Future booked cruises with All Included? Tips no longer included.

[neverlaysup]

1 hour ago, markeb said:

 

It could. But we don't have October 4 pricing yet. I suspect it will go up, but going up $125 pn is by no means certain.

That $125 is the hidden cost because of the loss of OBC and the addition of gratuities. Celebrity can keep the prices exactly as they are now but the reality is that it nets out to a price increase.

[Lastdance]

16 minutes ago, micruiser2002 said:

So has everything else that was in the 1st post of a summary of the recent changes.  That is why I said they missed the menu changes in this summary.

I do not know if it was “missed,” intentionally or not, but since you mentioned it, I guess it is now included.  I am sure Celebrity is not finished with making changes, so we can all stay tuned, listen and learn!  Most of us just want clarification and not speculation...I guess I did not realize that Celebrity made reference to specific menu items in print like these additional new changes.  I missed that document.

Edited August 30, 2023 by Lastdance

[markeb]

10 minutes ago, neverlaysup said:

That $125 is the hidden cost because of the loss of OBC and the addition of gratuities. Celebrity can keep the prices exactly as they are now but the reality is that it nets out to a price increase.

Exactly. I know that. If they keep them the same, it is approximately $125. If they come down, it’s $125 - the decrease. We won’t know until the start selling after October 4. 

[the penguins]

1 hour ago, markeb said:

 

You'll still have the daily auto tip in place. The difference is it's not in the fare and could be removed. With AI it's part of the fare.

 

I frankly would prefer it be in the fare. 

In what "fare"?

We never book AI and would be happy to have the grats included in the base price of the cruise ( exactly as X does in Australia/ New Zealand) and with no option to cancel the grats.

[neverlaysup]

1 minute ago, the penguins said:

In what "fare"?

We never book AI and would be happy to have the grats included in the base price of the cruise ( exactly as X does in Australia/ New Zealand) and with no option to cancel the grats.

They shouldn't allow any passenger to remove the gratuities from their account. If you want to tip more....go for it but if you want to be cheap and tip less.....find another vacation.

[markeb]

3 minutes ago, the penguins said:

In what "fare"?

We never book AI and would be happy to have the grats included in the base price of the cruise ( exactly as X does in Australia/ New Zealand) and with no option to cancel the grats.

Whatever fare you pay. I’m not wordsmithing here. AI is a fare. Cruise only is a fare. Cruise with gratuities for the Australia/New Zealand market is a fare. 

[the penguins]

2 hours ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

This news is all over the social media so here is a brief rundown of all the things that changed or were addressed by Celebrity this week. Not trying to start a debate as this isn't rumor or speculation. It came straight from the source. 

 

All Included

*Bookings created after 10/3 will not have gratuities included regardless if you book Cruise Only or All Included 

*Significantly more people booking Cruise Only in the past year (AI bookings were ~90% of the volume when initially introduced)

*Aqua Class will now offer a Cruise Only rate

*Gratuities can still be prepaid at the time of booking or anytime there after 

*Prices should be 'reflective' of gratuities being removed from the inclusions 

*Singles will no longer have the double charge for All Included 

*Quoting a flat $20 pp/pd (gratuity included) price to upgrade from Classic to Premium beverage package 

***Reason given - Drinks and WiFi are the two things people want most. (I don't agree with the delivery here - just passing along what was shared) Also provides some flexibility to use gratuities as a tool in future sales. 

 

Sky Suite Butlers

*Team concept is in place lead by a Head Butler 

*Head Butler will determine where/who needs extra attention (i.e. they will try to address who heavily uses their butler and who contacts them once in a cruise

*No one was terminated but positions were shuffled around including to other brands in the company 

***Reason given - many Sky Suites were requesting service at the same time which created a bottleneck for anyone getting service from a butler 

 

Cookies 

*Test pilot at the gelato bar. 

*Apparently sold hundreds over two cruises 

*Did not replace free cookies/pastries anywhere else onboard 

*Discontinued and won't be back 

***Reason given -They needed to implement a fee to temper demand since it took some time to heat the cookies 

 

Vaping 

*Tested, feedback received and discontinued. 

*Vapers will have to sneak their vapes in their cabins like they do today or head to a smoking area 

 

Removal of Retreat OBC

***Reason Given - None. Big miss here. This should have been directly addressed as it is (was) an crucial tool in justifying the high suite prices

 

Removal of Aqua and Concierge perks and canapes

*According to Celebrity nothing has been removed

*There should be a card in AQ and CC cabins to indicate if and how often you want these provided ranging from never to every day

*(Can someone confirm this card exists? I have not seen it.)

***Reason Given - most of these items go to waste (I cannot disagree with this. Retooling what is offered would solve a lot Please don't give me any more tins of pate!)

 

Perfect Day at Coco Cay

*Giving a few ships opportunity to visit Coco Cay based on guest feedback 

*Continue to welcome families as indicated by always having kid and teen programs 

*Family travel on Celebrity is different 

***Reason Given - Trying to make some apparent distinction that people with kids on Celebrity travel with their kids not for their kids. If you are traveling for your kids, you travel on lines packed with the 'kid stuff'. If you travel with your kids you bring them/drag them along with you. Not the first time they have mentioned this but I'm not sure I agree with this approach. 

 

MDR upcharge items

*These things will continue to be on the menu and evolve over time.

***Reason Given - these are test items to expand what is offered similar to entrees in some of the Specialty restaurants.

 

Groups

*Group rates will eventually not include gratuities 

*Nothing mentioned on the refundability of group rates 

*The previous FAQ showing group rates would only be Cruise Only is gone. Groups will be All Included. I'm still concerned that it even made it to a draft FAQ. 

*Very little shared in general. I'm hesitant to share much more since this really isn't meant for general customers and there is a ton of misinformation posted about how this program works. 

 

Ultimately there were some hits and misses. Prices will go up as demand goes up. That goes for any line. New to cruise and new to brand, especially on 7 night Caribbean cruises is very very high. I think this is where a lot of the removal of grats is stemming from. This segment frequently doesn't know better than to consider this cost element when they are booking. I suspect Celebrity has learned they need to get out in front of some of these changes (i.e. Butler Team) but a lot of this test type stuff never has and may never be communicated. 

 

I do think the All Included terminology needs to go away and eventually shift back to something more along the lines of the Go 1/2/3 or Big Better Best program that gave people easy to understand prepackaged incremental choices. 

Great summary.

Just one comment regarding AI being 90% of the volume when first introduced - should have been 100% as AI was compolsary. Immediately there was a choice many chose not to take the AI option.

[the penguins]

9 minutes ago, markeb said:

Whatever fare you pay. I’m not wordsmithing here. AI is a fare. Cruise only is a fare. Cruise with gratuities for the Australia/New Zealand market is a fare. 

I was trying to clarify not criticise.

Under the new system  you will have 2 choices:

Sail Only - no drinks or WiFi

or upgrade to

AI - including Classic drinks and basic wifi. 

You will  then have the option to pre pay the grats or they will be added to your account daily onboard.

I would prefer the grats to be added to the basic (Sail Only) price with no option to cancel.

 

[rxlowry]

1 hour ago, kwokpot said:

Just to be clear, are some of the statements facetious?

He did a great job summarizing this info direct from Celebrity.  The reasons given were the same I heard.  

[Jeremiah1212]

19 minutes ago, the penguins said:

Great summary.

Just one comment regarding AI being 90% of the volume when first introduced - should have been 100% as AI was compolsary. Immediately there was a choice many chose not to take the AI option.

 

The 90% comparison was compared to fall of 2022 which was ~5-6ish months after the Cruise Only options were introduced in May 2022. I can say first hand there is a significant connection in the large number of New To Cruise/New to Brand customers who book at the lowest price then purchase drinks, WiFi, etc. on board because they didn't realize it was advantageous to book the All Included are upfront. I've made detailed cost comparisons for people and they still struggle to wrap their head around it. 

[Cap_D]

26 minutes ago, the penguins said:

Great summary.

Just one comment regarding AI being 90% of the volume when first introduced - should have been 100% as AI was compolsary. Immediately there was a choice many chose not to take the AI option.

And probably changed so they could continue to play with advertising and promotions, but net same or higher dollar amounts.  

[sixpackeddie]

Very factual and accurate information.

Thank you

[micruiser2002]

51 minutes ago, Lastdance said:

I do not know if it was “missed,” intentionally or not, but since you mentioned it, I guess it is now included.  I am sure Celebrity is not finished with making changes, so we can all stay tuned, listen and learn!  Most of us just want clarification and not speculation...I guess I did not realize that Celebrity made reference to specific menu items in print like these additional new changes.  I missed that document.

Celebrity may not have made a reference in print but if you look at the menus in current sailings you will see they have all been updated including the breakfast menu in Luminae.  There is also a thread here and on the other site talking about the poor food choices.  The appetizers are now all soups or salads except for the standard shrimp cocktail or escargot.  There are no real appetizers.  Also the mains have really been downgraded.

[kwokpot]

24 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

He did a great job summarizing this info direct from Celebrity.  The reasons given were the same I heard.  

I was specifically referring to the couple of statements referring to the success of the cookie sales and 'hundreds' of cookies were sold in 2 days.

The last line seems especially tongue in cheek, don't you think?

Cookies 

*Test pilot at the gelato bar. 

*Apparently sold hundreds over two cruises 

*Did not replace free cookies/pastries anywhere else onboard 

*Discontinued and won't be back 

***Reason given -They needed to implement a fee to temper demand since it took some time to heat the cookies

Edited August 30, 2023 by kwokpot

[rxlowry]

3 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

I was specifically referring to the couple of statements referring to the success of the cookie sales and 'hundreds' of cookies were sold in 2 days.

The last line seems especially tongue in cheek, don't you think?

Cookies 

*Test pilot at the gelato bar. 

*Apparently sold hundreds over two cruises 

*Did not replace free cookies/pastries anywhere else onboard 

*Discontinued and won't be back 

***Reason given -They needed to implement a fee to temper demand since it took some time to heat the cookies

I heard the same thing.  They claimed to have sold hundred.   I highly doubt they did Bc why discontinue?

[kwokpot]

3 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

I heard the same thing.  They claimed to have sold hundred.   I highly doubt they did Bc why discontinue?

Was that information discussed here on a CC thread? I don't remember seeing it nor any subsequent discussion about the validity of this reported successful test.  

[wrk2cruise]

8 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

I heard the same thing.  They claimed to have sold hundred.   I highly doubt they did Bc why discontinue?

 

If they sold hundreds they should have got rid of gelato and put in a bigger cookie oven!  Other than the free scoops for CC members how much gelato do they sell?

[Lastdance]

1 hour ago, micruiser2002 said:

Celebrity may not have made a reference in print but if you look at the menus in current sailings you will see they have all been updated including the breakfast menu in Luminae.  There is also a thread here and on the other site talking about the poor food choices.  The appetizers are now all soups or salads except for the standard shrimp cocktail or escargot.  There are no real appetizers.  Also the mains have really been downgraded.

Yes, I have experienced the decline in food choices, both in a suite and SV.  I have also booked a suite on Oceania to try another cruise line because I liked the itinerary, not to mention sold my shares of stock, so not a stockholder(RCCL), at the moment.  My decisions do not stem from what other are saying, but from my own personal experiences.  The OP was talking about a specific document and that was what I was referring to with my comment, but did not state that in my answer to you; the OP has stated that.  I am NOT disagreeing with you about the food etc., but have made my own decisions/choices based on a variety of what I want in a cruise.  I do have three cruises on Celebrity that were booked when first released with very good pricing too, but have no plans to cancel at this time.  Of course, things can change in the future and everything is about choice.  So, which cruise lines are more food, and price appropriate with you?  What specifically are you doing because Celebrity has made many changes?  It is what it is and we all have a choice to cruise or not to cruise.  I have been with Celebrity a very long time...

Edited August 30, 2023 by Lastdance

[kwokpot]

27 minutes ago, wrk2cruise said:

 

If they sold hundreds they should have got rid of gelato and put in a bigger cookie oven!  Other than the free scoops for CC members how much gelato do they sell?

Hence my initial query as to whether those statements were tongue in cheek. I've gone back to the two threads directly related to this issue and to the CruiseHive articles and there isn't any mention of test results. 

[Cap_D]

Cookiegate is being spun by Celebrity and it's just making them look worse.   One more reason why they can't be trusted.  They would in no way know how popular the product was unless they offered it for free.  And have yet to see or read a review of the actual cookie.  So, their explanation makes no sense, as there are no reports of such a cookie being offered at the same spot, hours, etc. as included.  And, they could always have a warm cookie at OVC with plenty of equipment to heat it, present it, etc.  If cooked to order entirely then how many did they expect to sell, and why market it the way they did to seemingly promote volume consumption.  And, why mess around with the passengers?!   Meanwhile Eden Cafe has a well reviewed warm cookie, and there isn't a charge yet, but it's only available for a few hours a sailing and most passengers don't have one, know about it, etc.  Will that go to a charge to lessen current demand? 

 

Enough about cookies, I hope the TA community makes their displeasure known about the brand going down the tubes regardless of the promos, commissions, swag bags and Ascent tours offered in the coming weeks, or pricing games that can be now played.  

Edited August 30, 2023 by Cap_D

[NutsAboutGolf]

FYI about the cookies which initially caused the outrage:  Multiple passenger stated there were no cookies of any kind offered at the cafe.  There were cookies offered at the buffet ice cream station but reportedly not chocolate chip.  Had the Equinox ensured they stocked the cafe and buffet with chocolate chip cookie jars, the $2 cookie may still be around

[micruiser2002]

2 hours ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

 

That was on purpose. Food in general terms was not mentioned in this discussion so there is nothing to share. It is and will remain to be subjective as always.  

I am confused what discussion are you talking about?  I thought your original post was a summary of all the other posts here and on other sights about the changes and any possible responses from Celebrity?  I have seen many posts about the changes in the menus and responses from Celebrity on this.  Food is very subjective but to be honest so are many of the other issues depending on each persons likes/dislikes or ways of cruising.  I think the menu changes honestly affect more cruisers than a lot of the other things mentioned and that is why I brought it up. 

[rxlowry]

7 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

Hence my initial query as to whether those statements were tongue in cheek. I've gone back to the two threads directly related to this issue and to the CruiseHive articles and there isn't any mention of test results. 

The OP is summarizing a call he was on with Celebrity for TAs.  I heard all the exact same info on the call yesterday.  If I had been drinking when she said “sold hundreds” I would have choked!

[kwokpot]

2 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

The OP is summarizing a call he was on with Celebrity for TAs.  I heard all the exact same info on the call yesterday.  If I had been drinking when she said “sold hundreds” I would have choked!

NOWHERE on this thread, and especially on the opening paragraph of the initial post, did the OP revel that is where this 'summation' information is coming from. 

[Jeremiah1212]

4 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

NOWHERE on this thread, and especially on the opening paragraph of the initial post, did the OP revel that is where this 'summation' information is coming from. 

 

14 minutes ago, micruiser2002 said:

I am confused what discussion are you talking about? 

 

 

Summary of all of the items announced 8/29

*brief rundown of all the things that changed or were addressed by Celebrity this week

 

I'll be more clear. Yesterday 8/29 Celebrity hosted a call with TA's. I summarized the topics (and only the topics) that the SVP discussed.