Covid Reality on Quantum of the Seas

[surplustexas]

Just got back from my two week cruise on Quantum of the Seas.  Here's my observation for those planning a cruise this summer.  Love the ship and Royal Caribbean.  I think they are doing their best to prevent illness but sailing at full capacity (4200) does not make it safe.  Most are not wearing masks.  Too crowded in Windjammer.  And my wife and I both tested positive for Covid when we arrived back home.

Throughout the cruise, you could hear people coughing everywhere.  I knew covid was all over the ship.  We tried to deny it but it was true.  I personally started feeling ill about the third day of our last seven days.  I brought a home test with me and it was negative.  I thought I had a sinus infection.  I did not retest but then my wife got sick traveling home and we tested when we got home.

We took precautions.  We tried to wear masks inside crowded elevators.  We wore masks in crowded areas.  We went to the Windjammer and after getting our food, we used hand sanitizer as everyone is touching those utensils!  So just know if you are planning a cruise to Alaska, the risk is there and you have a good chance of getting Covid.  In closing, here's the deal.  People know they are sick but do not want to call medical and get tested as their cruise is over. So they continue on and cough and spread it throughout the cruise ship.  I would say less than 10 percent of those with covid on the cruise ship actually call and report it.  They don't want to end their cruise and go into quarantine.  That's the world we live in for cruising.  Be safe!!

[ldubs]

54 minutes ago, surplustexas said:

 I would say less than 10 percent of those with covid on the cruise ship actually call and report it.  They don't want to end their cruise and go into quarantine.  That's the world we live in for cruising.  Be safe!!

 

Might be an accurate estimate based on the number of people on this forum who openly say they would lie about being sick on board.  

[happy cruzer]

N95 masks worn properly (i.e. very tightly) offer the best protection for the wearer.  All other protocols are not very effective by most metrics.  So yep, people are not testing or reporting but you can still protect yourself if you want to by using a N95 or staying out of crowds i.e. staying home.

 

Your report is a good reminder of the reality of the situation at this time.  Better than last year and hopefully getting better in the future.

[cruizergal70]

3 hours ago, happy cruzer said:

N95 masks worn properly (i.e. very tightly) offer the best protection for the wearer.  All other protocols are not very effective by most metrics.  So yep, people are not testing or reporting but you can still protect yourself if you want to by using a N95 or staying out of crowds i.e. staying home.

 

Your report is a good reminder of the reality of the situation at this time.  Better than last year and hopefully getting better in the future.

It's possible to avoid crowds on a ship.  

[screwsmcernst]

On 7/6/2022 at 1:18 PM, surplustexas said:

  People know they are sick but do not want to call medical and get tested as their cruise is over. So they continue on and cough and spread it throughout the cruise ship.  I would say less than 10 percent of those with covid on the cruise ship actually call and report it.  They don't want to end their cruise and go into quarantine.  That's the world we live in for cruising.  Be safe!!

  These people are no different than the people who get on a ship with Noro Virus.  They don't care what happens to others, as long as they get to do what they want.  So, wear a mask if it makes you feel safer, Wash your hands often, and don't touch your eyes, nose or mouth.   

 

We for sure will NOT be eating in Windjammer.  

[Aquahound]

14 minutes ago, screwsmcernst said:

 

We for sure will NOT be eating in Windjammer.  

 

I sailed Quantum early in the AK season this year and I also brought home a nice souvenir of COVID.  Of course, there's no way to know exactly how I got it but my biggest criticism of RCI on this cruise was the self-serve in Windjammer.  They stressed COVID safety when they didn't hand around the mic during the Captain's Corner but had no problem with thousands of people handling tongs in order to get their food.  🙄 

 

That said, the cruise and the ship itself was amazing.  I love those Quantum Class ships.  

[screwsmcernst]

17 minutes ago, Aquahound said:

 

I sailed Quantum early in the AK season this year and I also brought home a nice souvenir of COVID.  Of course, there's no way to know exactly how I got it but my biggest criticism of RCI on this cruise was the self-serve in Windjammer.  They stressed COVID safety when they didn't hand around the mic during the Captain's Corner but had no problem with thousands of people handling tongs in order to get their food.  🙄 

 

That said, the cruise and the ship itself was amazing.  I love those Quantum Class ships.  

.  

I also have food allergy so cross contamination is a real problem for me.  I am always wary of buffets.  RCI making them self serve again just puts the final nail in that coffin.  😃

 

[Earthworm Jim]

On 7/8/2022 at 3:57 PM, Aquahound said:

 

I sailed Quantum early in the AK season this year and I also brought home a nice souvenir of COVID.  Of course, there's no way to know exactly how I got it but my biggest criticism of RCI on this cruise was the self-serve in Windjammer.  They stressed COVID safety when they didn't hand around the mic during the Captain's Corner but had no problem with thousands of people handling tongs in order to get their food.  🙄 

 

That said, the cruise and the ship itself was amazing.  I love those Quantum Class ships.  

 

The touching of serving utensils is more of a norovirus problem than a Covid problem. Covid doesn't really spread that way. Which isn't to say it's not a problem.

[Earthworm Jim]

The troubling thing is we really have no idea of the scope of the problem. The cruise lines don't report numbers. They submit infection numbers to the CDC, but the CDC just tells us what color status the ship falls into.

 

That tells is little though because 93 out of 94 ships are in orange, which is the highest color category with numbers attached to it. We know there are at least 0.3% of passengers/crew with Covid, but we don't know whether that means it's 0.31%, or 10% or 50% or 90%, because we don't know where the red category starts.

 

And, as was pointed out above, even if you knew the CDC number it would be artificially low because many (most?) people aren't reporting their illness anyway.

[cruisingguy007]

8 hours ago, Earthworm Jim said:

The troubling thing is we really have no idea of the scope of the problem. The cruise lines don't report numbers. They submit infection numbers to the CDC, but the CDC just tells us what color status the ship falls into.

 

That tells is little though because 93 out of 94 ships are in orange, which is the highest color category with numbers attached to it. We know there are at least 0.3% of passengers/crew with Covid, but we don't know whether that means it's 0.31%, or 10% or 50% or 90%, because we don't know where the red category starts.

 

And, as was pointed out above, even if you knew the CDC number it would be artificially low because many (most?) people aren't reporting their illness anyway.

 

That's not entirely true. Alaska had a big spike in covid positivity very recently and is still very high, only behind Hawaii recently and now #1 per 100K people, this information isn't really hard to find if one were to look. That is only "reported" mind you, extrapolate that by 2X/3X for likely numbers, some even suggest 10X is the likely real number (I'm not convinced myself it's that high). Expecting the cruise industry to act as public health officiants isn't really practical. They are a business, a business that is trying to survive no less. The onus is on individuals to keep abreast of the current covid climate and their own risk tolerance. It's well known Alaska is a covid hot spot. The good news is that the vast majority are reporting only minor symptoms. Hopefully, this summer surge pays dividends come fall/winter and we don't see a new curve-ball variant. So many are getting infected now, it may lead to some form of herd benefit. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by cruisingguy007

[Earthworm Jim]

4 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

That's not entirely true. Alaska had a big spike in covid positivity very recently and is still very high, only behind Hawaii recently and now #1 per 100K people, this information isn't really hard to find if one were to look. That is only "reported" mind you, extrapolate that by 2X/3X for likely numbers, some even suggest 10X is the likely real number (I'm not convinced myself it's that high). Expecting the cruise industry to act as public health officiants isn't really practical. They are a business, a business that is trying to survive no less. The onus is on individuals to keep abreast of the current covid climate and their own risk tolerance. It's well known Alaska is a covid hot spot. The good news is that the vast majority are reporting only minor symptoms. Hopefully, this summer surge pays dividends come fall/winter and we don't see a new curve-ball variant. So many are getting infected now, it may lead to some form of herd benefit. 

 

Knowing Alaska's covid positivity rate (which, as you point out, isn't very accurate anyway) isn't the same as knowing the Covid rate on a particular cruise ship sailing to Alaska.

 

Alaska's 7 day case rate is 307 cases per 100k population. Or 0.307%, which coincidentally is almost exactly the infection rate that gets a ship categorized as orange by the CDC (0.3%), which 93 out of 94 US ships are. But we don't know how much above 0.3% the cruise ships are.

 

If you get on a ship to Alaska do you have about a 0.3% chance of coming down with Covid? I can live with that. 3% chance? Still not too bad. 10% chance? That's getting worrisome, but OK. 30% chance? Now that's getting scary. Even higher?

 

We have no way of knowing, and the State of Alaska's overall case rate gives us no insight into the answer. And again, as you point out, even if the CDC reported the numbers we still wouldn't know the full truth because of all the unreported cases. But at  least you'd have a starting point for your calculation that the real number is 2X/3X or even 10X what the reported number is.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Earthworm Jim

[Flatbush Flyer]

13 hours ago, Earthworm Jim said:

 

The touching of serving utensils is more of a norovirus problem than a Covid problem. Covid doesn't really spread that way. Which isn't to say it's not a problem.

One of our criteria for a preferred cruise line is no self-served food.

All it take is seeing the same guy who didn’t wash his hands in the bathroom then proceed to the casual cafeteria style restaurant (or buffet) and start touching food items that he doesn’t end up taking.
 

That is gross beyond any definition of abhorrent behavior. 

[Earthworm Jim]

3 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

One of our criteria for a preferred cruise line is no self-served food.

All it take is seeing the same guy who didn’t wash his hands in the bathroom then proceed to the casual cafeteria style restaurant (or buffet) and start touching food items that he doesn’t end up taking.
 

That is gross beyond any definition of abhorrent behavior. 

 

I don't disagree. I'm just saying it's not really a Covid issue. But it's still an issue worthy of concern.

[K32682]

On 7/6/2022 at 2:14 PM, ldubs said:

 

Might be an accurate estimate based on the number of people on this forum who openly say they would lie about being sick on board.  

 

Are they lying about being sick or just not running to be tested at the first sign of a cough or sniffle? It's not hard to see people avoiding tests if they are not seriously ill and know a positive result means immediate incarceration in an inside cabin for the remainder of the cruise and potentially further restrictions when disembark. 

 

Edited July 11, 2022 by K32682

[ldubs]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

Are they lying about being sick or just not running to be tested at the first sign of a cough or sniffle? It's not hard to see people avoiding tests if they are not seriously ill and know a positive result means immediate incarceration in an inside cabin for the remainder of the cruise and potentially further restrictions when disembark. 

 

 

I was not referring to someone with a cough or sniffle. I was referring to those who admit they would hide symptoms or positive test results in order to preserve their vacation.   If someone suspects they have covid and avoids a test, or if someone self-tests positive and avoids reporting it, yes they are lying.  It does not really matter why they want to hide it.  In fact, the typical reason to lie about it is incredibly selfish.   I mean seriously, to knowingly expose dozens of others because their vacation might be interrupted?  It is all about the "me" with too many people.  

 

There are many threads criticizing folks who don't follow any number of cruise ship rules.  But it seems ignoring the rule and lying about spreading this virus to other unsuspecting passengers is OK with a lot of people on Cruise Critic. 

[K32682]

4 hours ago, ldubs said:

I was not referring to someone with a cough or sniffle. I was referring to those who admit they would hide symptoms or positive test results in order to preserve their vacation.   If someone suspects they have covid and avoids a test, or if someone self-tests positive and avoids reporting it, yes they are lying.  It does not really matter why they want to hide it.  In fact, the typical reason to lie about it is incredibly selfish.   I mean seriously, to knowingly expose dozens of others because their vacation might be interrupted?  It is all about the "me" with too many people.  

 

There are many threads criticizing folks who don't follow any number of cruise ship rules.  But it seems ignoring the rule and lying about spreading this virus to other unsuspecting passengers is OK with a lot of people on Cruise Critic. 

 

Self-testing positive and not reporting is in a different category than feeling ill and not taking the test. If you don't test you can't say for sure and aren't "knowingly" exposing anybody. 

 

 

[iancal]

This is exactly the reason why we have zero interest in adding cruises to our land travels at this point in time.

[lissie]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

Self-testing positive and not reporting is in a different category than feeling ill and not taking the test. If you don't test you can't say for sure and aren't "knowingly" exposing anybody. 

 

 

To be fair when I got Covid I was totally convinced it was a mild cold as I'd been nowhere inside for a week (I was on a tropical island), and I had such minor symptoms  -  the only reason I tested was because it was a requirement for re-entering NZ - I was amazed to discover I had covid 

Edited July 11, 2022 by lissie

[K32682]

48 minutes ago, lissie said:

To be fair when I got Covid I was totally convinced it was a mild cold as I'd been nowhere inside for a week (I was on a tropical island), and I had such minor symptoms  -  the only reason I tested was because it was a requirement for re-entering NZ - I was amazed to discover I had covid 

 

I had the reverse problem. During the time Canada required a negative test to board an aircraft to return home I fell ill with COVID-like symptoms while in Florida. I chose not to be tested in Florida, flew to Buffalo and was tested there. Canadians have an absolute right of return and even if positive I could not be refused at the border. I tested negative.  

[lissie]

2 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

I had the reverse problem. During the time Canada required a negative test to board an aircraft to return home I fell ill with COVID-like symptoms while in Florida. I chose not to be tested in Florida, flew to Buffalo and was tested there. Canadians have an absolute right of return and even if positive I could not be refused at the border. I tested negative.  

I wasn't refused entry - oddly I was returning from one of the few countries in the world that NZ did not require a pre-departure test from.  I was isolated at home for 7 days- but that's no different if I got it at my local shopping centre. 

[LocoLoco1]

A week on a Mega-ship or a week strolling the Aisles of a Wally-World?? Probably a toss-up at this late date.  Our recent 28-day had numerous confined to quarters. 

[ldubs]

8 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

Self-testing positive and not reporting is in a different category than feeling ill and not taking the test. If you don't test you can't say for sure and aren't "knowingly" exposing anybody. 

 

 

 

Let's see.   Someone has the symptoms and chooses not to test so that they can pretend they are doing the right thing.  The exact opposite of upstanding.       

 

 I can see someone honestly thinking they have the sniffles and not reporting or testing.  But that is really not an issue at all.   

[K32682]

6 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

Let's see.   Someone has the symptoms and chooses not to test so that they can pretend they are doing the right thing.  The exact opposite of upstanding.       

 

 I can see someone honestly thinking they have the sniffles and not reporting or testing.  But that is really not an issue at all.   

 

There are any one of a number of ailments that will cause similar symptoms to COVID. When it happened to me I didn't drop everything and rush off to be tested even though I might have been infected. It is a far less serious act that knowing you are positive, keeping the fact secret and circulating among fellow passengers on a cruise or other crowded social situation. 

[Aquahound]

8 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

There are any one of a number of ailments that will cause similar symptoms to COVID. When it happened to me I didn't drop everything and rush off to be tested even though I might have been infected. It is a far less serious act that knowing you are positive, keeping the fact secret and circulating among fellow passengers on a cruise or other crowded social situation. 

Agreed.  I’m not going to present myself to medical for a COVID test just because I have a headache or some muscle aches. That could be from any one of a thousand things I did that day. 

[ldubs]

12 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

There are any one of a number of ailments that will cause similar symptoms to COVID. When it happened to me I didn't drop everything and rush off to be tested even though I might have been infected. It is a far less serious act that knowing you are positive, keeping the fact secret and circulating among fellow passengers on a cruise or other crowded social situation. 

 

Yes there are and a responsible person should be able to decide when to test to make sure they are not exposing others.   All of the "what ifs" don't change the fact that folks are OK exposing others for selfish reasons.   Sounds like you are promoting a loophole, which is exactly the point I'm making.  

 

3 hours ago, Aquahound said:

Agreed.  I’m not going to present myself to medical for a COVID test just because I have a headache or some muscle aches. That could be from any one of a thousand things I did that day. 

 

A common headache should not be cause for a covid test.   After over two years dealing with COVID, one would think that would be understood.