

In addition to the estimated 80,000 cruise ship crew on ships in or near the US, there are the 1.6 million merchant mariners currently on ships. These mariners represent about 100,000 crew changes per month, all year long, and just like the cruise ship crews, they are basically stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.  Many ports around the world will not allow crew changes, many countries will not allow flights to/from the crews' home countries, and in the US, now cruise ship crew need to be on charter aircraft paid for by the cruise line to get permission to land crew for repatriation.  While the shutdown of the cruise industry will have a profound effect on tourism in many places, an extended shutdown of crew changes on the 54,000 merchant ships around the world will stifle the 80% of the world's trade that travels by sea, as the onboard crew reach their statutory work limit (11 months), and ships stop due to lack of crew.

Any system for ships to get waivers on the 11 month limit?  If so who would have to approve it?

[IrieBajan54]

Up to 15 ships anchored at Barbados

 

"MOST OF THE SHIPS anchored off Barbados are now operating with skeleton crews.Barbados Port Inc. chairman Senator Lisa Cummins said crew members had been boarding chartered flights and returning home.“For the last month, passengers have been getting repatriated and once they were gone, the crews have also been getting repatriated all over the world by way of charter flights. Last night [April 11] most of the crew of the Norwegian Spirit left on two charter flights,” she said.

The Norwegian Spirit, which arrived last week, would usually have a crew of 965. Cummins said some other ships had as much as 1500 but they were almost all down to around 200. “The ships cannot be abandoned so the minimum crew stays behind until they receive instructions as to what to do next. Until then the ships will stay at anchor and that is the same worldwide,” she said."

https://www.nationnews.com/nationnews/news/244976/anchored-cruise-ships-operating-minimal-crew

[chengkp75]

26 minutes ago, npcl said:

Any system for ships to get waivers on the 11 month limit?  If so who would have to approve it?

This would be virgin territory, since there has never been a world-wide ban on crew changes.  I'm assuming it would be up to the flag states to make waivers in agreement with their maritime unions.  Getting the IMO to move on something like this would be glacially slow.

[Aunu]

8 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

In addition to the estimated 80,000 cruise ship crew on ships in or near the US, there are the 1.6 million merchant mariners currently on ships. These mariners represent about 100,000 crew changes per month, all year long, and just like the cruise ship crews, they are basically stuck on their ships for the indefinite future.  Many ports around the world will not allow crew changes, many countries will not allow flights to/from the crews' home countries, and in the US, now cruise ship crew need to be on charter aircraft paid for by the cruise line to get permission to land crew for repatriation.  While the shutdown of the cruise industry will have a profound effect on tourism in many places, an extended shutdown of crew changes on the 54,000 merchant ships around the world will stifle the 80% of the world's trade that travels by sea, as the onboard crew reach their statutory work limit (11 months), and ships stop due to lack of crew.

My husband is one of those merchant mariners stuck on a ship right now.  Hes usually on a 4 week rotation but has been gone for 7+ at the moment with another week + to go as long as all goes well. He was supposed to be home the 25th of March.  He was taking the rig (drill ship) from W. Africa to Trinidad but by the time they got to Trini they have shut the borders down.   Him and his crew have been basically in quarantine since they left  and no one on board was sick. The issue is the reliefs getting to them.  They are taking a slow boat from LA to Trini.  They are taking 2 weeks to get there to do the mandatory 2 weeks that Trinindad is demanding (dont blame them at all!!)  to make sure that no one is sick.  The rigs in the gulf are doing 100 percent crew change every 4 weeks at this point instead of the staggered.   When he goes back he will have to take the 2 week slow boat down and hope that  on one gets ill on the way.  Hope this is over soon but i dont see how it will be.  A shore side job sure looks nice right now.  

[billslowsky]

A first person account:

 

https://nypost.com/2020/04/10/cruise-ship-worker-reveals-horror-of-coronavirus-quarantine/

 

"Horror" may be a bit strong.

[ncklhaus]

A friend of ours is a crewmember on the Jewel. She posted this yesterday on another site. 

 

"I am presently a crew member onboard the NCL Jewel. I have been following the News in my country about the Covid19. It saddens me to listen some persons making it seems like seafarers are being treated badly by the cruise companies. I can't  speak for everyone but let my pictures tell you if this looks like bad treatments. Picture taken from my balcony stateroom aboard the NCL Jewel.  Norwegian Cruise Line has done their best in trying to get as much of their employees safely back to their respective countries of origin. However, many countries have travel restrictions and airport closure at this time resulting in us being out here. We are NOT in a desperate situation by any means at this time. Norwegian has adopted social distancing practices with all crew having their own rooms and bathrooms. We have food, water and other necessities that we need on a daily basis. We are happy with this arrangement and are safe. We are indeed blessed to have no cases of covid-19 onboard the Jewel. To be honest I prefer to stay onboard until this dies down.The fear I have about travelling now is real. P.S..I DO MISS MY CHILDREN 
#beblessed
#staysafe
#Godisincontrol
#Seafearerstrong
#NClcrew

 

 

[ellasmomanddad]

4 hours ago, billslowsky said:

A first person account:

 

https://nypost.com/2020/04/10/cruise-ship-worker-reveals-horror-of-coronavirus-quarantine/

 

"Horror" may be a bit strong.

Very misleading headline

[fstuff1]

On 4/13/2020 at 9:14 AM, chengkp75 said:

While under normal circumstances, the crew in the DSC pool get paid a combination of wage and DSC, with DSC being the majority, the law requires a minimum wage for all seafarers of $618/month (for a 40 hour work week), plus overtime for hours worked over 40/week.  So, if DSC is reduced, or in this case removed completely, to the point where the normal wage is less than the minimum, then the company is required to make up the difference to the minimum.  So, I would suspect that most crew are either not working at all (on ships in quarantine), or working only the 40 hour week, so they are getting paid the minimum.

 

off topic:

$618/month (40hrs wk) = $3.57/hr minimum wage by mariitime law

 

most room stewards work 10hrs day/7days a week so 30hrs overtime.

(3.57 x 40) + (3.57 x 30 x 1.5) = $142.80 + 160.65 = $303.45/week

 

so $1313.95/month is the minimum pay for a crew member working 70hrs/week?

and if DSC is the majority of their pay, then they make at least double that?

 

edit:

i was wrong.

(see next post)

 

Edited April 14, 2020 by fstuff1

[chengkp75]

4 minutes ago, fstuff1 said:

 

off topic:

$618/month (40hrs wk) = $3.57/hr minimum wage by mariitime law

 

most room stewards work 10hrs day/7days a week so 30hrs overtime.

(3.57 x 40) + (3.57 x 30 x 1.5) = $142.80 + 160.65 = $303.45/week

 

so $1313.95/month is the minimum pay for a crew member working 70hrs/week?

 

Well, most cruise lines use the STCW or ILO (Rest) regimes to calculate work/rest hours, so crew can work a maximum of 91 hours/week, though 84 is more common.  Also, overtime is calculated at 1.25, not 1.5 times straight time.  So, you are pretty close for the monthly figure.  Now, how that pay is made up is the sticking point.  Depending on the crew position and the line's DSC charges, it can be as little as $50/month in wage, and the remainder in DSC.  As long as the total meets the minimum, legally it is the cruise line's decision how it is arrived at.

[mianmike]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

so crew can work a maximum of 91 hours/week, though 84 is more common. 

 

I was thinking, 84 hours isn't near as bad as I thought.  Then I realized: PER WEEK!  😬

[YVRBassElectric]

1 minute ago, mianmike said:

 

I was thinking, 84 hours isn't near as bad as I thought.  Then I realized: PER WEEK!  😬

I was a restaurant manager and worked 60 hours a week regularly (100 for a few really awful weeks) but couldn't imagine for 84 hours weekly for 9 months straight!

We were on the Bliss in 2018 on the first sailing and again 5 months later,  I could see Housekeepers and waiters were getting tired (everyone in a higher position had taken or was on vacation)

[fstuff1]

On 4/13/2020 at 9:14 AM, chengkp75 said:

So, I would suspect that most crew are either not working at all (on ships in quarantine), or working only the 40 hour week, so they are getting paid the minimum.

 

 

Holland America says they're not paying crew who's contracts will end:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/cruise-ships-crews-stuck-at-sea-paydays-dwindling-and-searching-for-a-way-home/2020/04/14/c7d9c498-78fb-11ea-a130-df573469f094_story.html

 

“For everyone else, as contracts end, we will make every effort to repatriate them home, understanding that current travel restrictions may significantly limit our ability to make this happen, and some people may need to remain onboard in an unpaid status.”

[chengkp75]

6 minutes ago, mianmike said:

 

I was thinking, 84 hours isn't near as bad as I thought.  Then I realized: PER WEEK!  😬

84 hours per week is pretty standard throughout the maritime industry, 12 hours/day, 7 days/week, since ships don't pull over for the night.  When I worked the international crewed cruise ships, I would frequently have men who were on their 3rd consecutive 10 month contract (that's 30 months without a day off).