In-person muster drills?

[ontheweb]

2 hours ago, CJANDH said:

Royal and Carnival also found ways to avoid the lack of mustering by making sure pax visited their muster stations as soon as they boarded. They also looked for creative ways to incentivize people to comply; like no drinks until mustered. Norwegian took the easy way out and will suffer from the bad customer response. 

The experienced mariners on the cc boards think they took the SAFER way.

[complawyer]

its a great way to get about 30 minutes of naptime. i usually had no problems with the muster, but we just got off the jewel on feb 4th. the muster took over half an hour, and because we had round sailing from panama, after the english, they repeated the entire process in spanish. im not complaining about that, but i could barely keep my eyes open.

[RocketMan275]

12 hours ago, ontheweb said:

The experienced mariners on the cc boards think they took the SAFER way.

The experienced mariners at Royal and Carnival think they took the safer way.  

Even others believe NCL restored the inpersonmuster to save money even though the emuster provides better safety information for the passengers.

Edited February 12, 2023 by RocketMan275

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

The experienced mariners at Royal and Carnival think they took the safer way.  

Even others believe NCL restored the inpersonmuster to save money even though the emuster provides better safety information for the passengers.

The bean counters, knowing what would make their passengers happy, kept the e-muster instead of returning to the tried and true way.

[RocketMan275]

Just now, ontheweb said:

The bean counters, knowing what would make their passengers happy, kept the e-muster instead of returning to the tried and true way.

Yes, the NCL bean counters decided to sacrifice passenger safety by returning to the tried and true inpersonmuster to save money.  BTW, just because "we've always done it that way" isnt' sufficient justification.

[ontheweb]

4 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Yes, the NCL bean counters decided to sacrifice passenger safety by returning to the tried and true inpersonmuster to save money.  BTW, just because "we've always done it that way" isnt' sufficient justification.

The "old fashioned way" has worked in the past, for instance the Star Princess fire. No one yet has any experience if the new way will work.

[RocketMan275]

1 minute ago, ontheweb said:

The "old fashioned way" has worked in the past, for instance the Star Princess fire. No one yet has any experience if the new way will work.

So, you admit that the emuster may work as well, if not better, than the inpersonmuster?

[ontheweb]

3 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

So, you admit that the emuster may work as well, if not better, than the inpersonmuster?

No, all I said was that it is totally untested in a real life situation. Here is something to ponder, if this new way would really be better, why did the authorities in charge not come up with it originally? It obviously puts less stress on the passengers for their part in the drill.

 

I was going to say, we will never agree, but then I realized there is something we can agree on. We can agree that we will never agree! 🤣

[RocketMan275]

3 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

No, all I said was that it is totally untested in a real life situation. Here is something to ponder, if this new way would really be better, why did the authorities in charge not come up with it originally? It obviously puts less stress on the passengers for their part in the drill.

 

I was going to say, we will never agree, but then I realized there is something we can agree on. We can agree that we will never agree! 🤣

We can speculate why things evolved the way they did. But it would only be speculation.

The point remains that a better way does exist as attested to by Royal and Carnival. 

The only reason to return to the inpersonmuster is that it is cheaper.

Hopefully, passenger feedback will convince NCL that the cost savings, if any, are not worth it.

I know that I will make the inpersonmuster a central issue in my post cruise survey. 

I will also encourage other passengers to do the same.  

[Raleigh Traveler]

We should be aware the there is a higher authority that determines muster drills, SOLAS. When it comes to cruise ships, "From 1 January 2015, passengers must undergo safety drills, including mustering at the lifeboat stations, before the ship departs or immediately on departure." Non in-person drills were allowed because of Covid. This has nothing to do with saving money by NCL but a return to a requirement by a higher authority.

[RocketMan275]

1 hour ago, Raleigh Traveler said:

We should be aware the there is a higher authority that determines muster drills, SOLAS. When it comes to cruise ships, "From 1 January 2015, passengers must undergo safety drills, including mustering at the lifeboat stations, before the ship departs or immediately on departure." Non in-person drills were allowed because of Covid. This has nothing to do with saving money by NCL but a return to a requirement by a higher authority.

Has nothing to do with a higher authorities requirements since Royal and Carnival are not returning to the inpersonmuster.  Only Disney and NCL are doing so.  Read the link up thread from the points guy on why NCL is returning to the inpersonmuster to save money.

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, RocketMan275 said:

I will also encourage other passengers to do the same.  

Great suggestion.  I did just that last week when I received my survey for my recent Sky sailing.  

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, Raleigh Traveler said:

We should be aware the there is a higher authority that determines muster drills, SOLAS. When it comes to cruise ships, "From 1 January 2015, passengers must undergo safety drills, including mustering at the lifeboat stations, before the ship departs or immediately on departure." Non in-person drills were allowed because of Covid. This has nothing to do with saving money by NCL but a return to a requirement by a higher authority.

So is Covid now completely gone?  I must have missed that memo.

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, RocketMan275 said:

We can speculate why things evolved the way they did. But it would only be speculation.

The point remains that a better way does exist as attested to by Royal and Carnival. 

The only reason to return to the inpersonmuster is that it is cheaper.

Hopefully, passenger feedback will convince NCL that the cost savings, if any, are not worth it.

I know that I will make the inpersonmuster a central issue in my post cruise survey. 

I will also encourage other passengers to do the same.  

As I previously wrote, the only thing we can agree on is that we disagree. I do not agree that a better way does exist because Royal and Carnival have made that decision.

[ontheweb]

16 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Has nothing to do with a higher authorities requirements since Royal and Carnival are not returning to the inpersonmuster.  Only Disney and NCL are doing so.  Read the link up thread from the points guy on why NCL is returning to the inpersonmuster to save money.

That is the OPINION of the Points Guy (who relies on advertising). I believe somewhere in this thread  @chengkp75has refuted that claim.

[ontheweb]

4 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

So is Covid now completely gone?  I must have missed that memo.

So does that mean you also want cruise lines to revert to requiring up to date vaccinations for Covid and passengers submitting negative Covid tests within 2 days of sailing? Or is it just the new e-muster that you want to remain from the Covid changes?

[ChiefMateJRK]

55 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

So does that mean you also want cruise lines to revert to requiring up to date vaccinations for Covid and passengers submitting negative Covid tests within 2 days of sailing? Or is it just the new e-muster that you want to remain from the Covid changes?

Just the new e-muster.  I don't care about up to date vaccinations because I do that anyway.  Not because of a cruise line or the government but because of what my trusted medical professionals recommend.  The tests were always a joke because I test negative and then pack into a Covid infested airplane for hours.  Even the port testing was a joke because I just got off the plane and the Covid didn't have time to show up.  I'm really not concerned about getting Covid while packed together for a muster drill.  It's the total lack of logic (along with the total waste of my vacation time) that rubs me the wrong way.

[chengkp75]

5 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

It's the total lack of logic (along with the total waste of my vacation time) that rubs me the wrong way.

Just because you don't see the logic in the in person muster drill (since you don't see the vast majority of the drill) doesn't mean it isn't there.  The basic argument against the in person drill is what you have in parenthesis:  my vacation time.  Again, sure hope you never have a real emergency on a ship that does the e-muster.  Just as you said about your experience with the in person muster, neither the passengers nor the crew knew how to handle the situation.  If the e-muster is providing adequate information to the passengers, why was there chaos?  If the  e-muster is training the crew to handle an actual muster situation adequately, why was there chaos?  

[NW Pacific]

The SOLAS information regarding safety drills states " including mustering at the lifeboat stations." I remember in the "olden days" yes that is where we went, haven't had that experience in many years. Now in a restaurant, theatre or atrium???  so do not think  SOLAS requirements are being followed??   

[shof515]

20 minutes ago, NW Pacific said:

The SOLAS information regarding safety drills states " including mustering at the lifeboat stations." I remember in the "olden days" yes that is where we went, haven't had that experience in many years. Now in a restaurant, theatre or atrium???  so do not think  SOLAS requirements are being followed??   

for some ships the restaurant, theater, atrium is all consider a valid muster station this due to the lifeboat stations on these being too small . chengkp75 can provide more information about this

[chengkp75]

7 hours ago, NW Pacific said:

The SOLAS information regarding safety drills states " including mustering at the lifeboat stations." I remember in the "olden days" yes that is where we went, haven't had that experience in many years. Now in a restaurant, theatre or atrium???  so do not think  SOLAS requirements are being followed??   

Of course SOLAS requirements are being followed.  Every time a USCG inspector comes on the ship and holds drills, and every time a class society surveyor witnesses drills onboard, they are using SOLAS requirements as the basis of whether the ship is meeting SOLAS or not.  If the muster stations were not in accordance with SOLAS, the ship wouldn't sail.  Muster stations are determined, by the class society, not the cruise line, at newbuilding, and the locations are based on the primary SOLAS consideration: "the muster location should be as close to the lifeboat embarkation point as practicable", and the locations must meet ingress/egress standards, volume standards, escape route standards, lighting and ventilation standards, and structural fire protection standards that are set by the class societies based on computer crowd and crisis management paradigms.  Older ships, that have larger promenade decks, will still have muster stations outdoors, under the boats, and will for the life of the vessel, they won't change.  Newer ships have reduced the size of the promenade decks (to maximize internal revenue generating space, i.e. more balcony cabins), and so the muster stations had to be moved indoors.  This was not for passenger comfort.

[ChiefMateJRK]

20 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Just as you said about your experience with the in person muster, neither the passengers nor the crew knew how to handle the situation. 

I never said this.  I only said it was a waste of time because we couldn't hear anything, already knew how to put on a life vest and were crowded together like rats despite the "experts" still preaching about distancing.  That was the logic fail.

[timcahill98]

Wish I had seen this thread before I booked my cruise yesterday. I would not have chosen to sail on Norwegian if I knew this ahead of time. This will be my first and last cruise with them.

 

I've also heard they just took on over a half billion $$ in debt and have forced their room and entertainment staff to take pay cuts (in addition to cutting some of their production shows, namely Kinky Boots).  So anyone who doubts NCL is making this move to save money, think again.

Edited February 13, 2023 by timcahill98
To add second paragraph

[ChiefMateJRK]

26 minutes ago, timcahill98 said:

So anyone who doubts NCL is making this move to save money, think again.

Smart businesses focus on increasing profits.  Cost saving moves "may" lead to increased profits, but not always.

[BirdTravels]

On 2/12/2023 at 10:39 AM, ChiefMateJRK said:

So is Covid now completely gone?  I must have missed that memo.

The President of the United States says that there is no longer a COVID emergency and will terminate all funding for the COVID programs. Close enough.