Celebrity is allowing people to outbid your MoveUp offer

[Arizona Wildcat]

The system, the real issue and a solution.

 

When you bid in move up there are an undetermined number of cabins available.  Nobody knows exactly how many because there are always last minute cancelations.  You bid an amout you are willing to pay for an upgraded cabin.  Celebrity and the marketing company look at the numbers and set minimum bids.  Celebrity then declares winners at a time it chooses to the highest bidders.

Of course people get outbid.   Of course the highest bids get upgraded.

The rub for some is the notifications some are getting (apparently immediately or very soon after bidding) that they have been outbid.

How was the OP harmed?  His bid was not high enough to be a winner.  Is it better to know sooner rather than later?

An action would be best, but moving someone from Aqua to a suite opens an Aqua cabin for another move up.  Without an exact number of cabins available a pure auction won't work.

The only issue seems to be notifications of under bids.  Are all under bidders notified and given an opportunitytoraise their bid?  If not there is a fairness issue that is easily solved.

If people are upset about this then they should contact Celebrity and if not then let it go.

[NutsAboutGolf]

25 minutes ago, mtempelaar said:

My last post got lost, so given that I am the one that posted the outbid email pic and there seems to be a desire to collect more data points I feel I can give a better view of my experiece.   
 

Facts going into this: 

1) I am a Captains Club member with Classic level, just shy of Select.  Bid Multiplier is 1.

2) I have not sailed Celebrity since 2003.  
3) I have an s2 sky suite booked for Beyond for Nov 13.   This was booked when Beyond showed up for reservations in 2020 and I applied Apex FCCs from pandemic.  All in $7100 (this was refundable fare prior to final payment date).   
4) We are perfectly happy with our cabin so if no upgrade, we are fine.

5) We are booked on Beyond again in 2024 in an S1, again at a steal of a price.

 

When we got initial Move Up email we reviewed the prices and said no thanks.

 

A few weeks later I decided, without telling my husband, to bid $400 pp for AQ Sky Suite.   We aren’t doing shore excursions so the thermal spa was enticing me as well as Blu.   This bid held for about 4 days and then I got the first outbid email.  By then my husband knew I had bid and the rationale.

 

I went in and did a $500 bid.  I IMMEDIATELY got an outbid email.   
 

After a few minutes calculating cost of thermal spa and whether value of that and Blu was worth it, I decided $600 was my max bid.   I submitted.   Again IMMEDIATELY got an outbid notification.  Note this was considered a strong bid.

 

I texted my husband.  I told him I was curious here.   Said I was going to roll the dice to see what happens at $700 pp but I was likely going to cancel after.   Kind of a test, but if it got accepted, I was kind of ok with it.   There were 6 AQ SS showing available at this time.   $700 was a very high strong big.   It stuck for a day.   Now I could have stood on that bid, knowing there were still cabins available and maybe only 1 person was ahead of me.   But I did more calculations and did cancel it.     This was a couple of weeks ago.

 

2 Days ago I bid, without telling my husband, as a lark $2k pp on a Royal Suite.   No outbid notification.  I texted my husband and told him.  He literally said “Cool go for it”.   So its still sitting there in pending. There are no RS available.  The chances are likely nil.  It was the minimum bid required.  So weak weak weak.

 

Given he said “Cool go for it”, I then went back in and put the same exact $2k pp bid on a Penthouse.  There is none available, its too big for us, but if we are submitting that for RS we might as well for PS since same minimum.    This has also NOT triggered an outbid email.   Yet.  Chances here likely nil.   But no outbid?  Really?  At 2 weeks out?    
 

so I sit here with RS and PS both in pending status.  If we get one, great.  If not, what my husband doesn’t know is I am going to like take that same money and bump up our category on the 2024 cruise.

 

I have a suspicion that outbid notifications are only going out for lower suites and not upper suites due to popularity.

 

Hope this helps people trying to figure it all out.   If I do pull off a surprise and get an upgrade, with let you all know.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks, this brings up datapoint we haven't even considered such as it MAY only be tied to lower suites and also that you receive the outbid email immediately.

[mtempelaar]

9 minutes ago, jagoffee said:

Thank you for sharing this information.  Has anyone else had this kind of experience.

 

Do you think it is possible that the notice was some kind of Spam?  Did you go back to your original bid email, when you increased you bid for the Aqua Suite or did you do it via the outbid email?

 

Very interesting.  It would  be good to know if this is happening to others.

You might want to go back directly to the Celebrity bid site and resubmit you AQ suite bid at a comfortable amount and ignore the request to bid a higher amount. (Just in case it is not legit or misleading)

 

Best of Luck.

Interesting question about spam.   For me going direct into move up from Celebrity website sometimes throws out an error initially but also immediately after the offer is submitted.  The vendor has some kind of server config issue.   The email links don’t work for me at all and never did.  It throws out the exact same error messages from the vendor.  I can even type in my name and booking number from the email.   So all of this is going via the Celebrity website.   

[NutsAboutGolf]

1 hour ago, morfred said:

Whatever it is my bidding days are over if this is the process. I do not mind bidding if it others are unaware of my bid. However I have no interest in getting in a bidding war.

 

For my personally I'll continue to bid a few ticks above the minimum for a sky suite (usually from AQ) as you really have nothing to lose assuming the price is right.

[NutsAboutGolf]

16 minutes ago, mtempelaar said:

Interesting question about spam.   For me going direct into move up from Celebrity website sometimes throws out an error initially but also immediately after the offer is submitted.  The vendor has some kind of server config issue.   The email links don’t work for me at all and never did.  It throws out the exact same error messages from the vendor.  I can even type in my name and booking number from the email.   So all of this is going via the Celebrity website.   

 

Broken URLs confirm it's from X and not spam...

 

[Jim_Iain]

5 hours ago, mtempelaar said:

My last post got lost, so given that I am the one that posted the outbid email pic and there seems to be a desire to collect more data points I feel I can give a better view of my experiece.   
 

Facts going into this: 

1) I am a Captains Club member with Classic level, just shy of Select.  Bid Multiplier is 1.

2) I have not sailed Celebrity since 2003.  
3) I have an s2 sky suite booked for Beyond for Nov 13.   This was booked when Beyond showed up for reservations in 2020 and I applied Apex FCCs from pandemic.  All in $7100 (this was refundable fare prior to final payment date).   
4) We are perfectly happy with our cabin so if no upgrade, we are fine.

5) We are booked on Beyond again in 2024 in an S1, again at a steal of a price.

 

When we got initial Move Up email we reviewed the prices and said no thanks.

 

A few weeks later I decided, without telling my husband, to bid $400 pp for AQ Sky Suite.   We aren’t doing shore excursions so the thermal spa was enticing me as well as Blu.   This bid held for about 4 days and then I got the first outbid email.  By then my husband knew I had bid and the rationale.

 

I went in and did a $500 bid.  I IMMEDIATELY got an outbid email.   
 

After a few minutes calculating cost of thermal spa and whether value of that and Blu was worth it, I decided $600 was my max bid.   I submitted.   Again IMMEDIATELY got an outbid notification.  Note this was considered a strong bid.

 

I texted my husband.  I told him I was curious here.   Said I was going to roll the dice to see what happens at $700 pp but I was likely going to cancel after.   Kind of a test, but if it got accepted, I was kind of ok with it.   There were 6 AQ SS showing available at this time.   $700 was a very high strong big.   It stuck for a day.   Now I could have stood on that bid, knowing there were still cabins available and maybe only 1 person was ahead of me.   But I did more calculations and did cancel it.     This was a couple of weeks ago.

 

2 Days ago I bid, without telling my husband, as a lark $2k pp on a Royal Suite.   No outbid notification.  I texted my husband and told him.  He literally said “Cool go for it”.   So its still sitting there in pending. There are no RS available.  The chances are likely nil.  It was the minimum bid required.  So weak weak weak.

 

Given he said “Cool go for it”, I then went back in and put the same exact $2k pp bid on a Penthouse.  There is none available, its too big for us, but if we are submitting that for RS we might as well for PS since same minimum.    This has also NOT triggered an outbid email.   Yet.  Chances here likely nil.   But no outbid?  Really?  At 2 weeks out?    
 

so I sit here with RS and PS both in pending status.  If we get one, great.  If not, what my husband doesn’t know is I am going to like take that same money and bump up our category on the 2024 cruise.

 

I have a suspicion that outbid notifications are only going out for lower suites and not upper suites due to popularity.

 

Hope this helps people trying to figure it all out.   If I do pull off a surprise and get an upgrade, with let you all know.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for your detailed experience.   I've never bid the minimum or in the 1st quartile so maybe the reason I've never seen an out bid notice.    

 

It would make sense to me that if they have 100+ passengers all bidding the minimum and with the adders are below the bids they might give an advise to jog the bids up.   Of course it could also be a new strategy and methodology  Celebrity and Cruise+ have instituted.

 

Good luck on the RS and let us hear how it goes.

[CruisingWalter]

On 10/28/2022 at 8:30 PM, prmssk said:

To me, this just looks like a marketing scheme to try and get people who have already made bids to bid more.

 

That's exactly what it is. Looks like it is sent to people who have placed bids on a particular class of cabin. "Before we close out the bidding, you do not have the winning bid so we're going to give you one more chance to give us a higher bid." Pretty standard marketing tactic. 

[Ex-Airbalancer]

On our Apex TA in April , there was enough empty balconies to room everyone from inside and OV to a balcony 

suites were sold out 

yet no one I knew won a move up offer but people got free upgrades at GS after they checked in 🤔

trying to figure out Celebrity is like trying figure out your government 😉

 

[zitsky]

No one knows your bid, right?  I don’t think so.  I don’t see your bid and you don’t see mine.  It’s all marketing.  Bid more.  Can someone show me I’m wrong?

[mayleeman]

Seems like the next step in maximizing revenue would be for X to start making every reservation subject to being outbid by someone else until you have made full payment (i.e., total booking price, nothing to do with Final Payment date). They would get free use of funds for months, even years.

 

Okay, I am kidding...sort of.

[canderson]

Another data point...

 

Our bids always show "Pending" from the beginning.  Always seems to simply indicate that a) the bid has not been rejected, and b) no decision has been made.

 

That said, we're always bidding on cabins that aren't available unless the current holder cancels.  Even a year+ out, by the time we get around to booking, a RS is the best available cabin, and suits our needs anyway.  Bidding on anything higher on the cruises we choose would require an extraordinary event in order to be successful.  We call these 'backfill' bids.  

 

That said, should the current owner no-show for whatever reason, we have a cabin that when abandoned could open the way for several ripple-up upgrades to occur with X gaining the additional revenue on each, which I would think would put us in a decent position.

[phoenix_dream]

On 10/28/2022 at 9:09 PM, mtempelaar said:

I sincerely doubt it was/is fair, otherwise there wouldn’t be multipliers based on status.   

I don't know why you think multipliers based on status are unfair (I think that's what you are saying?).  It is a perk that comes with loyalty and people who have spent alot of time and money with Celebrity.  Why shouldn't they have this perk?  As long as it is known upfront to everyone that it is the process, I think it is fair.  You can bid or not bid; your choice.  In the past, it was the higher level CC members who got offers to upgrade, in fact sometimes as a freebee.  At least this process allows everyone, at every level, to bid.  And when all is said and done, the multipliers are so small, even at Zenith level, as to really make almost no difference at all.  I really don't think an extra $10 or $15 added to my bid is going to be what pushes me into the win, although of course on a rare occasion that will be the case.

[mtempelaar]

32 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

I don't know why you think multipliers based on status are unfair (I think that's what you are saying?).  It is a perk that comes with loyalty and people who have spent alot of time and money with Celebrity.  Why shouldn't they have this perk?  As long as it is known upfront to everyone that it is the process, I think it is fair.  You can bid or not bid; your choice.  In the past, it was the higher level CC members who got offers to upgrade, in fact sometimes as a freebee.  At least this process allows everyone, at every level, to bid.  And when all is said and done, the multipliers are so small, even at Zenith level, as to really make almost no difference at all.  I really don't think an extra $10 or $15 added to my bid is going to be what pushes me into the win, although of course on a rare occasion that will be the case.

That is what I am saying.   The thing is, when I go to the Move Up page, I cannot finding wording anywhere about multipliers.  Not in the FAQs, the Terms and Conditions, not on the pages there.  Maybe I missed it.  But I do think there should be wording about that somewhere in the Move Up section.   

[phoenix_dream]

On 10/30/2022 at 12:14 PM, mtempelaar said:

That is what I am saying.   The thing is, when I go to the Move Up page, I cannot finding wording anywhere about multipliers.  Not in the FAQs, the Terms and Conditions, not on the pages there.  Maybe I missed it.  But I do think there should be wording about that somewhere in the Move Up section.   

I agree, it should be noted somewhere on the Move Up information pages

[Jim_Iain]

On 10/30/2022 at 10:14 AM, mtempelaar said:

That is what I am saying.   The thing is, when I go to the Move Up page, I cannot finding wording anywhere about multipliers.  Not in the FAQs, the Terms and Conditions, not on the pages there.  Maybe I missed it.  But I do think there should be wording about that somewhere in the Move Up section.   

https://www.celebritycruises.com/captains-club/program-changes

 

The multiplier was a recent upgrade to the Captain's Club Benefits -   They are marketing it as Move-Up Bid Priority -    Celebrity is terrible in messaging and updated pages if affected by new policies etc.

[NutsAboutGolf]

With the multiplier, just a WAG (Wild A$$ Guess) that it could be that the third party of PlusGrade hasn't yet integrated them into the bidding visuals yet.

[JuliaMS]

Isn’t that what the whole bidding process is? If this happened a week or two before the cruise AFTER your bid was accepted and paid for that is different. But when you bid someone can always outbid you until it’s final. I have changed it removed my bid in the past. I always bid low and assume I’m not going to get it. 

[actuarian]

On 10/28/2022 at 8:57 PM, Jeremiah1212 said:

It’s effectively letting you know you have no chance. If you bid $50 and they already have a full slate of $200 bids, you stand no chance and that is what it is. So if you want a realistic chance, pay more. 
 

Would you rather know immediately or wait 60 days to find out you didn’t get the upgrade? 

I have made quite a few move-up bids and I have won some and lost some but I have never received an "outbid" email.  The problem is that it is not clear what it means.  Of course, anyone who bids on eBay gets emails of this sort all of the time but, on eBay, all bidders start out equal. That is not the case with Move-up.  For example, if my original booking was for an Aqua Class room and I bid $500 to move-up to a sky suite, can I be outbid by a $600 bid from someone who's original booking was for an Inside stateroom? The truth is that the workings of the move-up system are so vague that, IMHO, most of us understand how it works about as well as most of us understand quantum mechanics. I do believe, based on my own experience, that the chance of succeeding with a move-up bid very much depends on how much demand there is for the cabin the bidder would be moving out of. Often, when I succeed, it seems to be because I made my original booking early and booked a room type that is in limited supply, like a Sunset Veranda room.

[morpheusofthesea]

Another poster posted this as another alternative " Cabin:  We booked an interior, and when we boarded, I went to the Concierge Desk to ask about a paid upgrade since I knew cabins were available.  We ended up getting a Balcony for a very reasonable price (about a fourth of the total bid guidelines for the offer they email you before the cruise). As I said, I asked at the Concierge desk to get on the list first thing.  Roughly, the rate is $39/person per night.  Concierge said that I was number one on the list and not to unpack.  Said they would know at closeout.  We were assigned our new room at about 3:15."

"It ain't over. til its over." Yogi Berra

[NutsAboutGolf]

23 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

Another poster posted this as another alternative " Cabin:  We booked an interior, and when we boarded, I went to the Concierge Desk to ask about a paid upgrade since I knew cabins were available.  We ended up getting a Balcony for a very reasonable price (about a fourth of the total bid guidelines for the offer they email you before the cruise). As I said, I asked at the Concierge desk to get on the list first thing.  Roughly, the rate is $39/person per night.  Concierge said that I was number one on the list and not to unpack.  Said they would know at closeout.  We were assigned our new room at about 3:15."

"It ain't over. til its over." Yogi Berra

 

It seems OVs-Concierge have a lot of availability, it seems that even in sailings that are less than 50% that AQ and up sail full.  The cheapest way to book a cruise on X for those who want lower categories is to book an inside within a month of sailing and to go guest relations upon boarding the ship to inquire about upgrades

[ggo85]

Here’s my question. How does anyone other than X know why one person wins an upgrade and another loses?   What if 2 or more bid the exact amount and there’s one cabin?  And no one wants to increase.  How do they choose?  
 

IMHO, it’s all a crapshoot.  It sounds like most folks here initially select a cabin that makes them happy, which is the best thing to do. 
 

If you want to bid for something better, do it, but pick an amount and stick with it.  Don’t assume the outcome is fair.  Or even that it goes to the highest bidder.  Probably, but who knows? Be content that, if you get the upgrade for the amount bid, you’re happy and if you don’t, you’re equally happy.  
 

 

[RichYak]

10 hours ago, ggo85 said:

Or even that it goes to the highest bidder.  Probably, but who knows?

It may not. If there are high bids for the cabin you're currently in, your own bid to move up probably doesn't need to be has high.

[Jeremiah1212]

11 hours ago, ggo85 said:

Here’s my question. How does anyone other than X know why one person wins an upgrade and another loses?   What if 2 or more bid the exact amount and there’s one cabin?  And no one wants to increase.  How do they choose?  

 

No. The point of the program is to bring in more revenue. Simply put, which ever scenario brings in the most money is the winner. What they can expect in return from your initially booked cabin is going to have some influence on top of what you are willing to pay for an upgrade.

 

 

[LMHSRN]

On 10/29/2022 at 3:49 PM, Jim_Iain said:

I think you may misunderstand how the bidding process work.    When you bid you are only bidding using the pricing for you cabin class and cabins you are working.   It is not like an regular auction where the first bid has to be outbid in order to win.

 

There are many factors involved and I don't believe any of us know the proprietary algorithm used by UpgradPlus.     

 

Some of the Factors involved may be:

 

1.  Added revenue by accepting a bid that triggers a chain of upgrades across many room classess.   Eg.   A RS wins a PS then a CS upgraded to RS etc etc.

 

2.  A bidder that bids the same as you but has a higher Captain's Club Status has an automatic multiplier added to their bid - 

 

MoveUp allows you to bid on a stateroom upgrade after you’ve purchased your cruise. As a valued Captain’s Club member your bid gets a bonus boost based on your tier. So, you get more value than what you bid. Classic members get an extra 1% multiplier, Select members get a 2% multiplier, Elite members get a 3% multiplier, Elite Plus members get a 4% multiplier, and Zenith members get a 5% multiplier.

So, if I read this correctly, according to you....If I bid on a cabin and I have no multiplier and a Zenith comes along and UNDER bids me, with their 5% they win the bid?

 

Like to know where this information came from please.

[prmssk]

3 minutes ago, LMHSRN said:

So, if I read this correctly, according to you....If I bid on a cabin and I have no multiplier and a Zenith comes along and UNDER bids me, with their 5% they win the bid?

 

Like to know where this information came from please.

Keep in mind 5% is a very small amount.  That's only $50 on a $1,000 bid.  I doubt these multipliers are going to typically do anything besides break a tie.