Why did they already cancel Sun to Alaska in Sept if Harry now says maybe they can do Alaska in August?

[oregonian123]

https://www.cruisecritic.com/ab/agents/variation-b/news/6099/?et_cid=3428850&et_rid=10399200&et_referrer=TripAdvisor

 

"Norwegian Cruise Line President Harry Sommer also seemed to think that there was a pathway for an August restart in Alaska. "We've seen movement in the right direction," he said in a May 6 interview with Cruise Critic. "We remain optimistic that we'll be able to start."

[chengkp75]

Even if Canada allows a technical stop, a PVSA waiver would be required, since CBP has determined that a technical stop does not meet the PVSA requirements.  And, the cruise lines need to get their port/service agreements signed and their plans to implement the Covid Operations Manual, for their cruises, even if going with 100% vaccinated pax/crew need to be submitted, reviewed, and approved.

[oteixeira]

The honest answer is they are not going.  Based on the new Phase 4 rules from the CDC (if they don't budge on them), I don't think any cruise goes from the USA before Nov. 1st.  That is just my opinion, but FDR has made it clear that the CDC new guidelines are not what NCL was hoping to see.

[graphicguy]

Agree with everyone else.  I finally gave up trying to sail to Alaska for any time this year.  Canada just doesn't seem to be opening up.  And, the ships going to Alaska have to stop in Canada.

[fubarbloke]

1 hour ago, graphicguy said:

And, the ships going to Alaska have to stop in Canada.

 

Not if you're on the Sun going from Seattle to Alaska to Russia to Japan in October 😁. Which hasn't been cancelled. Yet.

[RD64]

GraphicGuy - it is not Canada’s fault that there are no cruises to Alaska. Perhaps you should look at your historic American laws and assign blame where it is appropriate.  This is an American government issue - not a Canadian issue.

[oregonian123]

14 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Even if Canada allows a technical stop, a PVSA waiver would be required, since CBP has determined that a technical stop does not meet the PVSA requirements.  And, the cruise lines need to get their port/service agreements signed and their plans to implement the Covid Operations Manual, for their cruises, even if going with 100% vaccinated pax/crew need to be submitted, reviewed, and approved.

Thank you chengkp75, I always forget about the extra CBP rules.

[graphicguy]

15 hours ago, RD64 said:

GraphicGuy - it is not Canada’s fault that there are no cruises to Alaska. Perhaps you should look at your historic American laws and assign blame where it is appropriate.  This is an American government issue - not a Canadian issue.

Not pointing fingers.  

 

Bottom line, for good or ill reasons, the ships originating from the U.S. sailing to Alaska need to stop at a foreign port.  The nearest foreign ports are in Canada.  And, Canada will not let these ships in their port(s).

[awinte2]

It is not that we Canadians do not want the ships to stop as Vancouver so depends on Tourism as well.

We are not as fortunate to have as much vaccine available to us as the US does so we are struggling to maintain control of this virus.  I am a big cruiser but am happy that we are putting the health of our people ahead of vacations.  We are so tired of lockdowns and can hardly wait for things to be up and going again.

None of us thought we would be in this situation for so long but together we will weather this storm.

 

Big time cruiser from Ontario Canada

[All-ready2cruise]

20 minutes ago, awinte2 said:

Big time cruiser from Ontario Canada

I'm with you!  I just looked at another cruise I might book (April 2023). So agree that we are so tired/fed up with the lock downs and such.  

 

If our gov'ts wanted us to have the option of cruising, they'd make the changes necessary to make it happen. It will happen in the US long before it happens here in Canada but it will happen. 

[roger001]

There definitely needs to be a better distribution of vaccine.  In many areas of the US, vaccine exceeds demand.  Of course part of that is because so many US folks are declining to be vaccinated.  In Tennessee, it looks like we will be maxing out at no more than 50% vaccinate.  I was at a Wal Mart today.  They had a sign displayed as you walked in that, "Get  vaccinated, no cost, no appointment, walk in, pharmacy,"   They had about 6 chairs set up for the event, spaced apart.  Saw 2 persons waiting their turn.  Both that Walmart and the Publix grocery I went to next had signs saying "Masks are REQUIRED for all customers and employees."  At least 50% of the customers were without masks.  Some had children with them.  I will assume that the mothers did tell their children, "Just remember that nothing is required if you don't want to do it".   

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, All-ready2cruise said:

I'm with you!  I just looked at another cruise I might book (April 2023). So agree that we are so tired/fed up with the lock downs and such.  

 

If our gov'ts wanted us to have the option of cruising, they'd make the changes necessary to make it happen. It will happen in the US long before it happens here in Canada but it will happen. 

I'm curious, are you not allowed to leave Canada?  I had cruises cancelled to Alaska based on the Canadian stop over requirements for such a trip.   However, we (U.S. Citizens) can fly to other countries to sail, as I'm doing in August.

 

Can't you fly to another country to cruise?  What would have to happen to allow (or disallow) that?

[All-ready2cruise]

3 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

I'm curious, are you not allowed to leave Canada?  I had cruises cancelled to Alaska based on the Canadian stop over requirements for such a trip.   However, we (U.S. Citizens) can fly to other countries to sail, as I'm doing in August.

 

Can't you fly to another country to cruise?  What would have to happen to allow (or disallow) that?

Oh sure, we can fly to another country, however:

1. You need to make arrangements to stay  in a government approved hotel on your return, the cost is between $1200 - $2000 for 3 days, not including food and drink. 

2. You must quarantine for an add'l 11 days to make the 14 day mandatory quarantine. 

3. Any Covid tests you require for travel, you must pay for yourself. (other testing done here are free) 

4. This is despite having had both does of vaccine. 

 

There are probably other things which make it very inconvenient as well. 

 

I had a cruise booked on the Joy for Sept. out of Jamaica but when I was told these restrictions would not be changed any time soon, I cancelled it.  

 

I'll wait, better times ahead.   

[mianmike]

17 hours ago, oregonian123 said:

Thank you chengkp75, I always forget about the extra CBP rules.

 

They are the secret rules they will not publish for some unexplained reason. 

[chengkp75]

36 minutes ago, mianmike said:

 

They are the secret rules they will not publish for some unexplained reason. 

It is a CBP "interpretive ruling", which is not required to be published, according to the APA (Administrative Procedures Act).  It might be found in the CROSS system (Customs Rulings Online Search System) if you're really interested.  Since a technical port call is not something that a passenger can arrange, the information generally only goes to the cruise lines' compliance departments to ensure technical stops are not included in itineraries.

[mianmike]

46 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

It is a CBP "interpretive ruling", which is not required to be published, according to the APA (Administrative Procedures Act).  It might be found in the CROSS system (Customs Rulings Online Search System) if you're really interested.  Since a technical port call is not something that a passenger can arrange, the information generally only goes to the cruise lines' compliance departments to ensure technical stops are not included in itineraries.

 

In my prior life I worked 37 years for a federal regulatory agency. I wrote federal orders and later in my career I reviewed them.  All our agency regulations had to be published in the federal register and a final rule issued.  We could not issue new requirements via the interpretation route.   We had to either amend the order or issue a new one.  

Edited May 11, 2021 by mianmike

[graphicguy]

6 hours ago, All-ready2cruise said:

Oh sure, we can fly to another country, however:

1. You need to make arrangements to stay  in a government approved hotel on your return, the cost is between $1200 - $2000 for 3 days, not including food and drink. 

2. You must quarantine for an add'l 11 days to make the 14 day mandatory quarantine. 

3. Any Covid tests you require for travel, you must pay for yourself. (other testing done here are free) 

4. This is despite having had both does of vaccine. 

 

There are probably other things which make it very inconvenient as well. 

 

I had a cruise booked on the Joy for Sept. out of Jamaica but when I was told these restrictions would not be changed any time soon, I cancelled it.  

 

I'll wait, better times ahead.   

Didn’t know.  That IS onerous!  Hopefully things get better soon!

[Named-Tawny]

On 5/10/2021 at 11:05 AM, graphicguy said:

Agree with everyone else.  I finally gave up trying to sail to Alaska for any time this year.  Canada just doesn't seem to be opening up.  And, the ships going to Alaska have to stop in Canada.

 

Canada could open up to cruises tomorrow, and there still likely wouldn't be an Alaskan cruise season.

It's tough to cruise Alaska when cruises aren't leaving from, or visiting the United States.    And even if Canada DOESN'T allow cruises, the US is a sovereign country, and could allow no-foreign-stop cruises to Alaska if THEY wanted to.

The problem with Alaska cruises right now is the US.

Edited May 12, 2021 by Named-Tawny

[graphicguy]

10 hours ago, Named-Tawny said:

 

Canada could open up to cruises tomorrow, and there still likely wouldn't be an Alaskan cruise season.

It's tough to cruise Alaska when cruises aren't leaving from, or visiting the United States.    And even if Canada DOESN'T allow cruises, the US is a sovereign country, and could allow no-foreign-stop cruises to Alaska if THEY wanted to.

The problem with Alaska cruises right now is the US.

I wouldn't be so sure about that, as @All-ready2cruise points out. 

 

The state of Alaska is begging for cruise ships to port there.  Matter of fact, they have petitioned/brought a law suit against the CDC to do so.  They want cruise ships there.  They also want an exemption from the Passenger Vessel Services Act (PVSA), claiming it's an antiquated rule law (which I tend to agree with).

 

The most likely stop would be in Vancouver (a city I dearly love).  I believe Vancouver would LOVE the tourist revenue from a cruise ships porting there, again.

 

FL is making sailing from their ports quite onerous, enacting policies that will not allow cruise lines to require proof of full COVID vaccinations.  That is the reason NCL is sailing out of Jamaica instead of Miami. 

 

California and Washington, which would be the most likely embarkation points for cruises going to Alaska, would be more amenable to the 100% COVID vaccination requirements.  Some sticking points there.  First, if Canada got their COVID situation under control, and would allow ships to port on their way to Alaska, problem solved.  Alternatively, if the U.S. would lift the PVSA, porting in Canada would be bypassed (much to the chagrin of Vancouver) would become moot.

 

So, the issue is two fold...one with Canada getting their COVID situation ironed out (which would be best for everyone involved).  The other is with the U.S. in the enforcement of PVSA, which removes Canada from the equation entirely, but would be a financial detriment to Vancouver.

 

While not Alaska, same would apply to sailing from NYC or Boston to the east coast of Canada.  

 

Edited May 12, 2021 by graphicguy

[BermudaBound2014]

1 hour ago, graphicguy said:

So, the issue is two fold...one with Canada getting their COVID situation ironed out (which would be best for everyone involved).  The other is with the U.S. in the enforcement of PVSA, which removes Canada from the equation entirely, but would be a financial detriment to Vancouver.

 

I'm not following this at all. Isn't the real issue the fact that Cruise Ships can not sail out of the USA until they meet the Conditions to sail order? Until that happens, there will be no sailing to Alaska regardless what Alaska wants. Did I miss something? 

[graphicguy]

Yes…the cruise lines can sail out of the U.S. if they meet the CDC criteria.

[fubarbloke]

They can sail out of the US, but they can't come back unless they stop in a non-US port first.

[BermudaBound2014]

Just now, fubarbloke said:

They can sail out of the US, but they can't come back unless they stop in a non-US port first.

 Cruise ships can not sail from the USA until they meet the conditions to sail order (or the cdc changes the order). Anyone thinking that is going to happen before the Alaska season is long gone for 2021 is quite the optimist. 

[YVRBassElectric]

5 hours ago, graphicguy said:

The most likely stop would be in Vancouver (a city I dearly love).  I believe Vancouver would LOVE the tourist revenue from a cruise ships porting there, again.

 

While not Alaska, same would apply to sailing from NYC or Boston to the east coast of Canada.  

 

I live in BC and no large gathering will be allowed this summer (expectation we will be over 80% fully vaccinated by Sept).

Our Provincial Health Officer, Dr. Bonnie Henry, has already said her orders will not be changing to allow international travel or large gatherings - therefore no cruising in 2021

 

Nova Scotia is currently dealing with their worst COVID outbreak and Canadians are not allowed to enter for non-essential reasons (work, moving) & must quarantine for 14 days upon arrival. Definitely not allowing cruise ships this summer