Silversea vs Seabourn

[commodoredave]

On 2/19/2024 at 3:59 AM, Fletcher said:

A perennial and interesting topic.  I currently find myself on Silversea cruises (two last year, two this) because of the itineraries, though Silversea has already completely cocked up our so-called expedition cruise next April.  This has nothing to do with Suez/Houthis etc.  But on that subject, many people have complained about lack of information from Silversea about cancellations.  

 

If you want to do a 'classic' cruise on a biggish ship then Silversea has a broad choice, including some recent ones like the Dawn, the Nova and the Ray.  Once they were market leaders in the expedition sector but now lag behind Seabourn with its new purpose-built Venture and Pursuit.  Silversea's Cloud and Wind are old-school, old-tech conversions of classic cruisers.  Silver Endeavour is the only one of their fleet I'd consider taking to Antarctica. I still think Seabourn's ships - Quest class or Ovation class - are the best-designed I have ever been on, mainly because of their vast deck space. Seabourn's decor is also superior as Silversea is a bit too beige for me.

 

On a more general note, I always have preferred the vibe on Seabourn ships.  Silversea is a bit more dressy, a bit more formal, which isn't to my taste.  I also think the Silversea butler thing is pretty silly. I mean, seeing men waltzing around in tail coats when you come back on board covered in penguin poo is ridiculous.  I think service levels are pretty much equal and ditto the food.  You can pay extra on Silversea at La Dame for fancy glassware and cutlery which is a treat I am obstinately resistant to.  All Seabourn feeding stations are included and I'm delighted to see they have finally dumped Thomas Keller. 

 

So you can tell I prefer Seabourn, though Silversea  currently has - for me - the more attractive itineraries.  And that's the only reason I go on ships.  

Your comments are fair and interesting. Like you, we choose between the two based on itinerary and price. But we enjoy both and would never say “no” to a bargain on either!

[stan01]

2 hours ago, saminina said:

We all have opinions and your post hit the mark for likes within four hours.

 

Will be on Explora for three weeks during May.  This will be third three week cruise with the company so I'll say it has been a good value if you enjoy three decent daily meals.   Unlike SS and SB, no marketing about ultra luxury.  A clue they are aware 1998 happened a long time ago.  Just off three weeks on Crystal Serenity, which I do consider luxury.......all things considered.   The main difference being I'd suggest limiting Explora to a 14 day experiment and wishing I did not depart Serenity after three weeks.

 

Soon to do a crossing on SB to see what the product is like after 16 month absence.  They offered an expiring deal that was too good to refuse.  Hopefully, it tuns out as a good deal.

 

I am surprised at how many likes I have (seven and counting), not sure if that means people agree or they are acknowledging a strong opinion 🙂

 

For Explora and Ritz Carlton:  I do wonder if the shorter 6-8 day itineraries are going to attract a lot of families with children along with a younger demographics of people whose jobs don't permit longer vacations.  These ships are not set up with areas for families, and if a poorly supervised group of kids takes over the pool area(s) it really would detract from our experience.  Nothing against kids, just that these ships are not set up to handle them in a separate area where other passengers won't be disturbed.  Of course some parents are very watchful of their kids and would not allow them to disturb others.  But if the kids are disturbing others the crew seems unable to do anything in our experience.

 

[ak1004]

10 hours ago, Gourmet Gal said:

Ritz Carlton and the upcoming Four Seasons ships but they are so small they will not be a major competitor for a while if ever.  Some might say Crystal but I’ve never considered them as being in the same category as SS or SB.

 

Ritz Carlton is priced over $1,000 USD per night per person. Not sure if would be a fair comparison.

 

We sailed on Crystal pre Covid and considered them in the same category as SS, but their current prices don't make sense. If I can book SB for $400-500, I just cannot justify paying $600-700 for Crystal. Crystal fans will claim otherwise of course, but to me it's all about itinerary and price. 

[commodoredave]

13 hours ago, stan01 said:

 

I am surprised at how many likes I have (seven and counting), not sure if that means people agree or they are acknowledging a strong opinion 🙂

 

For Explora and Ritz Carlton:  I do wonder if the shorter 6-8 day itineraries are going to attract a lot of families with children along with a younger demographics of people whose jobs don't permit longer vacations.  These ships are not set up with areas for families, and if a poorly supervised group of kids takes over the pool area(s) it really would detract from our experience.  Nothing against kids, just that these ships are not set up to handle them in a separate area where other passengers won't be disturbed.  Of course some parents are very watchful of their kids and would not allow them to disturb others.  But if the kids are disturbing others the crew seems unable to do anything in our experience.

 

Agree. When we cruise with our grand children, we go on a mass market line like NCL that provides lots of activities and facilities for children. The kids have more fun and they do not interfere with adult activities or facilities. Why anyone would want to subject young children to an ultra-luxury cruise ship experience with little or no ability to entertain them is beyond me. Maybe others can explain their logic.

[saminina]

Maybe because not all children grow up equally.

[commodoredave]

5 hours ago, saminina said:

Maybe because not all children grow up equally.

How so? 

[commodoredave]

On 2/25/2024 at 10:50 PM, ak1004 said:

 

Ritz Carlton is priced over $1,000 USD per night per person. Not sure if would be a fair comparison.

 

We sailed on Crystal pre Covid and considered them in the same category as SS, but their current prices don't make sense. If I can book SB for $400-500, I just cannot justify paying $600-700 for Crystal. Crystal fans will claim otherwise of course, but to me it's all about itinerary and price. 

Crystal’s high pricing surprises me. Have they already done so well with passenger loads that they can be this aggressive with pricing?

[ak1004]

47 minutes ago, commodoredave said:

Crystal’s high pricing surprises me. Have they already done so well with passenger loads that they can be this aggressive with pricing?

 

Last time I checked couple months ago, the loads were 20-50%. Of course they say this is all part of the business plan because many people already had bookings, but I don't buy it. The prices are completely crazy, considering the ships are still 20+ years old and the cabins are still small. And if you read some objective reviews and ignore all the hype, people mention that the ship shows its age. there are rust stains, not all staterooms and bathrooms were updated, AC issues etc. Also someone mentioned "two tier service levels with regular known guests receiving warmer service and more indulged".

 

As much I wanted to try the new Crystal, this is not going to happen any time soon. And with the current prices, I doubt they will survive. 

 

You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.

Abraham Lincoln

[jdk-atlga]

Regarding Crystal (and I have fond memories), I don't know if they can put the genie back in the bottle. Perhaps with their planned new ships (and retiring the current two) they can recapture some of their old "glory".  Best, jdk

[CruiserFromMaine]

As far as I can tell, Crystal hasn’t even ordered any new ships yet. And getting financing for new ships will be difficult if the current ships aren’t full. I suspect new ships are at least four years away for Crystal. 

[ak1004]

3 hours ago, jdk-atlga said:

Regarding Crystal (and I have fond memories), I don't know if they can put the genie back in the bottle. Perhaps with their planned new ships (and retiring the current two) they can recapture some of their old "glory".  Best, jdk

 

Well, if they charge $600-700 per person for an OV 210 sqft cabin on a 20+ years old ships, I can only imagine how much they will charge for a larger cabins on a new ship. Doesn't mean of course that people will pay.

[Hlitner]

The luxury market is pretty competitive and we wonder if Crystal is in a position to meet the competition.  Also keep in mind that the new player on the block, Explora Journeys, will soon have 5 more ships (each with about 900 capacity) plying the luxury market.  Will A&K make the huge investment to secure new-builds for Crystal?  Questionable.  And it has been mentioned that the decent shipyards are all booked for the next few years.

 

Hank

[commodoredave]

5 hours ago, ak1004 said:

 

Last time I checked couple months ago, the loads were 20-50%. Of course they say this is all part of the business plan because many people already had bookings, but I don't buy it. The prices are completely crazy, considering the ships are still 20+ years old and the cabins are still small. And if you read some objective reviews and ignore all the hype, people mention that the ship shows its age. there are rust stains, not all staterooms and bathrooms were updated, AC issues etc. Also someone mentioned "two tier service levels with regular known guests receiving warmer service and more indulged".

 

As much I wanted to try the new Crystal, this is not going to happen any time soon. And with the current prices, I doubt they will survive. 

 

You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.

Abraham Lincoln

A good assessment. I’m afraid you won’t find this kind of objectivity on the Crystal forum.

[Texas Tillie]

And what do all these anti-Crystal posts have to do with a thread entitled Silversea vs Seabourn on the Silversea board?

[turtlemichael]

24 minutes ago, Texas Tillie said:

And what do all these anti-Crystal posts have to do with a thread entitled Silversea vs Seabourn on the Silversea board?

Since when has any thread on Cruise Critic stuck to the original topic 90 posts in?

[CruiserFromMaine]

3 hours ago, Texas Tillie said:

And what do all these anti-Crystal posts have to do with a thread entitled Silversea vs Seabourn on the Silversea board?

After 7.1K posts here you should know that threads wander. We even see posts complaining about other posts sometimes.  

[Port Power]

I have the opportunity of trying Seabourn without the expense of international flights in March 2026.   Seabourn Sojourn will be in Australia and my TA has a good offer.  On inquiring, there are only a very small number of cabins left.  In 2026!  No solo rate cabins at all.  I would be paying the same daily rate as I would for Silversea but without the included shore excursions.  Of course I don’t need excursions on this itinerary, but it does highlight the price difference.  

[Lois R]

55 minutes ago, CruiserFromMaine said:

After 7.1K posts here you should know that threads wander. We even see posts complaining about other posts sometimes.  

Hi Carl, it happens all the time..........pick a forum, any forum LOL..........

[commodoredave]

Doesn’t matter what forum, if someone says anything even slightly critical of Crystal, there will be whining.

[saminina]

Regarding Crystal pricing.  Posted rates are high because almost all past Crystal customers are sailing at deep discount.  Dummy me and new to Crystal people are paying posted rates.  Tough to see Crystal as a long term play.  I'd say same about Explora.   I find value in both today.  Manfredi is the Crystal money and he is the A&K money.  

 

Explora will be fine, but it will turn from being a good fit for me into a fit for many more people.

 

 

Edited February 28 by saminina

[caviargal]

On 2/24/2024 at 11:30 PM, saminina said:

I A band of transient players on deck 5 reading lyrics and notes from computer screen and hopefully someone that knows how to play the piano in the observation bar.  Normally passable, but when it is not it can be too painful to tolerate.

 

 

We had outstanding entertainment on SB Ovation, which was nothing like you describe.  Two live bands with talented musicians who played a wide variety of music for dancing.  We went to see them every evening.

The piano bar was in TK and the pianist was very good.

The duo in in the Observation lounge was the only snoozefest.

Our CD and staff were also talented and the best I've experienced on the ocean, including a recent disappointed on RSSC.

[Texas Tillie]

4 hours ago, saminina said:

Regarding Crystal pricing.  Posted rates are high because almost all past Crystal customers are sailing at deep discount.  Dummy me and new to Crystal people are paying posted rates.  Tough to see Crystal as a long term play.  I'd say same about Explora.   I find value in both today.  Manfredi is the Crystal money and he is the A&K money.  

 

Explora will be fine, but it will turn from being a good fit for me into a fit for many more people.

 

 

 

Excuse me, I'd consider myself a long time Crystal customer, since 2007, with close to 50 cruises, have done 2 cruises with the new Crystal and have 2 more booked, and NONE are at a deep discount. I have paid whatever the  posted fare was for the category I booked at the time I booked. Don't believe I'm the only one missing out based on the people I know. You are right that the money behind the relaunched Crystal is Manfredi. He got a BIG payout selling Silversea to Royal Caribbean.

[nancygp]

5 hours ago, saminina said:

Regarding Crystal pricing.  Posted rates are high because almost all past Crystal customers are sailing at deep discount

Really…if so, I’d have booked lots of cruises…you know this how?
 

Nancy

[saminina]

The lady serving drinks in Avenue Saloon told me.

[Gourmet Gal]

On 2/24/2024 at 8:30 PM, saminina said:

IME, SS standards have been slipping since 2006.  I remember meeting a couple Brits in 2002 that told me standards had dropped so much that they will not return.   The new ships have breathed life into a line that we had lost interest in booking.  It's a fresh product, but hardly luxury. 

 

If I cared at all about food, SS and SB would not make the cut.   A potential problem with Seabourn is that you have two interior bars.  A band of transient players on deck 5 reading lyrics and notes from computer screen and hopefully someone that knows how to play the piano in the observation bar.  Normally passable, but when it is not it can be too painful to tolerate.

 

So many good crew have found their way to the new options that compete for this market segment.

It's time for passengers to think beyond.

Just wondering why reading music from a computer screen is a bad thing?