Are hotels getting some competition?

[Markanddonna]

I have been looking at hotels and apartments for several future cruises and have noted so many condos, apartments, houses, and rooms in the mix.

 

I also noted that a hotel we had booked last January 2022 for $201 per night is now $129 a night for next Jan 2023.  I have been reading about how companies and individuals are buying up condos and apartments and turning them into short term rentals like Air BnBs.   This is adding to the housing shortage in our country I also noted this in Europe.  I love staying at an apartment with a kitchen and washing machine if I'm there for more than two days. One apartment I was hoping to book is not available. He said he is renting longer term until June.  This is in Poland, and so he probably has Ukrainians staying in his apartment.

[Mary229]

I think the mad rush to travel is calming down.  Much of the money spent in the past year was from peoples’ pandemic lockdown savings accounts, you know all of that money you couldn’t spend since you were told not to have any fun😉.  Now, like housing, travel demand is becoming more normalized.   If there will be fuel surcharges on hotels, especially in Europe, could be something to watch for.  This winter heating prices are supposed to skyrocket. 

Edited August 24, 2022 by Mary229

[sanger727]

Sure. Popularity of vacation rentals like airbnb and vrbo continue to become more popular. Especially since covid and people wanting their own space. And cities seem to doing more to cut down on short term rentals due to it affecting hospitality and housing markets. 

[jsn55]

I spent several years volunteering on a Consumer Advocacy Forum specializing in travel.  I've had 3 or 4 good experiences with VRs, but I think the bad guys are now so active that I'm sticking with hotels.  I'm really tempted to book vacation rentals, and I know several people who have been using them for years without issues.  But the sheer awfulness of trying to extricate yourself from a bad deal is not to be believed.  You're pretty much on your own with all the booking services.  If the owner/manager is not on the level, you have very little backup assistance. They have little customer service.   People would literally find themselves without a place to sleep when they arrived.  Of course, half the issues were caused by the traveller himself, but there are still too many fraudulent VR listings for my peace of mind.

[firefly333]

January out of Galveston is lowest prices of the year. More normalized but still high. My hotel in Miami airport went from $95 to $195 next spring break. I'm solo not interested in a vrbo. I find it annoying to have a bunch of condos listed when I want a hotel. Plus they dont offer a free airport shuttle and add on a cleaning fee. It's like a step back to my childhood when my parents would vacation and find a place with a kitchenette. I wanted to eat out. It's a vacation. 

[Mary229]

I agree with others on rentals.  I only now use them if I have looked them over during a prior visit and visited with the landlord.  I have a few I rent for extended periods in quaint resort towns but I stay away from them in the cities.  Many cities are now either banning them or severely restricting them

[capriccio]

1 hour ago, Mary229 said:

 Many cities are now either banning them or severely restricting them

Not just cities but individual buildings.  It is quite common in south Florida (and other places no doubt) for condo associations to have required rental periods written into their by-laws.  For example, our building has a very common clause:  one rental is allowed once a year and must be for at least three months.  Every now and then there are news stories of travelers paying for a rental only to show up and not be allowed in the building or being thrown out after unpacking. 

[Mary229]

16 minutes ago, capriccio said:

Not just cities but individual buildings.  It is quite common in south Florida (and other places no doubt) for condo associations to have required rental periods written into their by-laws.  For example, our building has a very common clause:  one rental is allowed once a year and must be for at least three months.  Every now and then there are news stories of travelers paying for a rental only to show up and not be allowed in the building or being thrown out after unpacking. 

Yes.  There are many illegal rentals on those websites.   All the websites protections don’t really help when you don’t have a place to stay once you land. 

[iancal]

Our distinct impression is that US and Canadian hotel rates are up, up, up.  Especially the MIA and FLL rates we have shopped from time to time.  Despite that, we booked a local airport hotel for the same price as we have paid for the past three years or so.

 

We did not find increased prices in Portugal on our recent 5 week May/June trip.  With the exception of one area.

 

I have been shopping Greece for Sept/Oct.    Hotels seem on par to what we paid two years ago...and in the past. 

 

Just booked an AI in Puerta Vallarta this week  for ten days in late November.   Rate was very much on par with past trips.  But...air was up 15-20 percent.

 

Booked a week at a 5 star resort in Thailand for March 1.  The rate was an absolute bargain. So much so that we might do another 7 days there on our snowbird trip.  Air is up by 30 percent but we expect it to decrease closer to the end of the year.

 

We do everything from family run B&B's to six star resorts.  Did an apartment in Madeira for five days in May.  Very reasonable.  We have never done an airbnb or vrbo.

Edited August 25, 2022 by iancal

[slidergirl]

I stayed in hotels for all but one 3 night part of my trip to France & Italy last month.  The one was a studio apartment in Aix-in-Provence.  I saw it pop up on several blogs.  It was in a perfect location on the Cours Maribeau.  I went in with my eyes wide open about apartment rentals.  It went problem-free.   

That said, I will always pick a hotel over a rental IF the location permits.  

I didn't notice the hotel pricing in Europe and Washington DC (a few days ago) to be what it has been for awhile.  And, the hotels were full.  What was surprising was the rental car prices for both.  I rent the manual transmission "econo box" cars in Europe and it was more than what I remember paying a few years ago.  DC was a shocker - $1000 for an econo box for 6 days...

 

hint on vacation rentals - stick to the people who are "super hosts" as they have passed certain over-and-above standards.  

[iancal]

2 hours ago, slidergirl said:

I stayed in hotels for all but one 3 night part of my trip to France & Italy last month.  The one was a studio apartment in Aix-in-Provence.  I saw it pop up on several blogs.  It was in a perfect location on the Cours Maribeau.  I went in with my eyes wide open about apartment rentals.  It went problem-free.   

That said, I will always pick a hotel over a rental IF the location permits.  

I didn't notice the hotel pricing in Europe and Washington DC (a few days ago) to be what it has been for awhile.  And, the hotels were full.  What was surprising was the rental car prices for both.  I rent the manual transmission "econo box" cars in Europe and it was more than what I remember paying a few years ago.  DC was a shocker - $1000 for an econo box for 6 days...

 

hint on vacation rentals - stick to the people who are "super hosts" as they have passed certain over-and-above standards.  

I also rent standard transmissions.  In many parts of Europe I prefer having a standard.   We like getting the Fiat Panda.  Both of our carry ons fit exactly in the back luggage area with the security cover on them!

 

Rentals were very expensive in Portugal this past May/June And my understanding was that they could be difficult to get in some places in the Algarve. 

 

 But...I priced one and two week rentals through autoreurope on Crete for mid October and the rates were only slightly highter than usual.  The rentals we priced for Toronto in Sept. were more than double what we have paid in the past.

Edited August 25, 2022 by iancal

[Mary229]

What happened with rental cars is many rental car companies sold off or returned their leases during the pandemic as no one was renting.  They will slowly build inventory as demand increases and prices will go down.  I am hoping by next summer. 

[Charles4515]

8 hours ago, capriccio said:

Not just cities but individual buildings.  It is quite common in south Florida (and other places no doubt) for condo associations to have required rental periods written into their by-laws.  For example, our building has a very common clause:  one rental is allowed once a year and must be for at least three months.  Every now and then there are news stories of travelers paying for a rental only to show up and not be allowed in the building or being thrown out after unpacking. 

 

Condos don't want to be hotels and the FHA and some other mortgage lenders won't approve  loans if short term rentals are allowed. Every condo I have lived in prohibits short term rentals in the bylaws of under 6 months. My old condo assoc. in Maryland fined a repeat offender almost $3000. After that the problem went away. 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Charles4515

[Joebucks]

AirBNB and short-term rentind are a huge problem. It's a big reason why housing prices are skyrocketing in so many places. As someone who generally is against regulation, I think this is an area that needs it. Florida housing, for example, isn't going to get any better when you rent it out for more than its worth. 

[cruisemom42]

I remember 5-6 years ago rentals were all the "hot" thing. Lots of discussion on the ports of call boards about finding rentals in other countries.  I guess I never got on the bandwagon. I prefer a nice hotel, and not just because I travel solo. I like having a concierge to make dinner reservations, I like hotel breakfasts and having someone make my bed and clean my bathroom daily. 💕

[Joebucks]

30 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

I remember 5-6 years ago rentals were all the "hot" thing. Lots of discussion on the ports of call boards about finding rentals in other countries.  I guess I never got on the bandwagon. I prefer a nice hotel, and not just because I travel solo. I like having a concierge to make dinner reservations, I like hotel breakfasts and having someone make my bed and clean my bathroom daily. 💕

 

Rentals have their place. I think if you are traveling with a large group, it can be fun and make sense in some cases. On the other hand, it can be very noisy, and lack privacy.

 

Overall, I agree with you. A hotel is generally more favorable for me. The hotel experience, for all of its flaws, has the science down to what we actually need. The beds can be awful in rentals. Sometimes, you have to do a basic "cleanup". Sometimes, you don't have any sheets or towels. The cheap factor for AirBNB is also not there as often after all fees. 

 

There needs to be some limitation to this madness. I think people should be allowed to have 1, maybe 2 properties they rent out. These serial renters are ruining it for everyone. 

[cruisemom42]

1 minute ago, Joebucks said:

There needs to be some limitation to this madness. I think people should be allowed to have 1, maybe 2 properties they rent out. These serial renters are ruining it for everyone. 

 

Yes to this. 

 

In places like Venice, the city is being hollowed out because people can make more money renting out apartments to short-term guests, and most of them can't afford to live in Venice anyway, with the "tourist" pricing.  Every year, the actual population of Venetians (those actually living on Venice) declines. Pretty soon it will finally become the EPCOT experience that it has been tending toward for years.

 

[Keksie]

I tend toward hotel/resort stays for pre or post cruises.  However, for a group of women going to a fiber fest I am very happy to find a house we can rent.  We take turns cooking dinner, spend a lot of time sitting on porches, knitting and talking.  This just wouldn't happen in a hotel.  When we go to St. John I prefer a condo since we can eat breakfast in our pjs., make picnic lunches and then walk to town for dinner.  

[ldubs]

2 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

Rentals have their place. I think if you are traveling with a large group, it can be fun and make sense in some cases. On the other hand, it can be very noisy, and lack privacy.

 

Overall, I agree with you. A hotel is generally more favorable for me. The hotel experience, for all of its flaws, has the science down to what we actually need. The beds can be awful in rentals. Sometimes, you have to do a basic "cleanup". Sometimes, you don't have any sheets or towels. The cheap factor for AirBNB is also not there as often after all fees. 

 

There needs to be some limitation to this madness. I think people should be allowed to have 1, maybe 2 properties they rent out. These serial renters are ruining it for everyone. 

 

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Yes to this. 

 

In places like Venice, the city is being hollowed out because people can make more money renting out apartments to short-term guests, and most of them can't afford to live in Venice anyway, with the "tourist" pricing.  Every year, the actual population of Venetians (those actually living on Venice) declines. Pretty soon it will finally become the EPCOT experience that it has been tending toward for years.

 

 

 

I was reading about Venice.  In addition to the high housing cost,  lack of jobs appealing to a younger population is also a big factor in the population decline.  I like the EPCOT comparison - very apt.   

 

I'm all for stopping scammers, but would worry about laws outright limiting or banning legitimate business.  Zoning restrictions might be an appropriate way to regulate vacation rentals, I think.  It is a sticky problem.   

[slidergirl]

The condo HOA where I work has a strict "no third party" rental policy.  The property management company i work for is also a vacation home rental company.  If an owner wants to rent out the unit, it has to go through us.  We provide the HK, concierge service on behalf of the owners as well as for the owners themselves.  We are a hybrid, I guess.  But, in my neighborhood, our HOA prohibits overnight rentals, must be at least 6 months so that we can rent seasonally.  Workers in the area can't find places to live because so many people who own condos/houses have gone the VRBO/AirBnB route. 

[rkacruiser]

1 hour ago, slidergirl said:

But, in my neighborhood, our HOA prohibits overnight rentals, must be at least 6 months so that we can rent seasonally.  

 

My HOA's Board has discussed the potential need to revise our documents for at least 3 years.  One of the changes that we have discussed is to banning rentals.  I am unsure that we ought to do that and I am very unsure if we could get the 75% approval of our homeowners needed to make that change.  

[ldubs]

23 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

My HOA's Board has discussed the potential need to revise our documents for at least 3 years.  One of the changes that we have discussed is to banning rentals.  I am unsure that we ought to do that and I am very unsure if we could get the 75% approval of our homeowners needed to make that change.  

 

Reading the various posts, I'm surprised vacation rentals are such a concern in neighborhoods.  I guess I live in an area that would not be appealing to a traveler.  From my town, it takes a while to get anywhere that might have an attraction to a tourist.   

 

In an HOA with extensive common areas, I could see making a surcharge for short term vacation rentals because of the potentially higher maintenance cost and higher exposure.  Additionally, consideration could be given to requiring proof of proper insurance coverage for a rental, minimum limits of liability,  and possibly naming the HOA as an additional insured.   Just seat-of-the-pants stuff, mind you.   

[Charles4515]

48 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

My HOA's Board has discussed the potential need to revise our documents for at least 3 years.  One of the changes that we have discussed is to banning rentals.  I am unsure that we ought to do that and I am very unsure if we could get the 75% approval of our homeowners needed to make that change.  

 

It is pretty difficult to change bylaws because it is not a majority vote. In my Maryland condo it took 60% and in my Texas condo I beileve it is 66% of owners. And that percentage is of owners on the rolls not the percent of people who vote. Both condos already banned short term rental of less that 6 months from their declaration. Both allow longer rentals. Some condo associations have run into a problem of too many longer term rentals as some mortgage lenders want a majority of residents to be owner residents, and also owner residents prefer their nieghbors to be owner residents. So what some HOA's do is change the bylaws and limit rentals. I know a few in Maryland who limited the number to 30%. They got the bylaw change passed by grandfathering in previous owners so they could eventually reach their desired percentage by attrition. Then there is also local regulation. So my county in Maryland passed legislation licensing short term rentals and requiring that they had to be the owners primary residence. That pretty much ended short term rentals of houses or condos. There are plenty of short term rentals though as large multi family apartment building landlords have taken them up as they can rent their apartments for any length of time and pay to get the licenses. 

[slidergirl]

There are instances of  people doing those short-term rentals to have a party house.  it's loud, brings in a lot of people & cars, and they don't clean up.   AirBnB has put a "no party house' policy on it's properties, but I'm not sure how well it is enforced.  

[Charles4515]

5 minutes ago, slidergirl said:

There are instances of  people doing those short-term rentals to have a party house.  it's loud, brings in a lot of people & cars, and they don't clean up.   AirBnB has put a "no party house' policy on it's properties, but I'm not sure how well it is enforced.  

Party houses became a big problem The Arbnb restriction is pretty recent so time will tell.