UK cruises, new gratuities

outstanding service should always be rewarded.

But good, very good and excellent service deserves no reward?

But good, very good and excellent service deserves no reward?

Sure it does, if you think it does, then reward it.

remember that you are already paying for a service to be provided, so if you feel it goes beyond your expectation of that service then reward.

So, as a matter of principle, you stiff the crew?

 

Do you agree that the fare would have to be increased by at least the amount of the service charges plus some other amount to offset taxes, etc.?

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I am quite happy to pay increases in baseline fares. I also believe that all these people are employed in cruise lines because of us fare paying customers and we should not feel guilty. I believe cruise liners are using gratuity as others means of making money. In any case I always tip handsomely to everyone Who gives outstanding services to equivalent amount to what cruise line charge.

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I am quite happy to pay increases in baseline fares. I also believe that all these people are employed in cruise lines because of us fare paying customers and we should not feel guilty. I believe cruise liners are using gratuity as others means of making money. In any case I always tip handsomely to everyone Who gives outstanding services to equivalent amount to what cruise line charge.

 

 

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I too prefer fares to include tips. I use the auto-pay system.

One aspect of the Princess system puzzles me though, that the tips the passengers pay on ship Y may be distributed to staff on ship X?

Am I understanding that correctly ?

Annie

So, as a matter of principle, you stiff the crew?

 

Do you agree that the fare would have to be increased by at least the amount of the service charges plus some other amount to offset taxes, etc.?

Out comes the usual saying "stiffing the crew" the only people "stiffing the crew" are Princess and Carnival plc who employ them on such poor wages while making billions in profit. Sorry but no service is good enough for me to pay £250+ in gratuities for a couple for 14nts.

The cabin steward cleans your cabin which is what he is paid for and the waiter serves you a meal which also what he is paid for so how is that excellent service and warrants nearly £20 a night in gratuities. Excellent service is going above and beyond normal duties which in that case then deserves a gratuity which should be at the discretion of the customer not senior management sitting in offices in the US deciding how much they should automatically take off to boost Princess/Carnival profits and increase their own bonuses.

Out comes the usual saying "stiffing the crew" the only people "stiffing the crew" are Princess and Carnival plc who employ them on such poor wages while making billions in profit. Sorry but no service is good enough for me to pay £250+ in gratuities for a couple for 14nts.

Last year I spent time in the Far East where it is standard practice that all hotel rates are quoted £X ++. The ++ represented local taxes and normally 10% service charge.

Maybe the time has come to incorporate 10% service charge into the fares.

Annie

I am quite happy to pay increases in baseline fares. I also believe that all these people are employed in cruise lines because of us fare paying customers and we should not feel guilty. I believe cruise liners are using gratuity as others means of making money. In any case I always tip handsomely to everyone Who gives outstanding services to equivalent amount to what cruise line charge.

 

 

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Your post makes no sense. If you're concerned about Princess diverting part of the gratuity, then why would you not be equally concerned if the gratuity were part of the fare?

As it is, Princess must follow certain accounting rules which prevent diversion of the gratuity. If the gratuity becomes part of the fare, then those rules would not apply.

Out comes the usual saying "stiffing the crew" the only people "stiffing the crew" are Princess and Carnival plc who employ them on such poor wages while making billions in profit. Sorry but no service is good enough for me to pay £250+ in gratuities for a couple for 14nts.

Yes, it is "stiffing the crew" because that is exactly what it is. If you don't think the service is worth the price, then kindly find a cruise line that provides the service at a price you prefer.

The cabin steward cleans your cabin which is what he is paid for and the waiter serves you a meal which also what he is paid for so how is that excellent service and warrants nearly £20 a night in gratuities. Excellent service is going above and beyond normal duties which in that case then deserves a gratuity which should be at the discretion of the customer not senior management sitting in offices in the US deciding how much they should automatically take off to boost Princess/Carnival profits and increase their own bonuses.

It's been explaining multiple times how the accounting rules prevent Princess from diverting these funds to general revenue purposes. Evidently, saving a few pounds is important enough that any excuse will do.

Princess if you are listening: PLEASE start including gratuities in the cruise fare. I am so tired of paying my auto gratuities in full as well as giving a little extra for the wonderful service we receive while others simply cancel their gratuities.How citizens of first world countries can sleep at night when they have stiffed the third world country crew out of a significant portion of their meagre wage for being away from home and family for long periods of time is just beyond me.

 

On the surface of it, a system of some guaranteed wage plus significant gratuities for doing a good job is a very good system to ensure the crew provide above average service. But, as soon as you make it as easy as saying "Please cancel my auto gratuities" to a person at the Passenger Service desk the system begins to fall apart. That is when some passengers begin taking advantage of not just the crew but also other passengers by cancelling their auto gratuities and those that don't cancel have been seeing the associated increase in gratuities lately.

 

I'm not saying that there shouldn't be an ability to discuss and maybe adjust the auto gratuity if the passenger legitimately feels they have not received the level of service they expected. But to just cancel it entirely without any discussion about what the problem was and just maybe a reduction of the amount is just wrong. Princess is just taking the easy way out by allowing this to happen as it doesn't directly hurt them to lose some gratuity pool money and it avoids them having a passenger who may go elsewhere next time if they were unable to cancel their gratuities.

 

It is time to include all gratuities in the cruise fare and put an end to this.

 

AE_Collector

Better yet, make it mandatory like port fees and taxes. These aren't included in the base fare either, and no one bitches about having to pay them. That way they couldn't be removed at all. Can't figure out why certain people selectively bitch about only some charges, and not all of them.

Must be a cultural thing, as it seems to be only a couple of countries that repeatedly stiff the crew by using that self-serving and flawed rational. Does this level of greedieness and disrespectful attitude towars the people who serve them during their cruise come naturally, or is it taught in their schools????

The same reason that you can be pretty certain that all of the gratuity money goes to the staff is the same reason that they do not make it mandatory and that they leave the option to remove it.

Here is why, under US tax and financial reporting law, which the cruise lines have to comply with since their primary listing is on the US stock exchanges and therefore are subject to the SEC financial reporting rules, gratuities are not listed as revenue nor as expense provided certain rules are met. 1. the gratuities must be optional (This is why cruise lines give you the option of removing them, if they did not have to comply with this rule you can be pretty certain that the option to remove would go away) and 2 all of the funds received must be distributed to the staff. That is why you can be pretty certain that the money received under optional gratuities, is fully distributed.

The day they are not you can be pretty certain is the day that your ability to remove them goes away.

Out comes the usual saying "stiffing the crew" the only people "stiffing the crew" are Princess and Carnival plc who employ them on such poor wages while making billions in profit. Sorry but no service is good enough for me to pay £250+ in gratuities for a couple for 14nts.

So you admit that they are paid "such poor wages" yet you help them out by cancelling your portion of " the rest of their wages" the gratuities! NICE

The Auto Gratuities are gratuities in name only, they are really a service charge. The gratuies are the other half of their wages making their "poor wages" not quite as poor.

The real "gratuities" are the extra given by many passengers over and above the auto gratuities. I don't expect anyone who regularly cancels their auto gratuity to be able to begin to comprehend giving a little extra.

And don't whine about the GBP being off against the US$. It isn't "off" nearly as much as the CDN$ is which I pay for everything on cruises with including the gratuities. That is just life.

AE_Collector

The same reason that you can be pretty certain that all of the gratuity money goes to the staff is the same reason that they do not make it mandatory and that they leave the option to remove it.

 

Here is why, under US tax and financial reporting law, which the cruise lines have to comply with since their primary listing is on the US stock exchanges and therefore are subject to the SEC financial reporting rules, gratuities are not listed as revenue nor as expense provided certain rules are met. 1. the gratuities must be optional (This is why cruise lines give you the option of removing them, if they did not have to comply with this rule you can be pretty certain that the option to remove would go away) and 2 all of the funds received must be distributed to the staff. That is why you can be pretty certain that the money received under optional gratuities, is fully distributed.

 

The day they are not you can be pretty certain is the day that your ability to remove them goes away.

Thank you for that.

However on the UK website, it states that the gratuity will be shared amongst staff across the fleet.

My question is simply this: Can the gratuities paid by guests on ship X be shared by staff on other vessels in the fleet ?

Annie

The same reason that you can be pretty certain that all of the gratuity money goes to the staff is the same reason that they do not make it mandatory and that they leave the option to remove it.

 

Here is why, under US tax and financial reporting law, which the cruise lines have to comply with since their primary listing is on the US stock exchanges and therefore are subject to the SEC financial reporting rules, gratuities are not listed as revenue nor as expense provided certain rules are met. 1. the gratuities must be optional (This is why cruise lines give you the option of removing them, if they did not have to comply with this rule you can be pretty certain that the option to remove would go away) and 2 all of the funds received must be distributed to the staff. That is why you can be pretty certain that the money received under optional gratuities, is fully distributed.

 

The day they are not you can be pretty certain is the day that your ability to remove them goes away.

Thanks for the explanation. It helps knowing that the cruise line actually gives the crew their earned tips.

Unfortunately, there will always be those selfish people who will take advantage of a situation to benefit themselves at the expense of others. That is why I like what NCL has done. There you must pay the gratuities during the cruise. You cannot opt out during the cruise itself. If you want to remove the gratuities, you must go to customer service and request a form. That form must be filled out with full details of why the gratuities should be refunded and mailed to corporate headquarters for review. If the review agrees with the reason, they will refund the gratuities. Otherwise, the gratuities remain.

On NCL a greedy passenger must make a concerted effort to beg for the gratuities to be refunded. It makes them work for it, and hopefully many will simply give up and let the gratuities stand rather than go through all the trouble.

Nah, who am I kidding!!! These people would spend hours trying to get those gratuities back, if only as a matter of so-called "principal". There is no limit that selfish people will go to to satisfy themselves.

Thank you for that.

 

However on the UK website, it states that the gratuity will be shared amongst staff across the fleet.

 

My question is simply this: Can the gratuities paid by guests on ship X be shared by staff on other vessels in the fleet ?

 

Annie

I don't see why not. I would imagine it to be a Princess fleet wide pool where everything goes in and out of. It isn't as though crew all board a specific ship for a specific time frame where all gratuities from that ship can be divided up amoungst them. Crew are constantly starting contracts, ending contracts and even moving from one ship to another. The only logical way to administer it in my mind would be fleet wide.

Why does it matter if part of your gratuity money winds up going to crew on another Princess ship as long as some of that ships gratuity money goes to your cabin steward?

AE_Collector

I too prefer fares to include tips. I use the auto-pay system.

 

One aspect of the Princess system puzzles me though, that the tips the passengers pay on ship Y may be distributed to staff on ship X?

 

Am I understanding that correctly ?

 

Annie

Yes. It's probably to make up for the cruises where folks from the UK remove the tips. Things like that cause disparities among the crew of various ships so the gratuities get shared to help even things out for the crew. If everybody just looked at the gratuities as part of the cost of the cruise then this wouldn't be necessary.

Thank you for that.

 

However on the UK website, it states that the gratuity will be shared amongst staff across the fleet.

 

My question is simply this: Can the gratuities paid by guests on ship X be shared by staff on other vessels in the fleet ?

 

Annie

Yes, the law simply requires that it be fully distributed to crew.

When you think about putting the money into a pool across the fleet makes sense. It balances issues that would otherwise occur with different cruise home ports, cruises, ships etc. In the same way it balances out different positions on the ship as well, those with front line contact vs those that more behind the scenes, but still very important.

They solved the problem in Australia by making those cruises under the Australian subsidiary, and therefore under Australian financial laws (gratuity included in fare and not optional).

What we don't know is how the pool works, does everyone in an equal position get the same thing, or are they adjusted in some way based upon customer feedback.

Thanks for the explanation. It helps knowing that the cruise line actually gives the crew their earned tips.

 

Unfortunately, there will always be those selfish people who will take advantage of a situation to benefit themselves at the expense of others. That is why I like what NCL has done. There you must pay the gratuities during the cruise. You cannot opt out during the cruise itself. If you want to remove the gratuities, you must go to customer service and request a form. That form must be filled out with full details of why the gratuities should be refunded and mailed to corporate headquarters for review. If the review agrees with the reason, they will refund the gratuities. Otherwise, the gratuities remain.

 

On NCL a greedy passenger must make a concerted effort to beg for the gratuities to be refunded. It makes them work for it, and hopefully many will simply give up and let the gratuities stand rather than go through all the trouble.

 

Nah, who am I kidding!!! These people would spend hours trying to get those gratuities back, if only as a matter of so-called "principal". There is no limit that selfish people will go to to satisfy themselves.

Technically if NCL rejects the customers request for refund of gratuities for any reason then they would no longer be compliant with the regulation. The option must be totally determined by the customer.

My understanding of the NCL process is while it must be requested by form they are always refunded, if the customer requests. Making the customer submit a form and put a reason down will reduce the number making the request by itself.

Technically if NCL rejects the customers request for refund of gratuities for any reason then they would no longer be compliant with the regulation. The option must be totally determined by the customer.

 

My understanding of the NCL process is while it must be requested by form they are always refunded, if the customer requests. Making the customer submit a form and put a reason down will reduce the number making the request by itself.

That makes sense. Thanks for the input.

Whatever makes it more cumbersome for those selfish people to stiff the crew is A-OK with me. (y)

Yes, the law simply requires that it be fully distributed to crew.

 

When you think about putting the money into a pool across the fleet makes sense. It balances issues that would otherwise occur with different cruise home ports, cruises, ships etc. In the same way it balances out different positions on the ship as well, those with front line contact vs those that more behind the scenes, but still very important.

 

They solved the problem in Australia by making those cruises under the Australian subsidiary, and therefore under Australian financial laws (gratuity included in fare and not optional).

 

What we don't know is how the pool works, does everyone in an equal position get the same thing, or are they adjusted in some way based upon customer feedback.

Just to clarify the reference to, in Australia. It is not automatically added, for 'Australian Guests', on the relevant cruises out of Australia (when the relevant ships are doing their 'Australian Seasons'), to their onboard account, it is optional:-

"For our Australian guests, when sailing on cruises departing from Australia aboard Sun Princess, Dawn Princess or Sea Princess, a daily gratuity amount will no longer be added to your on board account. You are welcome to reward our on board crew for exceptional service, however, tipping is not required."

Just to clarify the reference to, in Australia. It is not automatically added, for 'Australian Guests', on the relevant cruises out of Australia (when the relevant ships are doing their 'Australian Seasons'), to their onboard account, it is optional:-

"For our Australian guests, when sailing on cruises departing from Australia aboard Sun Princess, Dawn Princess or Sea Princess, a daily gratuity amount will no longer be added to your on board account. You are welcome to reward our on board crew for exceptional service, however, tipping is not required."

Don't Australians pay significantly more for cruise fare?

That makes sense. Thanks for the input.

 

Whatever makes it more cumbersome for those selfish people to stiff the crew is A-OK with me. (y)

People have a right on Princess to tip or not... it's a choice and it is what it is.... I am sure your name calling will not change anything!

I too prefer fares to include tips. I use the auto-pay system.

 

One aspect of the Princess system puzzles me though, that the tips the passengers pay on ship Y may be distributed to staff on ship X?

 

Am I understanding that correctly ?

No. Although there have been some posts claiming that due to some wording on the Princess web site, I have been assured by an officer in charge of a ship's payroll that all tips collected on a ship are only distributed to staff on that ship.

No. Although there have been some posts claiming that due to some wording on the Princess web site, I have been assured by an officer in charge of a ship's payroll that all tips collected on a ship are only distributed to staff on that ship.

This is straight from princess.com

To simplify the tipping process for our passengers, a discretionary gratuity charge will be automatically added to your shipboard account on a daily basis. The daily gratuity amounts are $15.50 per guest for suites, $14.50 per guest for mini-suites and club class, and $13.50 per guest for interior, oceanview, and balcony staterooms. This gratuity will be shared amongst those staff who have helped provide and support your cruise experience, including all waitstaff, stateroom stewards, buffet stewards, and housekeeping staff across the fleet. A 15% gratuity is added to bar charges and dining room wine accounts.